Lisa Gade of Mobiletechreview has a great review of the MBP 2018 w/ i9 - I think it puts things nicely in perspective and might help you make a decision.
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YouTuber Claims 15-Inch MacBook Pro With Upgraded Core i9 Chip is Severely Throttled Due to Thermal Issues
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Whatever, big guy. I’m happy to measure my three engineering degrees that are actually relevant to the issue (plus another advanced degree that is not) against yours.
The point I made is that it is ultimately Apple’s fault, not Intel’s, because Apple knew exactly how the chip behaved, knew it would suck unless they improved their thermal solution, and decided not to do so but to sell machines anyway.
If a chef buys rancid meat despite the specifications saying the meat is fine, it’s still the chef’s fault for serving you a ptomaine-burger.
Given that the i9 has the capability to deliver higher clock speeds than the i7 depending on the workload, I can see the value to the customer of Apple offering the part.
Perhaps the thing to do is to derate the spec as necessary. Characterize system performance with a certain benchmark at a given set of environmental operating conditions and make the appropriate fine-print caveats.
It’s never going operate at the 2.9GHz base if the GPU is pegged and you’re feeding it an all-core workload with power hungry AVX instructions. (It may not even be able to do 2.9 with the dGPU at idle and 12 Yes loops, I have no idea.)
Previous MBP have throttled, this i9 MBP throttles, but does that mean it shouldn’t be offered as an option at all? Maybe so. But Apple, like all laptop manufacturers, makes certain tradeoffs wrt cooling capability, fan noise, and the physical dimensions of the machine. Given the heat dissipation capacity of this platform, expecting zero throttling with continuous workloads for this i9 part (and probably i7) isn’t realistic, and to be fair Apple never claimed it wouldn’t throttle.
Perhaps the thing to do is to derate the spec as necessary. Characterize system performance with a certain benchmark at a given set of environmental operating conditions and make the appropriate fine-print caveats.
It’s never going operate at the 2.9GHz base if the GPU is pegged and you’re feeding it an all-core workload with power hungry AVX instructions. (It may not even be able to do 2.9 with the dGPU at idle and 12 Yes loops, I have no idea.)
Previous MBP have throttled, this i9 MBP throttles, but does that mean it shouldn’t be offered as an option at all? Maybe so. But Apple, like all laptop manufacturers, makes certain tradeoffs wrt cooling capability, fan noise, and the physical dimensions of the machine. Given the heat dissipation capacity of this platform, expecting zero throttling with continuous workloads for this i9 part (and probably i7) isn’t realistic, and to be fair Apple never claimed it wouldn’t throttle.
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The problem is the price. In the Good Old Days you could pay more to get more.
Now you simply don't know.
Id the Memory Bandwidth limited due to power consumption?
Is the clock speed throttled too quickly?
Problem is, the hardware looks great on paper, but the price you have to pay makes it an uncomfortable experience.
There has never been that much controversy.
And in my opinion, it is mainly the price and therefore the advertising as a high-end machine.
(Which I don't agree with at all)
Not only that, but Intel mobile CPUs don't have an integrated heat spreader. There isn't anything to "de-lid."
It's not really a matter of throttling or not, but if the throttling is acceptable.
If the i9 throttles to the point where it doesn't offer better performance than the i7, I think that's not acceptable.
If this is considered outrageously expensive to you... you obviously are way too young... in today's dollars the first computer plus a few toys to go with it ... would be more than double the top configuration ... ack.... home computer newbies!
I think it should be more than that. If the computer can't sustain base clock speeds, then its unacceptable. How is that even possible?
In the video around 13:25 she mentions that the same i9 CPU in a Razer laptop does the same video encoding with Handbrake 1m30s faster.
Everyone is basically confirming this i9 disaster by Apple.
Obviously Apple couldn't release a new MBP model just for the i9. Would it have been worse to not release a 2018 MBP with the i9?
My Mac SE/30 listed at $4369 in 1989 (over 8K today). I bought it used for $2500 in 1990.If this is considered outrageously expensive to you... you obviously are way too young... in today's dollars the first computer plus a few toys to go with it ... would be more than double the top configuration ... ack.... home computer newbies!
Personally, I’d rather live in the present than the past.
I’ve been as critical of Intel as you (ESP since my fav AMD has risen from the grave recently), but Apple had many months to watch other computer manufacturers have issues with Intels rushed 8th gen. Even the desktop runs many degrees hotter, look at my history, I linked a pic showing it. Apple is mostly at fault considering all the months these chips have been out.
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All the Apple fanboys keep giving this argument. Well... my 2017 MacBook i7 barely throttles, even in game (And yes I did try it for ***** and giggles, I mainly make iOS games and I sold a 2014 5k iMac for it), my Alienware 13r3 doesn’t throttle even in games like Witcher 3 at max settings minus aa (but it does get hot), unless I do something stupid like, play it on a bed...
I personally think they should have skipped the i9 altogether and avoided this embarrassment.
It’s unlikely that Apple is lying about performance on their webpage. Furthermore, all pros that have used it have raved about it, and I trust them over a Premiere Pro user, as it’s more than likely that Adobe software isn’t optimised (as usual).
Have faith.
I am not an Apple Fanboy, far from it. So hopefully you aren't calling me one otherwise I have news for you. As for your Macbook barely throttling...thats good, maybe for you thats acceptable but for someone who is shilling out over 3 Grand for a Laptop that isn't acceptable. My XPS 15 thermal throttled and that was unacceptable. Alienware has better cooling and is 3 MacBook Pro's thick which is why it doesn't throttle. And if you repaste it properly even playing on a bed won't cause it to throttle either.
If a laptop can't sustain the base clock speed of the processor within it then the Manufacturer of the Computer dun goofed very badly.
Not everyone has a sustained, all-core 100% util workload. And sustained for how long? Indefinitely? I haven’t really looked at the benchmarks, does it throttle at 2 seconds or 2 minutes?
People can say, oh, it’s a $2,800 pro computer, it should be able to run flat out for as long as I want it to... but that’s not the machine Apple sells. Apple sells a thin, light, rather quiet, relatively high performance laptop with good battery life. It’s not a workstation.
Depending on my requirements, I could be very interested in the machine—or have absolutely no interest. Just because the i9 is a $300 or $400 option doesn’t make it the best (performer) for everyone.
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Not relevant, but as a music producer should I just go with the Radeon 555x or 560x? With the 555x, I can reduce costs and lower possible thermal issues (which would help with throttling, laptop life in general, etc.) with using both the cpu and gpu.
Posted this elsewhere and don’t want to spam it around but this information is very relevant. Notebookcheck conducted tests limiting TDP instead of temperature (Apple are weird there, they do temp, pretty much everyone else does TDP) and the results are very encouraging.
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple...e-performance-with-a-few-clicks.317552.0.html
Looks like a software update may fix this after all and all the melodrama (including my own) may be overwrought.
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple...e-performance-with-a-few-clicks.317552.0.html
“notebookcheck” said:
Looks like a software update may fix this after all and all the melodrama (including my own
) may be overwrought.
I hope this is spot on.Posted this elsewhere and don’t want to spam it around but this information is very relevant. Notebookcheck conducted tests limiting TDP instead of temperature (Apple are weird there, they do temp, pretty much everyone else does TDP) and the results are very encouraging.
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple...e-performance-with-a-few-clicks.317552.0.html
Looks like a software update may fix this after all and all the melodrama (including my own
Notebookcheck are a very credible source. They know their stuff.
Posted this elsewhere and don’t want to spam it around but this information is very relevant. Notebookcheck conducted tests limiting TDP instead of temperature (Apple are weird there, they do temp, pretty much everyone else does TDP) and the results are very encouraging.
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple...e-performance-with-a-few-clicks.317552.0.html
Looks like a software update may fix this after all and all the melodrama (including my own
Holy ****. If I read that corretly, one would have to adjust via windows for the best performance, correct?
Then this seriously might all be way overblown if Apple actually listens to sources like that and issues a software update. I hope they do. This thread is out of control. It sure brings the Apple haters out of the woodworks too!
There’s a more limited utility for macOS than the one they’re using for Windows but it still works. Here it is http://volta.garymathews.com/ These guy is about to make more money than he ever dreamed of I suspect!
He needs to remove the trial, stat!There’s a more limited utility for macOS than the one they’re using for Windows but it still works. Here it is http://volta.garymathews.com/ These guy is about to make more money than he ever dreamed of I suspect!
Now, do I open the i9 that is in my desk or return it and wait for the i7 next week? Decisions....
heh, yeah..
my case is a little different but i definitely want a light yet powerful portable..
the majority of this is when carrying around a laptop (amongst other things).. there's more to it than just walking too (subway)
idk, apparently i'm not a real pro since a) i use Macs and b) i would actually mind having an 8Lb portable
so be it.