Why does Apple get a free pass on backflips?

[mikelegacy]

They aren't evil companies they are just capitalist companies that operate in their own self interest. Nothing surprising or bad about that (well, no worse than just whatever capitalism itself entails).

The key factor to a capitalist economy is competition. Verizon and major ISPs are trying to control competition by charging for internet fast lanes. Not to mention they essentially have closed door "meetings" to map out their territories so they aren't competing with each other.

Tell me what is capitalist about trying to kill competition and attempting to price fix. All while getting away with it by being some of the largest lobbyist-paying companies in the world. Open your eyes dude. That's pure evil.

 

[ahfu25]

Lol....a couple of you in here I remember saying no to a bigger screen. You guys are funny.

 

[C DM]

The key factor to a capitalist economy is competition. Verizon and major ISPs are trying to control competition by charging for internet fast lanes. Not to mention they essentially have closed door "meetings" to map out their territories so they aren't competing with each other.

Tell me what is capitalist about trying to kill competition and attempting to price fix. All while getting away with it by being some of the largest lobbyist-paying companies in the world. Open your eyes dude. That's pure evil.

That's what's good for the whole overall system and for everyone in general, but for each individual entity what's good is how to make as much as they can in whatever way possible as long as they can get away with it. Somewhat opposing pieces that are part of the same system. That's the reality, as opposed to a theoretical utopia, which of course is nice and all, just not real.

 

[TimothyB]

I think it's simply how the role of the smartphone has changed over time and new abilities and functionality adapted to it. At one point the 3.5" argument made sense. But today, these devices have slowly replaced computers for day to day tasks, plus used less and less for phone calls. A larger display was a needed compromise over ease of use with a single hand. I'm using two hands right now to type this on a 5s, one hand is too slow and uncomfortable. Apps have also grown in complexity that one hand just isn't practical anymore. Features like swipe to go back on a web page has fixed the need to tap the back button on the upper left, plus the new one handed mode to push everything down.


It doesn't feel like they caved in to trends, but saw what the smartphone means today and did what needed to be done, but carefully planned out so the old basics can be done with one hand, all while adding more useful information on the screen for things we now do almost 100% on our phones compared to when the iPhone originally launched.

 

[cdmoore74]

There are still tons of 3.5” and 4” iphone users and it’s going to be a shock just jumping to the 4.7” model. I can only imagine the horror of going from 3.5” to 5.5” for some people. Being an Android owner I went from 3.7” (Droid OG), 4.3” (Droid X), 4.65” (Verizon Nexus), 5.5” (Note 2) and to the 5.7” (Note 3). It took me from 2009 to 2013 to get use to those size bumps. You’re asking iUsers to make the change overnight. I don’t like what Apple did by giving the 4.7” the lower resolution, no OIS and shorter battery run times on the same day. People normally want the best so they pick the best and you’re asking them to make that jump way to quick. That was their critical mistake. It’s like Apple did a complete 180 on large phones.
What might bring me back to the iPhone are the developers. Samsung invented the phablet but Apple could reinvent it with phablet optimized apps. Samsung has little to no developer connections to do this. With the new Apple phablet you have one 5.5” model and 100’s of developers. I personally like the thought of having apps customized for a 5.5” 1080p display. And that’s why I would not go with the 4.7” iPhone.

 

[Zaft]

No, Apple admitted they were wrong when they went to 4" and now 4.7" and 5.5" they are admitting they were more wrong. They thought 4" would make people shut up. They were wrong.

I think at that time apple had to be careful because of app support. going to 4 inches was the least bit of effort for developers. Now they have scaling so it doesn't matter.

 

[sparky08]

Apple is the rare public company that can do just about anything and there customers will forget/rationalize/ignore it. They can charge just about any price, sell just about any product and dominate a market with little fear of public backlash. It's really amazing.

Ding! Ding! Ding!

It really is amazing. I can't think of another electronics company that has fallen years behind that hasn't either folded, or had to compete on price.

Whatever Apple is paying their marketing people, it isn't enough.

 

[Izauze]

It's really Apple's own fault.

Because of how big of an impact its initial phone had (which many people said was TOO big at the time), people now think of their phones as more than just phones that happen to have bells and whistles. They now buy it specifically for the bells and whistles, and the phone is almost incidental. It's become a central part of our day-to-day life. We read on it, we email on it, we watch movies on it – and for those kinds of things, one-handed use is simply not as important, screen size IS.

Really, I don't know that Apple changed itself as much as they changed all of us.

 

[mikelegacy]

That's what's good for the whole overall system and for everyone in general, but for each individual entity what's good is how to make as much as they can in whatever way possible as long as they can get away with it. Somewhat opposing pieces that are part of the same system. That's the reality, as opposed to a theoretical utopia, which of course is nice and all, just not real.

I've never argued that VZW are ATT are not looking out for themselves as businesses by doing this...that's obvious. But the thread is asking why they are looked upon as evil, and that is why. They have shady business practices, and at every stop, try to screw over the customers that support them.

 

[reverberlayed]

Ordinarily, you're right. I wouldn't have considered a large screen move a backflip either.

But when you spend the 4-5 years prior talking down large screened phones, saying that they're unnecessary, clunky and unwieldy, and that no-one will ever need one - it seems like a pretty big flip to then go and make a phone that rivals the biggest of the big.

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The difference is they never spent time and effort talking down and portraying those things as inferior.

I suppose to combat this point, they will say they've made it really thin and light so it is not unwieldy like the phones of 4-5 years ago.

 

[FrozenDarkness]

Ding! Ding! Ding!

It really is amazing. I can't think of another electronics company that has fallen years behind that hasn't either folded, or had to compete on price.

Whatever Apple is paying their marketing people, it isn't enough.

they don't need to pay much for marketing. Apple's app ecosystem is still world class with no competition for their own hardware since it runs proprietary software. it's amazing how fast people forget about this. Google may be catching up but it's not there yet.

 

[samg77]

Steve Jobs -- Not Apple, was the one who was against bigger screens. He ingrained it into the Apple staff, until they finally figured out the larger screens would increase sales. Many iPhone users loved the product so much they didnt care what screen size it was, and that has been the reason for 300 million iphone sales. Now they are going after the people who actually do care about screen size, which turns out is hundreds of millions of people, thats who! They now offer all 3 major sizes. 4", 4.7", and 5.5". Your analogy isn't really accurate to this case. Going from open-source to walled garden would be REMOVING something. Going from 4" only, to 4", 4.7" and 5.5" is ADDING something. People ALWAYS react negatively to removing something. If apple went the other way and made a 3" iPhone only, they would lose tens of millions of customers as would Android if they went walled garden. A closer analogy might be Google adding access to the Apple App store and all their apps, which goes against Google principals (obviously impossible but we are talking hypothetical analogies here). People would love having the access to all the new software of the Apple App store on their Android device, and the users would rejoice. Just as people are happy Apple is adding options on screen size.

 

[samg77]

Why do you think Apple is expecting huge numbers of upgrades this time around? People were going to buy whatever phone Apple made regardless of size, they clearing still preferred bigger screens...which is why Apple went even larger than 4". They were wrong and arrogant.

Apple has like 200 billion dollars cash on reserve. They clearly did something right. Everyone talking on this forum is a power user. Regular users dont talk on forums. Those are the people who didnt give a crap about screen size. If you care enough to join a forum and post on it, you defiantly are in the minority. Apple has adapted to realize they could make even MORE money by offering more screen sizes, so they are doing so, and by this time next year will probably have 300 billion in the bank.

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I don't think Apple ever bashed "large" screens (think iMac, iPad, MBP). They were adamant about being able to use a phone ONE HANDED. With the advancement in iOS (swipe gestures) and processing power/technology (Touch ID Ring...now allows for "REACHABILITY" with a double touch), Apple is now able to offer a larger screen while maintaining one handed use.

No Apple, Steve Jobs, at the time that was Apple, specifically bashed large phones. To quote Steve jobs "'no one's going to buy' a big phone".

 

[Zxxv]

No Apple, Steve Jobs, at the time that was Apple, specifically bashed large phones. To quote Steve jobs "'no one's going to buy' a big phone".

He was right and still is. What he didn't envision is how much people would stop phoning one another. Also how holding a phone up and using speaker phone is a more natural and friendlier way to use a phone; its more like two people are there so onlookers can hear both sides of the conversation. There are not that many situations where the conversation has to be totally private and for those instances people can look dorks with their over sized mummy and daddy handed baby the phone look. Steve was right.

 

[CEmajr]

The difference is, AT&T or Verizon really ARE evil companies. The price of their mobile plans have nothing to do with my decision to believe that. The fact that they want to kill Net Neutrality, and continue to price fix the cable and internet marketplaces without government indictment is why they are evil companies.

The truth is, people pay premium for companies that they can trust. One thing you always can trust Apple for is an amazing quality of product, and also an amazing quality of service if something is wrong with that product. Do you think Verizon or AT&T would give me a brand new Android if I walked into their retail stores with a shattered screen? Nope. Apple has never charged me for a replacement, either in or out of warranty.

I went to Android for a while. The OS is shoddy and every time I needed to make a service request, it was a major pain in the ass. I can understand why some people dislike Apple, but overall, I think it's easier to see why people love them. Just as it's easy to see why people love Google.

Modern-era tech companies operate with much more integrity than companies prior in most situations.

Exactly. Apple has spent decades (especially the most recent decade) building up a brand that people love and feel like they can trust. They've focused on capturing the consumer's mind rather than the quick one time sale. Most of the time when you buy an Apple product you know it's going to work well and work well for a long time before needing replacement.

Them having by far the best customer service in the industry goes a long way too. Go into an Apple Store and see how well they handle customer issues and returns/exchanges compared to how problems are handled by other electronics companies. That stuff goes a long way with people. The most important part of business comes after the sale and Apple seems to care a lot more than other companies about that part. The rest of them seem to not give two cents once they've gotten the initial sale.

One case in point is a few years back I bought a Macbook that was long out of warranty and not even turning on. Took it to the Apple Store and they were still happy to check it out and diagnose the problems with it free of charge. On the other hand the $1500 laptop I purchased from HP a few years prior started giving me problems a little after the 1 year warranty ran out and they wouldn't even bother acknowledging the computer anymore.

It's not just about marketing like some here are claiming. Samsung far outspends Apple on marketing and has ads everywhere but yet they still fail to generate the type of following that Apple has.

 

[C DM]

He was right and still is. What he didn't envision is how much people would stop phoning one another. Also how holding a phone up and using speaker phone is a more natural and friendlier way to use a phone; its more like two people are there so onlookers can hear both sides of the conversation. There are not that many situations where the conversation has to be totally private and for those instances people can look dorks with their over sized mummy and daddy handed baby the phone look. Steve was right.

More natural to hold the phone close to your face and use the speakerphone for a conversation?

 

[Zxxv]

More natural to hold the phone close to your face and use the speakerphone for a conversation?

Held up anywhere and talked to. What about holding it like you text?

 

[C DM]

Held up anywhere and talked to. What about holding it like you text?

When you text you text when you talk you talk, holding it up to your year is certainly more natural as a over a century of phone use shows.

 

[kerrikins]

I don't think they're really getting a free pass, I've certainly seen a lot of comments and posts about this very thing. It's definitely being discussed.

Part of it may be that in the current market, it's not "too little, too late", and that's why so many people are excited. Current users like me are ready to upgrade (and two years ago I didn't want a bigger screen, btw) and people who have switched are happy to come back.

Apple has a lot of emotional good will with the public, IMO. So that gives them the leeway to hold off on things and have their users be happy when they finally implement things.

I think another part of it is also that they found a way to help one handed use - Reachability. The key philosophy that they touted is still obviously important to them because they implemented this.

 

[Rockies]

Consumer preferences change over time. Larger screens are more in demand now than they were a few years ago. Companies need to adapt. Just look at Blackberry for an example of a company that didn't change with the times.

Exactly. I think it is good that Apple is doing this, giving the consumers what they want. Just look at Toyota. They recently made a HUGE refresh of there 2015 Camry in the middle of the current generation model. Even though it is the best selling sedan in the USA, they knew they had to keep up with competition. You have to adapt with the times.

 

[Primejimbo]

Lol....a couple of you in here I remember saying no to a bigger screen. You guys are funny.

People aren't allowed to change their minds? I like the 4 inch a lot, and it works fine for me. I might get the 6 because, well, I can. I liked the Lunima 920 when I got my iPhone 5, but I like iOS more then the screen size so I stayed with my iPhone. I don't buy my iPhone for the screen size, I buy it because I like iOS a lot.

ALS, I thought I saw an article saying they (Apple) adapted to the cell phone market? If that's true, the never said 4.7/5.5 is better, they are just giving people what they want.

 

[Apollonian]

I wouldn't call it a free pass. Apple tends to wait for technology to mature before putting it into their devices, for instance NFC. I think displays of the size found in the iPhone 6 and especially 6 plus are just maturing and the demand is now there. If the original iPhone had been the size of the 6 plus no one would have bought it at that time, technology and demand is constantly evolving.

 

[OneMike]

If Apple says that a bigger screen is OK now, it's OK now because Apple said it. People are good at rationalizing.

I always think about how they were saying the thumb is x size so this is natural, etc... Evolution has accelerated.

 

[2IS]

It's really not that complicated. CEO with one vision for the company passed away. CEO with a different vision for the company took over. Two different people in charge, so two different visions of what constitutes the "perfect" phone. Neither vision is right and neither vision is wrong. It's just subjective opinion packaged as gospel truth to try to convince you to buy whatever is on sale at the moment.

So you think if SJ were alive, we'd be looking at a 3.5" iPhone 6? Doubt it.

 

[stickybuns]

So you think if SJ were alive, we'd be looking at a 3.5" iPhone 6? Doubt it.

What a silly thing to write! You know perfectly well that I never wrote anything approaching the tired and hackneyed phrase, "If Steve Jobs was alive, he would never allow _______ to happen!" I was referring to company culture and differences in management style, nothing more and nothing less.

The debate over whether or not Apple should embrace a larger format phone had been going on for several years prior to Jobs' death; for whatever reason, he made the choice to not pursue that path until the release of the iPhone 5. How the heck should I know why he made the decisions that he made? Maybe he just really, really, really liked smaller screen phones; maybe he was a megalomaniac hoping to make the fanboys dance like monkeys for him; maybe he was an idiot who didn't understand how market forces work.

It is clear that Jobs and Cook have very different management styles, so we shouldn't be surprised that Apple is going in a different directions under Cook.