Why is Apple so quiet about the iMac Pro?

[Joe The Dragon]

All the leaked benchmarks so far seem based on the 10-core version, which runs at 3 GHz. Is it now safe to say for sure that iMac Pro runs at a lower clock rate than the native clock of the Xeon CPU? On the other hand, all reviews so far indicate that iMac Pro is vastly faster than all the other Macs. How do you guys feel about this lower clock rate of Xeon iMac Pro?

I have a mixed feeling. While it is satisfying to see an iMac Pro will easily outperform my Mac Pro 5,1 by a huge margin, it also makes me feel lost when I know the CPU is capable of running faster but prevented by Apple.

Or, does the turbo boost thing make the base clock rate irrelevant? The CPUs can still run higher than 3 GHz (10-core version) from time to time so users won't feel the difference unless running intensive multi-core jobs for a long time?

down clocked cpu's are a bad sign on the cooling part.

 

[fokmik]

how many hours until we will be able to order?

 

[Glmnet1]

Supposedly true 10 bit. The same as the iMac.

https://www.livescience.com/59512-apple-imac-can-display-1-billion-colors.html

From the article you linked:

"Unlike some displays that have 10-bit color built into the hardware of their panels, the new iMac screens will have 8-bit panels and will use a processing trick called dithering to present 1 billion colors to the user."

I'm not sure about the iMac Pro but I think it's the same, a 8bit display with dithering.

 

[thedeske]

My fav of the early reviews - http://blog.vincentlaforet.com/2017/12/12/apples-new-imacpro-has-an-impressive-200-300-speed-bump/

 

[fokmik]

nice numbers...i wonder how faster is the 18C Xeon

 

[RuffDraft]

From the article you linked:

"Unlike some displays that have 10-bit color built into the hardware of their panels, the new iMac screens will have 8-bit panels and will use a processing trick called dithering to present 1 billion colors to the user."

I'm not sure about the iMac Pro but I think it's the same, a 8bit display with dithering.

Thanks Glmnet - that's good to know!

I didn't read the article, as I'm not too bothered about this as a feature - the minute I move to 10 bit video recording will be the day I'm loaded. I can't handle 400mb/s data from multiple cameras on a wedding day, and so I'm happy for the screen to be representative of what I have in camera, but souped up so I can grade a bit better until the new Apple Display Panel comes out next year: I'll be using that as my second monitor and viewer from then on - I think it'll be a killer combo.

Still think this iMac screen is noice at 500nits too, but can completely understand people wanting true 10 bit too!

 

[fathergll]

He may be way more successful and making way more money, but they’re running a tech blog. Do you know what happens to tech sites that give no new information? They fall behind.

We’re allowed to criticise: it’s a part of the game of making films for YouTube in the first place. The same logic applies to MacRumors members telling Tim Cook that he’s losing the plot from time to time.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and the two YouTubers wasted an opportunity to take their tech videos up a notch, regardless of their audience.

If they don’t do better first impressions, someone else will, and guess who Apple will be sending the next Mac to? Not them.

Fans are fickle. They’ll go wherever the exclusives go. I’m not calling them lazy, I know YouTubers are on the grind, but it was a lazy exclusive video with little effort in terms of tests and nothing new. They’re more interested in a slider shot than explaining something groundbreaking.

Calling them kids is being too kind. These guys are men; they’re successful and they should be using their films to inform and push the envelope, not regurgitating the spec sheet.

Also, Vincent Laforet doesn’t need to be an award-winner to import some footage and tell us how fast it finished. It’s not groundbreaking or earth shattering but it is what we needed to know. Kudos to him.

A stated before MKBHD runs a tech themed YouTube channel or as Wikipedia would state "technology-focused videos". To translate this for you it means he basically running an entertainment channel that is focused on technology but it runs the gamut. This means everything from unboxing iphones to talking to Kobe Bryant He is not an authority on the things that he reviews. For example if you are a serious videophile do not go to his channel if you are in need of knowing what RGB level tracking and luminance results are on a OLED LG tv are. MKBHD is not going to tell you indepth information on the Tesla that he owns either. You made a mistake thinking a first impressions review from his channel was going to be useful for you. He is not going to devote 12 hours a day to testing the iMac Pro in order to get the testing that you want within a week. You can criticize all you want but his channel is setup for a specific audience. You can also go to a fast food restaurant expecting a rare steak and then give feedback about it but it doesn't mean much.

 

[bplein]

we'll have to wait for the iFixit teardown to know

Absolutely correct.

 

[Mr. Dee]

If are that desperate for in depth analysis, here are a couple reviews with heavy info you can check out:

http://hrtapps.com/blogs/20171212/
http://blog.vincentlaforet.com/2017/12/12/apples-new-imacpro-has-an-impressive-200-300-speed-bump/
https://www.fxguide.com/featured/exclusive-hands-on-with-the-1st-of-the-new-apple-pro-lineup/

 

[Think creative]

I believe it does. Many CPUs are overclocked by the user tweaking settings to overclock them. Therefore, when Intel says that it's good for up to 4.5GHz... it'll run at this speed whenever it is needed, which is quite clear from Laforet's post. It's a beast.



This makes sense. I agree with you on that front. It's just a shame that he can't tell us this in his videos, as then I wouldn't be mad at the fact that he wasted his opportunity with the model to help all of us who are in the market for this machine.

People's invested time with older Macs make this iMac Pro a very important vehicle for a lot of businesses. On average, I'm losing two days for every seven that I have editing due to the age of my system. This iMac Pro is what I've been holding on for as a small business owner, and so I really hoped for more tests like Laforet's and the Space Engineer guy who have both given us very appealing benchmarks with real world tests. This will do me fine, as I'll be ordering at midnight or whenever it goes live, but I just wished there was more to go off before I custom built mine using Apple's website; in particular, which spec you should go for when using FCPX and multi-cam / effects etc.

I can't hang on for the in-depth reviews, and as others have pointed out, I don't need to, as I'll have ordered one by this time tomorrow, but it's just frustrating that such a huge investment is going on very few benchmarks. I'd wait before ordering, but I know enough now to know that this is going to be a huge payoff for my business and I needed one last year...

I also like Casey... I like YouTube in general and agree that the tech reviews MKBHD does are great... but that's why I was disappointed with the video as I know he could have done a lot better.



It's not jealousy: it's frustration. When your business runs on Apple software and hardware, things are personal. Their choices affect my life.

Therefore, I can't just order one and go with it... then send it back. I need to know which spec'd model to order and how that will pay off between the different choices that will be available etc.

That said, a lot of business owners have held on for this Mac and we have had to wait far too long (since 2013) for another powerhouse Mac. I wasn't willing to shell £5K on a trash can by the end of 2015/early 2016, so I chose to wait, and wait I did.

Apple knows this, have apologised and delivered something incredible, though not exactly what pros were asking for (an AIO), but people like me can't wait another year for that new modular Mac Pro machine to be announced - it would destroy growth in my business, so this iMac Pro is the answer and I'm rolling the dice with it.

Hopefully you can see from the above why a pointless iMac Pro preview was met with frustration when the users have had them for a week. They had our answer, but were unable (for whatever reason) to tell us much more than we already knew.
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Thanks phobos. Exactly how I feel too... and I understand the latter as well.

Max Yuryev has paid for being honest, as Panasonic don't really like him after his autofocus test on the Panasonic GH5... as you'll probably know too...

It's a difficult rope to walk for sure, but they have these privileges, and a lot of the real pros are looking at them for help that they're not receiving.
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Supposedly true 10 bit. The same as the iMac.

https://www.livescience.com/59512-apple-imac-can-display-1-billion-colors.html

Now that I get your frustration as a small business owner (I run a business myself, though right now I'm just publishing novels, so my iMac 5k is all of the machine I need, and it does it's job amazingly well) I totally get why you wanted the actual review before you order. If I was in need of a new rig to make me not lose time, I would be in the exact same boat as you. I'll be curious to know what you think when you get it!

 

[macnmac]

man... how long before i get to order my max spec pro monster

 

[RuffDraft]

Now that I get your frustration as a small business owner (I run a business myself, though right now I'm just publishing novels, so my iMac 5k is all of the machine I need, and it does it's job amazingly well) I totally get why you wanted the actual review before you order. If I was in need of a new rig to make me not lose time, I would be in the exact same boat as you. I'll be curious to know what you think when you get it!

Nice on publishing novels - that's a great way to live your life, I imagine!

Thanks - I'll try to give my impressions at some point, but I'll have to finish my current project on my MacBook Pro due to FCPX libraries being different and not currently on board with High Sierra.

I'll post my thoughts before the end of the year, for sure though - I think I'll also do some tests for fun, as I know how much faster this iMac Pro is going to be vs 2011 MacBook Pro... it's most likely going to be quite laughable.

Hopefully I'll have it before the end of the year, as Apple may not have the config I want as an available model.

Will be checking at 1am, 4am and 7am/8am/9am to see when this is going to go live in the UK for ordering. I was going to check at 3 and 5 but nothing's happened on the Apple site, which suggests that it'll be 8am onwards.

 

[Brammy]

I can't afford one, and don't need all that power. But holy cow do I want one.

 

[Mr. Dee]

I can't afford one, and don't need all that power. But holy cow do I want one.

I want one, but the all in one thing is just too risky. My HP Z210 Workstation is starting to show signs of aging. The Ethernet port got hit by lightening recently, so, its ripe for replacement. Back in 2011 when I got it, I wasn't thinking I would be using all of its power. Seven years later, its just as average as my Acer Aspire.

I promised myself I wouldn't go back into desktops, but I did say I would be replacing most of my Windows PC's with Macs. I'm waiting to see what Apple does with the Mac Mini and Mac Pro. I do need the power to run a lot of VMs, but it still feels like overkill. But, considering how long I keep my devices, it would be a long term investment.

 

[Macintosh IIcx]

This is a good point. Below are some quotes from the transcript of that briefing (various Apple speakers, emphasis added):

"it is, by definition, a modular system...build something that enables us to do these quick, regular updates and keep it current and keep it state of the art...We need an architecture that can deliver across a wide dynamic range of performance and that we can efficiently keep it up to date with the best technologies over years....the Mac has always been about that, it’s been about not doing conventional thinking, not ‘me too’ stuff....the architecture, over time, proved to be less flexible to take us where we wanted to go to address that audience. In hindsight, we would’ve done that differently. Now we are...."

It is also at odds with Apple's highly-developed, high-density manufacturing prowess.
It seems unlikely the modular Mac Pro will be a PCIe slot box OR use the ATX form factor. The ATX form-factor dates to the mid-1990s. You can see the opinion of how antiquated the ATX form factor is in this discussion by industry professionals: https://www.realworldtech.com/forum/?threadid=163257&curpostid=164090

It is more likely the next Mac Pro will demonstrate Apple's engineering and high-density manufacturing skill, and not be an updated, slightly shrunken "cheese grater" Mac Pro slot box.

Great post, joema2! I think the point Apple was making is that they want to be able refresh motherboards, CPU and GPU with more of-the-shelf parts than in the current Mac Pro. Both the motherboard and the GPUs in that were very much custom designs that would just be to costly to re-engineer each year. I honestly think that was the main issue with the nMP; that they didn’t upgrade the CPU, mobo, GPU and ram each year.

 

[ixxx69]

Great post, joema2! I think the point Apple was making is that they want to be able refresh motherboards, CPU and GPU with more of-the-shelf parts than in the current Mac Pro. Both the motherboard and the GPUs in that were very much custom designs that would just be to costly to re-engineer each year. I honestly think that was the main issue with the nMP; that they didn’t upgrade the CPU, mobo, GPU and ram each year.

Apple ALWAYS custom designs the MB - even the lauded MP 1,1 - 5,1 used completely proprietary MB's. CPU & RAM are not custom. The only truly "custom" part of the nMP was the GPU, and that's where the nMP was apparently too limited for upgrading... the power requirements and cooling of current high multi-core CPUs & two GPUs was too much for the current design.

Also take into account what they didn't say but is widely understood to be true considering the evidence... After the nMP showed underwhelming sales, Apple planned to drop the Mac Pro completely and focus on the iMac Pro. They don't want to admit that, so they spin.

I do agree that Apple's main point is that this new Mac Pro will be easier to refresh, not that it will be a reincarnation of the cMP tower. While I wouldn't discount anything at this point, Apple almost always wants to do it a little differently, so anyone expecting a return of the cMP is likely to be disappointed.