4K Apple TV with a 1080p TV

[iMas70]

While I appreciate all of the technical discussion in this thread, it's a lot deeper than I get into video but it's helping me learn a few things.

I ordered two 4K Apple TVs. One for my bedroom. That will connect to my 4K Samsung. Currently I can only want limited 4K programming through DirecTV and the Netflix app. The other will connect to the 1080p Samsung TV in my living room. It seems like it will work fine but just won't provide a 4K picture. That TV will be upgraded by Thanksgiving (or the day after ).

 

[benji888]

While I appreciate all of the technical discussion in this thread, it's a lot deeper than I get into video but it's helping me learn a few things.

I ordered two 4K Apple TVs. One for my bedroom. That will connect to my 4K Samsung. Currently I can only want limited 4K programming through DirecTV and the Netflix app. The other will connect to the 1080p Samsung TV in my living room. It seems like it will work fine but just won't provide a 4K picture. That TV will be upgraded by Thanksgiving (or the day after ).

Yeah, after I posted my comment I went to my Apple TV settings and found I can change the resolution to as low as 640x480, with many options available, so, yeah the new 4K Apple TV should have many choices as well. Over HDMI most devices have a profile that tells other devices what it is capable of...so it should automatically connect.

 

[iMas70]

Apple uses DD+
If you purchase or rent from Vudu they appear in the vudu app and are streamed from there. Never downloaded. Redeem all your movie codes there! There's a vudu app on everything so you'll always have your content.
They sometimes have movies with Dolby Vision even though the disc doesn't have it. Same applies to atmos. For example my 4k Fantastic Beasts disc is HDR and DTS-HD. But on vudu, where I redeemed my code, gives me Dolby Vision and Atmos.
And the quality is really good!

Am I missing anything by using a 12 year old Yamaha receiver for my 5.1 surround or do I need to upgrade this too?

 

[benji888]

Am I missing anything by using a 12 year old Yamaha receiver for my 5.1 surround or do I need to upgrade this too?

Not really, DD+ is an improvement over DD, but is still a lossy codec. Nearly all VOD/streaming video uses DD or DD+ audio. ...Now if you have, or plan on getting a blu-ray or UHD blu-ray player, yes, you are missing out.

What kind of connection are you using to your Yamaha?

 

[danny842003]

There is no such thing as future proof with technology.

I do hope people who are “future proofing” also get a 4K UHD capable Home Theater receiver also if they currently don’t have one.

That’s not really true or a good example. The way people are using the term future proofing is that you may as well spend a little more on a device now I because if you have to buy a TV in the future it will more than likely be 4k.
Thus extending the potential lifespan of a device you are already purchasing for a small extra investment now.
That’s not the same as buying an extra device well just because internet argument.

For many people the normal Apple TV is ample but it is certainly worth thinking about spending a little more now.

 

[Shawn Parr]

Only benefit will be if any decent games come to the system. As mentioned above, HEVC will be coming to the ATV4 and the A8 chip with 2 GB Ram should be enough to decode HEVC 1080p (but Apple probably won't move all their 1080p films away from h.264).

I would guess Apple is highly motivated to deliver any content they can over HEVC/HEIF if the end device can handle it. With existing 1080P versions if they can deliver it with HEVC they only use half the bandwidth. With the amount of data Apple is streaming from their systems, and the cost of providing bandwidth of that level using HEVC would mean they could either:

1. Double the number of 1080P streams they currently can simultaneously handle
2. Reduce their bandwidth costs

I know some people will claim that with the amount of data Apple uses on a daily basis not on video, that the streaming bandwidth that could be saved only on newer devices is not a great percentage, and they could be right. But at the scale Apple is operating on it could literally mean thousands of dollars per day in cost savings.

While I have no issue streaming on my current connection, and only have 1080p devices, if Apple implements it so that 1080P can be delivered via HEVC, but only on the 4k device, I would consider one to reduce my bandwidth usage. Just because every year more and more data hungry things come out, and giving that little bit more overhead is always appreciated.

 

[benji888]

I would guess Apple is highly motivated to deliver any content they can over HEVC/HEIF if the end device can handle it. With existing 1080P versions if they can deliver it with HEVC they only use half the bandwidth. With the amount of data Apple is streaming from their systems, and the cost of providing bandwidth of that level using HEVC would mean they could either:

1. Double the number of 1080P streams they currently can simultaneously handle
2. Reduce their bandwidth costs

I know some people will claim that with the amount of data Apple uses on a daily basis not on video, that the streaming bandwidth that could be saved only on newer devices is not a great percentage, and they could be right. But at the scale Apple is operating on it could literally mean thousands of dollars per day in cost savings.

While I have no issue streaming on my current connection, and only have 1080p devices, if Apple implements it so that 1080P can be delivered via HEVC, but only on the 4k device, I would consider one to reduce my bandwidth usage. Just because every year more and more data hungry things come out, and giving that little bit more overhead is always appreciated.

I agree with you on this, and, with software updates this month, many millions of apple devices will be able to handle HEVC/HEIF, so, it's not like it's only the brand new devices they just came out with.

Here's proof you are correct, this is a section of the tech specs for the ATV (not 4K model):

 

[Shawn Parr]

I agree with you on this, and, with software updates this month, many millions of apple devices will be able to handle HEVC/HEIF, so, it's not like it's only the brand new devices they just came out with.

Here's proof you are correct, this is a section of the tech specs for the ATV (not 4K model):

Thanks for posting this! I had looked under the compare for the two different models, but didn't go into the older one and look at the tech specs specifically.

That means I can put off the AppleTV 4k upgrade for a while since I haven't got a 4k TV right now, and size/viewing distance it wouldn't make a large enough difference to be worthwhile to replace most of my system (TV, aTV, and receiver). When I'm at a place to do a more "whole hog" system upgrade I'll do the Apple TV at the same time.

The one advantage would be displaying 1080P60 and 4k videos captures on iPhones/iPads using HEVC and with much better performance, but in our house that is pretty rare anyway.

 

[SohoR1]

Just read through this thread...I have a 1080p Tv and just received ATV4k...the video is terribly choppy. I tried every combination of my Tv’s settings and the ATV’s setting to no avail. I was benchmarking using my tv’s Netflix app and ATV’s netflix and watching house of cards. HOC is super crisp, clear, and smooth on the Netflix tv app. The ATV is mostly crisp and clear, but quite choppy (super annoying). To me, if you don’t have a 4K tv this isn’t worth it. My tv doesn’t need to get upgraded at this time, so I’ll hold off for awhile.

 

[dantracht]

Just read through this thread...I have a 1080p Tv and just received ATV4k...the video is terribly choppy. I tried every combination of my Tv’s settings and the ATV’s setting to no avail. I was benchmarking using my tv’s Netflix app and ATV’s netflix and watching house of cards. HOC is super crisp, clear, and smooth on the Netflix tv app. The ATV is mostly crisp and clear, but quite choppy (super annoying). To me, if you don’t have a 4K tv this isn’t worth it. My tv doesn’t need to get upgraded at this time, so I’ll hold off for awhile.

Can you define choppy? As in picture quality?

 

[SohoR1]

Can you define choppy? As in picture quality?

The picture quality is good, but if anything moves you get a choppy ghost effect that does not occur when using the same application built into the tv's smarthub.

 

[dantracht]

The picture quality is good, but if anything moves you get a choppy ghost effect that does not occur when using the same application built into the tv's smarthub.

Thanks. I’ve been on the fence about getting one for my 1080 tv, but it really doesn’t sound like it’s worth it.

 

[benji888]

Thanks for posting this! I had looked under the compare for the two different models, but didn't go into the older one and look at the tech specs specifically.

That means I can put off the AppleTV 4k upgrade for a while since I haven't got a 4k TV right now, and size/viewing distance it wouldn't make a large enough difference to be worthwhile to replace most of my system (TV, aTV, and receiver). When I'm at a place to do a more "whole hog" system upgrade I'll do the Apple TV at the same time.

The one advantage would be displaying 1080P60 and 4k videos captures on iPhones/iPads using HEVC and with much better performance, but in our house that is pretty rare anyway.

Viewing 1080p60 videos from iphone/ipad should work on non 4K ATV, but, if using H.264 in the iOS device. (iOS 11 Settings>Camera>Formats)

Just read through this thread...I have a 1080p Tv and just received ATV4k...the video is terribly choppy. I tried every combination of my Tv’s settings and the ATV’s setting to no avail. I was benchmarking using my tv’s Netflix app and ATV’s netflix and watching house of cards. HOC is super crisp, clear, and smooth on the Netflix tv app. The ATV is mostly crisp and clear, but quite choppy (super annoying). To me, if you don’t have a 4K tv this isn’t worth it. My tv doesn’t need to get upgraded at this time, so I’ll hold off for awhile.

Did you try a different cable? Maybe still needs a certified cable?

 

[The Toddler]

Would definitely be interested to hear other users' experiences of the new ATV with a 1080p TV.

 

[scouser75]

The picture quality is good, but if anything moves you get a choppy ghost effect that does not occur when using the same application built into the tv's smarthub.

Possibly a silly question, but what's the quality of an HD film on the ATV4k?

 

[Caromsoft]

Would definitely be interested to hear other users' experiences of the new ATV with a 1080p TV.

I am interested as well. No current Apple TV or 4K sets. I would be buying the 4K model for the faster processor, gigabit networking and general future proofing as much as possible.

 

[SohoR1]

I tried multiple HDMI cables...no difference. It's good, but it's not great. I'm not interested in upgrading to a 4k tv at this time due to lack of adoption. When my cable box goes 4k, that will be the day (hopefully in 5 years?).

 

[kring]

Just read through this thread...I have a 1080p Tv and just received ATV4k...the video is terribly choppy. I tried every combination of my Tv’s settings and the ATV’s setting to no avail. I was benchmarking using my tv’s Netflix app and ATV’s netflix and watching house of cards. HOC is super crisp, clear, and smooth on the Netflix tv app. The ATV is mostly crisp and clear, but quite choppy (super annoying). To me, if you don’t have a 4K tv this isn’t worth it. My tv doesn’t need to get upgraded at this time, so I’ll hold off for awhile.

Thanks! this what I was hoping to find in this thread - a few real tests of this.

I find "HD" quality varies, I wish I could watch real HD and I think 1080p is sufficient for me, especially with slightly less then perfect vision and sitting about 10 ft away. But much of the program out there is low bit-rate HD so any action and the quality falls apart to SD. My hope was I could get the new 4KATV, stream the 4K content with 4K bit-rate and downscale to 1080p - resulting in noticeably improved HD quality overall.

Any more real-world examples out there of 4K ATV on 1080P TV?

 

[macpeach55]

Would definitely be interested to hear other users' experiences of the new ATV with a 1080p TV.

I am interested as well. No current Apple TV or 4K sets. I would be buying the 4K model for the faster processor, gigabit networking and general future proofing as much as possible.

Thanks! this what I was hoping to find in this thread - a few real tests of this.

I find "HD" quality varies, I wish I could watch real HD and I think 1080p is sufficient for me, especially with slightly less then perfect vision and sitting about 10 ft away. But much of the program out there is low bit-rate HD so any action and the quality falls apart to SD. My hope was I could get the new 4KATV, stream the 4K content with 4K bit-rate and downscale to 1080p - resulting in noticeably improved HD quality overall.

Any more real-world examples out there of 4K ATV on 1080P TV?

I got my ATV 4K yesterday. I also have the ATV 3 and it is still connected up to my receiver, so easy to make a Comparison. Just to say that I really like the quickness of the 4K, & i do like the new interface, & the remote versus the old version.

Here is my set up - nothing special but it fits together quality-wise
TV is an LG 50" Plasma THX Certified 1080P
Receiver is an Onkyo TX-SR608 Feeding a Canton 5.1 surround system
400Mbps Downstream Internet distributed via an Asus RT-AC87U Router

Ok, on to the comparison. Up to now I have watched Wonder Woman & an Episode of The Expanse on both units. Picture Quality Wise I detect no real difference, & that is not really surprising seeing as the Receiver sits in between. The streaming itself feels more solid (No sensation that not enough of the Movie is buffered), & the starts of Movies or TV episodes are much quicker. Sound Wise it seems a little more defined, although that could be me just wanting it to be so

You now have some changes with the audio output set up:-

On the ATV 3 I had Dolby Digital & Audio Output set to Auto, & automatically got the Dolby Digital Logo lighting up on the receiver (See more below)
Now with the 4K you get "Audio Output" "Audio Mode" & "Surround Sound"
Audio Output now relates to where the 4K sends the sound; I had the choice of the 4K, the ATV3, or any of my Wi-Fi connected speakers in other parts of the House
Audio Mode is the new name for what was called "Audio Output" on the ATV 3 - choice of Auto or fixed to 16 bit
Under Surround Sound you have
Best Quality Available
Dolby Digital 5.1
Stereo

At first I had it set to "Best Quality Available", but then noticed that I did not get the red Dolby Digital indicator either on the Film or the TV episode, although the sound was the same as if I set it to DD 5.1. On further reading, it turns out that on "certain" (read "older") receivers, the BQA setting will not activate the indicator even though you are actually getting DD 5.1 or 7.1 depending on your set up.

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204069

So overall I am very happy. Definitely a good step up from the ATV 3 in many respects, & I'm all set for when I get a 4K OLED later this year along with a new Receiver.

If I can help in any way with any questions, happy to!

 

[luy]

If u wanna have 1080p/24hz get the HdFury Linker. It is able to downscale the 4k signals from the Apple TV to 1080p/24hz. Im using it right now with my 1080p projector. It really looks amazing. But its a pretty expensive piece of hardware.

 

[twobelowpar]

1080p Samsung Plasma owner here. Went from ATV3 to the 4K and have no issues. No choppiness.. Netflix, Hulu, iTunes all streaming fine. I love having the app store, volume control on remote, etc. Not a fan of the TV app but could be partially due to lack of providers in Canada.

 

[Caromsoft]

macpeach55, xsmett, and twobelowpar, thank you for your feedback

 

[The Toddler]

Just rounding back to say that I set up my ATV 4k last night on my 1080p TV, a Sony W800B model. I upgraded from a 3rd gen. I still have much more testing to do (thanks, macpeach55 for the insight on audio settings -- I too have an older receiver), but at this stage I see no reason to be afraid of the upgrade.

 

[dantracht]

Have a 4K set up with my 37" vizier 1080P. For the speed increase alone it's worth the upgrade.

 

[AdamSeen]

Yes, no problems with 1080p and Apple TV 4K. Probably better experience than getting it for a 4k TV at the moment due to the unresolved switching issues.

I purchased it as a replacement to Samsung's ageing Smart TV - which although it is a 1080p TV - the quality of all streams (neflix, plex, etc...) were more like 720. So a massive, noticeable, visual upgrade already. Also centralised homekit hub, is the other reason.