2017 MacBook Pro 13 non-TB Review

[Jodiuh]

"keyboard will wake anyone in the house...grrr"

How can I possibly accept anything else in your "review" after that?

Personally, I LOVE the keyboard and it's "noise." I haven't heard the fan in a week. What are you doing on a 13" notebook with a dual core cpu if you don't want to hear fan noise? If you're hearing the fan kick in a considerable amount of time, this notebook's not for you.

 

[project_2501]

"keyboard will wake anyone in the house...grrr"

How can I possibly accept anything else in your "review" after that?

Personally, I LOVE the keyboard and it's "noise." I haven't heard the fan in a week. What are you doing on a 13" notebook with a dual core cpu if you don't want to hear fan noise? If you're hearing the fan kick in a considerable amount of time, this notebook's not for you.

Good question. Answer in the review and thread, with photos, videos and tempt/fan speed monitoring.
[doublepost=1508279689][/doublepost]After all this pain with MacBook Pros .. the Microsoft Surface Book 2 looks like an oasis in the desert...

https://www.dpreview.com/news/4144039451/microsoft-unveils-updated-surface-book-2

 

[project_2501]

Update 20 - 18/10/17

• Back to covent garden store for genius appointment. I showed them the videos, screenshots of fan speed and temperature.
• They are taking it in to replace, to quote:
  • "Replacement Display Assembly,
  • Top Case,
  • Logic Board, and
  • Heat Sink under warranty. Re-apply thermal paste."
• They admit the display panel glue gets damaged by the overheating, and noted it in writing.
• Heat sink is not normally under warranty (!) but they won't charge me.
• 10 days to turn around.

 

[salanddaz]

A

Update 20 - 18/10/17

• Back to covent garden store for genius appointment. I showed them the videos, screenshots of fan speed and temperature.
• They are taking it in to replace, to quote:
  • "Replacement Display Assembly,
  • Top Case,
  • Logic Board, and
  • Heat Sink under warranty. Re-apply thermal paste."
• They admit the display panel glue gets damaged by the overheating, and noted it in writing.
• Heat sink is not normally under warranty (!) but they won't charge me.
• 10 days to turn around.

Very interesting thread

Are they stating this is a general issue with non-TB MBP's or a faulty one that you have?

 

[project_2501]

Are they stating this is a general issue with non-TB MBP's or a faulty one that you have?

Apple have always behaved like this. Deny any general problem. Make each customer think the issue is isolated.

Have a look at the many threads here and social media to see the reports on the keyboard and overheating/fan issues piling up.

Seems to be a 2016/7 issue not just a nTB issue.

 

[eddjedi]

Hope you get it sorted at last. But you should remember a couple of things:

1) Most people only post on the internet when there is a problem, you won't find threads about how perfectly someone's machine is running
2) Apple have sold millions of these, a few dozen threads doesn't mean they are all unfit for purpose.

Based on using mine for the last week, I think you have just been unlucky and got a dud.

 

[darkmatter343]

Hope you get it sorted at last. But you should remember a couple of things:

1) Most people only post on the internet when there is a problem, you won't find threads about how perfectly someone's machine is running
2) Apple have sold millions of these, a few dozen threads doesn't mean they are all unfit for purpose.

Based on using mine for the last week, I think you have just been unlucky and got a dud.

I always remind people of this when looking at reviews. The majority of people will only write a review and provide feedback when they are not satisfied with the item, so take reviews with a grain a salt. That's not to discount negative reviews because they are important to understand what issues you might run into, but just keep an open mind that you're less likely to hear from the user's that are ecstatic with their new computer, so pay attention to the positive reviews and what they say.

 

[ET iPhone Home]

I actually like the Touchbar and it doesn't look cheap to me. If anything, it makes the Pro look expensive, nevertheless, it's all subjective.

 

[macjunk(ie)]

Thanks OP for the running commentary on your ownership of the Mac. I had a similar experience with two of my previous MBPs failing on me and despite that, I gave in and got the 2015 MBP.

This model has been flawless so far and I made sure I did not get tempted into buying one with the graphics card. So I am counting on this laptop to last me another 3-4 years. However, my next will not be a Mac. I just can’t stand the pricing of the new Pros and the damned keyboard. The last time I tried the 2016 Pros, my fingers a hurt and I found the touchbar to be useless and more importantly, distracting.

 

[project_2501]

Hope you get it sorted at last. But you should remember a couple of things:

1) Most people only post on the internet when there is a problem, you won't find threads about how perfectly someone's machine is running
2) Apple have sold millions of these, a few dozen threads doesn't mean they are all unfit for purpose.

Based on using mine for the last week, I think you have just been unlucky and got a dud.

Sure - but look at the statistics which indicate an underlying problem:

• no previous macbook pro has caused so much negative comment or reviews about the keybaord and its reliability
• all, yes I mean ALL, of the macbook pros I have ever ordered had to be returned and replaced due to physical hardware issues - and then subsequent reliability issues, and I've been in tech professionally for over 20 years.

Of course, we can never say anything absolute, and given Apple will never publicly admit a fundamental design flaw, .. we have only the relative upsurge in statistics as indicators.

But of course, it could be pure back luck.

I always remind people of this when looking at reviews. The majority of people will only write a review and provide feedback when they are not satisfied with the item, so take reviews with a grain a salt. That's not to discount negative reviews because they are important to understand what issues you might run into, but just keep an open mind that you're less likely to hear from the user's that are ecstatic with their new computer, so pay attention to the positive reviews and what they say.

My own experience is that every Macbook Pro I've ever bought had to be returned due to physical issues. And the replacements not free of issues either. Every single one.

Maybe bad luck?

 

[eddjedi]

Sounds like it I'm afraid. I've had around ten Macs over the last 15 years including iMacs, Powerbooks, Macbook Pros, Airs, Mac Pro etc. The only one I've ever had to take back to Apple for repair was the 27" iMac due to the well known "dust behind the screen" design fault. They replaced the screen, just as I'm sure they will sort yours out (eventually.)

I work in a data driven industry, and one person having issues with a couple of computers (even if it is every one you have bought) is not sufficient data to say something is badly designed. You're right a lot of people are moaning about the keyboard, I like it personally and guess what, there aren't dozens of threads titled "Love the new MBP keyboard!" because most people don't go to the effort of writing positive reviews sadly.

 

[ixxx69]

Maybe bad luck?

Yes. You seem to think you're doing some sort of public service by blogging your experience on the forums, but your purchase is just one out of about 20 million Macs that will be sold, and your customer service experience is just one of untold tens of millions. For every story like yours, there's dozens more of absolute delight at Apples customer service that will never be posted. Doesn't make it suck less for you, but like so many of these types of threads, you seem to interpolate your singular personal experience into some wider issue. (and I'm sorry to insinuate, probably not true in your particular case, but it's really weird how some people have the darnedest luck! )

And now your posting links to this thread throughout the forum.

 

[project_2501]

Yes. You seem to think you're doing some sort of public service by blogging your experience on the forums, but your purchase is just one out of about 20 million Macs that will be sold, and your customer service experience is just one of untold tens of millions. For every story like yours, there's dozens more of absolute delight at Apples customer service that will never be posted. Doesn't make it suck less for you, but like so many of these types of threads, you seem to interpolate your singular personal experience into some wider issue. (and I'm sorry to insinuate, probably not true in your particular case, but it's really weird how some people have the darnedest luck! )

And now your posting links to this thread throughout the forum.

I saw first hand a company paid to go online to product forums and make positive statements, and counter any negative news or evidence. Clients included tech industry big names ...

 

[ixxx69]

I saw first hand a company paid to go online to product forums and make positive statements, and counter any negative news or evidence. Clients included tech industry big names ...

Yes! So true. For example, many Amazon reviews have almost become useless because of it. Certainly goes both ways!

Not sure about your point?

 

[Fthree]

i actually enjoy reading the reviews on this site (good and bad) the good ones reinforce my purchases -obviously- and the bad ones give me ideas on what to look out for. Keep blogging!!

 

[ixxx69]

i actually enjoy reading the reviews on this site (good and bad) the good ones reinforce my purchases -obviously- and the bad ones give me ideas on what to look out for. Keep blogging!!

LOL, yes, because what we definitely need more of in the world right now is more confirmation bias.

 

[macjunk(ie)]

This and the many other threads serves to demonstrate that Apple is not what it is cracked up to be. For many Apple old timers, such incidents are in the realm of impossibility but Apple has grown today and with the glutton fueled girth comes the problems.

These kind of threads do well to highlight that when you buy Apple, it is exactly the same as buying from any other corporate entity. Nothing special because you are paying the exhorbhitant premiums.
[doublepost=1508624731][/doublepost]

LOL, yes, because what we definitely need more of in the world right now is more confirmation bias.

Confirmation bias works both ways

 

[ixxx69]

These kind of threads do well to highlight that when you buy Apple, it is exactly the same as buying from any other corporate entity. Nothing special because you are paying the exhorbhitant premiums.

Well, if you mean that you use money to purchase a product, and you are given said product upon receipt of said money, then yeah, I'd generally agree with that.

Confirmation bias works both ways

How does it work both ways?

 

[macjunk(ie)]

Well, if you mean that you use money to purchase a product, and you are given said product upon receipt of said money, then yeah, I'd generally agree with that.


How does it work both ways?

Well you are here trying to make less of the OP’s account aren’t you? Maybe that plays to your bias about Apple and the quality of products it churns out.

 

[ixxx69]

Well you are here trying to make less of the OP’s account aren’t you? Maybe that plays to your bias about Apple and the quality of products it churns out.

That's what I thought... you didn't understand what I was replying to, nor evidently do you understand what "confirmation bias" is.

 

[project_2501]

Update 21 - 24/10/17

• Apple finally replied to my complaint via the Better Business Bureau - which they've committed to doing as part of being a member.
• They didn't apologise for anything at all - the broken promises (eg sending me to Wimbledon on the assurance they could test the device properly), the poor customer service experience (eg 22 calls to get through in one day).
• They refused a refund.

 

[Jodiuh]

Good question. Answer in the review and thread, with photos, videos and tempt/fan speed monitoring.
[doublepost=1508279689][/doublepost]After all this pain with MacBook Pros .. the Microsoft Surface Book 2 looks like an oasis in the desert...

https://www.dpreview.com/news/4144039451/microsoft-unveils-updated-surface-book-2

Yeah, that post of mine came off pretty rude. My apologies! I just did a quick scan of your review and it definitely seems like you had some problems, but IMO, you should be using something quite a bit more powerful and NOT that Surface Book 2. The 8650U IIRC in that device is not going to be any better, if even it is better than the 7920HQ in the 15" 2017 MBP. So their claim of being 2x as powerful's not accurate @ all.

The GPU however is significantly more powerful than the 560. That said, I think you'd be FAR FAR better off with a Dell XPS 15 or even an Alienware. HP, Lenovo, Acer, etc all seem to be a little bit subpar in comparison to Dell and Apples stuff. Also, perhaps wait until the next refresh of Intel chips as the 8XXX series don't quite seem to be fully fleshed out yet. Either they're going to update w/ some 88XX or 89XX or perhaps waiting for Ice/Tiger Lake to bring in the big guns.

Anyway, good luck on whatever you decide!!!

 

[project_2501]

Update 22 -27/10/2017

• The genius at Apple Store Covent Garden said my laptop should take 7-10 days. He encouraged me to check in on progress. Teh store doesn't have a phone number but he said they'd respond to emails to coventgarden@apple.com
• Seven days was 25th and I'd heard nothing so I emailed.
• Today is the 27th and still no reply.
• This is again demonstrating the quality of Apple customer experience and suport.

 

[Acronyc]

I’ve really never heard of such poor customer service by Apple. It really is too bad. I’ve only had nothing but a great experience with them. Some examples:

1. First 2012 15 inch retina MBP I received had what looked like clump of nose hairs between the screen and keyboard. I was filming the unboxing so had clear proof I didn’t put it there. It was pretty gross. I called up Apple to tell them I was disappointed and they sent me a brand new machine, even though the one I had worked fine.

2. The replacement for the above came with a bad battery. Replaced no questions asked.

3. My second replacement developed image retention, again taken care of by Apple without any questions except for me taking it to the Genius Bar where they ran a test. New screen was installed and I used it for over 4 years without issue.

4. I had a 2015 retina MacBook that developed a squeak when opening and closing the screen after six months. Didn’t affect the usability at all, but I took it in to an Apple Store. I happened to get the manager and he apologized and let me do a return of the computer - six months later - for a brand new one in the store (not a refurb). That computer worked great until I sold it a year later.

5. Brought in an iPhone 6s for a Bluetooth issue (still on warranty) and had the phone replaced without any questions or problems.

The excellent customer service I’ve experienced with Apple is one reason I have stuck with them. It’s really too bad you are receiving such poor customer service.

 

[project_2501]

I’ve really never heard of such poor customer service by Apple. It really is too bad. I’ve only had nothing but a great experience with them. Some examples:

1. First 2012 15 inch retina MBP I received had what looked like clump of nose hairs between the screen and keyboard. I was filming the unboxing so had clear proof I didn’t put it there. It was pretty gross. I called up Apple to tell them I was disappointed and they sent me a brand new machine, even though the one I had worked fine.

2. The replacement for the above came with a bad battery. Replaced no questions asked.

3. My second replacement developed image retention, again taken care of by Apple without any questions except for me taking it to the Genius Bar where they ran a test. New screen was installed and I used it for over 4 years without issue.

4. I had a 2015 retina MacBook that developed a squeak when opening and closing the screen after six months. Didn’t affect the usability at all, but I took it in to an Apple Store. I happened to get the manager and he apologized and let me do a return of the computer - six months later - for a brand new one in the store (not a refurb). That computer worked great until I sold it a year later.

5. Brought in an iPhone 6s for a Bluetooth issue (still on warranty) and had the phone replaced without any questions or problems.

The excellent customer service I’ve experienced with Apple is one reason I have stuck with them. It’s really too bad you are receiving such poor customer service.

That's great that you are happy with the service.

Personally two devices in a row with issues isn't enco

I’ve really never heard of such poor customer service by Apple. It really is too bad. I’ve only had nothing but a great experience with them. Some examples:

1. First 2012 15 inch retina MBP I received had what looked like clump of nose hairs between the screen and keyboard. I was filming the unboxing so had clear proof I didn’t put it there. It was pretty gross. I called up Apple to tell them I was disappointed and they sent me a brand new machine, even though the one I had worked fine.

2. The replacement for the above came with a bad battery. Replaced no questions asked.

3. My second replacement developed image retention, again taken care of by Apple without any questions except for me taking it to the Genius Bar where they ran a test. New screen was installed and I used it for over 4 years without issue.

4. I had a 2015 retina MacBook that developed a squeak when opening and closing the screen after six months. Didn’t affect the usability at all, but I took it in to an Apple Store. I happened to get the manager and he apologized and let me do a return of the computer - six months later - for a brand new one in the store (not a refurb). That computer worked great until I sold it a year later.

5. Brought in an iPhone 6s for a Bluetooth issue (still on warranty) and had the phone replaced without any questions or problems.

The excellent customer service I’ve experienced with Apple is one reason I have stuck with them. It’s really too bad you are receiving such poor customer service.

That's great you had a good experience.

I guess for me two bad devices in a row doesn't seem like what we expect from Apple at those prices!

Every single macbook I've ever had from Apple had to be returned for a replacement.