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17" MacBookPro C2D Colour Banding Problem / LCD Quality Observations / OSX Users
- Thread starter geehk
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about color banding test..what exactly am i looking for? what is good what is bad?
The color banding thread seems to have come to a standstill for nowFor those who haven't tried the test yet, the problem that I saw on some of the Macbook Pro C2D's 15" & 17" looks a little like this simulation when viewing a Color Gradient Test Chart:
If you want to test the gradient charts on your C2D MBP then here are the links: Granger Test or Gamut Test.
I saw a rumour that the LCD's possibly come from three suppliers and this may help explain the difference in 'banding' and 'grainyness' experienced by different MBP C2D owners.
'Apple Discussions' Source: http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=758021&tstart=0
As a share holder I doubly mad
As a shareholder you should be pleased. They are buying LCD panels at 10 cents a piece and putting them into $3000 laptops.
On top of that Apple's readiness to accept that there is an issue is even worse than Dell's
http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies-archive.cfm/579149.html
Apple's response will probably be, "it is within specifications". At least Dell will do their best to replace the screen with a part you specify if they have the part in store, which they probably do, since they basically own the PC manufacturing market. Sure beats the hell out of the grand total of 3 display models used by Apple in their flagship laptops. The cheapest 3 no less, plagued with dead pixels and grainy colours.
Are there any response from Apple?
I have tested with LCD test last night on my 15inch MBP,
it is not good on the gradient test, but an phenomenon is intresting
on the MBP, I have installed vista RTM on the MBP with bootcamp,
and I created a gradient picture with gimpshop, the picture shows
very bad on mac osx, also on vista (with xnview, photo gallary), but
very strange it shows very smooth with picasa.
So I wonder to know when Apple will response this problem? May they
give us an driver update or firmware update, I think maybe firmware
update is the better solution.
I have tested with LCD test last night on my 15inch MBP,
it is not good on the gradient test, but an phenomenon is intresting
on the MBP, I have installed vista RTM on the MBP with bootcamp,
and I created a gradient picture with gimpshop, the picture shows
very bad on mac osx, also on vista (with xnview, photo gallary), but
very strange it shows very smooth with picasa.
So I wonder to know when Apple will response this problem? May they
give us an driver update or firmware update, I think maybe firmware
update is the better solution.
Yes, would be really good to get a resolution to this problem now - is it software, firmware, hardware or maybe a combination of all?
Some people report smooth colour gradients on their most recent purchases. Other people with the previously made batches report problems in some programs yet banded color gradients in others. Too many variables - too few answers from Apple. Seems the 'Pro' is not for better display characteristics, its for flashy keyboard, branded graphics card and aluminium finish - we need complete functioning systems
Did anyone find out for sure if the LCD's are 6bit rather than 8bit versions?
Some people report smooth colour gradients on their most recent purchases. Other people with the previously made batches report problems in some programs yet banded color gradients in others. Too many variables - too few answers from Apple. Seems the 'Pro' is not for better display characteristics, its for flashy keyboard, branded graphics card and aluminium finish - we need complete functioning systems
Did anyone find out for sure if the LCD's are 6bit rather than 8bit versions?
Strange... I see virtually no banding with the image http://home.freeuk.com/jackdodds/banding/granger_MBP_C2D_test.jpg
But in LCDTest 1.1, I do see the banding. Anyone has any idea why this is the case?
But in LCDTest 1.1, I do see the banding. Anyone has any idea why this is the case?
same here
the colors are BAD ... very bad
if i edit images in aperture and then preview them on my acd
this is NO PRO machine !!
bad bad apple
http://www.gezinsgids.nl/data/foto/16_maart_2006/rotteappel.jpg
yes....so sad. I have terrible banding on my week 46 0962 display too. I've never seen banding this bad on a recent LCD. Quite shocking. Can we be missing something here? even the cheapest LCD is usually capable of display these things, so either it's a manufacturing defect or a graphics card firmware issue.
I ran the Granger Test and the Gamut Test on my MBP C2D 17" that has a matte display and my colors look find. There is no banding as far as I can tell.
My replacement 17" MBP for 3 defective 15" MBP's in a row arrived. It's a week 47 as well...here's to hoping there's no problems with this unit. I'll report back my findings after I get home from work.
same here
the colors are BAD ... very bad
if i edit images in aperture and then preview them on my acd
this is NO PRO machine !!
bad bad apple
http://www.gezinsgids.nl/data/foto/16_maart_2006/rotteappel.jpg
Does this mean it is not a fault due to the display on the MBP but more of a software issue?
With the two sample JPGs posted, I see very very faint banding, but nothing that seems horrible to me. My model LCD is 9C61 and it has even backlighting and no abnormal bright strip on the bottom of the LCD. While the gradients may not display perfectly smooth (with the default color profile), I am super thrilled to have no grainy/shimmering display as on the 3 previous 15" MBPs I went through.
yeah, I too am interested in finding out how to test these LCDs to make sure they really are 8-bit instead of 6-bit?
I have the 9C26 display, and NO color banding problems and im glad that there arent any stuck/broken pixels and it isn't grainy.
The brightness is really great, i took some pics of the screen for you.
Comparison between my old dell inspiron 8600 (notice that both are on maximum brightness and that the dell is a 15.4 inch notebook and it still is higher than the MBP 17'):
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The backlight isnt uneven as it look on some of the photos, its just my crappy camera that is making it really worse
it looks even when you look at it from the front.
Maximum brightness from left:
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Minimum brightness from left:
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Minimum brightness from right:
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The only problem that i have with it is that it wakes up when the display is shut and i press on the right side on the lid.
The brightness is really great, i took some pics of the screen for you.
Comparison between my old dell inspiron 8600 (notice that both are on maximum brightness and that the dell is a 15.4 inch notebook and it still is higher than the MBP 17'
):
The backlight isnt uneven as it look on some of the photos, its just my crappy camera that is making it really worse
it looks even when you look at it from the front.
Maximum brightness from left:
Minimum brightness from left:
Minimum brightness from right:
The only problem that i have with it is that it wakes up when the display is shut and i press on the right side on the lid.
Virtually no banding with this test image. Display is 610, 9C62, MBP build week 46.
I just made a call to Apple the other day on a whim, not really thinking it would ever go anywhere. You know "we'll call you back" sort of thing. OK
Well guess what? Those guys are all over the issues with this 17 C2D like stink on poop. I've had about 10 calls in the last hour, everyone from engineering to sales to 3rd tier tech to marketing. "What can I do - what will make you happy"?
No, Buckwheat ain't farting around on this - this is for real. I can't get over it. You think HP or Dell would ever do this? Right.
I also think that those guys look into the marketplace, and in particular forums such as this one. Interestingly, they don't pay much attention to the official "Apple Support" forums, as they're much too filtered, polished and generally withhold posts that would otherwise be beneficial to engineering.
I haven't been so impressed in years. I was going to wait for a while until the dust settled to start bitching, but here they are swaping it out for a pre-quality controlled unit. QC'd by the Cuppertino senior group. Claim they're dieing to get their hands on one of the "bad displays" to see what it's all about. Well they're gonna see pretty soon.
You know, I bet ole' Steve was reading these forums one day and decided to fire his brother-in-law in charge of Chinese production. Kicked his butt right off his new yacht into Monaco harbour. Now everythings moving up. My hat's off to you apple
Well guess what? Those guys are all over the issues with this 17 C2D like stink on poop. I've had about 10 calls in the last hour, everyone from engineering to sales to 3rd tier tech to marketing. "What can I do - what will make you happy"?
No, Buckwheat ain't farting around on this - this is for real. I can't get over it. You think HP or Dell would ever do this? Right.
I also think that those guys look into the marketplace, and in particular forums such as this one. Interestingly, they don't pay much attention to the official "Apple Support" forums, as they're much too filtered, polished and generally withhold posts that would otherwise be beneficial to engineering.
I haven't been so impressed in years. I was going to wait for a while until the dust settled to start bitching, but here they are swaping it out for a pre-quality controlled unit. QC'd by the Cuppertino senior group. Claim they're dieing to get their hands on one of the "bad displays" to see what it's all about. Well they're gonna see pretty soon.
You know, I bet ole' Steve was reading these forums one day and decided to fire his brother-in-law in charge of Chinese production. Kicked his butt right off his new yacht into Monaco harbour. Now everythings moving up. My hat's off to you apple
My experience as well. Emailed Steve Jobs and within two days I had both the local apple store manager and executive relations calling me and asking what they can do to make me happy. They were simply amazing. However, I was complaining about my 15" display. Their final solution? To upgrade me to a 17". I thought it was fine, but it's not really: left half darker than right and when doing the banding test it looks absolutely terrible. Compared the macbook I'm typing this on, it's pretty poor. I decided to wait until Apple introduces new displays and then get it swapped since I don't think they're on top of this yet.
Well Done Buckwheat!
I'm happy to see some pro-active moves from Apple on this one - better late than never. If they want to send me a new unit to "Test" for having the foresight and knowledge to start this thread
I may write a spectacular review stating my findings.I'm still without laptop waiting for the right moment - I can't tell you how much I miss the Powerbook, I was so dumb to sell before I made sure the Macbook Pro replacement was good enough for my needs.
Let us know how you get on!
wait wait...so that sjobs@apple.com thing really works?
lol I might have to give it a try. Though I dont mind my screen, no grain would be nice.
What do you guys say in the email? Do you give them your # and addy?
and i hope those "sample" MBPs you guys sent in will have them switch screens for all of us.
lol I might have to give it a try. Though I dont mind my screen, no grain would be nice.
What do you guys say in the email? Do you give them your # and addy?
and i hope those "sample" MBPs you guys sent in will have them switch screens for all of us.
I'd think it's something one might use if you're suffering from multiple, or serious problems. Especially first run QC problems - the kind of stuff they really want to see. Sometimes they don't now what garbage China is really pumping out until they get one through such channels. I had a few additional issues as well as the known screen/hardware, so I just listed my problems in a 2 page Word doc and sent it.
I've got a separate MBG4 that's blown a sound card, but that's a send-in issue. I won't use the Steve email for that. I wouldn't want to abuse this idea and blow it for others. geehk were you the originator of this? - good job
What really surprised me is Apple has a full staff just itching to work this stuff out. I'm sitting here trying to think of ANY manufacturer, of ANYTHING that is this responsive and concerned. Televisions, cars, electronics, dishwashers, housing, public issues - I mean just nobody gives a hoot anymore. We've been conditioned to it. Especially public service, government and public utilities. Can you think of one?
It's a real breath of fresh air. I'm not sure how long it's going to last, but I'm glad I caught it when I did. So when they finish QC'ing the new unit, I'll get it shipped. Apparently the techs now had a good excuse to intercept a unit off the line. They will get it here in the US, scrutinize it as a team. I'll be sure to post updates
I just gave them my name and phone number and that was enough for them to know who i am and what i purchased and when and all that.
They were very helpful in trying to find me a good computer. however, the guy's solution was for me to go to the New York Soho store to find a good display model since he said what i am experiencing is (officially at least) an 'anomaly'". Of course the store units had the same problem so i am sending in for a refund. All models i went through and looked at in the store according to him are being sent in to engineers. So it looks like Apple is starting to realize (unless they are fooling us). Well done to those of us who complain and do not settle like most fanboys.
I wrote a letter detailing my experience and gave them my phone number and email. Got a call within a few days and within a week - after trying to replace the display on my 15" and getting another bad one (since there are no really good ones)- was offered an upgrade to a 17" MBP. However, as we all know, the 17" is not without faults either, especially uneven illumination and inability to show gradients smoothly. I'm not that happy, though the display is certainly much nicer than the 15" units I had. Compared to my mother's powerbook G4, however, it's inferior because of worse color rendition, worse viewing angles, uneven illumination and inability to display all colors in gradients.
Apple responded with amazing professionalism and did everything anybody could ever ask of a company. They bent over backward to get me a computer that I would be happy with and when I asked who I can write to express my positive experience, they replied "there's really no need to do that. We're here to serve you". Exceedingly impressed with them would be an understatement. This was the best customer service experience I've had - ever.
Unfortunately, it wasn't enough. It doesn't seem that Apple actually has good displays right now, nor does it seem that they are able to determine which models are good and which ones are bad. And when I tried to get a certain display for my 15" mbp - the 09C56 - they said it was impossible to find out what display it was until they attached it to the computer. They were willing to keep swapping until I got one that worked for me, but I didn't have the time so I went with the 17" instead. So: Apple seems to be trying to fix this problem for those who complain and that's a good sign, but they need to fix issue at the source: their LCD suppliers.
I downloaded the LCDtest, and used the gradient test... I found that I did see some lines where there were color transitions, but it was not as severe as what the OP is experiencing. Does this mean my model is also affected? I'm definitely experiencing a grainy screen...
PS In case anyone was wondering, I am using a 15" C2D MBP (9C 57)
PS In case anyone was wondering, I am using a 15" C2D MBP (9C 57)