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Adobe to Resume Work on Flash-to-iPhone Compiler

If Apple is so great as you all seem to believe since everybody seems to just swallow whole everything SJ says.

Then they will not allow any crappy developed apps.

They will test and if you are a ****** developer you won't be able to get it to run smoothly and not crash, doesn't matter what tools you use or what language you use.

People worry too much. As if Apple would give you a choice on what to install on your iPhone. You can only install what they approve for you to install. In this case it's a good thing i guess to weed out the crappy apps. And this is what in my opinion what will keep the App store on top of the Droid Marketplace when it starts getting big.
 
I'm actually surprised with Apple's recent decision to loosen up App Store restrictions. Now if Jobs would only bring HDCP to OS X for Blu-Ray (full high def support for Final Cut and no need for Windows on a Mac Mini HTPC).
 
Maybe some day Flash will make it to Safari on iOS. Then I can finally see all those bright, blinking ads that I miss so much.

Maybe... *sniff* .....some day.
 
SPUY767 said:
That's not entirely accurate. On a device with limited resources, e.g. a phone, the language and tools used are extremely important. You can get away with being a crappy programmer on a platform with seemingly infinite resources, by comparison, e.g. a PC. This is why there are no worthwhile JIT compiled languages that run well on phones. Java ran OK, but the apps that it was running weren't exactly earth shattering, but I'd love to see someone attempt Epic Citadel in a JIT language.
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and yet even there that is quickly being a non issue. Memory and processing power on phones is quickly getting to the point that it does not matter much.
 
killmoms said:
Unsurprising! Now get ready for a flood of crappy “native” (AIR) apps on the App Store. :(
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Um... You can make really ****** apps with C+ too. I think that while there are allot of developers who will churn out completely ridiculous Flash built apps, there are others who may have some really interesting ideas, but since they may not have any coding experience are leaving their ideas on the table. I'm personally really exited what people might do now that Apple has started to gradually move away from their totalitarian app submission policy.
 
SPUY767 said:
PeterQVenkman said:
If you're a good developer then you have nothing to worry about from sub-par apps, native or otherwise.
Click to expand...

That's not entirely accurate. On a device with limited resources, e.g. a phone, the language and tools used are extremely important. You can get away with being a crappy programmer on a platform with seemingly infinite resources, by comparison, e.g. a PC. >snip<
Click to expand...

I think I wasn't clear - I meant a good developer should have nothing to fear if their competition is a bad app, native or otherwise.

Zarubsoba was more clear than I was:

zarusoba said:
If Flash-made apps are inherently inferior to those coded natively, won't the bad reviews kill the market for those apps?
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Likewise, the good apps should rise to the top.
 
The last time I looked not every app in the app store was like Epic Citadel. Like it or not but the ios devices have always been plagued by crappy 5 minute attention span sort of apps. Most current ios apps are gags at best so I really don't see a huge change there.

Why don't we all wait and see what happens with this. I think some of the Xcode developers are just freaking out that they may no longer get top dollar as the select few who can make ios apps. There are a lot of apps currently in the app store that are simple enough that would work perfectly if they were compiled with Flash. I'm talking more or less a web page in app form or simple tile based games like retro game remakes.

The Flash ios compiler does make use of the ios GPU so these apps will without a doubt run much faster then a Flash player plugin in a web browser. Maybe these apps will not run as fast as an xcode app but I doubt any Flash developer plans on making a game as large as Epic Citadel with Flash. After all there isn't such a thing for a PC on that scale so why all of a sudden would there be for ios? The key is going to be for developers to understand what the limits are.

Hey the best part of all of this is that the haters don't have to buy the apps if they suspect they were compiled with Flash. My challenge to you is to go ahead and try to figure out which ones they are once they start coming out.
 
juanster said:
If Apple is so great as you all seem to believe since everybody seems to just swallow whole everything SJ says.

Then they will not allow any crappy developed apps.

They will test and if you are a ****** developer you won't be able to get it to run smoothly and not crash, doesn't matter what tools you use or what language you use.

People worry too much. As if Apple would give you a choice on what to install on your iPhone. You can only install what they approve for you to install. In this case it's a good thing i guess to weed out the crappy apps. And this is what in my opinion what will keep the App store on top of the Droid Marketplace when it starts getting big.
Click to expand...

So you want more crap apps in the Droid store...so be it. It's called Verizon and AT&T. Have a blast!
 
PeterQVenkman said:
You are missing the bigger picture. Apple finally woke up and smelled the coffee when they saw "Epic Citadel" and Rage running on the iPhone. Say what you want about Adobe, because lord knows they've earned plenty of the crap they're taking, but this is about getting people the right tools to do the right job.

That's ID Tech 5, Unreal, and Unity. The tools real game developers use to make the best games!
Click to expand...

Tools like those used in Epic Citadel still generate Open GL code which is why it runs well. The flash compiler basically creates a layer between the OS and the developers App which translates to bad touch responses and bad frame rates. Apple doesn't want that experience for users but they realised that its better to reject an App based on poor user experience rather than because it was made using a tool.

Flash will never be a good tool to make touch screen Apps.

Also having a sea of crap apps that people have taken no time developing will affect people who spend time doing good apps because they will be harder to find.
 
UnseenLlama said:
So you want more crap apps in the Droid store...so be it. It's called Verizon and AT&T. Have a blast!
Click to expand...

I think you totally misunderstood juanster.


rudigern said:
Tools like those used in Epic Citadel still generate Open GL code which is why it runs well.
Click to expand...

And most of those tools still use scripting languages - sometimes custom ONLY to their game/level editor - as the means of actually developing the app.

Apple realised that its better to reject an App based on poor user experience rather than because it was made using a tool.
Click to expand...

As it should have been in the first place.

Flash will never be a good tool to make touch screen Apps.
Click to expand...

never say never. Right now it sucks. I don't think Adobe will get it together, but we'll see.

Also having a sea of crap apps that people have taken no time developing will affect people who spend time doing good apps because they will be harder to find.
Click to expand...

That problem already exists now, without Flash as part of the equation.
 
how to identify apps built this way?

Too bad there's no easy way to identify apps built this way. Then customers who are against easy bloatware development can boycott this stuff (unless it somehow proves great enough that it's overcome this intrinsic handicap).
 
How can we tell that a crappy app is adobe's? There are a lot of soso aps out there, but I wonder how to differentiate native vs third party app?
 
RawBert said:
Maybe some day Flash will make it to Safari on iOS. Then I can finally see all those bright, blinking ads that I miss so much.

Maybe... *sniff* .....some day.
Click to expand...

Or the real nike+ site
or the Adidas site
or the ufc site
or hulu
or Sherdog
or mmatorch
or cbc in Canada.
or google Analytics
or anything half as awesome as this http://waterlife.nfb.ca/

*sniff* I do miss flash. I don't care if it dies. Let it die. But it is not even closed to dead yet. So I do miss that HUGE chunk of internet that is missing on my iPhone. And no all those crappy sites like the nike+ version they made for the iPhone do not count. there is no rich media experience in them.
 
Bonsai1214 said:
i'm going to get ready for a flood of poorly made games then :(
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:rolleyes: yeah, a whole flood of games that will force themselves onto your device, without giving you any choice

free market people... if the games suck, then people won't buy them.
 
Rodimus Prime said:
and yet even there that is quickly being a non issue. Memory and processing power on phones is quickly getting to the point that it does not matter much.
Click to expand...

Not entirely true. I know a flash website that takes up 120% CPU of a 2.4GHz dual core and about 400MB of RAM and all it does is display basic content. Bad tools attract bad developers, people who don't know the difference between relative urls and absolute urls, thinking that a 4MB jpg being displayed at 40px x 40px is ok.
 
killmoms said:
Unsurprising! Now get ready for a flood of crappy “native” (AIR) apps on the App Store. :(
Click to expand...

How is this different from some of the crappy native apps? I'm waiting for the first million dollar Flash iPhone app to finally quite all you Flash complainers! It will happen!
 
i.mac said:
How can we tell that a crappy app is adobe's? There are a lot of soso aps out there, but I wonder how to differentiate native vs third party app?
Click to expand...

If you know what to look for its easy. But as not many do people blame the hardware or the OS rather than the game. Hence why the App store is restrictive, people don't often realise where the problem lies.
 
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/webers-on-the-grill/id321412323?mt=8

Ok here is an example of an app that will without a doubt run flawless if it were made with the Flash compiler. This app is not made with Flash but I am using this as an example of the totally lame native xcode apps that are out there right now. This thing is more or less a cookbook in app form and is something Flash will be able to do with flying colors. The beauty of it however is that a smaller company doesn't have to pay somebody $10,000.00 to build them a stupid app like this. Content is what drives the app store and believe it or not many of the interactive designers in the world that have been winning awards for the last 10 years are Flash designers/developers. Content is king and if a light app can be as good as some award winning Flash websites then I think it will sell very well and most people will be happy.

If some of you really want to know how to tell which apps are made with Flash then you have to start to ask yourself why you are freaking out so much. If you cannot tell then what is the big deal? Just use it and judge for yourself.

Give a pro iMovie and they will make a great movie. Give an amateur Final Cut Pro and you will still get garbage. A better programming environment doesn't always give better programs. Content will always be king. Just look at half the Nintendo Wii games as an example. These are made by seasoned professionals with a decent programming language and half the games are still garbage. Sure they run at a high framerate but who cares they are lame.
 
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