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20" & 23" Aluminum Displays Now Shipping
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monogee said:
Decisions decisions. I think this comes down to what you're going to be doing on the monitor. The 23" can, in theory, handle non-scaled HDTV video and so if you're using FinalCut (et al) and want to see video large and in charge, the 23" is the way to go. The 23" is also slightly brighter from what I've read and seen than the 23" but it's really splitting hairs. I don't know about how color accurate the 20" is vs. the 23", my guess is the same as they're similar LG Philips displays in use. Both have the aluminum goodness and the FW and USB ports.
So I guess it comes down to cost diff, if you're paying $1300 street vs. $2000 street, $700 is a lot of bucks. I'm very pro-Apple so don't take me as trying to give bucks to the competition, I choose the 23" HP 2335 after a lot of research and in fact soul searching, it lacks FW and USB ports but gains S-Video and some other tricks, it's also plastic vs. aluminum... however you can get the 23" HP that uses the same display as Apple for $500 less, or $200 more than the 20" Apple CD.
Anyways I think any display is fine, strange slight color morraying with a very limited color range not withstanding.
Good luck.
I just received my brand new 23" Apple Display. Just wanted to ask if anyone noticed like one or two light marks on their LCD screen. They can only be seen when using a flash light when the monitor is turned off. These light marks do not affect the monitor when it is on. The LCD is clear as can be. Just wanted to know if anyone else noticed this on their screen. Thanks
HELP A GAMER
I HAVE THE 23 INCH SCREEN (APPLE), I WANTED TO KNOW IF THE PS2 HAS A DVI OUT CONNECTOR SO THAT I CAN USE IT FOR GAMES OR WHAT I HAVE TO DO IN ORDER TO MAKE IT WORK. IF IT WILL WORK? ANYONE CLUED IN.
THANKS
I HAVE THE 23 INCH SCREEN (APPLE), I WANTED TO KNOW IF THE PS2 HAS A DVI OUT CONNECTOR SO THAT I CAN USE IT FOR GAMES OR WHAT I HAVE TO DO IN ORDER TO MAKE IT WORK. IF IT WILL WORK? ANYONE CLUED IN.
THANKS
I purchased a Cinema HD Display (Aluminum) a few days ago and I was very disappointed after using it. I feel that every year, Apple is cutting corners in quality one way or another.
First, toward the left side of the screen, the contrast level dramatically drops. And also toward the right edge of the screen. The center retains the most of the contrast. Here is how you can test this on your Cinema 20/23. Launch Safari. Then open the download window - Command-Option-L or Window the choose Downloads. Once the downloads window is opened, enlarge the download window vertically until you see the white and blue rows. Now drag the window to the center and observe the contrast level between the white and blue band. Then drag the download window toward the left edge of the screen and you will notice the white and blue contrast level drop and the border between the two colors become faint. Therefore, the white and blue band will be almost the same color. This is not acceptable for a product that comes from Apple at this price. Even at under $1000, it is not acceptable. I've seen this on 5 monitors. 2 that i've got. 3 demos at the stores. (Fry's and CompUSA)
Second, I also noticed ghosting of the closed window. on the desktop after closing a window or a document. This should not happen on a $2000 Pro Apple product.
Third, I also see the pink tinting even after adjusting the display. I did manage to correct this by tweaking the calibration. When calibrating in Display Calibrator, do not look at the back ground but look at the color of the apple logo in the gray box where you are making the color adjustments. Also use you arrow cursor to adjust rather than with a mouse. to jump from left to right adjustments, use the Tab rather than the mouse. This prevents the setting from jump to the mouse pointer location.
I must say that the space gain over the 20 inch Display is great especially when I'm working with lots of pallets and multiple apps. Also like the fact that this monitor tilts vertically over the previous Displays where the display can not be turned completely vertical. I also like the shorter edges around the LCD screen.
However, I will regretfully return this monitor. All the pluses are great but the actual LCD has to be better quality that what it is now. That is what i expect from Apple. I own a 20 Cinema Display with the plastic body. I think that was the best quality LCD I have seen from Apple to this date.
I really wished that Apple used a better LCD for this 23 Cinema HD Displays. They maybe brighter over the last model, but that is far from an improvement over the last with the the pink cast and uneven contrast issues. Good design is welcomed but better quality component is far greater than just good looks.
Facts: The last Cinema screens were made in Korea and Taiwan. The current ones are made in China. The 30" are still made in Korea.
First, toward the left side of the screen, the contrast level dramatically drops. And also toward the right edge of the screen. The center retains the most of the contrast. Here is how you can test this on your Cinema 20/23. Launch Safari. Then open the download window - Command-Option-L or Window the choose Downloads. Once the downloads window is opened, enlarge the download window vertically until you see the white and blue rows. Now drag the window to the center and observe the contrast level between the white and blue band. Then drag the download window toward the left edge of the screen and you will notice the white and blue contrast level drop and the border between the two colors become faint. Therefore, the white and blue band will be almost the same color. This is not acceptable for a product that comes from Apple at this price. Even at under $1000, it is not acceptable. I've seen this on 5 monitors. 2 that i've got. 3 demos at the stores. (Fry's and CompUSA)
Second, I also noticed ghosting of the closed window. on the desktop after closing a window or a document. This should not happen on a $2000 Pro Apple product.
Third, I also see the pink tinting even after adjusting the display. I did manage to correct this by tweaking the calibration. When calibrating in Display Calibrator, do not look at the back ground but look at the color of the apple logo in the gray box where you are making the color adjustments. Also use you arrow cursor to adjust rather than with a mouse. to jump from left to right adjustments, use the Tab rather than the mouse. This prevents the setting from jump to the mouse pointer location.
I must say that the space gain over the 20 inch Display is great especially when I'm working with lots of pallets and multiple apps. Also like the fact that this monitor tilts vertically over the previous Displays where the display can not be turned completely vertical. I also like the shorter edges around the LCD screen.
However, I will regretfully return this monitor. All the pluses are great but the actual LCD has to be better quality that what it is now. That is what i expect from Apple. I own a 20 Cinema Display with the plastic body. I think that was the best quality LCD I have seen from Apple to this date.
I really wished that Apple used a better LCD for this 23 Cinema HD Displays. They maybe brighter over the last model, but that is far from an improvement over the last with the the pink cast and uneven contrast issues. Good design is welcomed but better quality component is far greater than just good looks.
Facts: The last Cinema screens were made in Korea and Taiwan. The current ones are made in China. The 30" are still made in Korea.
All I know is come Jan. 10th 2005 Apple had better drop the prices on the Cinema Displays particularly the 20 incher or I'm buying something else.
Bye Bye Baby said:I HAVE THE 23 INCH SCREEN (APPLE), I WANTED TO KNOW IF THE PS2 HAS A DVI OUT CONNECTOR SO THAT I CAN USE IT FOR GAMES OR WHAT I HAVE TO DO IN ORDER TO MAKE IT WORK. IF IT WILL WORK? ANYONE CLUED IN.
THANKS
Actually this was one of the considerations for buying the HP 2335 over the Apple unit is it has S-Video in. The PS2 I have does not have DVI, sorry.
Philoman said:
Though all your complaints are, indeed, valid, they're not in this respect... none of the current crop of larger LCDs, and quite a few of the smaller ones, will not live up to your expectations. An analogy may be that you don't like wind noise in your Ferrari, but you're driving a Ferrari, so it'd seem frivilous. Anyways you seem to not be one who needs to be adopting newer technology because you wont deal well with some trade offs. I can duplicate your issues... but they don't bother me enough nor would I blame Apple for doing the best they can to deliver pretty much the best product in it's segment they can with the technology that is available to them. Had you complained about the aluminum frame or some such I'd have felt more compassion, but you clearly don't realize technology curve of product.
My advice, wait five years, then buy a large LCD.
Photorun, first thanks for reading my post and taking the time to reply.
Take a look at the last 20" Cinema Display (Plastic), and you will not see contrast issue and yellow banding on the screen. So I can not accept that this is a limitation of technology.
If they can accomplish this on a 20" last generation, they can do that for the 23" displays. it comes down to economy and marketing decision. So i do not want to hear you sucking up and telling me that it is the limitation of technology.
As a pro consumer, I expect higher quality at a higher price. Provide a better product and I will pay the price.
Lastly, If I owned a Ferrari and i do not like the wind noise, i have a reason to voice my opnion. Then Ferrari may consider improving the wind noise for their next model.
Take a look at the last 20" Cinema Display (Plastic), and you will not see contrast issue and yellow banding on the screen. So I can not accept that this is a limitation of technology.
If they can accomplish this on a 20" last generation, they can do that for the 23" displays. it comes down to economy and marketing decision. So i do not want to hear you sucking up and telling me that it is the limitation of technology.
As a pro consumer, I expect higher quality at a higher price. Provide a better product and I will pay the price.
Lastly, If I owned a Ferrari and i do not like the wind noise, i have a reason to voice my opnion. Then Ferrari may consider improving the wind noise for their next model.
I recieved my new 23"ACD about a month ago. It was built in October. I have it connected to my 2.5GHX G5 with an NVIDIA 6800GT.
No pink whatsoever right out of the box.
1 dead pixel off to the side.
No yellow edges.
No ghosting.
For the most part very even backlighting but I do have some uneveness on the extreme left side. It is very subtle and only apparent with very light values like the blue bands in some OSX windows.
It is not perfect. But over my career in graphic design I have seen few monitors that were perfect (or that remained so with use). Eizo monitors come close but they are twice the price.
For me the 23"ACD is sharp and bright. It offers all the screen real estate I need and then some.
bit
No pink whatsoever right out of the box.
1 dead pixel off to the side.
No yellow edges.
No ghosting.
For the most part very even backlighting but I do have some uneveness on the extreme left side. It is very subtle and only apparent with very light values like the blue bands in some OSX windows.
It is not perfect. But over my career in graphic design I have seen few monitors that were perfect (or that remained so with use). Eizo monitors come close but they are twice the price.
For me the 23"ACD is sharp and bright. It offers all the screen real estate I need and then some.
bit
Bitman said:
Hi Bitmam, Thanks for sharing your info. Did you try the Safari monitor test i have mentioned above. Here is the info again:
Here is how you can test this on your Cinema 20/23. Launch Safari. Then open the download window - Command-Option-L or Window the choose Downloads. Once the downloads window is opened, enlarge the download window vertically until you see the white and blue rows. Now drag the window to the center and observe the contrast level between the white and blue bands. Then drag the download window toward the left edge of the screen and you will notice the white and blue contrast level drop and the border between the two colors become faint. Therefore, the white and blue bands will be faint and less distinction between the two colors.
Let me know if your monitor passes this again. If you are a graphic designer, you should be able to pickout subtle differences pretty well.
Regards
Ginza Store
Maybe nobody reads this anymore, but..
I purchased a 20 in. Cinema Display Last year, because every store in the Osaka area had pinkish looking 23 in. ones, even the Apple store Shinsaibashi. Well this week I was in Tokyo on business and I had a chance to visit the Ginza store for the first time. The Ginza store looks about 3 times the size of the Shinsaibashi store, but basically has the same items.
To make a long story short I checked out all the 23 in. displays and they were all pinkish. The good news is that the 30 in. and 20 in. had no such problems at both stores.
Brian
Maybe nobody reads this anymore, but..
I purchased a 20 in. Cinema Display Last year, because every store in the Osaka area had pinkish looking 23 in. ones, even the Apple store Shinsaibashi. Well this week I was in Tokyo on business and I had a chance to visit the Ginza store for the first time. The Ginza store looks about 3 times the size of the Shinsaibashi store, but basically has the same items.
To make a long story short I checked out all the 23 in. displays and they were all pinkish. The good news is that the 30 in. and 20 in. had no such problems at both stores.
Brian
Eastend said:
I'm sorry you didn't know about the fact that the "pinkish" hue had nothing to do with a hardware problem but a calibration issue fixed literally in seconds upon going into Control Panels and Colorsync. Wish salespeople were onto this. Admittedly it's odd they ship with the hue but it has nothing to do with the monitor at all, they're stellar and, upon quickly rectifying the pinkish hue in a snap of the fingers, are just as good, if not better than, the 20 and 30.
Photorun said:
I hear what your saying and I know this as a fact. However, I was talking about the Apple stores products. When you purchase a Apple product it should work on the Apple product without fine tuning. As far as I know most Apple products do this, the 23 in. does not. My 20 in. required me to do nothing but hook it up to my G5 and it just worked. Usually that statement fits Apple "it just works", it does not fit the 23 in. Perhaps those screens were an older batch, I do not know? There are many questions, but I am reffering only to what I saw.
Brian
wdlove said:
Love the 20 in. required me to do nothing but hook it up and look at it. Most Apple products just work. Did own a Dead PowerBook once, but Apple replaced it quickly. I also wondered about calibration on the 23 in. but in all honesty they should not need to be calibrated in the first place as far as basic use is concerned. My company once sold a very good ball pen at a cheap price, then we had a bad batch. The company we sold them to returned all of their stock, they gave us no second chance and we lost a little money on that. I have to tell you in all honesty, my company did not really make that ball pen just as Apple did not make that screen. But, we apoligized even though we lost money, because a companys trust is number one thing for us, we were unresponsible, just as Apple is with those screens. The difference is Apple is not going to take the loss for this and I can also see that for what it is, it's a fact. My company would have fixed the screen, but I'm not in that business. Now, I'm going to add here because Apple sues too regular, it's all just my 2 cents. I am an Apple fanatic, but I think the Apple fan is Apples biggest critic. I know this was long WD, but maybe you should not have said calibration, that got me started.
Brian
Photorun said:
Hmmmm.....are you sure about this? Not saying you're wrong, but it seems more than a bit odd that this problem seems to be exclusive to the 23" display. You'd think that if this issue was so easily correctable that Apple would have nipped this in the bud early on...especially given all of the negative publicity surrounding it.
I've seen a total of two 23" ACDs on display in two different venues (CompUSA and my local small Apple authorized resale boutique) since they were introduced. In both cases they had the pinkish hue! Now I can certainly see where the people at CompUSA might not be savvy enough to do the recalibration you mention, but the local folks are Apple Care repair specialists. I was speaking to one of their people today about this issue and he indicated they'd performed a variety of recalibrations on the display model (the one sitting on the desk) to no avail. He said Apple hasn't formally acknowledged there's a problem with these displays and is recommending steps along the lines of what you've described. However, he also said it hasn't worked in all instances. When it doesn't, there's another approach Apple suggests that involves replacing some internal piece of the display's guts!
I've read where some have suggested this problem is limited to early versions of the 23" ACD, and that more recent versions are free of this anomaly. That would be nice if it was true as I'm considering buying one of these in the not-too-distant-future and would like to think this problem has been resolved.
Can't speak for CompUSA, but the one my local reseller has on display is an early model...one they received a couple of months back. I suspect that most establishments use as display/demo models the first ones they get in. As long as an ACD isn't glaringly defective, they probably keep it on the shelf and sell new models out of whatever inventory they have. And I imagine that to the non-critical, average consumer, the 23" ACD looks great even WITH the pinkish hue!
Actually, if the one at CompUSA wasn't sandwiched between a couple of beautiful, color-accurate 20" and 30" ACDs, it would look pretty good on its own.
Actually, if the one at CompUSA wasn't sandwiched between a couple of beautiful, color-accurate 20" and 30" ACDs, it would look pretty good on its own.