Why I Returned the MacBook Neo

[Mach 5]

Have to laugh at “abuse the return policy.” I haven’t returned an Apple product in 20 years other than a first gen MacBbook Air defective out of the box as mentioned.

I returned the Neo because its screen wasn’t good enough. In other words, the product failed for me.

Let’s keep repeating the same thing over and over. Yes, I knew the specs. A non-p3 panel with almost identical PPI to a MacBook Air. Apple did not state the type of glass they used for the screen, or much of any details of the LCD panel, including whether it was laminated or not.

Therefore, critical parts of what makes a good screen were not known from written specs. In person, it took me 5 seconds to notice the poor viewing angles, washed out colours and slightly distorted content.

No amount of arguing, pushback, accusations, etc. will change the fact that THE NEO FAILED MY EXPECTATIONS.

It's too bad that you couldn't see it before buying it

 

[ipsedixit]

Ask yourself this.

For about ~$500 (with student discount, which everyone is basically eligible for), how many Apple products -- any product, phone, wearable, laptop, desktop, etc. -- can match Neo's performance with an OEM warranty?

I'll wait.

Spoiler: Answer

Not many, if any at all, for all practical purposes -- at least according to ChatGPT

 

[Pbwallstreet]

Ask yourself this.

For about ~$500 (with student discount, which everyone is basically eligible for), how many Apple products -- any product, phone, wearable, laptop, desktop, etc. -- can match Neo's performance with an OEM warranty?

I'll wait.

Spoiler: Answer

Not many, if any at all, for all practical purposes -- at least according to ChatGPT

View attachment 2615463

I never introduced price as some magic metric. Price was not important to me and it's not the only factor. And comparing Apple's to Apple's is what matters. The M5 MacBook Air handily beats the Neo in single core and destroys the Neo in multi-core and graphics performance as well as SSD speed. Everyone here knows the Neo's limitations and if these things are important to a person, they will consider that in whatever they are buying. Also, an M5 MacBook Air base model comes with double the Neo's base RAM and double the Neo's SSD memory.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

I played with a Neo in Walmart today, they had a display for it and a live computer. This is perfect for me. I travel a lot to developing countries and this is a perfect laptop to take that I can afford to lose.

Yeah I have to admit. I would still never buy one as I would get an M5/M4 Macbook Air. But I have always been willing to pay more so I didn't understand why anyone would want one--given the much-discussed shortcomings.

But it is a Mac and it is $600/$500 education. I used it for a minute or two (they had the Citrus one out) and then messed with the equivalent (and cheaper) Windows laptops there.

It wasn't close. The Mac blew them all away. I can admit when I am wrong.

 

[Mainsail]

When discussing the target market for the Neo, one thing that often gets missed is that many people have employer provided computers/laptops for their work related activity. That's where they do the heavy lifting.

So, for these folks, the Neo might just be a supplemental laptop for personal use. Of course they could use an iPad, but some people prefer MacOS to iPadOS. They now have a low cost option with the Neo.

As just one example, there are lots of people taking professional classes in their spare time to advance their careers. The Neo might be perfect for these folks.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

Here's another good video. I honestly can't see myself ever buying another Windows PC. But over the next coming months. I'm expecting several PC manufacturers to respond.

Yeah I am expecting the basics to really matter once again on the Windows side. Which may be the best part if you are into Windows. The Neo will prompts PC manufacturers to improve the low end of the product mix.

 

[teralpar]

As just one example, there are lots of people taking professional classes in their spare time to advance their careers. The Neo might be perfect for these folks.

This is one of the main reasons why I bought my Neo. It's much easier to carry around and use at work and the library than carrying my MBP 16". I have an M4 iPad Pro 13" also but there are some things I prefer using MacOS for when it comes to school work.

 

[I7guy]

I never introduced price as some magic metric. Price was not important to me and it's not the only factor. And comparing Apple's to Apple's is what matters. The M5 MacBook Air handily beats the Neo in single core and destroys the Neo in multi-core and graphics performance as well as SSD speed. Everyone here knows the Neo's limitations and if these things are important to a person, they will consider that in whatever they are buying. Also, an M5 MacBook Air base model comes with double the Neo's base RAM and double the Neo's SSD memory.

When shopping for technology you can have your wants, needs requirements. Sure a fancy oled screen is the best but the neo screen imo, is more than acceptable.

The entire package is designed very well for the price. If someone doesn’t like the display the NEo isn’t for you.im not going to defend it.

For me the Neo is a very good combination of price and value. YMMV.

 

[ipsedixit]

I never introduced price as some magic metric. Price was not important to me and it's not the only factor. And comparing Apple's to Apple's is what matters. The M5 MacBook Air handily beats the Neo in single core and destroys the Neo in multi-core and graphics performance as well as SSD speed. Everyone here knows the Neo's limitations and if these things are important to a person, they will consider that in whatever they are buying. Also, an M5 MacBook Air base model comes with double the Neo's base RAM and double the Neo's SSD memory.

If price was not an important factor, then why did you buy the Neo?

It's a budget product aimed at the price conscious crowd.

If price was not important to you, then why not just get the M5 Macbook Pro? Price be damned, since it's so "not important."

 

[turbineseaplane]

@Pbwallstreet

Well, I’m guessing you learned the lesson to never share anything about your purchasing decisions unless it’s totally positive and pro Apple.

This thread has been really incredible. Not in a good way.

For the record, I enjoyed you sharing your experience.

 

[ikramerica]

That's the truth. Some of the posters are even challenging the OP's sense of vision 😅

A former coworker of mine who's a professional musician (he plays classical music of various kinds) can hear the most subtle changes in tone, notes, and so on, while I don't. There is not a possible way for me to equal his sense of hearing. Not all of us at unison see, or hear, or feel, identically the same.

If he sees a problem nobody else sees and isn’t just being hyperbolic, then what can one conclude? People asked if maybe it was a bad unit, but he claimed to see it in the store when he returned it.

So one can posit that his eyes are seeing it differently than the rest of the world.

Maybe his vision is so amazing he notices problems others just don’t see? And those problems are so glaring he can’t ignore them?

So his eyes are in “too good of shape.”

 

[Dirk Pieters]

I think people want to prove to others that a product is “bad,” when in reality they simply aren’t the target audience. The same thing happened with iPhone Air. None of them ever seriously considered it as their only phone. They bought it as if they were “trying it out,” but the real reason was that they could return it and then come here to say how bad it was.

Original post certainly feels like that: looking for an excuse to return it.

 

[darngooddesign]

Got my Neo today. Put it through some paces, and just got back from the Apple Store to return it.

Why I returned it:

• The screen size is just a little bit too small for my liking. The 13.6” MBA size is a better size for me. I could sort of live with this, if it wasn’t for:
• The screen quality is just not good enough for me. Two main issues with it: the viewing angles are noticeably worse than a MBA and MBP screen and the clarity and crispness of the text and graphics is noticeably not as good as a MBA or MBP. Everything looks slightly blurred on screen in comparison to Apple’s Pro devices and even compared to the MBA.

The Neo’s screen made me feel like I was stepping back in time. I can’t go to a screen like that when I use devices like the iPhone 17 Pro Max, the iPad Pro M5, the MacBook Pro M series, and a M3 MacBook Air.

I did side by side comparisons with the same content as well just to make sure my eyes weren’t playing tricks on me.

Overall really nice device though. Great build quality, nice keyboard and trackpad, decent sounding audio, ran apps well, etc.

UPDATE: I BOUGHT THE NEO BECAUSE I AM LOOKING TO REPLACE MY 15” M3 MBA WITH A SMALLER DEVICE AS THE MBA IS MY NON-WORK PERSONAL LAPTOP. I BOUGHT THE NEO TO PUT IT THROUGH ITS PACES AT HOME OVER A SEVERAL DAY PERIOD, NOT A FLEETING HANDFUL OF MINUTES IN A RETAIL STORE. I INTENDED TO KEEP IT AND DON’T REGULARLY RETURN PRODUCTS TO APPLE. THE SPECS OF A SCREEN ARE NOT ENOUGH TO KNOW AHEAD OF TIME WITHOUT USING THE DEVICE WHETHER IT’S ACCEPTABLE OR NOT.

Thanks for sharing your experience. Apple's return policy is there for a reason and they will be happy with your buying an 13" Air instead. Also, your return means one more Neo refurb in the pipeline. 😁

 

[I7guy]

Everyone is entitled to their own price to value ratio. For me I went to the Apple store to play with it to ensure it wasn’t some bottom of the barrel manufactured item.

For $600 I expected something gimped but imo Apple under promised and over delivered.

It’s not about posting only positive stuff, but yeah a $600 computer compared to a $1200 computer will have compromises.

 

[Meedoss]

Have to laugh at “abuse the return policy.” I haven’t returned an Apple product in 20 years other than a first gen MacBbook Air defective out of the box as mentioned.

I returned the Neo because its screen wasn’t good enough. In other words, the product failed for me.

Let’s keep repeating the same thing over and over. Yes, I knew the specs. A non-p3 panel with almost identical PPI to a MacBook Air. Apple did not state the type of glass they used for the screen, or much of any details of the LCD panel, including whether it was laminated or not.

Therefore, critical parts of what makes a good screen were not known from written specs. In person, it took me 5 seconds to notice the poor viewing angles, washed out colours and slightly distorted content.

No amount of arguing, pushback, accusations, etc. will change the fact that THE NEO FAILED MY EXPECTATIONS.

Apple reps promote being able to try and return so wouldn't worry about that, some people on here think everyone lives near a Apple Store, I am 6 hour drive and have never set foot in one, and have been all apple since 4s, first iPad and 21"/27" iMacs.

Screen quality is most important to me, I am no pro but own all pro screens, some people don't care or don't realise the difference between apple products.

 

[Technerd108]

I bet businesses will start buying these up for employees, point of sale, etc.

People haven't even discussed the potential business applications of a cheap deployable, and portable Mac. Put a big case on it and put it out on the field. Something breaks, no problem get a new one.

If I had a small business and my employees just did admin work or similar these Neos would be perfect.

I think there is another huge market potential that opened up for Apple.

 

[sdfox7]

I've had my silver Neo for a day. Wanted an extra machine to play around with around the house and this is CHEAP!!

At $499 with my student discount, the Neo fully meets my expectations. It would even at the standard $599. It's half the price of the MBA, but more than half as good.

The design, build quality, performance and feature set is fully acceptable at this price point.

Anyone who thinks the Neo is a bad product is not the target consumer for this product, and has unrealistic expectations. First world problems.

The availability of the Neo is the difference between someone being able to afford a Mac, or not.

 

[Technerd108]

I've had my silver Neo for a day. Wanted an extra machine to play around with around the house and this is CHEAP!!

At $499 with my student discount, the Neo fully meets my expectations. It would even at the standard $599. It's half the price of the MBA, but more than half as good.

The design, build quality, performance and feature set is fully acceptable at this price point.

Anyone who thinks the Neo is a bad product is not the target consumer for this product, and has unrealistic expectations. First world problems.

The availability of the Neo is the difference between someone being able to afford a Mac, or not.

Think this time next year if there is a new Neo released I bet Apple will keep Neo 1 and price it at $499 and then with Apple edu discount could go down to $399. That is an affordable Mac!!

I agree at $499 it is one heck of a laptop!!

Honestly I am simply happy Apple has entered the low end market.

Years ago when Macs were much more expensive comparatively to Windows laptops I really wished Apple would release the OS to any hardware like MS did with Windows. Simply for us folks who loved MacOS but just couldn't justify the extra cost over Windows at that time.

Now with the Neo I think Apple is finally addressing a core audience that formerly were prohibited from Macs due to cost while still providing a leading class product in that class.

I am hopeful for the years to come when new Neos come out and get more features and older neos get even cheaper further lowering the bar to entry for MacOS. This is great news for Mac users.

 

[Pbwallstreet]

If price was not an important factor, then why did you buy the Neo?

It's a budget product aimed at the price conscious crowd.

If price was not important to you, then why not just get the M5 Macbook Pro? Price be damned, since it's so "not important."

If you read my original post, then you will have your answer.

 

[Pbwallstreet]

@Pbwallstreet

Well, I’m guessing you learned the lesson to never share anything about your purchasing decisions unless it’s totally positive and pro Apple.

This thread has been really incredible. Not in a good way.

For the record, I enjoyed you sharing your experience.

Thanks for that.

 

[Pbwallstreet]

If he sees a problem nobody else sees and isn’t just being hyperbolic, then what can one conclude? People asked if maybe it was a bad unit, but he claimed to see it in the store when he returned it.

So one can posit that his eyes are seeing it differently than the rest of the world.

Maybe his vision is so amazing he notices problems others just don’t see? And those problems are so glaring he can’t ignore them?

So his eyes are in “too good of shape.”

There is a difference in the screens and you know that, not the least of which is the significantly reduced colour spectrum. This is just trolling at this point.

 

[Pbwallstreet]

I've had my silver Neo for a day. Wanted an extra machine to play around with around the house and this is CHEAP!!

At $499 with my student discount, the Neo fully meets my expectations. It would even at the standard $599. It's half the price of the MBA, but more than half as good.

The design, build quality, performance and feature set is fully acceptable at this price point.

Anyone who thinks the Neo is a bad product is not the target consumer for this product, and has unrealistic expectations. First world problems.

The availability of the Neo is the difference between someone being able to afford a Mac, or not.

Thanks for chiming in with your experience. I thought I would respond and ensure that you notice certain things I'm saying by bolding those words. Are there any cons in your experience with the Neo or it's all incredible?

 

[Pbwallstreet]

Think this time next year if there is a new Neo released I bet Apple will keep Neo 1 and price it at $499 and then with Apple edu discount could go down to $399. That is an affordable Mac!!

I agree at $499 it is one heck of a laptop!!

Honestly I am simply happy Apple has entered the low end market.

Years ago when Macs were much more expensive comparatively to Windows laptops I really wished Apple would release the OS to any hardware like MS did with Windows. Simply for us folks who loved MacOS but just couldn't justify the extra cost over Windows at that time.

Now with the Neo I think Apple is finally addressing a core audience that formerly were prohibited from Macs due to cost while still providing a leading class product in that class.

I am hopeful for the years to come when new Neos come out and get more features and older neos get even cheaper further lowering the bar to entry for MacOS. This is great news for Mac users.

Too much focus on the hardware. I get that the Neo can help penetrate more of the Windows market. That's great and I hope it does. But I don't see it putting much of a dent in it. Because... drum roll...

It's all about the software. And Microsoft 100% rules in the business world. I use Macs but I have to work with Microsoft all day. I'm in software development and work with large enterprise applications and live in Microsoft's ecosystem for work and I have partnered with them for AI development. The combination of Microsoft's 365 applications, AI built into their apps including enterprise applications, Copilot Studio, Azure AI Foundry, Fabric, Low code Power App platform, etc. etc. it's just not even close.

Microsoft is building an ecosystem where you can deploy AI Agent Doppelgängers that will login and use a virtual machine and be autonomous. They're refining their AI Agent Studio. They're revamping the whole concept of creating, customizing and maintaining software using AI. And automating key aspects of DevOps.

From their consumer based applications that are well integrated together and have AI baked into them, to the enterprise side, they are quite far ahead of Apple in their software ecosystem.

What Apple needs to do in my opinion, aside from more affordable devices like the Neo is this:

1. Revamp their core software offerings including total code rewrites of the online versions of these (e.g., Numbers online).
2. Introduce a new application builder that uses AI as its main interface to build.
3. Create and launch a new search engine that will have AI as its main experience. This search engine may screen each website listed in its index to remove spam and garbage that's on the Internet.
4. Offer virtual machines for AI Agents and have a new AI Agent builder studio for consumers and business customers.
5. Revamp the operating system and offer new classes of devices, including a large touchscreen monitor.
6. Hire armies of business account managers to penetrate the enterprise.
7. I could go on and on...

 

[Technerd108]

Too much focus on the hardware. I get that the Neo can help penetrate more of the Windows market. That's great and I hope it does. But I don't see it putting much of a dent in it. Because... drum roll...

It's all about the software. And Microsoft 100% rules in the business world. I use Macs but I have to work with Microsoft all day. I'm in software development and work with large enterprise applications and live in Microsoft's ecosystem for work and I have partnered with them for AI development. The combination of Microsoft's 365 applications, AI built into their apps including enterprise applications, Copilot Studio, Azure AI Foundry, Fabric, Low code Power App platform, etc. etc. it's just not even close.

Microsoft is building an ecosystem where you can deploy AI Agent Doppelgängers that will login and use a virtual machine and be autonomous. They're refining their AI Agent Studio. They're revamping the whole concept of creating, customizing and maintaining software using AI. And automating key aspects of DevOps.

From their consumer based applications that are well integrated together and have AI baked into them, to the enterprise side, they are quite far ahead of Apple in their software ecosystem.

What Apple needs to do in my opinion, aside from more affordable devices like the Neo is this:

1. Revamp their core software offerings including total code rewrites of the online versions of these (e.g., Numbers online).
2. Introduce a new application builder that uses AI as its main interface to build.
3. Create and launch a new search engine that will have AI as its main experience. This search engine may screen each website listed in its index to remove spam and garbage that's on the Internet.
4. Offer virtual machines for AI Agents and have a new AI Agent builder studio for consumers and business customers.
5. Revamp the operating system and offer new classes of devices, including a large touchscreen monitor.
6. Hire armies of business account managers to penetrate the enterprise.
7. I could go on and on...

AI is great but I think you may be placing a lot more value in it than the average cash strapped consumer. Beyond photo edits and summerizations that are superfluous I don't see the benefit for consumers buying the Neo?

There are some people who are rather adverse to AI, specially AI in the OS, AI developing OS code and GUI, AI tracking and predictive models, etc. Privacy may still trump the novelty of AI for a significant segment of the population.

If AI is all you got to sell MS then you are in trouble. All that legacy software and code is holding Windows back at this point.

Just because business is cheap and wants to run the same software for years doesn't mean that consumers need Windows 2000 software compatibility in 2026. There may be a lot of business software aimed for MS simply because of MS office and it doesn't mean it is good. If business could get off MS office then it might free business away from Windows.

Apple should aim to produce a better MS Office alternative that is actually better than Office and is completely compatible with it in formats. Offer this alternative as free software included with MacOS as they already do with Pages, etc. Currently Pages and the like are not good enough to compete.

Finally hardware is really important and maybe something you are not placing enough value in. I have Windows laptops and MacBooks both from the same recent time and even top windows laptops are not as nicely made as my MacBook. To have a fan less laptop at $600 is pretty sweet. A lot of people have never had a laptop without fans in the $600 price range before. The build quality, design, battery and performance are huge. Add Apple's better software experience that is cohesive on multiple devices in a way Windows or Android can't yet replicate fully.

Wait, wait, wait.......I thought your main complaint with the Neo was it's hardware?? The screen wasn't good right? Yet now you say it is the software that is important?? Anyone who has a focus on quality software generally likes Apple software over Windows.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

Too much focus on the hardware. I get that the Neo can help penetrate more of the Windows market. That's great and I hope it does. But I don't see it putting much of a dent in it. Because... drum roll...

It's all about the software. And Microsoft 100% rules in the business world. I use Macs but I have to work with Microsoft all day. I'm in software development and work with large enterprise applications and live in Microsoft's ecosystem for work and I have partnered with them for AI development. The combination of Microsoft's 365 applications, AI built into their apps including enterprise applications, Copilot Studio, Azure AI Foundry, Fabric, Low code Power App platform, etc. etc. it's just not even close.

Microsoft is building an ecosystem where you can deploy AI Agent Doppelgängers that will login and use a virtual machine and be autonomous. They're refining their AI Agent Studio. They're revamping the whole concept of creating, customizing and maintaining software using AI. And automating key aspects of DevOps.

From their consumer based applications that are well integrated together and have AI baked into them, to the enterprise side, they are quite far ahead of Apple in their software ecosystem.

What Apple needs to do in my opinion, aside from more affordable devices like the Neo is this:

1. Revamp their core software offerings including total code rewrites of the online versions of these (e.g., Numbers online).
2. Introduce a new application builder that uses AI as its main interface to build.
3. Create and launch a new search engine that will have AI as its main experience. This search engine may screen each website listed in its index to remove spam and garbage that's on the Internet.
4. Offer virtual machines for AI Agents and have a new AI Agent builder studio for consumers and business customers.
5. Revamp the operating system and offer new classes of devices, including a large touchscreen monitor.
6. Hire armies of business account managers to penetrate the enterprise.
7. I could go on and on...

(As a fellow enterprise developer that is stuck in the Microsoft environment) So this is why everything sucks now in that world. Like things will hang and break and the error messages are non-existent. This is the future you want for Apple? AI has many many issues and while I use it in a limited fashion, it will be hilarious to continue to see these autonomous agents f up everything like 1 in 20 times. It's already happening. Amazon had to hire more programmers just to make up for all the AI coded downtime they have had lately. LOL.

It was so much better ten years ago when everything had a backstop. Now nothing does, and no one takes responsibility when an arcane function in Azure Data Factory doesn't work correctly. It's all shrugs across the board.

There is a reason that Microsoft is realizing that it might just lose the whole thing if it presses AI too hard and is pulling back on Copilot integration into Windows altogether.

This is not the path for Apple to emulate.