Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Seriously? for free?

As a screwed 2008 MacbookPro NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT debacle customer, with my computer failing just one month after they unilaterally closed the repair program in 2012, bricking a 42 month old computer - for which I paid very good money for - because of their incompetence and greed... I agree. I wish more governments would have the balls to truly represent their citizens interests, instead of boosting consumption.

That's a 3.5 year old computer, and it was your fault for not taking it in and getting it fixed. This one's solely on you, buddy.


Now, everyone else in the thread, learn that capitalism is how you have everything nice in your life. Sure, let's just all tax the rich, and f the corporations, because that will solve ALL our problems.
 
If the product is fine and dependable with no problems then Apple has nothing to worry about. We have always paid considerably more for electronic devices here in Australia and it has nothing to do with our consumer laws. Some of it is taxes, but most of the time it's been proven here in Australia that a lot of it is the fluctuation of exchange rates. They go up the product gets more expensive, the rates go down but the products price doesn't change to reflect that.
 
In other news, Apple announced a 10% price increase across the board for all Austrailian customers.

They already did that...

----------

They were having national mega project of rolling out fiber optic to every household for achieving internet bandwidth10 Gbps. They use law to develop their nation.

It's more like 100Mbps

----------

You hit the nail on the head. AppleCare is a premium service. It's a part of the Apple experience. The Australian law mandates part of what AppleCare offers be thrown in for free-- the utilitarian part. So AppleCare in Australia would be limited to charging you for the First Class upgrade, while the law requires throwing in the bumpy ride in Coach. Most people will fly in coach to save the money, then curse the airline for the cramped seats, crap food and crying babies. So Apple will get downgraded in their eyes for the bare bones utilitarian service, which is what those people will end up with. Apple loses control of its service packaging and pricing, the thing that had provided the incredible service you have had.

Your post is complete nonsense lol. The best part was "It's a part of the Apple experience." though, I loved that one.

Show where the Australian government is mandating Applecare for free.
 
i always thought u have to proof that it was defective from the start after one year which seems rather impossible. u learn sth new each day i guess

This could in fact be the case. And why many complaints were rejected by Apple. Particularly for refund. And often it's after six months that the consumer has to prove the issue was present at delivery.

So you bring in a computer, phone etc at say ten months that had zero record of issue claiming it was like that from the start. But you offer no proof. Apple says no refund but you are under the limited warranty so they will fix it. Someone gets pissed and screams they should get the refund cause 'the law'

Also, another detail many stories neglect to bring up is that Apple is only responsible under consumer law if they were the retailer and it was in that country. You buy it at Joe's computers or here in the States you are out in regards to demanding Apple do anything under consumer protection for whatever country, in most cases. However that AppleCare folks keep calling illegal is between manufacturer and only depends on the retailer being authorized to sell products etc

----------

Great news. Like an early Christmas present, but not sure from whom...

Yeah, something seemed a bit easy a few weeks back in the local Apple Doncaster store when just out curiosity I took a sick iPad 2 (purchased from early last year) in for a diagnosis and they replaced it with a new one! It was well and truly out of the stated 1 year warranty.

If it was that easy it likely had nothing to do with consumer law. Because almost every country requires you the consumer to prove the item was delivered faulty. And you would have brought it in well before a year later.

More likely your issue is one under investigation for a possible quality program or under an existing one. They don't bring this up because they don't want folks tweeting etc about it cause then sites like this puck it up and hype it until something way bigger than it is
 
I can't believe people are against more consumer protection. As an Australian, this makes me glad that there is legislation in place that mandates a certain degree of protection for items I purchase. Perhaps a flow on effect will be greater QC leading to more robust products for all.

I honestly think people will find anything to complain about. Snide remarks like "well, have fun with your price rises," really show a lack of maturity. What a bitter bunch of people.
 
Don't see how they can get much higher but I agree. Consumers will never learn that it only actually seems like they win.

When you can get a Nexus 5 in Australia for $399 and the equivalent iPhone costs $869, how much room is there to charge extra without pricing themselves way out of reach of their competitors?

----------

It's more like 100Mbps

*sigh*

It's being deployed initially at artificially capped speeds of 100mbps but even with todays technology (and we haven't even come close to learning how to get the most out of fibre) it will do 1Gbps.

You cant deploy today at 1Gbps because there is no way that our web hosting companies and interstate/international links could handle such a massive increase. You'd end up in a situation where a few hundred people could easily DDoS our international links.

----------

Now, everyone else in the thread, learn that capitalism is how you have everything nice in your life. Sure, let's just all tax the rich, and f the corporations, because that will solve ALL our problems.

What are you even talking about? The law simply states that the consumer has a reasonable expectation that a computer costing thousands of dollars won't break within 2 years. If it does, Apple has to adhere to our consumer laws.

If you like giving corporations large amounts of money to sell you broken items that's your business.
 
*sigh*

It's being deployed initially at artificially capped speeds of 100mbps but even with todays technology (and we haven't even come close to learning how to get the most out of fibre) it will do 1Gbps.

You cant deploy today at 1Gbps because there is no way that our web hosting companies and interstate/international links could handle such a massive increase. You'd end up in a situation where a few hundred people could easily DDoS our international links.


*sigh*

Read the post I responded to...

"They were having national mega project of rolling out fiber optic to every household for achieving internet bandwidth10 Gbps."

10Gbps?
 
That's a 3.5 year old computer, and it was your fault for not taking it in and getting it fixed. This one's solely on you, buddy.

I could see that one going well. "Hey Apple, my computer isn't broken at the moment but can you fix it just in case it does?". Even then they were just replacing the faulty gfx card with an identical part with an equally high failure rate. There are instances of people getting 3 or 4 repairs.

It WAS NOT a recall.

----------

*sigh*

Read the post I responded to...

"They were having national mega project of rolling out fiber optic to every household for achieving internet bandwidth10 Gbps."

My point is that a 100mbps connection is simply a product being marketed to the consumer, not the capability of the underlying infrastructure. He seemed to be talking about the speed potential of the infrastructure so I responded in relation to that. Apologies.
 
You can actually go to the seller or the manufacturer but yes, if Apple sold it then they are responsible for it. This obviously makes sense...

The manufacturer is under zero obligation to repair, replace or refund. The retailer is:

http://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees/repair-replace-refund

Approaching the retailer or manufacturer

The retailer who sold you the product or service cannot refuse to help you by sending you to the manufacturer or importer. You can approach the manufacturer or importer directly, however, you will only be entitled to recover costs from them, which include an amount for reduction in the product’s value and in some cases compensation for damages or loss. You cannot demand a repair, replacement or refund from the manufacturer.


----------

And in addition to this, the Australian consumer laws dictate that any product, Apple or 3rd party sold through their retail channels must also be covered by Apple, not the manufacturer of the product? Really, I think that is ridiculous. That's like telling a grocery store to ensure that the food you buy stays good until you decide to eat it.

No, it's like telling Apple that they need to stand behind the products they sell in their store.

Besides, Apple has repair/replacement supply chains in place with all manufacturers with stock in the Apple store.

One reason this is needed because not all manufacturers have direct points of contact for a consumer to source a replacement or repair from.

----------

Consumers are delighted with Apple products and do not need the government telling Apple how to run their business. Let Apple make the right decisions for its business and the consumers it loves.

Bahahahahahahaha. They don't love you, they love your money.
 
The manufacturer is under zero obligation to repair, replace or refund. The retailer is:

http://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees/repair-replace-refund

.

True but you do have recourse.

"Approaching the retailer or manufacturer

The retailer who sold you the product or service cannot refuse to help you by sending you to the manufacturer or importer. You can approach the manufacturer or importer directly, however, you will only be entitled to recover costs from them, which include an amount for reduction in the product’s value and in some cases compensation for damages or loss. You cannot demand a repair, replacement or refund from the manufacturer."
 
Full refund within 2 years? That's the work of a nanny state, of which the United States is in danger of becoming.

Yeah, this is my problem right there. Replacement, sure, refund? No way. I will never open up a business in Australia if it's going to be that way. It's like giving away a free upgrade.

But you do not have the right to a full refund by default. The seller has the right to try to fix the problem (repairs, replacement, offer compensation) and only if that doesn´t fix the problem, can you demand a full refund.

The article is over-simplifying things.

Australian Consumer Law defines two types of problems with a product: minor and major.

A major problem allows the consumer to choose between a repair, replacement or refund is one of the following:
* has a problem that would have stopped someone from buying the item if they had known about it
* is unsafe
* is significantly different from the sample or description
* doesn’t do what you said it would, or what the consumer asked for and can’t easily be fixed.

These problems would almost always be noticed by the consumer very soon after purchasing the product as they mostly involve misrepresentation of the product.

All other problems are minor problems. In those cases the retailer can choose to only offer a repair but may replace or refund if they like.

In practical terms, no one is going to get a refund that long after purchasing a product unless it had an extremely severe defect, in all other cases it would be a repair or replacement.

Source: http://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees/repair-replace-refund
 
And Aussies whinge because the prices of Apple products are too high.... well this is the reason prices are more expensive in Australia: government interference. Consumers are delighted with Apple products and do not need the government telling Apple how to run their business. Let Apple make the right decisions for its business and the consumers it loves.

I really hope you are joking because that is the stupidest thing I have ever read.
 
Trans-Pacific Partnership

If our (Australia's) government signs the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) trade agreement, Apple (and other multi-nationals) will by international law, be able to sue Australia (and other countries) for damaging their profits.

The deal, which is so secretive the coalition won't even let our senate see the details until 'after' it is signed, has a clause that our Trade Minister Andrew Robb, has told Fairfax Media he is prepared to agree to which would allow just that.

The so-called ''investor-state dispute settlement provisions'' of the TTP, which was rejected by the previous Labor government, allow foreign corporations to sue sovereign governments.

A leaked draft of the intellectual property chapter published by WikiLeaks and Fairfax Media shows the US attempting to extend patent terms, weaken the negotiating power of member countries dealing with pharmaceutical companies and to outlaw presently legal behaviour on the internet.

For those of you who don't know much about the TPP, that's not a surprise - you're not supposed to.

http://www.wikileaksparty.org.au/why-australians-should-be-worried-about-the-tpp/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bPIsjH25GHo
 
Last edited:
And in addition to this, the Australian consumer laws dictate that any product, Apple or 3rd party sold through their retail channels must also be covered by Apple, not the manufacturer of the product? Really, I think that is ridiculous. That's like telling a grocery store to ensure that the food you buy stays good until you decide to eat it.

The consumer should only ever need to go back to the place of purchase to sort out problems with a product they purchased there. It is then up to the store to take it up with the manufacturer.

Most manufacturers are not based in, and do not have offices in Australia. It can often be difficult if not impossible for consumers to contact these companies with expensive international shipping charges to return goods. The store, however obviously has regular and good communication with the manufacturer and access to their wares.

The Australian consumer law isn't new, it used to be called 'The trade practices act 1974'. Apple have always been subject to these warranty conditions.
 
Current apple Australia retail employee here. Normally I refrain from posting but this article is just so ridiculously inaccurate that I had to.

We have been observing ACCC standards for AGES. If someone comes in with a $500 pair of headphones a year and a half after they purchased them and they are faulty I will gladly offer a refund. Apple has deals in place with the suppliers for us to cover things like that.

Furthermore we were trained on ACCC as part of standard training, and it applies at the Genius Bar and has for as long as I've worked there. Despite what the media has reported twice we have had no change to our policies what so ever. We even have had ACCC pamphlets on the bar voluntarily for over a year!

What AppleCare buys you is telephone support, iOS device replacements through Australia post (before sending yours away), iMac and Mac Pro repairs at your house if you're within an 80km radius of an authorised repair service, and various other perks.
 
So, with your logic, the cheap $300 notebooks and $69 tablets as an example, should come with a full 5 year warranty?

You very much get what you pay for when it comes to technology. I can understand the argument for Apple to have the full 5 year warranty you speak of, but not every product made by every manufacturer.

If a 5 year warranty was imposed for all products, prices will skyrocket back to pre-GFC levels and possibly, products will be made with much better quality than 90% of the electronic trash that is currently sold that ends up in landfill within <5 years.

Just my .02c

My Hyundai comes with a 5 year unlimited km warranty, which Hyundai extended to 10 years to make the sale. It costs 1/3 of a Mini Cooper which comes with 3 year 100,000km warranty.

Something can be cheap and good enough for the manufacturer to back their own product.
 
In other news, Apple announced a 10% price increase across the board for all Austrailian customers.

They already have a 10-30% markup on their products in Australia and that has been the case for over 20 years. Even software which can't break down, sold through the same online store costs up to 50% more.

It's not just apple. It was cheaper to pay for a return flight from Sydney to LA and purchase a copy of Adobe CS6 at US prices (including exchange rates) than to purchase the same software in Australia.
 
That's a 3.5 year old computer, and it was your fault for not taking it in and getting it fixed. This one's solely on you, buddy.


Now, everyone else in the thread, learn that capitalism is how you have everything nice in your life. Sure, let's just all tax the rich, and f the corporations, because that will solve ALL our problems.

How the hell is that my fault? the computer NEVER failed before it completely bricked, and apple refused to do anything about it unless it presented the problem. I had AppleCare from the moment I purchased it, and six months after it expired, when the graphics card failed, they told me the extended repair program was over.

Now, about your second comment:

I'm all for entrepreneurship and private enterprise.... But capitalism in its current form is an aberration: the way it's morphed into an instrument of corruption by the rich and corporate criminals - bribing doctors to prescribe unwarranted drugs to patients, hijacking the political and legislative processes, wrecking the global economy for short term profits for a few; breaking the laws with impunity, reneging responsibility to the environment, consumers and society, without paying their fair share.

If you think this form of capitalism is sustainable for you, your children and grandchildren, you are sadly mistaken. Making Apple follow the rules of where they sell their products is an example of the basic balance that must be met for keeping capitalism in check and us to survive: the rule of law in benefit of society - and not only a bunch of companies, millionaires and hedge fund managers. Think about what longer warranties mean for YOU - not only avoiding the cost of repair, but the incentive for companies to design, develop and produce longer lasting products that protect your economy, your environment and your interests.

Understand that today's global capitalism is not representing entrepreneurs and working people, but a few privileged people, usually through bankers and financial institutions, that have more in common with the mafia and casinos than anything else. Some would argue that, if you comprare the definition of capitalism with what we have today, we ought to call this something else. IMO it's just a matter of time until economists, sociologists and historians come up with a name for it, as it becomes even more obvious globally.

There's a saying in today's big business: if you do not know who the sucker is, chances are you're it. So, if you think today's unfettered capitalism is protecting you and your family in some way, think again. Unless you're on the top 1% (which I doubt), sooner or later you'll get screwed along with everyone else.

It's really hard to understand how can people vote and cheer against their best interest. Usually it's because of simple blatant ignorance, or simple greed.

Of course, one can ignore all the data supporting this and just keep a black-and-white tea-party-fox-news-joe-the-plumber world view, and wait for things to get gradually worse, until the circumstances adjust one's viewpoint.

Cheers!
 
Last edited:
While I do believe companies should be covering repairs on these products for a reasonable time, a complete refund up to two years is completely unreasonable.

My television purchased from JB Hifi is 22 months old and will no longer power on - to think that I can walk in and return the product for a full refund is ridiculous.

Never mind the 22 months I've been "Free-Trialing" the product, using it on a daily basis. Pfft.

Whoever mentioned nanny-state was on the mark completely.
 
Furthermore we were trained on ACCC as part of standard training, and it applies at the Genius Bar and has for as long as I've worked there. Despite what the media has reported twice we have had no change to our policies what so ever. We even have had ACCC pamphlets on the bar voluntarily for over a year!

That's nice and all, but I've been told within Apple stores that the warranty is 12 months, and when I mentioned the ACCC, that after 12 months was up to the discretion of Apple. That's a flat out misrepresentation of the 24 months mandated warranty.
 
Well, auto makers are about to pull out of Australia due to high prices and restrictive laws and so I can imagine Apple just pulling all their products out of Australia to send a message. Don't frak with the man. We dictate to people not the other way around. You don't like our prices or warranties? Go make your own products from scratch. :apple:
 
While I do believe companies should be covering repairs on these products for a reasonable time, a complete refund up to two years is completely unreasonable.

My television purchased from JB Hifi is 22 months old and will no longer power on - to think that I can walk in and return the product for a full refund is ridiculous.

Never mind the 22 months I've been "Free-Trialing" the product, using it on a daily basis. Pfft.

Whoever mentioned nanny-state was on the mark completely.

*sigh* they weren't, because you can't get a refund. This article is incorrect for almost all circumstances.

https://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=18519254#post18519254
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.