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Why does the touchbar receive so much hate?

I have the base 2016 model so I may be biased but the touchbar just doesn't add any use for me. I've used the touchbar on my coworkers machines at work and it just seems like a ******** way to adjust volume and brightness. I also don't see why it had to be an either/or situation. Stick a touchbar above the function keys and it doesn't have to become a sacrifice.

I just think the whole concept has been badly thought through and hasn't been supported anywhere near to what it needs to become genuinely useful.
 
Oh look, a toucbar! Now you can press keys that you used to press before without any tactile feedback! Oh, and it scrolls left and right in Final Cut, which you ABSOLUTELY COULDN'T DO on one of the worst touchpads in history! Oh, and the laptop in now $500 more expensive so that you can sell it later on for $250 extra!

Only advantages.
 
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Why does the touchbar receive so much hate? All you had to do was read through the forums and then your question would have been answered...
 
It’s functionality is cool and in my case, can be extremely useful. But I do miss having the physical buttons, not because that’s what i’m used to, but because certain uses need or work better with physical buttons. I think it wouldn’t hurt to have the function row about the Touch Bar, and that way the entire Touch Bar could be used for the application controls (which is a much nice experience). Some people also blindly think the Touch Bar is the cause for the price increase.
 
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c0ppo said:
I can't speak for anyone else, but for me, TB is a pure gimmick. Nothing more, nothing less then a gimmick.
Of course, some will find it useful. But me? I gave up on MBP because of TB, and moved on to the PC side.

Everything TB brings I can do with keyboard shortcuts. And it's way faster, easier and more elegant then when using TB. And I do mean everything. Even scrubbing thru youtube videos (k, l). And I don't have to take my eyes of the keyboard.

TB is useful for someone learning some app (like FCP for example). But just at the beginning. Later on it will actually hurt those students process. Why? Because they won't learn kb shortcuts, which are simply put - way faster and better.

I don't hate TB. It's just a gimmick, you can't hate gimmicks. But what I do hate is that Apple gave me no option. If I want 15", I get a TB. And pay premium for something I really never asked, never wanted, and will never use. I would gladly now pay premium just to get rid of TB :)

P.S.
Actually, there is one option Apple left me - move on. And I have. But since I prefer MacOS over Windows, I will be back. But only if I can purchase a MBP without TB.
Click to expand...

so let me just get this straight....you hate the TB so much that you are punishing yourself by switching to windows? You must have really loved the old function keys.
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Nik said:
Hitting the ESC key by accident and not having a physical ESC key was driving me insane when I had my TB MBP. Sent it back for this and a couple of other reasons. Working with the machine was a hassle. I do not know what to buy when I need to upgrade. :(
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I guess since I'm a non programmer I cant relate. I don't think I have ever pressed the ESC key on my old laptop.
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Pangalactic said:
Oh look, a toucbar! Now you can press keys that you used to press before without any tactile feedback! Oh, and it scrolls left and right in Final Cut, which you ABSOLUTELY COULDN'T DO on one of the worst touchpads in history! Oh, and the laptop in now $500 more expensive so that you can sell it later on for $250 extra!

Only advantages.
Click to expand...

and I can use Touch ID to log in with my finger print or purchase things online. That alone makes it worthwhile.
 
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PhoneI said:
so let me just get this straight....you hate the TB so much that you are punishing yourself by switching to windows? You must have really loved the old function keys.
Click to expand...

As I said in my post - there is no hate. You can't hate things like TB. You can dislike them. And since doing my work I use function keys a lot, of course I'm gonna jump ship if you take that away from me.

And it's not like I wasn't using Windows anyway. I was a primarily .NET developer for more then 10 years. And still have a lot of work on .NET framework. So jumping ship wasn't that hard.

I still love MacOS way more then I love Windows. But I also like to get my work done without being hassled with gimmicks :)
 
I like some of the shortcuts that the TouchBar has in it. For example in Calendar, the months show up on the TouchBar so I can jump from month to month with a tap. I like the sliders from the right side of the TouchBar such as the volume, touch and slide, much better than repeatedly clicking on a button. I don't think that the TouchBar is a gimmick, however, until more developers make better use of it, it might not be that useful for some users.
 
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PhoneI said:
and I can use Touch ID to log in with my finger print or purchase things online. That alone makes it worthwhile.
Click to expand...

TouchID is not touchbar, not a single sane person is complaining about it. If it was just $100 extra for the touchID anyone would take it without a doubt.
 
Gjwilly said:
Except it isn’t the only difference.
Different CPU, different graphics, different ports, different cooling system.
Oh. And different battery.
Click to expand...

Emphasis on the major. The different CPU, graphics and ports would not be sufficient to justify a 30% improvement over advertised battery life - otherwise we'd see similar differences between other models - even with touch bar. The different battery of course would contribute some improvement but if I recall the capacity difference again is not 30%.
 
Idk dude. The TB versions cost more but you get faster processor, 2 more ports, faster RAM, touchID, and TB. Is it $300 more? Yes. Do you get more than just a TB? YES.

I'm not happy paying $2,200 for a MBP but I love it! Won't upgrade for many years.
 
haydn! said:
I don't recall the exact stats but there was some pretty significant differences in battery life between the 13" without and with the Touch Bar, with the touch bar being the only major spec difference.
Click to expand...

The specs of no touchbar one is way worse than the tb one.. the no touchbar is a consumer macbook air replacement and the tb is the mb 13 pro version
 
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c0ppo said:
I can't speak for anyone else, but for me, TB is a pure gimmick. Nothing more, nothing less then a gimmick.
Of course, some will find it useful. But me? I gave up on MBP because of TB, and moved on to the PC side.

P.S.
Actually, there is one option Apple left me - move on. And I have. But since I prefer MacOS over Windows, I will be back. But only if I can purchase a MBP without TB.
Click to expand...

I'm curious what you replaced your MBP with from the PC side seeing as your evidently an Apple fan, albeit a disgruntled one (aren't we all these days?)

More importantly, how is the transition and what was the replacement PC hardware?
 
pixelatedscraps said:
I'm curious what you replaced your MBP with from the PC side seeing as your evidently an Apple fan, albeit a disgruntled one (aren't we all these days?)

More importantly, how is the transition and what was the replacement PC hardware?
Click to expand...

Lenovo P50. Not the prettiest thing around, but very, very powerfull. Excellent keyboard (Lenovo/Thinkpad keyboards are the best laptop keyboards ever. IMHO of course), excellent build, great hardware.

One thing I find that is lacking behind any retina MBP is the screen. Not in MBP category for sure, but still a good screen. And I use it hooked up to external monitors most of the time, just like I do with MBP.
 
Jaekae said:
The specs of no touchbar one is way worse than the tb one.. the no touchbar is a consumer macbook air replacement and the tb is the mb 13 pro version
Click to expand...

Oh dear...not the "pro" argument again...

We've already established that pros use Iomega Zip Drives and parallel ports. This discussion is not for debate.
 
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c0ppo said:
And pay premium for something I really never asked, never wanted, and will never use.
Click to expand...

You assume the premium price is because of the TB and ignore the (very) premium computer around it.

You also assume that Apple designed it based on what you asked, wanted and will use.
 
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aevan said:
You assume the premium price is because of the TB and ignore the (very) premium computer around it.

You also assume that Apple designed it based on what you asked, wanted and will use.
Click to expand...

MBP from 2015/14/13/etc. weren't premium for you I guess?
Prices of CPU/GPU haven't changed a bit in the last few years. Actually, not a lot has changed hardware based.

But what has changed is that Apple took out the 'premium' cable out of the package (it was there always!), and weight of the MBP and packaging in general. So that means lower transport cost for Apple. Considering that we are talking about large number of devices, this makes a huge cost saving for Apple.

So then, if it isn't the TB, what is it? CPU? Mediocre GPU? Or keyboard that gets stuck now and then? What is so premium about this MBP that previous generations lacked? What contributes to the price increase?

And btw, It's not just me. If I could ask Apple to design a laptop just for my needs - of course I would do it. Just like you would, or anyone else. But somehow it seems that many users don't really like TB, so it isn't just me. And even if it was, I'm so sorry that expressing my own personal opinion hurts your feelings ;)

P.S.
I have 0 problems paying for a MBP, even if the prices go further up. But I have problem paying for something I don't consider is gonna help me get my job done. Quite the opposite.
 
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I must say I haven't used my escape keys or function keys in years.

If options and paying for stuff we don't use is the debate I'll join in. Why should I have to pay for a track pad on a laptop? I never ever use one. I hate track pads. I always use an external mouse. How about we make that an option as well?
 
c0ppo said:
Lenovo P50. Not the prettiest thing around, but very, very powerfull. Excellent keyboard (Lenovo/Thinkpad keyboards are the best laptop keyboards ever. IMHO of course), excellent build, great hardware.

One thing I find that is lacking behind any retina MBP is the screen. Not in MBP category for sure, but still a good screen. And I use it hooked up to external monitors most of the time, just like I do with MBP.
Click to expand...

Its funny people are willing to move away from a MacBook because of the TB, but are willing to live with the almost unusable trackpads found on Lenovo's. Really, they are terrible.

The P50 is also almost 6 pounds.
 
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c0ppo said:
MBP from 2015/14/13/etc. weren't premium for you I guess?
Prices of CPU/GPU haven't changed a bit in the last few years. Actually, not a lot has changed hardware based.

But what has changed is that Apple took out the 'premium' cable out of the package (it was there always!), and weight of the MBP and packaging in general.
Click to expand...

Like a lot of people, you mistake "premium" with "value" or "quality". Premium is a price category, not a quality measurement. It's premium because it costs more, not the other way around.


c0ppo said:
So then, if it isn't the TB, what is it? CPU? Mediocre GPU?
Click to expand...

It's the shareholders. Revenue must grow in this new world where people rely on mobile phones for more and more of their personal computing and incentive to upgrade is really low. Apple was able to grow Mac sales until recently, but now the only way for them to increase revenue is to start raising prices. Microsoft is doing a similar thing with the Surface line, because the PC market is saturated, Intel is stagnating and you cannot increase profits with growth any more - so you have to start charging more. It's simple economy, really. It has absolutely nothing to do with the price of individual components. And certainly very little to do with TB. They added the TB because they think it's a cool idea and they think it will be a good marketing opportunity to get people to buy new Macs - but the MBP is not more expensive because of it. It would cost the same without it.

One could argue that Apple added the TB to try to justify the price increase to ordinary customers (flashy new thing), but in reality that price increase was imminent, with or without the Touch Bar.


c0ppo said:
Or keyboard that gets stuck now and then? What is so premium about this MBP that previous generations lacked? What contributes to the price increase?
Click to expand...


See above.


c0ppo said:
I'm so sorry that expressing my own personal opinion hurts your feelings ;)
Click to expand...

And now you assume you've somehow hurt my feelings. You assume a lot :) This is a standard (and very plain) trick in a discussion - like asking the person you're arguing with "why are they nervous".

So, no, my feelings weren't hurt, I was just pointing out the fallacy of your reasoning.

c0ppo said:
I have 0 problems paying for a MBP, even if the prices go further up. But I have problem paying for something I don't consider is gonna help me get my job done. Quite the opposite.
Click to expand...


Same as everyone. Considering the MBP is selling very good, a lot of people seem to think it is going to help them get their job done. I know it helps me.
 
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