WSJ: Apple's 5G Modem Prototypes 'Three Years Behind Qualcomm's Best Chip'

[sunlit]

Anyone surprised?

I for one, am surprised bigtime. If its true about "billions of dollars" and "thousands of engineers in teams across the globe" - with resources like that one can build anything, even spaceship. I suspect poor management and slack sloppy work on the part of "engineers". They were just lounging instead of working all these years, thats the only explanation.

 

[DelayedGratificationGene]

You have a market cap of 2.5 trillion. Just buy Qualcomm

Luv it. Done. No more worries lol

 

[indychris]

Cook isn't an innovator. He's never been an innovator and he'll never be an innovator. He is a manager at best who is focused on maintaining dividends and building a brand that leads the world in political correctness. He may be 'nicer' that Steve J was, but he doesn't inspire or attract the greatest levels of competency and creativity like Steve could.

Under Cook, Apple will successfully bring to market great new technologies about the same time they release their new foldable Apple Car.

 

[chucker23n1]

Apple wants to leave Qualcomm not just to save paying them money (though chip purchases, licensing fees and revenue sharing), but also because they want to be able to customize the modems for Apple-specific functionality.

This. At some point, an Apple-designed modem could integrate better with iOS: more efficient power management, smoother handling of poor reception, etc.

 

[I7guy]

Apple consists of control freaks. They want to do everything on their own and they think they can do everything better. Apple buildings chips is like Tesla trying to build cars. They might work, but they will never be a Porsche.

Tesla is not trying to build cars, they are building cars. They are building, like apple, the most popular car(phone) in the world. And you’re right they will never be Porsche, that is a good thing.

Apple shows us what things look like when they do everything in their own and it’s all good.

 

[johnpurlia]

In the last few years, Apple has spent billions of dollars attempting to develop its own modem chip to replace the Qualcomm modem chips that it uses in iPhones, but a new paywalled Wall Street Journal report suggests Apple's approach to the project has been dogged by unrealistic goals, a poor understanding of the challenges involved, and completely unusable prototypes.

Apple's plan to design its own in-house modem led to the hiring of thousands of engineers: Apple acquired the majority of Intel's smartphone modem business in 2019, and as it filled the project's ranks with Intel engineers and others hired from Qualcomm, company executives set a goal to have the modem chip ready for fall 2023.

The modem chip project was codenamed Sinope, after the nymph in Greek mythology who outsmarted Zeus.

However, "it soon became apparent to many of the wireless experts on the project that meeting the goal was impossible," according to the report.

The obstacles to finishing the chip were "largely of Apple's own making," according to former company engineers and executives familiar with the project who spoke to WSJ. Teams working on the project were "slowed by technical challenges, poor communication and managers split over the wisdom of trying to design the chips rather than buy them."

From the report:
Apple's ability to design its own microprocessors for iPhones and iPads reportedly caused the company to think it could build modem chips. However, such chips transmit and receive wireless data from various types of wireless networks, and must comply with strict connectivity standards to serve wireless carriers around the world, making them a significantly more challenging undertaking.
Executives reportedly better understood the challenge after Apple tested its prototypes late last year. The results were so poor that the chips were "essentially three years behind Qualcomm's best modem chip," and using them threatened to make iPhone wireless speeds slower than its competitors, according to people familiar with the tests who spoke to WSJ.

Apple was forced to settle its lawsuit with Qualcomm and has since used Qualcomm 5G modem chips for its latest ‌iPhone‌ and iPad lineups. As it stands, 2025 may be the soonest that the technology is finally advanced enough for Apple to phase out Qualcomm, according to the report's sources.

"These delays indicate Apple didn't anticipate the complexity of the effort," said Serge Willenegger, a former longtime Qualcomm executive who spoke to WSJ. "Cellular is a monster." Underlining the significance of Apple's setback, the company last week extended its agreement to obtain modems from Qualcomm for three more years.

Article Link: WSJ: Apple's 5G Modem Prototypes 'Three Years Behind Qualcomm's Best Chip'

Apple made a huge mistake buying the modem business from Intel. Modems are really, really hard; a lot of it is simply (from a technology standpoint) "black magic".

Though it would raise all kinds of regulatory issues, Apple should simply buy Qualcomm for, oh, $200 billion.

 

[JPack]

Apple wants to leave Qualcomm not just to save paying them money (though chip purchases, licensing fees and revenue sharing), but also because they want to be able to customize the modems for Apple-specific functionality.

Buying Qualcomm means that they have to keep designing models for all their customers and if they try and make an "Apple modem" alongside a "customer modem" without the Apple-specific functionality, it would increase Apple's costs to have two independent design teams working on two versions of the modem (plus the higher manufacturing costs) and chances are they will stuff up both and we'll see lower performance than if Qualcomm remained independent and continued to design "common" modems for everyone.

It’s purely about money because if it were about features, Apple would have developed their own Wi-Fi and BT radios instead of buying from Broadcom.

Qualcomm isn’t selling and Apple couldn’t buy even if they were due to global regulatory issues. Nobody else buys Qualcomm’s discrete modems. It’s already customized for Apple.

 

[jbmelby]

Sounds like to me that the WSJ is doing what the media does best and more of lately which is creating news(conflict/FUD etc) when there is none. Apple executives have to be getting some nice laughs at these constant “news” releases. Basically the news headline here is “Apple is creating its own modems.” There is no news…..The media needs those clicks so this is what they have to resort to. It’s a shame.

I’m surprised that it took 40 posts for someone to realize that the WSJ is not the Delphic Oracle and that maybe, just maybe, its pronouncements should be taken with a grain of salt.

 

[BornAgainMac]

I had no idea Apple spent billions of dollars on this.

 

[Nozuka]

Honestly 3 years is not as bad as I thought…

 

[Nozuka]

Apple consists of control freaks. They want to do everything on their own and they think they can do everything better. Apple buildings chips is like Tesla trying to build cars. They might work, but they will never be a Porsche.

You have it backwards… Apple is like Porsche, trying to catch up on tech and Tesla is like Qualcomm, Innovation leader in the field.

 

[ams1117]

I don't see why everyone is so pessimistic, 3 years is not a lot.

Three years ago, iPhone 12 Pro was released with Qualcomm X55 5G Modem, and it wasn't bad. Power consumption wasn't great but it was usable, it also had mmWave and other stuff.

 

[Rigby]

From the WSJ article, it sounds like a mix of management errors and lack of recognizing the importance of engaging with standardization bodies during the development of wireless components.

Engineering teams working on Apple’s modem chip have been slowed by technical challenges, poor communication and managers split over the wisdom of trying to design the chips rather than buy them, these people said. Teams were siloed in separate groups across the U.S. and abroad without a global leader. Some managers discouraged the airing of bad news from engineers about delays or setbacks, leading to unrealistic goals and blown deadlines.

Apple found that designing a microprocessor, essentially a tiny computer to run software, was easy by comparison. Modem chips, which transmit and receive wireless data, must comply with strict connectivity standards to serve wireless carriers around the world.

Modem chips are trickier to make than processing chips because they must work seamlessly with 5G wireless networks, as well as the 2G, 3G and 4G networks used in countries around the world, each with its own technological quirks. Apple microprocessors run software programs designed solely for its iPhones and laptops.

Interestingly it sounds like some in the company were in favor of sticking with the Intel partnership as opposed to bringing development in-house.

Rubén Caballero, Apple’s longtime head of wireless, supported the Intel chip partnership at the time, while Srouji, senior vice president of hardware technologies, backed the pursuit of a company-built chip, said people involved in the project. Caballero left Apple in 2019.
Many members of Caballero’s team who were versed in wireless chip design were placed under Srouji. Other employees engaged in complementary wireless work, such as antenna design, were split off into the hardware engineering group. One of the top project managers on Srouji’s team had no background in wireless technology, said people who worked on the project.

 

[CordovaLark]

I love how everyone here is putting the blame on Intel when Apple bought said division from Intel lol

 

[jz0309]

Extremely embarrassing for Apple, but after all innovation is scarse these days at the company so it’s nothing to be surprised about.

"embarrassing" for apple was AirPower (our whatever it was called).
it was actually the Kuo's and Gurman's who said "Apple plans ..." so as usual - they were wrong.

 

[iPay]

Wild that we’re barely 3 years post Apple completely ditching existing laptop/desktop processor chips, changing architecture, and handling it like a champ with near full speed emulation of legacy software and people are already acting like Apple is now incapable of innovation.

True! Some day they impress the world and invent ... gaming!
Down to Earth: They bought #2 modem supplier, tried to beat #1 by june 2023. They failed big style and have to keep buying from #1. No big deal for customers, best modems still in iPhones.

 

[iPay]

I for one, am surprised bigtime. If its true about "billions of dollars" and "thousands of engineers in teams across the globe" - with resources like that one can build anything, even spaceship. I suspect poor management and slack sloppy work on the part of "engineers". They were just lounging instead of working all these years, thats the only explanation.

True. God created the whole universe (not metaverse) with 6 days and arguably much less cash. Maybe Steve Jobs was God, but Tim Cook is not
Clearly, Apple product development is ruled by insane timelines. One can't imagine they flunked because of sloppy managers failing to report or stimulate collaborators. Maybe they underestimated the whole project.

 

[svish]

Not expecting Apple designed modem to be in any device in the near future

 

[tahoeroscoe]

I’m glad Apple is pursuing this to keep Qualcomm on their toes, but I can’t say I’m optimistic about Apple topping them anytime soon. I hope apple is smart enough to stay with Qualcomm unless they can truly do better.

 

[playtech1]

You have a market cap of 2.5 trillion. Just buy Qualcomm

I can't see that flying due to the competition law concerns. Having acquired Intel's modem business to then acquire the other main player in that market is going to be too much of a concentration in the hands of Apple. Qualcomm's other customers would go nuts and make sure it was challenged.

Really Apple just wants access to their patents and a bit better performance from its own team to solve this problem. Even if it's slow I bet it's still quicker and cheaper than the multi-year project of buying Qualcomm.

 

[kiranmk2]

Apple loves to maintain absolute secrecy even within Apple. Silo is inevitable if secrecy is the priority, otherwise leaks would be rampant. Model division Managers aren’t really the one to take the blame imo.

Which is surprising to think that iOS isn’t a train wreck despite all the secrecy and absolute control over what employee Can and cannot do, if information silo is pretty common inside Apple.

I understand that for unrelated aspects (e.g. a team working on the iPhone display cutout doesn't need to know about another team working on the software for the dynamic island), but when there are several teams working on the same thing (e.g. two teams working on a 5G modem) why keep them siloed for secrecy? Each team could already leak that Apple is working on a 5G modem...

 

[dysamoria]

Arrogant siloed Apple culture still arrogant and siloed. Shocker.

 

[Rnd-chars]

From an engineering perspective, this piece seems highly suspect. Having a circuit board that would consume half an iPhone isn’t the problem they pretend it is — it’s actually an expected part of hardware engineering before miniaturization.

I also find it a bit disingenuous to suggest that cellular hardware connectivity is somehow much more complex than Apple’s other hardware investments (ya know, little things like a Neural Engine, industry leading SoCs, Vision Pro, yada yada yada.) I’ve only done enough work in that area to know that it’s certainly not easy, but it also doesn’t strike me as something that only a few rarefied engineers at one company on the entire planet can somehow magically comprehend, leaving everyone else at their mercy. (Cue Gob shouting “C’mon!”)

 

[anshuvorty]

This. At some point, an Apple-designed modem could integrate better with iOS: more efficient power management, smoother handling of poor reception, etc.

Hell, maybe even bring that modem to the Mac!

 

[kdjohn3]

This ridiculous claim makes me doubt the veracity of the entire clickbait story.

Its circuit board was so big it would take up half an iPhone, making it unusable.