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It's sort of incredible how people who are tech savvy have no business sense. I sometimes am annoyed at Apple, but what they are doing makes sense.This is the deal, as simply as I can put it.

With iPhone/iPad, Apple opened a new revenue stream for businesses - a new way to make money they were not able to before. They sell an app (say for $1) and Apple gets 30% of that sale. This is pretty standard. Now these companies can make millions they would not have made before. And of course Apple makes money too.

Then with certain apps, companies can sell other items inside the app, say books. So once again they have a new way to make more money, again money they were not getting before. With the in-app sales, Apple gets nothing. A company might sell a finite number of the apps, but the in-app sales is infinite. Apple comes along and says, hey, we should get a cut, as we were the ones who created the new revenue stream for you. And guess what, that's standard for any business! They would be stupid to say no to Apple because they would then give up all this new money. As said many times over, 70% of some is way better than 100% of nothing.

It may sound like greed to some people, but that's good business. And it's common in all industries! Just as those companies selling in-app items can have expanding business, Apple business needs to expand too. If they did not take a cut, they would be silly, and losing out on huge growth opportunities. All app stores will do this. Andriod also does the 70-30 split. I'm not 100% sure about in-app purchases, but if not now, they certainly will. Business, people! Business!

I think most people know the in-app purchase gives Apple a cut.

But even without the cut, Apple benefits from keeping the Kindle app on its iPad through increased hardware sales. Anyone in the market for an e-Reader is more willing to buy an iPad since it has the best e-Reader app / eBook store on the market. Anyone looking to replace their Kindle is more willing to buy an iPad because they can transfer their library over. And Apple doesn't have to spend money on developing that inferior app called iBooks (they can just let it rot like they've been doing) or trying to get all publishers on board (which they stopped trying to do after the hype went away). Instead they can just let Amazon do all the work that makes the iPad a viable e-Reader for them and make money off the hardware.

Basically it would be stupid for them to drop the Kindle app when they have nothing to replace it. iBooks doesn't count.
 
That's exactly my point. Apple has locked down the iPad to only install apps from the App Store. This is not normal for a device marketed as a general computing platform.

I guess since books take up more room, there's not as much of a chance to create an HTML5 web app for Amazon. The beauty of the native app is that it gets the resources of the device including memory.

With regards to what Amazon will do, I'm wondering if they'll just rely on pre-existing customers for a while? Most everyone who would install the Kindle app, already have. Might as well let those users run their course for a while before you update the app to remove the link. If they don't update, the apps will remain on the iOS devices that have them already installed and theoretically there won't be any new installs from the app store. So, the choices are

1) Take a 30% hit from new and existing iOS app sales
2) Take 100% revenue from existing iOS app installations with no new installations.
 
It's Apple's store, they have a right to dictate what is sold in it and their position is reasonable. They're not killing the app, they're simply saying that if Amazon wants to profit from Apple's store, Apple ought to get something out of the deal.

Let me help you understand where your argument is falling apart:

It's [Microsoft]'s [OS], they have a right to dictate what is [installed] on it and their position is reasonable. They're not [blocking other browsers], they're simply saying that if [customers] want to [install] [Netscape]'s [software], [Microsoft] ought to get something out of the deal.

Apple currently has 90+ percent of the tablet market in the US.
Microsoft had 90+ percent of the PC operating system market in the 1990s.
 
It's not free advertising. Apple gets a 30% cut of every app they sell. That's like saying Target is providing Sony free advertising when they put their Blu-Ray players on display, or put them in the weekly mailer.

True, some apps are free. But Apple puts free apps in their ads because they know saying "thousands of great, free apps" entices people to buy iPhones and iPads. They're not doing these app developers any favors.

You could easily turn the argument around and say Apple owes Kindle, Netflix, etc. for making these apps available on the iPhone, making their platform more attractive to customers. Neither of these arguments is correct. Apple needs the developers and the developers need Apple.

OK, Vizin, I hate to say this, but you sir really don't know what you are talking about.

You have no understanding of advertising or marketing. You also have no understanding of business. Did you not read my post about new revenue streams?! Yes some apps make the platform more attractive. But NO, if you are a dev, you CANNOT turn this around. Apple makes the revenue stream, devs pay to be part of it. End of story. Go learn business!

Also, Apple doesn't only put free apps in their ads, it's a mix with some paid apps. Not that has anything to do with anything.

I'm through with you sir!
 
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...Distributers of goods? 30% for being the middle man? Crazy talk. Apple needs to wake up and realize the difference between original content publishing and re-distribution of content.

You mean like they do for music with iTMS?
Or like music distrobutors did before them?
...Will it ever stop? ;)
 
The third time I ask you this. Can you explain me why Amazon/Netflix/B&N/Spotify owes anything to Apple when there is a transaction from Safari Browser?


Apple's argument would be that they don't. They don't want people originating transactions with Apps from their store without giving them equal opportunity. I don't really agree with Apple on this because companies like Netflix, Kindle, B&N, and Hulu add value to the platform.

It was not a big deal for content owners, since they pay more in affiliate fees then Apple's cut, but the policy hurts middle men, and some of those middle men are very good for iOS.
 
OK, Vizin, I hate to say this, but you sir really don't know what you are talking about.

You have no understanding of advertising or marketing. You also have no understanding of business. Did you not read my post about new revenue streams?! Yes some apps make the plat for more attractive. But NO, if you are a dev, you CANNOT turn this around. Apple makes the revenue stream, devs pay to be part of it. End of story. Go learn business!

Also, Apple doesn't only put free apps in their ads, it's a mix with some paid apps. Not that has anything to do with anything.

I'm through with you sir!

So Apple, Google, MS etc have to pay a cut to AT&T, Verizon, Vodafone, etc for providing a new revenue stream like mobile market?
 
It doesn't matter what anyone or I thinks. The justice department and FTC are investigating Apple for their subscription model. Removing Kindle is not going to help their cause.

If you define the market as mobile apps, Apple has a monopoly, unquestionably. Just ask any app developer.
 
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You missed the point. I wasn't saying Apple was gracious. I was point out that the relationship has a very strong give and take. Apple and devs support each other. Someone else way saying it was all about the devs. Please read before you speak.

Apple wasn't showing third party apps to help them grow. Apple was showing third party apps to sell their hardware.

Do you think that if iBooks had been available since 2007 like Kindle books that the ads would have been about the possibility to read Kindle books on the iPad? No, they would have been about iBooks.
 
I for one, absolutely love books.
Got a few on the desk now, they're paper books, I flick through them, scribble in them, smell them, bend them, throw them in the boot of my car and drop them in swimming pools. They're great.

I've got a few on Kindle/iBooks, and as much as I persevere with the ePub revolution, I'm always going back to bloody wonderful paper books.

Anyone with me on this?

...oh just me then!
 
Apple wasn't showing third party apps to help them grow. Apple was showing third party apps to sell their hardware.

Do you think that if iBooks had been available since 2007 like Kindle books that the ads would have been about the possibility to read Kindle books on the iPad? No, they would have been about iBooks.

Is there an add with Pandora, Spotify, Netflix or Hulu?
 
So Apple, Google, MS etc have to pay a cut to AT&T, Verizon, Vodafone, etc for providing a new revenue stream like mobile market?

Are you brain damaged? Or are you pulling my leg?

Everyone has to make deals with the carriers. And in case you didn't know it's the same in the cable/tv industry.

I can't believe you would even ask such a silly question.

Sir, I am also through with you.
 
Really? You're not going to open that crazy can of worms again are you?:)

As far as "their" device, lets just say the device they created that allows all the business access to a new revenue stream. Hope that covers it. :p

It's not the device, it's the control of the store. Basically Apple doesn't want to distribute in the App Store other "stores" of digital content unless it gets a cut. Nothing wrong with that, after all those other stores are competitors. Still, Apple is making huge amount of money selling devices (hardware+OS), I'm wondering if trying to control the digital content market as well will be in the long run a winning move for them, surely not for consumers.
 
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Perhaps not if you read the post out of context, within the context of this thread it should be clear what was meant.

Maybe you should read the context more carefully. Sometimes a conversation veers tangentially (or worse) from the point of the thread. Oletros is all over the place in his arguments.
 
Are you brain damaged? Or are you pulling my leg?

Everyone has to make deals with the carriers. And in case you didn't know it's the same in the cable/tv industry.

I can't believe you would even ask such a silly question.

Sir, I am also through with you.

Apart from insulting, can you provide any argument or answer any question?


Perhaps the brain damaged and fanatic are not the ones you're insulting when they doesn't have your opinion
 
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