Adobe Universal Support FAQ

[silentlaughmode]

Really? I don't know ANY designers who are still running on Blue and Whites or OS9. I have 3 Duals (1.25, 1.4, 2.0), 1 Quad (8 GB RAM, 1.5 TB hard drives), CS2, Maya 7 Unlimited, Electric Image, Lightwave, After Effects, Quark, Final Cut, Real Flow, 2 Barcos and a Cinema Display all running on Tiger. That did NOT come cheap.

wow, thanks for that newsflash. i guess my 1.67GHz PB, 1.6 GHz G5, dual 1.25GHz G4, all running 10.4.4, Illustrator CS2, Photoshop CS and 23" Cinema are pretty behind the times.

i know you're making broad generalizations, but i guess i hang w/ different designers. all the ones i know are on G4 PB's or G5 desktops and none of us have seen the HappyMac face of OS9 in years. i was "using" the developer release of 10.0, when did you switch?? (i say "using", b/c it wasn't very useful, but damn it looked pretty)

maybe you just know bad designers that can't afford to buy computers made in this decade or maybe they have kids (those things will soak up some dispoable income).

That guy may have made a generalization but I think I can speak for some other people when I say that some designers are a little cocky about their hardware...

 

[robbieduncan]

It's really unlikely that major cross-platform apps will make the pointless jump to being all Cocoa.l

After all, Cocoa is built on Carbon. Ding-ding!

If Carbon were bad, would Cocoa be using it?

Cocoa is not built on top of Carbon. Cocoa does not use Carbon. You are confusing the Core Foundation/Quartz/etc layer with Carbon. Cocoa and Carbon both sit on top of a common layer of foundation code. The APIs they expose are very different.

It is possible to call into Carbon from Cocoa but to say that Cocoa is built on Carbon is wrong.

 

[gnasher729]

I am not surprised, though...Photoshop (and Flash...the other thing I need) are old-ass bloated apps, and I know they are Carbon to the core, so moving to XCode and Cocoa is a lot of work for those Adobe engineers.

I don't know where this idea comes from that there is any need to port to Cocoa. Carbon applications work just fine, and they can be ported to Intel Macs just fine. The problem is applications that need CodeWarrior to compile: CodeWarrior is dead, unsupported, and cannot produce code that runs on Intel Macs.

 

[jacobj]

...And hopefully the Lightroom UB beta will fill a big camera raw processing void on the new macbook pros until Adobe releases CS3 next year...

Where have Adobe announced that Lightroom will be Universal? They're Beta version is not and nor do they state that it will be as far as I can tell.

Could we be wating 2 years for a universal Lightroom... ?

EDIT: I just didn't look hard enough..

Lightroom Product Details

Will Lightroom run on Intel-based Macintoshes?
We already have a version of the Lightroom beta running internally at Adobe on an Intel-based Macintosh, but the version we are initially posting to Adobe Labs only supports PowerPC-based Macs. We don’t want to release to the public a version of Lightroom that runs on Intel-based Macs until Apple is shipping these systems, because there is always the possibility that there could be changes in the final shipping systems. We want to be able to test Lightroom on a production version of these new systems prior to making it publicly available.

 

[robbieduncan]

Where have Adobe announced that Lightroom will be Universal? They're Beta version is not and nor do they state that it will be as far as I can tell.

Could we be wating 2 years for a universal Lightroom... ?

They have stated a few times that there will be a Universal Beta within the next few months.

 

[hvfsl]

I recently managed to get Adobe Creative Suite Pro 1 for £110 (ebuyer.com was getting rid of their old software at greatly reduced prices) and looking at Adobe's website, it looks like I will be able to use the upgrade version from CS1 to CS3 (which should only cost me another £150). So I am not too bothered about this.

 

[Chip NoVaMac]

I use Photoshop every day in my profession. I'm working on it 8 hours a day, 5 days a week, around 50 weeks of the year. I will not upgrade my G5 until Photoshop is a universal binary. However, I still manage fine on my dual G5 2.0 Ghz even after almost 2 years so I can wait a while longer.

CS2 came out in May 2005. Since Adobe is pretty consistent with the 18 month upgrade cycle expect CS3 to come out around Nov 2006, or the end of this year. Considering the Pro machines won't go Intel until probably around WWDC in July waiting another half year really won't be that bad. Sure it's not the best news in the world, but I can hold off. The time it will take to get pro apps from other vendors than Apple out with universal binaries is going to hurt adoption of the new machines a bit though.

Yeah, I see the point - but SJ gave the masses the idea that vendors would have universals of current apps for about $30-40. It sucks that Adobe is wanting to milk their user base the way they are. It is bad enough that once CS3 hits the streets, what ever cameras that are supported in ACR 3.x in CS2 are it. Any new cameras will force the PS user to CS3 anyways.

 

[AidenShaw]

Cocoa is not built on top of Carbon. Cocoa does not use Carbon. You are confusing the Core Foundation/Quartz/etc layer with Carbon. Cocoa and Carbon both sit on top of a common layer of foundation code. The APIs they expose are very different.

It is possible to call into Carbon from Cocoa but to say that Cocoa is built on Carbon is wrong.

Perhaps it's just a semantic issue, but I've seen many statements like

"it seemed to me that the right way to look at the two frameworks is not side by side as all of Apple's marketing material would indicate, but as Cocoa building on top of Carbon."​

http://www.macdevcenter.com/pub/a/mac/2001/05/23/cocoa_vs_carbon.html

 

[iGary]

I'm not trying to sound like a smarty pants, but this is exactly why I bought my machine a month after WWDC.

 

[Manatee]

That's disappointing. Some of my most-used apps are from Adobe, and I'd really like to have the full power of the machine. Maybe I'll just keep my Powerbooks until Adobe can deliver universal builds. Maybe they just didn't see this coming.

 

[jer2eydevil88]

MacGIMP Has Been Built Cross-Platform with XCode 2.2

A Universal binary of MacGIMP for PowerPC and Intel-based Macs has been built and is being tested in preparation for any Intel-based Macs that Apple may introduce in the future. If you would like to test the Intel-PowerPC Universal version of MacGIMP, please email: mat@macgimp.org

Adobe can take its time I'm no pro and can get by with gimp until they get up their off archaic code base and give us a real update.

 

[aegisdesign]

I need a vector drawing package to finally complete my switch from PC to Mac, and was in two minds whether or not I should go for Illustrator CS2. But at £499 including VAT (and yes my American friends, that's a whopping US$886), it wasn't a decision I was ever going to take lightly.

Try http://www.purgatorydesign.com/Intaglio/ $89 if you can't afford the big iron apps.

They have stated a few times that there will be a Universal Beta within the next few months.

IIRC it's also a Cocoa app from the ground up too with no legacy code.

 

[ATD]

That guy may have made a generalization but I think I can speak for some other people when I say that some designers are a little cocky about their hardware...

LOL, I'll agree with that one. It's not like anyone here lists their hardware/software with their posts or anything like that. Myself included.


The guy did make a generalization that from my POV had little to no truth in it. I know lots of designers who are on G5s/CS2/Tiger at work as well as home. Some on G4s and OSX. None on Blue and Whites and OS9.

 

[ImAlwaysRight]

Photoshop Elements

I know this is a different caliber app, but Photoshop Elements is due to come out with version 4 by March. (ver 3 was out in late 2004) I imagine this will be a universal app. Fits in well with the consumer release of the iMac, and probably by March, the iBook (oops, I mean, MacBook).

 

[devman]

Frankly, I've never read so much pointless and unrealistic whining in a thread.

Wow, you must not have read the MacBook Pro announcement thread then...

This timescale is reasonable. Those who use the Adobe CS — day in, day out — for their jobs will not be put out by this at all.

The number of graphics pros who rely on laptops for their work are in a small minority.

And for those of you who wonder why Photoshop is the industry standard yet have it running on your machines, I suggest that you don't know what the hell you're doing with it.

Totally agree with all that. Well said.

As has been said before in this thread - this is not news. Adobe said so right after the switch to Intel announcement.

As has also been said before in this thread - the only thing that is a surprise is that people here are surprised.

 

[iMeowbot]

Enough with the Cocoa ranting.

Cocoa or a lack thereof is not the reason it takes time to port these programs to Macintel. Carbon is alive and well. The build environment (Abode were using CodeWarrior and now must use Xcode) is a much more important issue.

It would be silly for Adobe to use either Carbon or Cocoa for more than what absolutely must interact with the OS anyway. They sell most of their stuff on Windows, where both of the Apple APIs are useless.

Being on Windows means that all the important parts of their software are already optimized for x86.

Again this is all about Adobe not seeing the point of moving old versions from CW to Xcode. I don't see a point in doing that either, not when new versions are already in the works as part of their regular cycle.

The software will make it over when it's good and ready, and it won't help anyone for old product to go through a slipshod conversion and be rushed out the door.

 

[MacTruck]

I'm not trying to sound like a smarty pants, but this is exactly why I bought my machine a month after WWDC.

Yep. Thats what I have been saying. A mac with an intel processor won't be usefull until 2008. Yeah, you heard me.

 

[guffman]

Yep. Thats what I have been saying. A mac with an intel processor won't be usefull until 2008. Yeah, you heard me.

That's not entirely true. The Apple Pro apps will be out in March, and those are the programs I need. Sure i need PS too, but I think Rosetta will complelety drag CS2 down. Besides, has anyone used CS2 on a MacBook Pro yet?

 

[hasselhoff]

We've been dugg!

 

[BenRoethig]

Steve must be infuriate with Adobe tonight. This is extremely bad news for new Intel Mac sales.

It's partly Steve's fault. If he would have kept the developers in the loop from the beginning instead of keeping Apple locked up tighter than Area 51. Steve Jobs is a creative genius, but he can hurt Apple just as much as he helps them.

A Perfect opportunity for apple to release and perfect a creative suite killer, come on what are adobe thinking off! I assume that goes with dreamweaver etc (Studio 8).

And watch Adobe drop development of all their apps including the ones inherited from Macromedia. Dell would sure enjoy that.

 

[aegisdesign]

I know this is a different caliber app, but Photoshop Elements is due to come out with version 4 by March. (ver 3 was out in late 2004) I imagine this will be a universal app. Fits in well with the consumer release of the iMac, and probably by March, the iBook (oops, I mean, MacBook).

I very much doubt it. It'll be PPC only.

 

[york2600]

Newsflash: Most graphics people are so cheap, they are still running blue and white G3's under system 9 and photoshop 5. This is true, I see it all the time. Very few people stay on the cutting edge in graphics, they are just too cheap. Plus most people I know that are not way behind, are sticking with CS1 anyway because CS2 is so dog slow at everything. I suspect that CS1 via rosetta will be just as fast as CS3 native on an x86 ANYWAY. Now is a prime time for another company to swoop in with a 'photoshop killer' and really hurt adobe. I hope this happens but somehow, I doubt it will. Maybe I should make a donation to GIMP.

Agreed. I fix computers for a family in exchange for some nice conference passes and the wife is a graphic designer. She does a good amount of business doing ad layout and magazine spreads. She was given a 1Ghz G4 by one of her friends, but didn't want to go through the trouble / cash of an upgrade. So instead she continues to do most of her work on a biege G3. Pretty sad stuff. I found a new HD, some more RAM, and a 333Mhz chip for it (it was 233mhz model), but it's runs 8.6. She finally decided to dump the old 17 inch Trinitron that she had on it for a 18 inch LCD. It's funny to know that the monitor is worth probably 8 times the computer.

 

[aegisdesign]

Let's put this way.
buy the latest Powermac quads now and wait for PM Intel Rev.B.
That seems to be the safest route for professionals.

Especially as the refurb Quads are now hitting the Apple refurb stores. In the UK a Quad is going for about £460 off the retail price. 20% off.

And the G5 will still be way faster than anything Intel can cook up by the end of the year even if we had native software to run, unless they start shipping something much much faster than the 2.5 DC G5 and with a fast FSB.

Otherwise we've gone from the laptops having starved CPUs because of their busses to having desktops starved of bandwidth.

 

[Cosmo modo]

well,

i use Photoshop everyday..... and have done so for the last 5 years or so...
i wouldn't mind a photo editing app from Apple......

if it will have an elegant interface like the rest of Apple's apps, i am in !!

i'd switch to an Apple photo app with ease...........

btw, Aperture is only at version 1, so it's not perfect all right !!

 

[aegisdesign]

What makes you say that? Why would Adobe release an app that runs on 1% of Macs out there?

Huh? Since when was the PowerPC Mac market 1%?

Photoshop Elements uses Photoshop's technology as it's basis so they've cut down from Photoshop CS2, which is PowerPC only. Elements won't be Universal until Photoshop is.

Yep. Thats what I have been saying. A mac with an intel processor won't be usefull until 2008. Yeah, you heard me.

2007 I'd guess.

CS2 was released in April last year so CS3 is probably due end of this year or April 2007 if they are to be believed on their 18 month to 2 year development schedule.

I'd guess on there being at least a whole year where the G5 Macs are still the fastest computers out there for running Adobe's software (including Windows PCs). It'll be slightly tricky for Apple though if Intel or AMD come out with something faster than a Quad G5 before Adobe release CS3 though. So far, Intel's roadmap says they wont but AMD's Opterons scale much better than Intel.