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No one forces you to go to a major carrier. There are tons of online eSIM providers that are not tied to a specific carrier. And the prices are cheaper than physical SIMs and it’s a lot more convenient.

One provider I have used multiple times without issues in Europe, Asia, and the US is Holafly. More recently though, I have used Airalo, which is an app and it couldn’t be any more convenient than that.

So no, SIM trays are no longer necessary.

You're spreading misinformation when you say prices are cheaper- this vastly is untrue. A few instances you might find do not alter that fact.
 
Agree, UK has almost all carriers on eSim, and to change between devices you can do this really easily in most of the carriers apps. So it's a non-issue over physical.

However, until the rest of the planet catches up to countries like US, UK, other European, et al., having a physical sim is a useful option to retain. But it shouldn't be this way, non-eSim carriers should be getting their act together and updating to eSim options ASAP.
As mentioned earlier it is some of the MVNOs that still don't do them (SMARTY, 1pMobile etc.), Apple needs to announce a date when they will cease that will force their hand then.
 
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You're spreading misinformation when you say prices are cheaper- this vastly is untrue. A few instances you might find do not alter that fact.
This is India in particular which has its own problems with authoritarian undertones. Don’t project that to the rest of the world. So no, you’re still incorrect.
 
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This is India in particular which has its own problems with authoritarian undertones. Don’t project that to the rest of the world. So no, you’re still incorrect.
🤦‍♂️ You seem to be here to cause trouble by making things up. I have no idea what you think you stand to gain from your fallacies here. I'll remind you Google is your friend. It's everyone's friend when they want to fact check nonsense like you're spouting in this thread.
 
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Yep, eSIM adoption is absolutely garbage in the UK. I'd much prefer if we had dual SIM iPhones that China were given.
The eSIM adoption in the UK is not garbage. At least against the world.

All main networks carry eSIMs plus a few number of MVNOs. There are plenty...more than 100 countries that haven't reached what we reached yet.
 
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I kept my iPhone 11pro as a backup when I purchased my 15pro just for when I'm traveling internationally, (but what a pain in the butt). I would pay extra for my future iPhones for a sim card option.
 
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Question: Has anyone had to send their iPhone 15 in for service or even do an exchange? If so, does Verizon or other carriers charge a fee to migrate your phone number to a backup or new phone???
 
No one forces you to go to a major carrier. There are tons of online eSIM providers that are not tied to a specific carrier. And the prices are cheaper than physical SIMs and it’s a lot more convenient.

One provider I have used multiple times without issues in Europe, Asia, and the US is Holafly. More recently though, I have used Airalo, which is an app and it couldn’t be any more convenient than that.

So no, SIM trays are no longer necessary.
This is unfortunately misinformation.
Getting a local SIM not only provides most of the time cheaper data, but a number so you can make calls and send texts to the locals and their services. Big difference.

If you do your research before landing to a different country (especially the UK), you'll find better deals than what Airalo is providing for example.

Services like Airalo should be your last option or you just simply can't be bothered to research.

Me personally, I'll use Airalo/Roamless for their free data, once that's run out I'll use the local SIM.
 
Never been to Belarus, but had a great trip to Russia a few years ago.

Outside of Europe... Haven't China and India banned eSIMs, or at least the companies that often provide them like Holafly and Airalo, in India's case? There are a lot of Americans that visit both each year that will have issues.
They banned the apps from their local app stores. The esims of bought abroad still work. Just got back from China this summer where we used both providers on our family phones after our 50GB of Google fi roaming ran out.

For me personally I love eSIM. Would I mind a physical sim? No. But I’d rather have two eSIMs than one eSIM and one psim. Best scenario would be 2 esims + 1 psim.

That said, I’ve traveled a ton over the last years. I’ve done over 1.5 million miles on United alone and probably as much if not more on other international carriers. In that time I never felt the need to go find a local sim. Google Fi (and more recently lots of global eSIM providers including Vodafone) have kept me connected quickly, effectively and fairly cheaply.

Except for the scenario of a long term (expat) type traveler who stays in one place for months at a time…the local sim is better nonsense is just outdated IMO. Sure is may be a bit cheaper, but compared to flights, hotels, meals etc …paying 30-50% more every few weeks is a drop in the bucket. We are talking less than a cup of coffee differences in many cases. I can’t fathom buying a $1,500 phone…then crying about the few bucks extra an eSIM might cost you if you don’t do your research and find a good deal.
 
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They banned the apps from their local app stores. The esims of bought abroad still work. Just got back from China this summer where we used both providers on our family phones after our 50GB of Google fi roaming ran out.

For me personally I love eSIM. Would I mind a physical sim? No. But I’d rather have two eSIMs than one eSIM and one psim. Best scenario would be 2 esims + 1 psim.

That said, I’ve traveled a ton over the last years. I’ve done over 1.5 million miles on United alone and probably as much if not more on other international carriers. In that time I never felt the need to go find a local sim. Google Fi (and more recently lots of global eSIM providers including Vodafone) have kept me connected quickly, effectively and fairly cheaply.

Except for the scenario of a long term (expat) type traveler who stays in one place for months at a time…the local sim is better nonsense is just outdated IMO. Sure is may be a bit cheaper, but compared to flights, hotels, meals etc …paying 30-50% more every few weeks is a drop in the bucket. We are talking less than a cup of coffee differences in many cases. I can’t fathom buying a $1,500 phone…then crying about the few bucks extra an eSIM might cost you if you don’t do your research and find a good deal.
How much did you pay for your SIM in China?

I was living there until Covid, and paid 1rmb per day on my contract. If I used over 1GB then I'd pay a second 1rmb that day. China Unicom. That's under $5 USD a month.

Modern iPhones do support two active eSIMs at the same time, by the way.

Choice of networks is also important- when I visited Indonesia the first network I chose had no signal in some places, and I had to buy another- WHICH DIDN'T HAVE AN ESIM OPTION.

Well done on your 3 million miles since eSIMs became a thing. 🤣 Lapping the earth 120 times in a couple of years? That's the equivalent of flying from LA to New Zealand more frequently than every other day. 🤣🤦‍♂️ Even if you're a pilot or cabin crew, your numbers are nonsense.
 
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Different cellular bands and technologies in different regions of the world. I think there's more than 2 regional versions. It definitely adds cost, and should be mentioned more when overseas people whine about Apple tax, Apple tax, Apple tax.
There are 3 region variants

US: eSIM only (supports dual stand-by SIM).
Global: eSIM + Physical SIM (supports dual stand-by SIM).
China: Physical SIM + Physical SIM (supports dual stand-by SIM).
 
Having used both regular SIMs and eSIMs when traveling, I think eSIM is the loser as it currently works. While it's nice to be able to buy eSIMs through apps like Airalo, the setup process is pretty painful and requires you to remember a bunch of complicated instructions that you need to step through. There's no easy way for an app to just add the eSIM for you.

Also, mobile carriers have no incentive to make eSIMs work, since they can make more money by selling SIM cards at the airport on their own plans.
 
Having used both regular SIMs and eSIMs when traveling, I think eSIM is the loser as it currently works. While it's nice to be able to buy eSIMs through apps like Airalo, the setup process is pretty painful and requires you to remember a bunch of complicated instructions that you need to step through. There's no easy way for an app to just add the eSIM for you.

Also, mobile carriers have no incentive to make eSIMs work, since they can make more money by selling SIM cards at the airport on their own plans.
Not true. MANY carriers apps have esims available inside them, which you then setup in a few clicks on your phone.
A huge amount of carriers globally work in such a way, so you find one for your destination, pay, and use it.

I used T-Mobile in the US recently that did just that, making it an affordable local data and calls/texts trip.
 
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I realize people like eSim in many situations, but it's hard to argue that a Sim Slot isn't simpler and more efficient for those who want to quick swap or add a plan when traveling and they see something for sale at a store, etc

or if one has a SIM they like to move from device to device as they need

We should be supporting very pro customer options and features here

Going "all and only eSIM" will eventually mean a very pro carrier environment -- not anything that ultimately benefits the customers (us)
 
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I realize people like eSim in many situations, but it's hard to argue that a Sim Slot isn't simpler and more efficient for those who want to quick swap or add a plan when traveling and they see something for sale at a store, etc

or if one has a SIM they like to move from device to device as they need

We should be supporting very pro customer options and features here

Going "all and only eSIM" will eventually mean a very pro carrier environment -- not anything that ultimately benefits the customers (us)
Apart from the ease of seeing-buying-installing pSims now, I don't agree.

Sooner rather than later there'll just be online lists of competing eSim carrier/MVNO apps per country/region that you can download local eSims, pay, install at the same prices as pSims. We're not there yet, but this will obviously be a lot easier than pSims as you can be anywhere and get one, including remote locations with no physical stores selling pSims – even get before you go, or if there already connect to any WiFi to download and install.
 
🤦‍♂️ You seem to be here to cause trouble by making things up. I have no idea what you think you stand to gain from your fallacies here. I'll remind you Google is your friend. It's everyone's friend when they want to fact check nonsense like you're spouting in this thread.
You're delusional if you think just because India enforces protectionist policies that this somehow applies to every other country. For the record, I have traveled to multiple countries and continents over several years with the services I mentioned but apparently, you know better.

And my point still stands, there are other eSIM providers for India, making the physical SIM unnecessary and more inconvenient.
 
Apart from the ease of seeing-buying-installing pSims now, I don't agree.

There's no way to "disagree" if someone wants to swap sims routinely between devices
I personally do this daily with a phone I use for Gym/outdoor activities where I don't want to risk my main device
 
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There's no way to "disagree" if someone wants to swap sims routinely between devices
I personally do this daily with a phone I use for Gym/outdoor activities where I don't want to risk my main device
You can do that with eSims already. So when all devices have eSim that won't be the issue it is today with devices without eSim.
 
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This is unfortunately misinformation.
Getting a local SIM not only provides most of the time cheaper data, but a number so you can make calls and send texts to the locals and their services. Big difference.

If you do your research before landing to a different country (especially the UK), you'll find better deals than what Airalo is providing for example.

Services like Airalo should be your last option or you just simply can't be bothered to research.

Me personally, I'll use Airalo/Roamless for their free data, once that's run out I'll use the local SIM.
This isn't the case for countries I have traveled to. The ability to make calls is country-dependent as well and is unnecessary if you use any of the chat apps to make data calls.

Maybe the UK has different pricing, not a place I would visit anyway. So you do you.
 
How much did you pay for your SIM in China?

I was living there until Covid, and paid 1rmb per day on my contract. If I used over 1GB then I'd pay a second 1rmb that day. China Unicom. That's under $5 USD a month.

Modern iPhones do support two active eSIMs at the same time, by the way.

Choice of networks is also important- when I visited Indonesia the first network I chose had no signal in some places, and I had to buy another- WHICH DIDN'T HAVE AN ESIM OPTION.

Well done on your 3 million miles since eSIMs became a thing. 🤣 Lapping the earth 120 times in a couple of years? That's the equivalent of flying from LA to New Zealand more frequently than every other day. 🤣🤦‍♂️ Even if you're a pilot or cabin crew, your numbers are nonsense.
Re-read what I wrote. I didn't say "couple" of years. I wrote: "I’ve traveled a ton over the last years".
I was doing most of my travel between 2011 and 2020 when Covid caused me to stop traveling... and eventually change jobs. Over those years I think my first esim was in 2018? But the golden age of eSim didn't really emerge till 2019. Regardless, previously I was always using Google FI... which has native roaming.... and for the purposes of this argument is the same as using an eSim, it ain't a local sim.

As for my China trip, it was a personal holiday with my famaily.
I paid for my flight TO china with ~120k United miles (don't remember exact figure as it was ages since I booked), flight back FROM china was via ZipAir out of NRT which cost me $2,500 per person one way (lie-flat mind you). While IN china, we paid $3k between hotels, and airbnb type places. For Food, trains, entry tickets etc... we spent at least another $1000 for my group of four.

We only needed 1 week of data in China as our 50GB of Google FI data covered the remaining 3 weeks of the trip. I don't remember what exactly I paid for Airalo at the time but given current metrics the 5GB or so I bought would cost me $16.50. Had I been patient or more cost sensitive I could have looked on eSimDB.com and found data for my needs for <$10.

I think you inadvertently have underscored my argument when you said you "lived" in China. Living in a place as an expat is very different than "travel." Sure if you are living abroad for many months or years, you want to have a phone that can handle local network sims. However the topic I was responded you was in regards to travel. Most countries define "tourist" visas at a max of 30-90 days. Any longer than that and I'd argue you aren't traveling to a place.... you are living there... and most immigration officers would agree with me.

For my 1 month trip, The incremental cost of an eSim over a local sim is trivial when compared to the other costs of travel. We are talking less than the cost of an airport sandwich. Furthermore, the benefits of not having to go look for a local sim, and local currency to possibly pay for that sim, as well as the ability to traverse the great firewall of China made a travel eSim the logical choice.

As for making local phone calls. I've traveled to both India AND China Extensively... I can't remember the last time I made or recieved an old fashioned phone call. In China ALL calling was done exclusively over WeChat.

Would I love a pSim slot? YES!
Is it a big deal to me? Not in the slightest.
 
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This isn't the case for countries I have traveled to. The ability to make calls is country-dependent as well and is unnecessary if you use any of the chat apps to make data calls.

Maybe the UK has different pricing, not a place I would visit anyway. So you do you.
It's not about the countries you travelled to. It's about debunking the claim that eSIM services like Airalo will always be cheaper than a local SIM.

I've just came from Thailand and Japan, local SIMs are cheaper (or a little more expensive but in return way more data).

And definitely in the UK you'll get better for your money with a British SIM on a smaller network.

Another thing I discovered. If you ran out of data on your eSIM abroad, you're completely dead until you find free WiFi. And even then, some countries block eSIM services like Airalo to top up, so you are effing screwed. Especially in China. Thank God I had a VPN to bypass and top up. That's one country you're better off with a local SIM.

Anyway, I like eSIM but I want SIM tray as backup. Thank God I live in a country (UK) that I can have the best of both worlds.
 
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