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Honestly, I understand paying $65 or even $144 over the next four years for a subscription if you feel you're getting the appropriate value for your money. I don't quite understand why it should factor into my decision whether employees at AgileBits are able to pay their bills or not. That's kind of not my concern.

You don't have to be concerned with them. But a reasonable person recognizes that humans living in a society that isn't a communist country where the government provides for all needs of its citizens will need to engage in acts of commerce that produce revenue in order to live. And a reasonable person of average to below average intelligence can take that information into account in determining that it makes logical sense for a company run by people who have economic needs will price their goods in a way that makes it possible for them to pay the costs of living in their society. And while that person may not like the fact that the product they've used for so long for a single purchase price that, amortized over the course of their use may come out to less than $5 per year, the consumer would understand and accept the fact that it is necessary, rational, and reasonable for the price to increase.

In such case, the reasonable and rational consumer would either accept the increase and pay it willingly, or would decline to pay the increase and stop using the product. But in either case, any average intelligence possessing rational person would be accepting of a modest and long overdue price increase, and would proceed without complaint. Just my feelings on the matter after seeing this type of conversation come up EVERY single time some company that people have freeloaded on for years finally decides to actually *gasp* make money doing the work they do every day.
 
You don't have to be concerned with them. But a reasonable person recognizes that humans living in a society that isn't a communist country where the government provides for all needs of its citizens will need to engage in acts of commerce that produce revenue in order to live. And a reasonable person of average to below average intelligence can take that information into account in determining that it makes logical sense for a company run by people who have economic needs will price their goods in a way that makes it possible for them to pay the costs of living in their society. And while that person may not like the fact that the product they've used for so long for a single purchase price that, amortized over the course of their use may come out to less than $5 per year, the consumer would understand and accept the fact that it is necessary, rational, and reasonable for the price to increase.

In such case, the reasonable and rational consumer would either accept the increase and pay it willingly, or would decline to pay the increase and stop using the product. But in either case, any average intelligence possessing rational person would be accepting of a modest and long overdue price increase, and would proceed without complaint. Just my feelings on the matter after seeing this type of conversation come up EVERY single time some company that people have freeloaded on for years finally decides to actually *gasp* make money doing the work they do every day.
You seem to be fully in the mindset of software subscriptions which I'm sure is appreciated by many software companies. I still feel like if I paid for a software product (which I did), I get to use it for however long I want. If a company releases a new version, it needs to be priced according to its added value (to me) in comparison to the version I'm already using to get me to consider upgrading to it. I'm not just going to upgrade to a new version for the hell of it. AgileBits gets to charge however much they want, and I get to decide whether the upgrade is worth it to me at that price. I'm not going to base that decision on how many employees they have who may or may not appreciate my support. I'm not going to be shamed for not valuing a product at a certain price enough to purchase it. I'm sure Microsoft employees need the money just as much, and they're not getting anything from me, either. :D
 
You seem to be fully in the mindset of software subscriptions which I'm sure is appreciated by many software companies. I still feel like if I paid for a software product (which I did), I get to use it for however long I want. If a company releases a new version, it needs to be priced according to its added value (to me) in comparison to the version I'm already using to get me to consider upgrading to it. I'm not just going to upgrade to a new version for the hell of it. AgileBits gets to charge however much they want, and I get to decide whether the upgrade is worth it to me at that price. I'm not going to base that decision on how many employees they have who may or may not appreciate my support. I'm not going to be shamed for not valuing a product at a certain price enough to purchase it. I'm sure Microsoft employees need the money just as much, and they're not getting anything from me, either. :D

I get it. And nobody's saying that everybody has to just pay whatever they're asked and like it whether they like it or not. I'm just saying that if someone says "meh, too rich for my blood and not worth the value I get from it" they can move on and not be a douche by whining about how unfair it is that someone running a company is trying to make money from business. Not saying you're one of those people.
 
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You seem to be fully in the mindset of software subscriptions which I'm sure is appreciated by many software companies. I still feel like if I paid for a software product (which I did), I get to use it for however long I want. If a company releases a new version, it needs to be priced according to its added value (to me) in comparison to the version I'm already using to get me to consider upgrading to it. I'm not just going to upgrade to a new version for the hell of it. AgileBits gets to charge however much they want, and I get to decide whether the upgrade is worth it to me at that price. I'm not going to base that decision on how many employees they have who may or may not appreciate my support. I'm not going to be shamed for not valuing a product at a certain price enough to purchase it. I'm sure Microsoft employees need the money just as much, and they're not getting anything from me, either. :D

Are you using any Apple product?
 
My biggest issue right now is that I'm utterly confused as to where I stand with all the commercial and technical options. I don't know anymore what I'm entitled to, and I don't know what's going to happen if I upgrade to version 7 on the Mac. Looking back through my purchase history doesn't shed much light either. It seems that I:
  • originally got version 2.5.8 for Mac in Jan '08 as part of a MacHeist bundle
  • got version 1.3.2 for iOS (for free apparently) in Nov '08
  • joined the 3.0 beta program for Mac in Oct '09 and paid $19.95
  • bought version 3.9 for iOS in Sep '11 and paid $20.99
  • bought version 4.2.5 for iOS in Sep '13 and paid $8.49
I have no record about how I switched to the App Store version on the Mac and got to 6.8.9. Nor how I upgraded to version 7.0.6 on iOS (must have been free upgrades).

I never had a subscription and I use iCloud syncing. This works well for me, is fast and reliable, and I'm already paying for iCloud. I need another cloud service like a finger in the eye.

So, given that Mac version 6.8.9 and iOS version 7.0.6 obviously work well together, what will happen if I were to upgrade to version 7 on the Mac? In particular:
  • Will I still be able to use iCloud syncing, or do I have to migrate to the 1Password cloud service?
  • The Mac App Store says the app is free with in-app purchases. What do I get for free? What on top of that will a subscription get me?
  • If I don't want a subscription I have to buy from AgileBits directly, right? Are there functional differences to the App Store version?
Likewise, what will happen if I don't upgrade to Mac version 7?
 
Just because the sidebar is dark does not mean that this is "Dark Mode". FFS...
[doublepost=1527148738][/doublepost]And yes, I did successfully purchase it. I anticipate that as things have evolved, this will be my last paid version of a password keeper. I could probably do just fine with Safari, but I'm going once more to support AgileBits, and for them allowing a license purchase and continued Dropbox support.

I'm really hoping that the "magazine" style catches on, where you buy what's there in features beyond a free, basic set, and you get any new features for 12 months. You keep those features forever, and if they have a new feature in the future, you just renew again and get caught up. You never LOSE anything; you keep what you buy.

It's when you lose functions from a subscription model that people object to. I'm one of those people. I'm happy to pay money for software, but I am NEVER going to be in a situation where I drop features for time running out. That model must go away, and I am voting with my money.
 
Kudos to AGKyle for putting his head above the parapet :)

Just purchased the standalone version. UK price is currently £46.99 inc VAT.

I originally bought version 4.02 from the App Store in 2012 for £5.49. (must have been a promotion). I think it's fair to say I got good value for money!
 
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I have no record about how I switched to the App Store version on the Mac and got to 6.8.9. Nor how I upgraded to version 7.0.6 on iOS (must have been free upgrades).
  • Will I still be able to use iCloud syncing, or do I have to migrate to the 1Password cloud service?
  • The Mac App Store says the app is free with in-app purchases. What do I get for free? What on top of that will a subscription get me?
  • If I don't want a subscription I have to buy from AgileBits directly, right? Are there functional differences to the App Store version?
Likewise, what will happen if I don't upgrade to Mac version 7?

You have no record of the App Store version to 6.8.9 because Mac App Store customers who purchased 3.9 (the first version for the Mac App Store) got version 4, 5 and 6 for free. So... something like 6 years of free upgrades. We originally released 3.9 sometime in 2011. so 6.5 years I think of free upgrades, thus a gap of that between payments :)

6 vs 7 doesn't play a roll with iCloud sync right now. Version 6 and version 7, across Mac and iOS, will sync fine. I don't anticipate this changing, but we don't know what Apple's plans are for iCloud in the future. It's possible that changes they make could break this. But we're not going to intentionally break anything I don't think, unless there's a security reason to do so or something that's vital to requiring it. I'm mostly saying this to make it clear there are exceptions, but we don't have plans to make changes to how iCloud sync works in 1Password.

The Mac App Store app is free to download. Using the app is not. The reason it's free is because we aren't going to charge our subscription customers to use the app. So free for that reason. However to use the Mac App Store application you must have an active subscription (or sign up for one in the app).

If you want a license of version 7 you must use and buy from our website direct download, yes. That's the requirement going forward on licenses. There are very few (if any) functional differences between them, particularly in version 7. However, there are many differences with regard to the features that licenses get versus subscription users get. We've added features that are impossible or incredibly difficult to add for license users. We outline some of the reasons why you'd potentially want a subscription here: https://support.1password.com/why-account/ which covers some of the differences between features that a license gets versus a membership.

Hope that helps!
 
So, given that Mac version 6.8.9 and iOS version 7.0.6 obviously work well together, what will happen if I were to upgrade to version 7 on the Mac? In particular:
  • Will I still be able to use iCloud syncing, or do I have to migrate to the 1Password cloud service?
  • The Mac App Store says the app is free with in-app purchases. What do I get for free? What on top of that will a subscription get me?
  • If I don't want a subscription I have to buy from AgileBits directly, right? Are there functional differences to the App Store version?
Likewise, what will happen if I don't upgrade to Mac version 7?

* You can use iCloud sync, if you want, regardless of what you do / how you purchase or don’t purchase. If you subscribe to 1Password membership I’d highly recommend using 1Password.com though as otherwise you are paying for features you aren’t getting. There are some things we’re only able to do if your encrypted data is stored on 1Password.com. iCloud simply doesn’t offer enough flexibility to offer them.
* The MAS saying the app is free is a misnomer. Yes, you can download it without paying, but it doesn’t do anything without a subscription. To use 1Password 7 from the Mac App Store you need a subscription.
* Correct; standalone licenses are only sold through our website. They are not sold in the Mac App Store. The software downloaded from our website is the same software available in the MAS, except the software from our website has a way to purchase licenses in-app and the software from the MAS does not.

I hope that helps! :)
 
What difference does it make?

In a constructive realm, a question is usually answered, not questioned back. Never mind, though. It's an issue with mindset and mentality that I do not want to get into on this forum.

To answer your question, it makes no difference to me, but it does make a huge difference to what you say and what you do if you own an Apple device.

Coming back to why I asked: If you own any Apple device, please explain exactly how did you justify the price of the product for the value it offered to you.

Also, let me know what your stand about iOS updates is, when Apple stops offering updates to a phone some years down the line. Going by your posts in the thread, it would stand to reason you would expect lifelong support for anything you paid for, in the software and hardware world. I wish they made car tyres with your mindset of pay once and use lifelong. It would save a hell of money for everyone on the planet.

Realistically, I would only say you get into development of software, and then we will see how you stick with your current tone or change your tune and how soon.

I just do not get it, why people expect software developers (in particular!) to provide free updates and upgrades, and charge a pittance if they were to decide to charge. How does software pricing even be a discussion is unclear to me. The makers charge what they want, and we buy if we need the software. Simple. Who are we to question the worth they attach to something they created and not us?
 
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In a constructive realm, a question is usually answered, not questioned back. Never mind, though. It's an issue with mindset and mentality that I do not want to get into on this forum.

To answer your question, it makes no difference to me, but it does make a huge difference to what you say and what you do if you own an Apple device.

Coming back to why I asked: If you own any Apple device, please explain exactly how did you justify the price of the product for the value it offered to you.

Also, let me know what your stand about iOS updates is, when Apple stops offering updates to a phone some years down the line. Going by your posts in the thread, it would stand to reason you would expect lifelong support for anything you paid for, in the software and hardware world. I wish they made car tyres with your mindset of pay once and use lifelong. It would save a hell of money for everyone on the planet.

Realistically, I would only say you get into development of software, and then we will see how you stick with your current tone or change your tune and how soon.
I‘m a software developer. I specifically mentioned compatibility with future versions of MacOS would probably get me to upgrade to a new, paid version of 1Password eventually. I see enough value in Apple products to justify their price.
 
I‘m a software developer. I specifically mentioned compatibility with future versions of MacOS would probably get me to upgrade to a new, paid version of 1Password eventually. I see enough value in Apple products to justify their price.

What app(s) do you sell?
 
I dont understand the price discusión
On Mac we hace by far the best software for computers
Tell me one app for windows with this quality ?

I did think some time ago to switch to the keychain from Apple but it’s not what I want.
The app is simple, clean design and powerful

Look at ccc ... any similar app for windows for that ?
I feel ashamed by the I think new Apple community acting like windows users wanting everything free.
Keep it up agile bits, by far the best password app
 
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In such case, the reasonable and rational consumer would either accept the increase and pay it willingly, or would decline to pay the increase and stop using the product. But in either case, any average intelligence possessing rational person would be accepting of a modest and long overdue price increase, and would proceed without complaint. Just my feelings on the matter after seeing this type of conversation come up EVERY single time some company that people have freeloaded on for years finally decides to actually *gasp* make money doing the work they do every day.

I think we're seeing some pushback because 1P7 simply doesn't offer much in the way of new features. The problem with 1P is that it's a pretty mature product. What more can they add? While it might be nice that every pixel got polished, that's superficial. What are the new features? Why should users upgrade? I doubt I'll upgrade because I simply don't see the value. It's a great application, but version 6 works just fine. Furthermore, if you're all in on Apple products, the iCloud Keychain is a much better solution. Not only is it part of the OS, but it's well integrated with many iOS apps now. I simply don't find 1P that useful any longer.

The one feature that would make me upgrade is seamless background syncing between 1P and iCloud Keychain. I'd much rather use the superior 1P UI for managing passwords. I can't stand having to save passwords twice, once in 1P, once in the Keychain. Sometimes one doesn't pick up the password, so I find myself with certain passwords that are only saved in one or the other. Frankly, a third party password manager is no longer so useful now that iCloud Keychain exists and so many apps are hooked into it. I hope AgileBits considers supporting the iCloud Keychain because I think that would be much more useful at this point.
 
I think we're seeing some pushback because 1P7 simply doesn't offer much in the way of new features. The problem with 1P is that it's a pretty mature product. What more can they add? While it might be nice that every pixel got polished, that's superficial. What are the new features? Why should users upgrade? I doubt I'll upgrade because I simply don't see the value. It's a great application, but version 6 works just fine. Furthermore, if you're all in on Apple products, the iCloud Keychain is a much better solution. Not only is it part of the OS, but it's well integrated with many iOS apps now. I simply don't find 1P that useful any longer.

The one feature that would make me upgrade is seamless background syncing between 1P and iCloud Keychain. I'd much rather use the superior 1P UI for managing passwords. I can't stand having to save passwords twice, once in 1P, once in the Keychain. Sometimes one doesn't pick up the password, so I find myself with certain passwords that are only saved in one or the other. Frankly, a third party password manager is no longer so useful now that iCloud Keychain exists and so many apps are hooked into it. I hope AgileBits considers supporting the iCloud Keychain because I think that would be much more useful at this point.
Ios Keychain lack of a Lot of features

About the price
I never seen an app updating so much than 1 password
So I don't need new features a need bug fixes and improvements.

http://www.idownloadblog.com/2017/11/27/the-benefits-of-using-1password-over-icloud-keychain/
 
Ios Keychain lack of a Lot of features

About the price
I never seen an app updating so much than 1 password
So I don't need new features a need bug fixes and improvements.

http://www.idownloadblog.com/2017/11/27/the-benefits-of-using-1password-over-icloud-keychain/

No argument. 1P manages all kinds of private data. Keychain is more less just passwords and credit card numbers. I definitely appreciate 1P. I just don’t need it as much as I once did now that iCloud Keychain exists. My primary need, syncing passwords across my Apple devices, has largely been solved by Apple as part of the OS.

I think the price is fair. 1P is an ideal SAS product and I totally understand why they are moving towards a subscription model. For me 1P is now somewhat redundant because of iCloud Keychain, so I don’t see the value in upgrading or subscribing. Like I said, if I could essentially use 1P’s superior interface and extra features instead of Keychain Access to manage my iCloud Keychain, I’d subscribe. I’m tired of either iCloud Keychain or 1P not picking up a password or one catching a password change while the other does not. Running both is rather frustrating and at this point I’m going to choose Apple’s built-in solution, despite the short-comings.
 
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No argument. 1P manages all kinds of private data. Keychain is more less just passwords and credit card numbers. I definitely appreciate 1P. I just don’t need it as much as I once did now that iCloud Keychain exists. My primary need, syncing passwords across my Apple devices, has largely been solved by Apple as part of the OS.

I think the price is fair. 1P is an ideal SAS product and I totally understand why they are moving towards a subscription model. For me 1P is now somewhat redundant because of iCloud Keychain, so I don’t see the value in upgrading or subscribing. Like I said, if I could essentially use 1P’s superior interface and extra features instead of Keychain Access to manage my iCloud Keychain, I’d subscribe. I’m tired of either iCloud Keychain or 1P not picking up a password or one catching a password change while the other does not. Running both is rather frustrating and at this point I’m going to choose Apple’s built-in solution, despite the short-comings.

In 1 password I have also my licenses for all my apps what have saved me my ads for more than one time.
Server access codes

It Generates passwords for me and tell me if my password should be changed.
1 password changed my life for good.
And people who se how I fill the password (with Touch ID) always ask what awesome app is this.
Maybe it's just me but i told that if they would make an payed update I would go for it.
Like Istat menu
Or carbon copy cloner 1 password is the must have app for me.

40 bucks for updating ? For me it's worth it.
 
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In 1 password I have also my licenses for all my apps what have saved me my ads for more than one time.
Server access codes


And people who se how I fill the password (with Touch ID) always ask what awesome app is this.

Please explain this? If the app can just fill passwords on websites with Touch ID I would appreciate this a lot more than the native Apple solution.
 
Please explain this? If the app can just fill passwords on websites with Touch ID I would appreciate this a lot more than the native Apple solution.

Yes definitely
You need to use Touch ID in order to fill a password
And if I am right the Apple keychain does not save the secret 3 digit number from your card.

And as I have many credits cards it helps me to remind the pin sometimes.
 
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We hope that with 1Password 7.1 and 7.2 we'll really increase the reasons why someone might want to upgrade. If you don't think it's worth upgrading to right now then it's on us to convince you by adding more. Keep an eye on future releases.
Honi soit qui mal y pense, and will this coincide with the introductory price ($49.99) expiring? :D
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Honestly, I understand paying $65 or even $144 over the next four years for a subscription if you feel you're getting the appropriate value for your money. I don't quite understand why it should factor into my decision whether employees at AgileBits are able to pay their bills or not. That's kind of not my concern. I have no control over the way they're running their business.
Whether something is worth $50 (or $65) to you depends on two general considerations.
  1. Does it give you at least $50 (or $65) of usefulness and/or satisfaction?
  2. Do you think it is a fair price given the effort that went into the product?
Some people might say they don't care about point (2) at all. But most people do, even if only subconsciously. Talking about AgileBits employees is highlighting point (2), though with a bit of a sledgehammer. There are also subconsiderations that contribute to point (2), eg, is it a sustainable business (which with software is a requirement to allow for software maintenance).
 
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Honi soit qui mal y pense, and will this coincide with the introductory price ($49.99) expiring? :D

The $49.99 price will expire far before 7.1 is even remotely close to being released. Anticipate the launch pricing to last at the very most 3-4 weeks. 7.1 Won't even begin getting worked on in any real capacity until after WWDC. Our goal every year with WWDC is to have nothing on our plates so that after we see the new things announced that we can work on those things immediately.

So we've got ideas for 7.1, but very little is actually worked on. Some of it wasn't quite ready for 7.0 so those things might get some attention between now and WWDC. During WWDC we'll be working on proof of concepts based on the new things announced, then after we'll gauge how viable some of the proof of concepts are and start fleshing those out more.

If iOS gets a lot more attention in terms of features and things we can implement then that's where our attention will be, if macOS gets that attention instead then we'll be working on that. Right now, we're mostly at a clean slate. Until WWDC we're basically working on bug fixes for 7.0.

A week or two after WWDC the promo pricing will almost certainly be gone and we'll have barely started whatever new stuff we'll be working on.
 
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