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5K2K at 120Hz with Mac Mini M4

MxDaviD said:
Great, yes like I said it works exactly like the M2 Pro.
This is the cable I have.

www.amazon.de

UGREEN USB C auf DisplayPort 1.4 Kabel 8K 60Hz 30Hz 4K 240Hz 144Hz HDR VRR Thunderbolt 4 3 DP1.4 Kabel kompatibel mit iPhone 16 MacBook Pro Air M2 Mac mini M4 iPad Pro Air 5 Surface Pro 8(2M)

8K Displayport Kabel: Dieses USB C auf Displayport Kabel unterstützt eine Auflösung von bis zu 8K@60Hz/30Hz, 4K@240Hz/144Hz/120Hz/60Hz/30Hz, 2K@240Hz/144Hz/120Hz/60Hz, 1080P@240Hz/120Hz/60Hz. Mit den Funktionen HDR, HDCP2.3 und eARC können Sie Videos auf Ihren Monitor streamen und realistischere ...
www.amazon.de
Click to expand...
Here is @MxDaviD's post about the cable he is using.
 
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EugW said:
@MxDaviD already posted a screenshot of his M4 outputting 3840x1620. It's confirmed to be HiDPI as the screenshot image size is 7680x3240. I downloaded the screenshot, and looked at the info:

View attachment 2449840

David is using a UGREEN 8K DisplayPort - USB C cable with his Dell U4025QW.
Click to expand...

@EugW, I believe you're mistaken. I captured the entire screenshot at a resolution of 3008x1269, and the image size ended up being doubled. Please refer to my screenshot for clarity.

This doesn't indicate that HiDPI settings are enabled for @MxDaviD. @MxDaviD has only shared the Resolution settings, not the System Information(Graphics/Display), and as I’ve already explained, we can't determine whether resolutions are HiDPI based solely on those settings. Therefore, I still stand by my assumption that HiDPI is not supported for resolutions above 3072.

I just tried Cable Matters 8K, 1.4 DP cable, same result.

Edit: Please disregard this assumption. I took the screenshot on HiDPI which confirms the behaviour.
 

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maksakal said:
@EugW, I believe you're mistaken. I captured the entire screenshot at a resolution of 3008x1269, and the image size ended up being doubled. Please refer to my screenshot for clarity.

This doesn't indicate that HiDPI settings are enabled for @MxDaviD. @MxDaviD has only shared the Resolution settings, not the System Information(Graphics/Display), and as I’ve already explained, we can't determine whether resolutions are HiDPI based solely on those settings. Therefore, I still stand by my assumption that HiDPI is not supported for resolutions above 3072.

I just tried Cable Matters 8K, 1.4 DP cable, same result.
Click to expand...
That is not correct. If the screen shot is a doubled/quadrupled resolution, then it is HiDPI.

Here's mine on an M1 Mac mini at 2304 x 1536 low resolution. The screen grab is 2304 x 1536.

Screenshot 2024-11-11 at 1.58.17 PM.png

Here's mine at 2304 x 1536 high resolution. The screen grab is 4608 x 3072.

Screenshot 2024-11-11 at 1.57.57 PM.png
 
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@MxDaviD, thanks for the screenshot! You've cleared up the dilemma and solved the mystery. It's time to order the cable now! Thank you!
 
MxDaviD said:
No problem, if someone would want to reach me faster or have any question you can also contact me on X :)

x.com

David Grasic (@DavidGrasic) on X

All about tech 👨‍💻 Tech Enthusiast  Car Guy 🚗 ex-Apple Technician  Slovenia 🇸🇮
x.com x.com
Click to expand...
Hey MxDaviD! Do you by chance have a possibility to check whether the HiDPI scaling on the same solution also works with the included TB4 cable of the Dell U4025QW? So only one cable from the Mac Mini (besides Power)? Or does it differ to the UGreen cable?
 
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Anyone with an M4 Pro or Max able to say whether there are HiDPI resolutions higher than 3840x1620 (60Hz or higher)?

I have the 40" LG 5k/2k widescreen and use 3840x1620 HiDPI @72Hz with my M1 Max MBP. But there are some high effective resolutions that I'd love to use (e.g. 4096 x 1728) to get a little more screen real estate with text size I can still comfortably read. But they're not HiDPI with the M1 Max. Wondering if the M4 Pro or Max can do better?
 
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maksakal said:
I just received the base M4 Mac Mini and connected it to my LG 5K2K monitor, but it doesn’t support 4K HiDPI. My M1 Pro does scale correctly and supports 3840x1620 HiDPI, but the M4 Mac Mini doesn’t. I tried both Thunderbolt and HDMI connections, but no luck. I’ll be returning it.
Click to expand...
Have you tried using the BetterDisplay app to solve that problem?
 
anthonymoody said:
Anyone with an M4 Pro or Max able to say whether there are HiDPI resolutions higher than 3840x1620 (60Hz or higher)?

I have the 40" LG 5k/2k widescreen and use 3840x1620 HiDPI @72Hz with my M1 Max MBP. But there are some high effective resolutions that I'd love to use (e.g. 4096 x 1728) to get a little more screen real estate with text size I can still comfortably read. But they're not HiDPI with the M1 Max. Wondering if the M4 Pro or Max can do better?
Click to expand...

Please post if you figure this out. I can't find any clarification whether the M4 Pro will push 3840x1620 HiDPI as well as the Max will.
 
I'm just setting up a M4 MAX macbook pro and can confirm that I cannot get HiDPI at 3840 x 1620 and that's with Apples 5K Thunderbolt cable! I'm on a Dell 4021QW and it used to work fine on my M1 Max... Really frustrated I've gone backwards.
 
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rojharris said:
I'm just setting up a M4 MAX macbook pro and can confirm that I cannot get HiDPI at 3840 x 1620 and that's with Apples 5K Thunderbolt cable! I'm on a Dell 4021QW and it used to work fine on my M1 Max... Really frustrated I've gone backwards.
Click to expand...
Ironically this may be good news, since I don't see Apple going backwards especially with M4 gen's supposed display engine upgrade. On the base chip maybe but not on the Max. This may just be a software lock waiting to be lifted, along with the base M4 capability.
 
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rojharris said:
I'm just setting up a M4 MAX macbook pro and can confirm that I cannot get HiDPI at 3840 x 1620 and that's with Apples 5K Thunderbolt cable! I'm on a Dell 4021QW and it used to work fine on my M1 Max... Really frustrated I've gone backwards.
Click to expand...
I don't really understand this since others here are able to get it.
 
Chancha said:
Ironically this may be good news, since I don't see Apple going backwards especially with M4 gen's supposed display engine upgrade. On the base chip maybe but not on the Max. This may just be a software lock waiting to be lifted, along with the base M4 capability.
Click to expand...
I really hope so. I've tried everything, including Better Display and SwitchXres... HDMI etc etc. Nothing works.
 
Please folks, don't try to use screenshot sizes to determine if your setup is HiDPI or not. There are several better ways.

1. Use BetterDisplay. Here's a screenshot from my M2 Max MBP 16", connected to a Samsung G95NC 57" superultrawide, which is split using Picture by Picture mode to 5120x2160 + 2560x2160 displays.

The bar that says 3840x1620 shows the scaled resolution, and the "High Resolution (HIDPI) being colored shows it's running in a HiDPI mode.

Screenshot 2024-11-12 at 14.13.52.png



2. Use System Information.

"Resolution" shows the current rendered resolution, "UI Looks like" shows the scaled resolution.
For HiDPI, "Resolution" should show 2x "UI Looks like" resolution.

Screenshot 2024-11-12 at 14.17.10.png



3. Use Settings -> Displays.

Turn on Advanced -> Show resolutions as list, then turn on "Show all resolutions". Now you can clearly see the supported HiDPI and LoDPI resolutions. Anything that is not native res, or says (low resolution) is HiDPI.

Screenshot 2024-11-12 at 14.19.36.png


I recommend you use BetterDisplay, because just toggling the High Resolution toggle will immediately show you the difference between HiDPI and LoDPI. If it cannot be enabled, then you don't have a HiDPI option.

The reasons why you might not get the full capabilities from your display:
  • Mac hardware capabilities. This is usually the main reason.
    • M1 series is by far the worst in this regard. Its HDMI port is HDMI 2.0 speed only.
    • M2-M4 Pro/Max/Ultra will generally have better display capabilities than the base model M2-M4. Max/Ultra has the guaranteed best display capabilities. There is no obvious way to figure this out from specs.
    • M2-M4 Pro and Max display capabilities in Apple specs are identical.
  • Connection type.
    • The native HDMI 2.1 port should be what you try first.
    • USB-C/TB -> HDMI 2.1 adapters/cables can be very problematic on MacOS. There are afaik very few that actually work at HDMI 2.1 speeds, others drop to HDMI 2.0 speeds on Macs. Yet those same cables and adapters will happily work on Windows PCs.
    • USB-C/TB -> Displayport 1.4 should generally also work well. It can even be less problematic than the native HDMI port in my experience, if we are dealing with oddball resolutions. For example, I can't get the 11:9 aspect ratio 2560x2160 working reliably on my Mac without using a USB-C to CableMatters DP 1.4 adapter. Why? Ask Apple, their external display handling is straight up ****.
    • USB-C/TB -> USB-C/TB should also work well, and be equivalent to DP 1.4.
    • TB5 -> Displayport 2.1 is still a mystery. This was just added in the M4 Pro/Max series. Technically TB4 -> DP 2.1 cables should be fine but whether it works right is unknown at the time of writing. I think we will see what happens when TB5 cables, adapters and docks start appearing on the market. It's possible that MacOS updates in the upcoming year will also silently fix stuff.
  • Display capabilities.
    • Some displays don't support the same capabilities over DP and HDMI. Some might even have specific ports that perform worse. Check the manual or reviews of your display.
    • Try reducing refresh rate. On one 4K display, HDR would not work at anything but 1:1 ("Looks like 1920x1080") and native 4K, unless I dropped refresh rate to 60 Hz.
  • Number of displays.
    • The higher the res and refresh rate, the more likely it is that multi-monitor setups won't work at max capabilities. Try reducing your setup to a single display and see if that solves the problem.
  • Cable quality.
    • Macs are inexplicably picky about this. I had a 2m HDMI 2.1 cable that worked fine on a 3840x2160 @ 144 Hz display, but would randomly flicker at 5120x2160 @ 120 Hz. If I connect that same cable to my desktop PC's Nvidia 4090, there is no issue even at 7680x2160 @ 120 Hz.
    • Use high quality, certified, preferably short cables. HDMI 2.1 and DP 2.1 are especially picky about cable length, so if you can keep your Mac close to the display, use short cables (0.5 - 1.5m) as well.
  • Docks and hubs.
    • Until TB5 docks become more common, docks should be avoided with above 4K @ 60 Hz displays. A single 40 Gbps USB-C/TB port is just not enough to drive multiple displays or high res, high refresh rate screens, especially if shared with USB and Ethernet.
    • Many docks and hubs will only list e.g 4K @ 60 hz capabilities for displays.
    • If facing issues, try if connecting directly to a dedicated port on your Mac.
  • MacOS shenanigans.
    • On my G95NC, there's 2x HDMI 2.1 48 Gbps ports, and 1x HDMI 2.1 32 Gbps port. The 32 Gbps port is supposed to do 8Kx2K @ 120 Hz, and it does on my desktop PC. On MacOS, I cannot get above 60 Hz out of that port no matter what resolution. Why? Ask Apple!
TL;DR: MacOS is straight up **** when it comes to external display handling and scaling.
 
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Newgoblin49 said:
I'm just thinking out loud here but do you think the Apple Thunderbolt 4 cable would work ?

I doubt very many have that cable to test it out
Click to expand...
I have the Apple TB5 cable on an M4 Max and so far, no luck making it work. Am ordering the 8K Ugreen one.
 
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