Alternative iOS App Stores Only Work for 'Grace Period' When Traveling Outside of EU

[1129846]

The iPhone is Apple's product that uses its own hardware and software. They have spent billions on developing the product, the App Store, developer APIs and marketing.

What right does anyone, including governments, have to say Apple how Apple does business, I don't hear customers complaining, it is companies like Spotify and Epic games that are complaining, because they have to pay commission on sales to Apple for using the App Store.

If Apple had not created the App Store they would not have made the profits that have done off Apple.

I have worked in the computer software industry for 30+ years and we had to give a minimum of 30% discount to resellers to sell our software. If we went through a large distributer it could be up to 60%.

Even if Apple had reduced their commission to say 10% the likes of Spotify and Epic would have still complained.
Well if you dont like paying commission to Apple stick to Android where you still have to pay commission and a larger market.

If iOs was on all the phone manufactures phone's then I could understand the complaints as they then would have have been another Microsoft in the respect of a monopoly.

I for one will not use third party stores, I want Apple's security.

And here is where your entire argument breaks down. In software for anything BUT iOS if you want to self publish and distribute you can keep all that money. You have the choice in what disturber/ publisher you want.

The underlying issue is for iOS the ONLY option is to threw Apple and pay those fees. The App store is not the problem, being require to use the App store along with some very heavy handed greed control by Apple is the issue.

Most developer yeah will gladly use Apple but there are a lot that dont want it or dont have a need to pay the fees.

If you want to go by your argument then where is my former employers cut for the 10,000's of iPad companies bought only to use my former employers software. They did not care about iOS just they wanted to use the software from my former employer and the only thing that ran on it was you guess it my former employers software. Apple made out great on that deal. I also know if they could self publish they would of because the App store provide them nothing.
The rest of their software for desktop they just self published and self hosted.

 

[turbineseaplane]

This is straight up evil BS

My goodness has Apple become horrible

 

[Beautyspin]

Ahh yes, comparing software to illegal drug trade that ACTUALLY puts lives and health at risk. That was probably the dumbest comparison you could've made.

Not really, both are illegal. The difference is the extent to which they are illegal and which sections of the law. That is all.

 

[Beautyspin]

I think it’s insane that people are rooting for the government to bully companies instead of just voting with their wallets.

If a 3rd party App Store is so important, don’t buy an iPhone. Simple. But we all know this is a non-issue for the vast majority of consumers.

But it’s a great excuse for the EU to steal more money from the private sector because we know their voracious appetite for our hard earned money is insatiable.

Or I could buy an iPhone, vote for a government that has the guts to reign in Apple and make it do all the things I want on my iPhone. Don't you think it is more fun that way?

 

[macjoshua]

The law is the law and they should do as the Roman’s do and stop being the special snowflakes they pretend they are.

They aren’t a small little weak company anymore

What law are they breaking? Seems like they’re complying with the EU’s requirements. If you’re outside of the EU, the law doesn’t apply.

 

[Naraxus]

Makes perfect sense to me.

In the EU: Get access to alt app stores

Not in EU: Lose access until you go back

What am I missing here?

 

[VulchR]

The lack of ability to update apps while not in the EU is not good enough. It introduces a security hole, as security updates will be parked until the person returns to the EU.

This will affect tens of thousands of cross-border workers, and students like my daughter who is from Ireland, but goes to college in the UK. Ireland is not the only country with a land border with non-EU countries, or who imports/exports students. There will be many people adversely affected by this.

And this from a company that's supposed to be all in on security!

I live in the UK and this is the first time I have felt anything positive about leaving the EU. This situation is due to crass EU government overreach, there were better solutions available (like making Apple guarantee the security of apps in its store), and it will expose EU users to greater malware risks. Glad this kind of Balkanisation of the App Store is not happening in the UK. It will just lead to consumer hassles.

 

[Beautyspin]

Here's a link showing that Spotify communicated to customers in 2015 that they could pay $9.99 online. Again, this shows that Vestager claiming customers didn't have a choice isn't supported by the evidence. Spotify didn't use IAP prior to 2014 (so all the iOS subscribers were paying via web) and didn't use IAP after 2016 (same again). That's how they had 99% of their subscribers on iOS paying via the internet at the time of their complaint to the EU.

Spotify urges iPhone customers to stop paying through Apple’s App Store

The Apple Music rival sends out an anti-iTunes PSA

www.theverge.com

I guess you have not gone through the link I gave you. Apple hounded them for not allowing IAP on their app. Please read.

 

[turbineseaplane]

Reality check, they are not.

Is iOS really more secure than Android?

Which is better for corporate mobile communications security-wise: iPhone or Android device?

www.kaspersky.co.in

I think it's even worse than this because iOS users "think" they are more secure

 

[gnipgnop]

You are impressively dishonest.

The issue is that the information wasn’t allowed to be provided in the app.
It’s about the anti steering mechanism.

How is it "dishonest" to show that Spotify didn't need to communicate in-app? Their own Time to Play Fair web site shows that they only used IAP from 2014-2016. That means that Spotify relied on iOS customers to pay via the internet from 2008-2013 and 2017-2023. How could that be possible if what Vestager says is true, i.e., that customers were prevented from knowing they could pay somewhere else?

 

[MilaM]

I live in the UK and this is the first time I have felt anything positive about leaving the EU. This situation is due to crass EU government overreach, there were better solutions available (like making Apple guarantee the security of apps in its store), and it will expose EU users to greater malware risks. Glad this kind of Balkanisation of the App Store is not happening in the UK. It will just lead to consumer hassles.

Then you should quickly voice your concerns with your local MP ... although it's likely too late for that. The bill is quite advanced already.

https://bills.parliament.uk/bills/3453

Edit: the UK bill is very similar to the DMA.

 

[bollman]

Mac OS is one of the least succesful operating systems on the market, what are you even talking about? It only beats stuff like ChromeOS and that is not even something to be proud of.

In the meantime, iOS is one of the biggest operating systems in the world, absolutely dwarfing Mac OS, it is not even close.

You are aware that macOS and iOS share a huge part of their codebase? Like, to the level that macOS can run iOS apps just fine. The reason iOS can't run macOS apps are purely made up by Apple.

 

[Johns12]

Can anyone running Android actually confirm that DesiMunda's post is even slightly accurate, because I don't have an Android and never have, and so really wouldn't know what it's like!

I've been running Android for around 7 years. Never had any malicious or virus infection problems. Also, the reason I post on a Mac site is because I, like many other people, own other Apple products. There seems to be this sense on this board that If you don't use an Iphone, you're not an Apple user.

 

[gnipgnop]

I guess you have not gone through the link I gave you. Apple hounded them for not allowing IAP on their app. Please read.

I already addressed that. Spotify only used IAP for two years. 2008-2013 was entirely web based. 2017-2023 was entirely web based. How can the EU claim customers couldn't know about web based payments when 13 years of Spotify's iOS subscriptions required web based payments?

 

[Beautyspin]

The iPhone is Apple's product that uses its own hardware and software. They have spent billions on developing the product, the App Store, developer APIs and marketing.

What right does anyone, including governments, have to say Apple how Apple does business, I don't hear customers complaining, it is companies like Spotify and Epic games that are complaining, because they have to pay commission on sales to Apple for using the App Store.

If Apple had not created the App Store they would not have made the profits that have done off Apple.

I have worked in the computer software industry for 30+ years and we had to give a minimum of 30% discount to resellers to sell our software. If we went through a large distributer it could be up to 60%.

Even if Apple had reduced their commission to say 10% the likes of Spotify and Epic would have still complained.
Well if you dont like paying commission to Apple stick to Android where you still have to pay commission and a larger market.

If iOs was on all the phone manufactures phone's then I could understand the complaints as they then would have have been another Microsoft in the respect of a monopoly.

I for one will not use third party stores, I want Apple's security.

Let Apple collect whatever it wants to. Let it allow alternate app stores and let them collect whatever they want to. Developers will publish their apps in only those stores that give them the best value. If Apples App Store is really good, it will be the best and will attract the most apps. Even if Apple's Appstore is the best, there might still be some Apps that might not be published on the AppStore. Apple should not worry as Apple would anyway not have published them. Why should Apple worry? Is it worried that it will not be able to match the quality or the value of the alternate app stores? For too long Apple has coasted because it was the only store available on iOS. Now it has to work hard to maintain its leadership position but it is worried it has forgotten how to do that as it has forgotten how to compete since a long time.

 

[Zest28]

As I said it doesn't make sense to compare volumes across market segments. You might as well say Toyota is a failure because walking has a greater market share.

Then on the desktop, macOS is #2 behind Windows (#1). Linux is far behind both. In the US macOS's market share gain over the past 15 years has been significant. You can lookup the numbers on StatCounter for whichever period you want.

Linux and Windows dominate the server market.

Android and iOS dominate the mobile market.

Total units doesn't matter if they are not in the market you are targeting, which is based on how you are anticipating your buyers will use the product. Otherwise there would be Oracle Database Enterprise Edition for Android but not Solaris and AIX and full Adobe PhotoShop for Android but not macOS. But it is the opposite.

Similarly, Tableau Desktop targets Windows and macOS while Tableau Server targets Windows and Linux. Tableau Mobile targets Android and iOS. Clearly that company can build products for any platform they want and clearly they target different platforms based on popularity within the target segment.

Mac OS is not beating Linux, far from it. You know that this website called MacRumors what you are using is run on Linux?

And number of users is what matters. Mac OS cannot be successful if it is one of the least used operating systems on the market. Apple is basically an iPhone company in the end because there is where all the money is coming from, not from Mac.

Mac can disappear and Apple would be fine. But if the iPhone disappears, Apple is in deep trouble.

 

[bigjnyc]

Wait... there are major companies that "cares about us"?

It seems to me your disillusionment with Apple may have to do with your own naive expectations. No company "cares about us".

Thats not true! they care very much about our money and seperating us from it 🤣🤣

 

[Beautyspin]

In other words, they're not really competing with the App Store.

Not at scale. However, if they become wildly successful, the list may grow and that might cause problems for Apple. Apple can prevent that by being the App Store that gives the best value for the developers so that nobody approaches the alternate stores.

 

[techfreak23]

Alright this is pretty petty and low. I think some of their pettiness is funny, but this is just ridiculous. Seems like more work to have those restrictions in place, but I guess they don’t want people changing their store/region and using a VPN to get access to the alt stores.

 

[VulchR]

I think it's even worse than this because iOS users "think" they are more secure

The issue isn't iOS versus Android. It's iOS with the App Store vs iOS with the Wild West. At a minimum, the latter will require users to spread the credit/debit card details far more widely to purchase apps.

Also, the Kapersky article is hosted on the web site of a company that makes a profit from anti-malware software. They're no doubt delighted at this move by the EU because it will increase the need for their products - a malware tax of sorts.

 

[bigjnyc]

No. This isn't about Apple's ridiculous memory and storage prices, it's about the freedom to install the software of MY choosing on MY iPhone.

I have a feeling you tough guys pounding your chests and proclaiming my phone my choice! are going to the be first ones crying and criticizing apple for "allowing" your phone to be hacked or malwared.

 

[wanha]

That's because they own it and want to control it.

In this case it's my phone and I own it and want to control it.

That's lovely but that's not the legal agreement you consented to with Apple.

You don't own the software code. You just own the device that runs it.

Disclaimer: Because people read way too much into things - I'm not saying the above is right or a good thing, just pointing out how it is

 

[coolfactor]

This feels like a lot of needless complexity. I’d hate to be the developers working on these features.

Agreed. It's plainly obvious that they care more about their App Store commissions than looking forward.

This alternative App Store support should've been global out of the gate.

Users that don't want to install one of these 3rd-party stores, including me, have the CHOICE not to.

Come on Apple, do what's right.

 

[VulchR]

Then you should quickly voice your concerns with your local MP ... although it's likely too late for that. The bill is quite advanced already.

https://bills.parliament.uk/bills/3453

Edit: the UK bill is very similar to the DMA.

I knew some copycat bill was being introduced in the UK. Shame that. I'd rather Parliament address more immediate tech concerns, like AI regulation.

 

[Sophisticatednut]

[In walk the 2024 apple drones]

"Today we (apple) celebrate the first glorious anniversary of the (iOS AppStore) Information Purification Directives.

[Apple's DMA Hammer-thrower enters, pursued by (Apple) storm troopers.]

We have created for the first time in all history (the AppStore) a garden of pure ideology, where each worker may bloom, secure from the pests of any contradictory true thoughts.

Our Unification of Thoughts is more powerful a weapon than any fleet or army on earth.
We are one people, with one will, one resolve, one cause.
Our enemies shall talk themselves to death and we will bury them with their own confusion.

[Hammer is thrown at the screen]

We shall prevail!( and make a lot of money)

[Boom!]

On march 2024 EU introduced the Digital Market Act January 24th Apple Computer will introduce Macintosh. And you'll see why 2024 1984 won't be like '1984.'"

Hmmm how strange apple sounds