AdMob Chief Responds to Apple's New Developer Terms for Analytics Data Collection

[BayouMan]

blah blah blah

When Google makes the hardware and doesn't want their internal secrets getting out, they'll restrict AdMob analytics from going directly to competitors. Plain and simple. It is still a unique situation for Apple. As hardware manufacturer, OS maker, and now as Ad administrator/regulator, it puts the company in a unique, if almost painful position. Protect your hardware, or lose your edge. Do so and you get blasted.

(And an aside note to those who even TRY to bring up tired old Microsoft arguments into this, when MS removes the requirement that a PC have Internet Explorer installed in order to use the software update feature, then they'll have a better leg to stand on, but for now, their OS REQUIRES that their own browser be installed to do so. Just because they allow other browsers does not mean they really gave up on their mandatory use of IE for PC users.)

 

[LagunaSol]

But I am not aware of any restriction on software development and connected advertising on Android. If there is no app approval process, how would Google monitor and control what ad platforms are used in Android apps?

Google is free because it will be paid for with advertising. Do you think Google is going to provide a free OS and let other companies use it to make money on advertising at Google's expense? Highly unlikely.

Android's "openness" is a charade - it's a commercial product from a corporation that intends to profit from it not by selling it but by pumping advertising through it. Anyone who believes Google's song and dance about freedom is a fool.

Google's Android rants against Apple are like the Bolsheviks telling the people how much better off they'll be liberated from the czars. Unfortunately, people believed the Bolsheviks too...

 

[madmaxmedia]

Again that is not what he had ask, don't change the context of the subject to make it seem like you have a answer to his question; it was posted as follows


"Unless someone can post a link to where AdMob gives Apple all the same info about Android phone users I keep my opinion."

Facts are this has noting to do with what Apple can do in the future, Facts are Google and AdMob do not give Apple direct data information, so Apple has no legal right to give Admob any data about any Apple user (.)

Now do you understand sunshine, this is business not a Sunday church social.

For god sake how stupid can people be, If you have had any background in busniess you would be aware it's a game if chess sometimes you win and if your real good a checkmate is at evey crossroad.

Understand this is how it's done and it's a good solid move by Apple.

Where did I say Apple shouldn't do this?

Someone said Apple couldn't collect analytics data from Android users. They can if they set up a mobile ad platform for Android.

I am actually roughly okay with this move. It would have bothered me if Apple had prohibited ALL mobile ad analytics collection, but that is not the case. Independent ad platforms can still operate as before. This new rule only restricts companies that develop competing mobile platforms.

 

[robbyx]

I think it does have something to do with enhancing customer experience. Apple doesn't want Google collecting all kinds of information on its customers and then doing ??? with it.

But, you're right. It's definitely a swipe at Google, and frankly, fair is far. Maybe Google should have thought all of this through a bit more before going up against Apple. Android is simply a vehicle to sell more ads. Google makes no money on Android, so their only option is to shove ads down our throats as much as possible.

Apple and Google had a good relationship until Google decided to go head-to-head. The two companies could have had a very amicable and mutually beneficial relationship. And now Google is pushing Apple and Microsoft closer together. Stupid move. Regardless of what Google might like to believe about itself, it's hardly irreplaceable. Apple and Microsoft control the operating system markets and there's no chance that ChromeOS will make any more of a dent than Linux. Google should have worked with - not against - the real powers in Silicon Valley.

They're not 'required' to.

Apple could extend iAds to Android platform if they wanted to and collect information on Android users, because it is open and does not have the restrictions Apple has introduced.

But I understand the competitive reasoning behind the move. As I said, it does not prevent independent ad platforms from collecting such data- had they done that I would have strongly disagreed with the move (and I think it would have resulted in too much negative PR to be worth it.)

Just saying it has nothing to do with enhancing customer experience.

 

[robbyx]

Bingo! Don't buy the Android hype. Google wants to know everything about you - so that it can sell, sell, sell to you 24/7. Android is the vehicle. No thanks!

Google is free because it will be paid for with advertising. Do you think Google is going to provide a free OS and let other companies use it make money on advertising at Google's expense? Highly unlikely.

Android's "openness" is a charade - it's a commercial product from a corporation that intends to profit from it not by selling it but by pumping advertising through it. Anyone who believes Google's song and dance about freedom is a fool.

Google's Android rants against Apple are like the Bolsheviks telling the people how much better off they'll be liberated from the czars. Unfortunately, people believed the Bolsheviks too...

 

[madmaxmedia]

in fact, at least at the moment, there is, because iAd is build right into iOS.

Do you really not get my general point, or do you just want to split hairs?

Someone said that Apple COULD NOT collect ad analytics info on Android. But there is no such restrictions on the Android platform.

So they actually could if they chose to. I was only clarifying how mobile advertising platforms can operate on iOS vs. Android.

 

[robbyx]

Very good point, one that has been missed so far in this discussion.

That's not a fair assessment. Apple did not change the rules to favor iAds over other third party ad companies would be affected to. Apple realized what analytics were capable of when they read about the discovery of their iPads in Cuppertino. Apple is concerned that AdMob has a conflict of intrest in that it's aanlytics could provide insight into Apple's prototypes. AdMob can still server ads on the iPhone, they just cannot collect analytics.

 

[notabadname]

it's clear that competition delivers the best outcome.

This is competition. AdMob's idea of competition is McDonalds being required to sell Whoppers in their franchises.

Coke doesn't have to allow Pepsi into the vault to view "the recipe", and Apple doesn't have to allow the competition an avenue into Apple's customer's habits, wants and demographics. This is valuable information obviously for Apple, which, in a true competition, you don't give to your rival. A competitor should have to develop their own avenue for this data. Not whine about the competition denying them easy access to metrics.

 

[whooleytoo]

Question: Does anyone else think that watching Apple and Google fight over who can show you adverts and how much info they can get from your device, is a bit like watching two guys fighting over who gets to kick you in the nuts?

 

[madmaxmedia]

Google is free because it will be paid for with advertising. Do you think Google is going to provide a free OS and let other companies use it make money on advertising at Google's expense? Highly unlikely.

Android's "openness" is a charade - it's a commercial product from a corporation that intends to profit from it not by selling it but by pumping advertising through it. Anyone who believes Google's song and dance about freedom is a fool.

Google's Android rants against Apple are like the Bolsheviks telling the people how much better off they'll be liberated from the czars. Unfortunately, people believed the Bolsheviks too...

There are mobile advertising platforms on Android (outside of AdMob which of course Google owns.) You are clearly conflating Google's own advertising revenue, vs. selling advertising in independent 3rd party apps (using mobile ad platforms like AdMob, iAds, etc.)

I'm not saying Google is the good guy or the bad guy. There are distinct differences in how Google and Apple have chosen to operate their mobile platforms, that's all.

 

[HiRez]

I smell another DOJ investigation.

And actually, Apple might be in trouble on this one, because it's pretty clearly anti-competitive. They're basically saying you can compete with us (get the analytics data), as long as you're not too large to really be a threat.

 

[HiRez]

AdMob can still server ads on the iPhone, they just cannot collect analytics.

Yes, but you can't run that business without the analytics data. Advertisers need to know what people and how many people are seeing their ads, otherwise they will not pay.

 

[madmaxmedia]

I smell another DOJ investigation.

And actually, Apple might be in trouble on this one, because it's pretty clearly anti-competitive. They're basically saying you can compete with us (get the analytics data), as long as you're not too large to really be a threat.

It has nothing to do with size though. It only has to do with whether the mobile ad company is connected to development of a competing mobile platform.

I could start an independent MobileAD company, compete with iAds on Apple and somehow turn it into a bigger ad provider than iAds, and Apple's new developer terms would not apply to me.

But if I were to develop a new mobile OS one day, then it would (regardless of how big my ad platform is or isn't.)

 

[PatrickCocoa]

or with which feet Steve Jobs is waking up today.

I don't understand this idiom. Should it be "on which side of the bed Steve Jobs is waking up today"?

 

[Tux Kapono]

Here's what makes this whole thing sound childish...

I don't have any apps on my Mac (that I know of) that have banner ads or any kind of advertising in it. It's always been like this, and still is. The same for iPhone and iPad apps.

So, Apple introduces iAds as an unobtrusive way to allow an app within an app system so developers can create revenue for their free apps (and I hope it sticks to that).

Now suddenly, within the same month, Google/Admob wants to do the same, but in a decidedly more obtrusive way (as banners). No, hell no. It's bad enough that the OS is allowing any kind of ads as it is.

I don't want banner advertising in my Mac apps to become a trend, and the same goes for iPads and iPhones. Stay out of my sandbox, Admob, and stop whining about it.

 

[mcmlxix]

…and without Google, Apple would definitely be in the mire. I don't think they appreciate that, but have you tried using Bing?!)

Sure Google is the most used and best search today, but that’s unlikely to always to be true.

I have a sneaking suspicion that Apple is working behind the scenes with Microsoft to bring Bing up to a level where it could be Google’s usurper. What then Google? Apple’s booting AdMob will look trivial.

 

[Mattie Num Nums]

This is competition. AdMob's idea of competition is McDonalds being required to sell Whoppers in their franchises.

Another person trying to compare two totally different industries.

 

[Reed Rothchild]

Google is free because it will be paid for with advertising. Do you think Google is going to provide a free OS and let other companies use it make money on advertising at Google's expense? Highly unlikely.

Android's "openness" is a charade - it's a commercial product from a corporation that intends to profit from it not by selling it but by pumping advertising through it. Anyone who believes Google's song and dance about freedom is a fool.

Google's Android rants against Apple are like the Bolsheviks telling the people how much better off they'll be liberated from the czars. Unfortunately, people believed the Bolsheviks too...

You think Apple aren't going to also try and rape their users with iAds and whatever else they can get their hands on? At least with Google it's fairly transparent, and they do provide tools to disable tracking of web activity. Android is also nice and open and benefits from this enormously. iOS is big brother incarnate compared to Google.

Better a Bolshevik than a Stalinist.

 

[AtHomeBoy_2000]

Question: Does anyone else think that watching Apple and Google fight over who can show you adverts and how much info they can get from your device, is a bit like watching two guys fighting over who gets to kick you in the nuts?

If the app is free, I have absolutely NO problem with ads

 

[PatrickCocoa]

God bless Steve Jobs, he is digging his own tomb.

Tombs are (usually) above ground. They are intended to be monuments for future visitors. Perhaps you meant "he is digging his own grave"?

 

[Hunabku]

To be completely honest, I don't have a source that explicitly says Apple can develop an ad platform for Android.

But I am not aware of any restriction on software development and connected advertising on Android. If there is no app approval process, how would Google monitor and control what ad platforms are used in Android apps?

Currently there probably are minimal restrictions on software development and advertising on Android. Its not because they love you its because it that is the whole PR angle/strategy so they can do their covert user data collection and advertising scheme. That is why Adsob is whining like it is - this is calculated PR folks.

Now if the shoe were on the other foot and Apple was in a position to seriously compete with or erode Googles turf. I'd bet you a million dollars that your do no evil "open" Google would take a similar action and limit Apple. It's not in Googles current strategy because their the upstarts and they cleverly have adopted the open/not evil strategy.

 

[BigJimmyC]

Of course you would have no objection if Microsoft had banned competing apps, like iTunes, and competing devices, like iPods, from Windows.

Bingo. Can you imagine what would have happened to apple if microsoft prevent ipods from being compatible with windows? Apple as we know it today wouldn't exist. The ipod got apple a new name for itself and brought in tons of money. If ipods couldn't be used on windows, nobody would have bought them since nobody is going to buy a whole new computer just so they can use an mp3 player. But now that apple's got the other end of the stick they don't wanna play nice.

 

[madmaxmedia]

I think it does have something to do with enhancing customer experience. Apple doesn't want Google collecting all kinds of information on its customers and then doing ??? with it.

But, you're right. It's definitely a swipe at Google, and frankly, fair is far. Maybe Google should have thought all of this through a bit more before going up against Apple. Android is simply a vehicle to sell more ads. Google makes no money on Android, so their only option is to shove ads down our throats as much as possible.

Apple and Google had a good relationship until Google decided to go head-to-head. The two companies could have had a very amicable and mutually beneficial relationship. And now Google is pushing Apple and Microsoft closer together. Stupid move. Regardless of what Google might like to believe about itself, it's hardly irreplaceable. Apple and Microsoft control the operating system markets and there's no chance that ChromeOS will make any more of a dent than Linux. Google should have worked with - not against - the real powers in Silicon Valley.

I completely agree with (almost) all of your points. It is all competition, and Apple new rules are restricted to ad platforms connected with companies with competing mobile platforms.

Apple and Google were natural partners at one point, but obviously both companies are very successful and will continue to grow and expand. It's not hard to see that competitive friction would eventually result.

Regarding customer experience- Apple doesn't seem to care if other companies (or the companies that advertise via iAds) collect analytics information and does ???? with it. This is why the rules strikes me as purely competitive (and thus largely fine.) They aren't restricting advertising information collection as a whole, only for companies with competing mobile platforms.

 

[voidptr]

Yes, but you can't run that business without the analytics data. Advertisers need to know what people and how many people are seeing their ads, otherwise they will not pay.

They're still allowed to collect basic information on ad views.

What they're not allowed to collect anymore is device and OS information that could betray unreleased products.

 

[gdbleb]

Like someone already posted a great move by move. This is a chess game being played i doubt its the last move and this is the end result. Just relax sit back and enjoy the game.

Daniel.

PS: sorry that you are upset in finding out big companies are not nice and Steve is running apple as a really big company.

Yep - REALLY big. 2nd largest market cap co. in the world - I think.
Lots and lots of other really big companies are your competition, rivals, jilted lovers, etc. And many other companies just looking to make a bundle of money riding your coattails too.

Our "little" Apple has smashed the old business mantra of "Core Competencies" whereby you do one thing really well and outsource the rest. Our "little" Apple now does chip design, hardware, system design & integration, OS, App SW, App marketplace, Bookstore, Media Store, Retail outlets, Developer toolset, etc. The only thing they do not do is manufacturing (chip-level or system-level).

Its a whole new world and the rest of the industry is still wondering WTF is happening. There is no way these other guys can catch up with that level of tight integration in many years.

Also - PITA is "pain in the a$$"