Windows Goes Multi-Touch

[NT1440]

Try this experiment. Hold your arm out straight for 60 seconds. A little fatigued, no? Now multiply that by your best guess as to how long you use your computer during the day. My point is that using multi-touch on a vertical surface for an extended length of time will be painful to the neck and shoulder. It is bad enough for some using a keyboard and mouse when gravity is not such an issue. Just my $.02

may be just your two sense, but also a very true and common sense fact, now why cant a certain company see taht?

 

[dgdosen]

I'm all for competition, but I just have more faith in Apple's design team to build a better user experience. This will be Microsoft's first release of multi-touch usage, and experience shows Microsoft's first release of anything always has flaws...

I also think MS and it's processes are fundamentally flawed. I'm going to gues whatever they produce will be over-engineered.

 

[Rhosfelt]

Of course this is ugly it is windows, i mean, even the pictures were ugly.

This is not a good idea, windows will mess up the multi-touch technology for next year, and mac will have to save the computing world once again. Plus I can do just about all of that with my iPod touch, even if I have to use the installer. They pretty much have nothing new going on...

 

[NT1440]

Of course this is ugly it is windows, i mean, even the pictures were ugly.

This is not a good idea, windows will mess up the multi-touch technology for next year, and mac will have to save the computing world once again. Plus I can do just about all of that with my iPod touch, even if I have to use the installer. They pretty much have nothing new going on...

does windows ever?

and what makes me laugh is that they are essentially relying on computer companies to have multi touch STANDARD capable computers by the release of this "new" OS. Not likely to happen, or be inexpensive. Without the touch capabilities, its essentiall vista (its been stated its built directly from vista).

no dice microsoft.

 

[inkswamp]

It has to bug them that Apple is the "darling" of the media with the iPhone and their multitouch etc... while MS is portrayed as the evil one.

I actually do think it would bother them. (well, maybe just Ballmer)

I'm sure Apple is on their radar and they are aware of the media and consumer perceptions and that they have their own opinions/feelings about that, but what I think is weird is when my fellow Mac users on these forums talk about how MS is timing any of their product releases or announcements in relation to some bit of rumored minutiae at WWDC. I'm willing to bet that most execs at MS, including Gates and Ballmer, are only peripherally aware of WWDC and are completely unaware of any rumored announcements that may occur there.

 

[Much Ado]

Hmm...

The reason there's multi-touch on the iPhone is to maximize what you can do with it, e.g. no plastic keyboards required. It makes what screen space there is more versatile.

With a desktop- err... why not just buy a keyboard?

Answers on a postcard, Microsoft.

 

[BongoBanger]

You guys do realise that it's not an exclusive means of operation, right?

Please, for the love of God, tell me you do.

 

[bikemonkey]

Quite!

This is the company that has never innovated. Never got anything right. Why does anyone think that just because they pretend this is new, that people will buy it?

To be ahead of the game you have to be right. M$ have never been right.

Interesting point of view...considering Windows is by far the highest selling and most used operating system in the world.

Also, what is with this Microsoft bashing from everyone? Yeh yeh, it's not smooth, but that's beta software for you. At least MS is trying. Who knows what input devices we'll be using in five years time and MS may have even worked out really good ergonomics for such a device by then.

I'm glad to see such a large company pushing this technology as they are in the best position to influence the market. Also, like a few people have said, if Apple had demoed this, everyone would be singing them praise.

Sometimes I feel embarrassed to use a Mac...

 

[John Dillinger]

I mean, who really would have believed Microsoft would be outselling the playstation?

They're not actually anymore. Playstation 3 with its higher price has been outselling the 360 worldwide since october/nov 07. In the US too, bar a few weeks, since jan this year. Even in the U.S.

360 has outsold the PS3 overall because it was rushed out a year early--which led to design flaws and a 3year extended warranty costing $1Billion in losses. They still havent fixed it thats whys IGN-the biggest online gaming site- runs a podcast entitled "The Three Red Rings Podcast". IGN will keep it so until the errors return to an acceptable rate. Thats embarrassing. They're the world's richest tech company. It came out November '05.

In fact, if you even compare sales of first year for 360 versus PS3, the PS3 has been selling much better, again despite retailing significantly higher. That is some achievement when you factor in all the negative press it received for being so expensive, having no games etc.

see here: http://www.vgchartz.com/

 

[dicklacara]

Apart from your call for haptics, I think you have an interesting point. I'm a fan of Engelbart's work too, ever since I saw the Scoble interview with him.

What I'm thinking is feasible, is the software to link a chord based system onto a iPhone or other Apple device. It might not push to everyone, but i'd imagine Engelbart might like a crack at porting over his glove concept to typing and gesturing via a Touch OS... You might not sell many, but it might be superior in certain applications

Yes! It is interesting to me how proficient touch-typists can also be proficient text messagers-- using two thumbs, teensy keys, or even a touch keypad.

A chord-based system, done right, could also have very broad appeal to 2-finger typists-- just because it is (or could be) easier to learn and use) than what is currently being used by millions on non-QWERTY cell phones!

If you can figure out how to single/double/triple-press keys on a 10-key pad to enter text (with some speed), playing chords to do the same should be a piece of cake!

The point: If you are going to [try to] supersede the QWERTY KB, don't give 'em a "Virtual QWERTY KB". Rather give them a solution that allows 'em to do more (and better) with less!

That, IMO, is the potential, and it applies to typists and non-typists, alike!

 

[Syrus28]

does windows ever?

and what makes me laugh is that they are essentially relying on computer companies to have multi touch STANDARD capable computers by the release of this "new" OS. Not likely to happen, or be inexpensive. Without the touch capabilities, its essentiall vista (its been stated its built directly from vista).

no dice microsoft.

Not be to rude, but don't you think that Microsoft would have a large degree of leverage over the PC manufactures, who essentially base their entire multi-billion $ existence on their product. Especially Dell, who is probably looking for any chance to take Apple out of the picture.

 

[NT1440]

You guys do realise that it's not an exclusive means of operation, right?

Please, for the love of God, tell me you do.

yes, but this is essentially the "defining" difference (why else would they demo it) between 7 and vista. and frankly not even the microsoft fanboys are all that impressed (take a hop over to engadget or giz). Sure there will be a few more tweaks and differences, but 7 is built upon vista.

 

[Much Ado]

You guys do realise that it's not an exclusive means of operation, right?

Please, for the love of God, tell me you do.

Why design something like this if you do not expect extended use?

 

[BongoBanger]

Why design something like this if you do not expect extended use?

I think you're confusing extended and constant.

 

[NT1440]

Not be to rude, but don't you think that Microsoft would have a large degree of leverage over the PC manufactures, who essentially base their entire multi-billion $ existence on their product. Especially Dell, who is probably looking for any chance to take Apple out of the picture.

well of course, but with pc's getting cheaper and cheaper, i dont think users are going to adopt pricey touchscreens very readily. For this feature to be "big" its going to have to be on almost ALL pc's, and thats just not gonna happen until prices drop substantially

 

[BongoBanger]

yes, but this is essentially the "defining" difference (why else would they demo it) between 7 and vista. and frankly not even the microsoft fanboys are all that impressed (take a hop over to engadget or giz). Sure there will be a few more tweaks and differences, but 7 is built upon vista.

Well no, it's just a taster. Since they didn't really show anything else about W7 how can we say it's the defining experience?

It's cool and no doubt Apple will follow suit.

 

[NT1440]

Interesting point of view...considering Windows is by far the highest selling and most used operating system in the world.

Also, what is with this Microsoft bashing from everyone? Yeh yeh, it's not smooth, but that's beta software for you. At least MS is trying. Who knows what input devices we'll be using in five years time and MS may have even worked out really good ergonomics for such a device by then.

I'm glad to see such a large company pushing this technology as they are in the best position to influence the market. Also, like a few people have said, if Apple had demoed this, everyone would be singing them praise.

Sometimes I feel embarrassed to use a Mac...

um, not me, touchscreen to me is completely useless on a desktop AND laptop to me, trackpad is alright, but i dont feel the need to keep touching my screen. Even if Apple had released it i personally wouldnt like it that much, but at least theres a very good OS behind it, with 7, uh, not so much (vista)

Well no, it's just a taster. Since they didn't really show anything else about W7 how can we say it's the defining experience?

It's cool and no doubt Apple will follow suit.

when people do demos, they usually show off some of the best theyve got...

 

[John Dillinger]

I'm sure Apple is on their radar and they are aware of the media and consumer perceptions and that they have their own opinions/feelings about that, but what I think is weird is when my fellow Mac users on these forums talk about how MS is timing any of their product releases or announcements in relation to some bit of rumored minutiae at WWDC. I'm willing to bet that most execs at MS, including Gates and Ballmer, are only peripherally aware of WWDC and are completely unaware of any rumored announcements that may occur there.

Im sure they have small teams dedicated to finding out exactly what the competitor is doing. It would be stupid not to. You think Steve or Bill Gates dont care about having honours of releasing x technology first?? Theyre Tech companies. And theyre CEO who are sure to have Massive Ego's. Theres a small matter of pride and esteem at stake. These are basic human traits and trust, they care and would prefer to be out first. Which company (or person for that matter) would be content to be trailing and not leading? Certainly not leading companies like Apple or Microsoft.

 

[BongoBanger]

when people do demos, they usually show off some of the best theyve got...

Well usually some cool stuff. The more interesting stuff will be how W7 functions.

I think they did this to steal a march on Apple and it worked.

 

[NT1440]

Well usually some cool stuff. The more interesting stuff will be how W7 functions.

I think they did this to steal a march on Apple and it worked.

well lets just hope that they got their act together this time...for their sake

(written on a toshiba laptop running vista, whos taskbar literally crashes EVERYTIME i go to click on a different program, requires a restart of explorer)

god i cant wait till i have the money for a (hopefully redesigned) macbook

 

[infowarfare]

Interesting point of view...considering Windows is by far the highest selling and most used operating system in the world.

And for a time Brittany Spears and the Backstreet Boys were the biggest selling and most heard music acts in the world, but that doesn't mean they were better or more talented than everyone else.

Not be to rude, but don't you think that Microsoft would have a large degree of leverage over the PC manufactures, who essentially base their entire multi-billion $ existence on their product. Especially Dell, who is probably looking for any chance to take Apple out of the picture.

Very good point. I guess that's one thing we all have to realize, it's not that Microsoft Windows is so bad in and of itself, its that they have to play to the lowest common denominator which is all the various PC Brands and their particular configurations.

When Microsoft does do it right, it's when they take a hint from the Apple playbook, i.e. when they make their own hardware like the Surface, the Xbox and the Zune. Though the latter 2 have their faults, still it shows what happens when Microsoft controls both the hardware and the software, but it's not their normal business model unfortunately.

 

[Syrus28]

And for a time Brittany Spears and the Backstreet Boys were the biggest selling and most heard music acts in the world, but that doesn't mean they were better or more talented than everyone else.

Their success would lead me to believe they did something right, which I believe is what bikemoney is referring to when G58 stated Microsoft never got anything right.

 

[hiimamac]

It would be nice, but would never happen. Microsoft gets sued for including Internet Explorer and Windows Media Player already, anything else would be suicide.

True. I know Apple has the best OS right now, just not fond of some of their business practices - I mean really, if the macbook (and this is just one example) can never play games and you can get motion to work, why rape the system for the small 1% of Pro users? What's the point? All in all, why not make it so a macbook and mini can play games and let them sell them in the millions. I just don't get it at all. From a business stand point, the loss of PRO's buying cheaper machines to run motion, FCP, would be hugely offset by the number of college kids saying wow, this is one fast machine (gaming) and would intro more people into gaming and editing. I think its a matter of when not if.

Now on to Microsoft, I read about the new OS before Vista came out and 7 will probably be what Vista should have been with bells and whistles and some competition is good. Imagine if someone wrote some code to run mac programs on a PC without the OS for example? And users got iLife?

On the other hand, you are stuck scratching your head sometimes wondering why with the billions can't Microsoft come out with something decent. I mean, hello, Zune? Time for them to step away from the copyright (same goes for mac) and make the machines more for the consumer.

I worked in the music business and saw the hit coming along time before it actually happened when I was one of the few with high speed. I predict that once we have pipe light speed in everyone's house, the networks will take a hit as will cable and satellite providers. You can already watch premium sports on the net anyway. Imagine once light speed is everywhere, all the shows that will be produced. Now add that satellite will provide net/phone access anywhere - editors will be in demand as will composers, shows will be in the thousands online and in your hand. I think Macbook Pro's 4 core with 4/8/16 core blocks to add to the machine (dock) will be the future (same for pc) and the desktop will disappear. Most laptops will be replaced by phones and small tablets. Would also like to see a paper size flexible screen that you can load documents onto and flip to read and store 100+ pages on it so you can read articles, and more. I think that will happen sooner rathe than later.

 

[Erwin-Br]

I think the whole touch screen thing will work best on a tablet PC. Holding my arms in the air is not quite convenient, so I don't think I would use this on a normal laptop or workstation.

I wish people would stop with the copycat complaining. It's embarrassing, because the technology has been around since the eighties. As a matter of fact, the first Microsoft demonstration was shown long before anyone even heard about the iPhone.

--Erwin

 

[twoodcc]

why am i not surprised? man, it's not that i love apple and hate microsoft, but i sure seem to really dislike this ballmer