Anandtech: 47W Broadwell Processors launched today; 15" rMBP already outdated within two weeks

tubular-

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Apr 1, 2015
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http://anandtech.com/show/9326/intel-launches-five-47w-laptop-broadwell-skus

They even noted how odd of a decision it is by Apple at the bottom of the article.

Apple may have their reasoning for doing so but a) it looks comically stupid to release a notebook which becomes outdated within two weeks and b) any consumer who just purchased a $2,000 - $3,000 notebook in this situation should feel extremely disappointed. I'd love to see the return rate on this machine.

Their reviews of Iris 6200 and Broadwell show fairly significant improvements too. Oh well
 
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magbarn

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Oct 25, 2008
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http://anandtech.com/show/9326/intel-launches-five-47w-laptop-broadwell-skus

They even noted how odd of a decision it is by Apple at the bottom of the article.

Apple may have their reasoning for doing so but it looks a) comically stupid to release a notebook which becomes outdated within a week and b) any consumer who just purchased a $2,000 - $3,000 notebook in this situation should feel extremely disappointed. I'd love to see the return rate on this machine.

Their reviews of Iris 6200 and Broadwell show fairly significant improvements too. Oh well
Apple sure likes to take us for fools.... They first use an 'old gpu' and then now it's shown they also could've just waited a month or two and released a proper cpu/igpu upgrade. The final insult is the release of TB3 also. I can easily see Apple releasing a Broadwell or Skylake rMBP 15 with TB3 + better gpu in 6 months....
 

maflynn

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Its not like Apple was caught off guard to this. Intel tells all their customers when to expect the chipset.

Given how late in the year this was rolled out, why should apple embrace Broadwell when Skylake is literally around the corner.

Its less about playing its customers for fools but rather laying the groundwork imo for a bigger update in the fall.
 

magbarn

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Oct 25, 2008
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Hah. The 2015 15" is looking like an even more disappointing update now.

Busy day for Intel today.
Here's the kicker, the Broadwell chip could've been a 'drop-in' replacement for the Haswell chip used in the 2015 rMBP as it's pin compatible and uses the same supporting chips. Broadwell-H has also the same list prices as Haswell-H. Apple must've gotten some sweet/cost-cutting/profit-boosting deals from Intel + AMD to bring you the '2015' rMBP for the same list price as last year's model...
 
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tubular-

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Apr 1, 2015
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Its not like Apple was caught off guard to this. Intel tells all their customers when to expect the chipset.

Given how late in the year this was rolled out, why should apple embrace Broadwell when Skylake is literally around the corner.

Its less about playing its customers for fools but rather laying the groundwork imo for a bigger update in the fall.
For sure, Apple knew the chips were coming. We can agree on that.

Why should a consumer embrace Apple when their "latest and greatest", isn't?

As @magbarn indicated, its a fairly direct upgrade to the processor they're using now. If Skylake is literally around the corner and Apple is just waiting for that, why would they even do the 2015 update now? And it's not like the 2015 update was so minor the processor wasn't worth doing. New trackpad, new battery configuration, new GPU. There was some significant change already.

What groundwork needs to be laid? Creating some "keynote ammunition" for the Skylake update, such as "40% faster processors than the previous model!" or "Over 2x graphics performance!"?
 

pendragon1984

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Oct 24, 2013
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Either Apple is trying to really rip people off or Apple is planning a significant refresh of the 15" Macbook pro very soon and wanted to save Broadwell for that refresh. Maybe we'll see a significant refresh in the next 5 months? All speculation. I certainly wouldn't buy the current models though. Overpriced old hardware.
 

MacDevMike

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Jun 13, 2012
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These are basically drop in chip replacements for the current Haswells. I bet you see Apple silently use them in the coming weeks with no press release.
 

abowlby

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Oct 7, 2013
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I'm really glad I avoided the temptation of upgrading. I love Apple's products, but this feels like a slap in the face. The dGPU AND the CPU are both so underwhelming for a Pro machine. I've owned a PowerMac G4, and a 2012 13" rMBP and was really looking forward to this release and then this all happens.

I don't want to get a Windows machine, at all, but I can only justify paying a premium for less to a certain extent. It's like any value proposition: if the perceived value is higher than the dollar amount, it's a go. If the cost seems higher than the value, then it's a no go.

/disappointedrant
 

polabud

macrumors newbie
Jun 2, 2015
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These are basically drop in chip replacements for the current Haswells. I bet you see Apple silently use them in the coming weeks with no press release.
Can they do this? I paid upwards of $3000 for a machine that was advertised as new. How can they then ship out a significantly better machine two weeks later?
 

T5BRICK

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Aug 3, 2006
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Can they do this? I paid upwards of $3000 for a machine that was advertised as new. How can they then ship out a significantly better machine two weeks later?
Of course they can. I seriously doubt they will though.
 

MacDevMike

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Jun 13, 2012
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Can they do this? I paid upwards of $3000 for a machine that was advertised as new. How can they then ship out a significantly better machine two weeks later?
When you're Apple, you can do whatever you want. Remember that if you bought the dGPU system that the Broadwell improvements are likely to be completely unrecognized. They are each about 100mhz faster in core clock speed, and use the same socket as Haswell. The biggest improvement is in the integrated GPU side of the CPU, and if you have a dGPU that will be much less meaningful. I suppose in theory that new iGPU might handle retina basic actions and animations smoother when in use but its hard to know.

Apple did something like this a while back. They silently updated the CPU, and didn't change anything else as I recall. Its also possible Apple is skipping all of this completely for Skylake. Intel today announced Thunderbolt 3 shipping towards the end of the year and using (wait for it) a USB 3c connector (like the 12" MacBooks). That could mean that Apple is going to be updating both the Macbook Pro and the Mac Pro later this year, along with a 5k TB3 display for pro users.
 
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joema2

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Sep 3, 2013
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....it looks comically stupid to release a notebook which becomes outdated within two weeks...Their reviews of Iris 6200 and Broadwell show fairly significant improvements too. Oh well
I think the top-spec 2015 MBP uses the i7-4980HQ, which has a 2.8Ghz base freq. and 4.0Ghz turbo freq, and Iris Pro 5200 GPU + R9 M370X. In the link you posted, none of the mobile Broadwell chips have a turbo frequency that high. Broadwell is a die shrink not a new microarchitecture.

Maybe Apple tested those and determined the benefit was so marginal that waiting for Skylake was better.

This is especially considering that announcing a chip doesn't equate to availability in the vast quantities needed for production on Apple's scale. Even so-called "drop in" replacements still must go through a complete engineering test cycle, including alpha, beta, environmental extremes, FCC certification, etc. Those delay factors could have easily pushed the 2015 MBP well into Skylake, so the decision point was a modest upgrade now vs nothing for another year.
 
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Chunk72

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Mar 16, 2008
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Either these will be a silent update once supplies are available or will be skipped altogether until Skylake is ready.
 

magbarn

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Oct 25, 2008
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I think the top-spec 2015 MBP uses the i7-4980HQ, which has a 2.8Ghz base freq. and 4.0Ghz turbo freq, and Iris Pro 5200 GPU + R9 M370X. In the link you posted, none of the mobile Broadwell chips have a turbo frequency that high. Broadwell is a die shrink not a new microarchitecture.

Maybe Apple tested those and determined the benefit was so marginal that waiting for Skylake was better.

This is especially considering that announcing a chip doesn't equate to availability in the vast quantities needed for production on Apple's scale. Even so-called "drop in" replacements still must go through a complete engineering test cycle, including alpha, beta, environmental extremes, FCC certification, etc. Those delay factors could have easily pushed the 2015 MBP well into Skylake, so the decision point was a modest upgrade now vs nothing for another year.
You don't think Intel would've provided Broadwell engineering prototypes to Apple?

This whole 2015 (really a 2013 rMBP as it could've been built 2 years ago minus the force touchpad) rMBP fiasco is a whole money saving move to allocate more R&D funding for a re-design of the rMBP with TB3/USB-C ports....

When a 3.7ghz max boost Broadwell is keeping up with the 4.4ghz boost Haswell desktop CPU, I'm pretty sure the Broadwell-H cpu's are quite the decent upgrade. Notwithstanding the significant power savings seen also between the Haswell and Broadwell cpu's. The iGPU upgrade is also significant...
 
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madat42

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Mar 25, 2011
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Most folks venting will probably not understand that even though Intel announced the chips TODAY, it would likely be a few more months before we'd actually see them in Macbook Pros on the shelf. So, why in the hell would Apple release a Broadwell Macbook Pro 15 late summer with Skywell chips right around the corner? Sounded like a tough decision needed to be made. And those who know about licensing, marketing, balancing financial quarters, etc. and all that goes into releasing a product probably all came to the same conclusion: don't wait.
 

SamuelShand

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May 20, 2015
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you know what i got the new 15" macbook pro with amd card and upgraded processor and whilst this announcement is slightly disheartening I will not be returning my macbook. had it for 5 days now and it works like a dream, performs very well in every task i use it for and TBH couldnt be happier with its performance.
there is always going to be something much better around the corner in this world of technology, i cant say I am bothered.
now if it didnt perform well in the tasks i use it for then I would be bothered, hell i would have returned it a few days ago.
This laptop will last me at least a few years at least.
I was in dyer need for a new laptop and couldnt wait any longer.
also helps i won a £1000 voucher to go towards the purchase at work which I won a year ago!!! so havnt paid the full price for it anyhow.
Regardless i still wouldn't mind. is what it is, as i say always something better around the corner.
All things considered i am a happy camper.
 

tubular-

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Original poster
Apr 1, 2015
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http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench3/2675551

Adding more fuel to the fire...The top end processor from the newly launched models, i7 5950HQ, seen here in a Geekbench test for an MSI notebook.

3,886 single core
15,410 multi core

Granted its in Windows, but comparing to the 32 bit scores of the latest high end rMBP its about a 11.5% improvement single core and 19% multicore. Plus battery improvements and large improvements in Iris Pro 6200. As fast single core as the fastest current iMac, and keeping pace with an 8 core 2009 Mac Pro.

--------------------

Playing devils advocate, Intel could be announcing these to save face from all of the delays and they may in fact not be ready. Apple has had processors available shortly after update in prior years so one would think they could still get that access if it were available.
 
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magbarn

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http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench3/2675551

Adding more fuel to the fire...The top end processor from the newly launched models, i7 5950HQ, seen here in a Geekbench test for an MSI notebook.

3,886 single core
15,410 multi core

Granted its in Windows, but comparing to the 32 bit scores of the latest high end rMBP its about a 11.5% improvement single core and 19% multicore. Plus battery improvements and large improvements in Iris Pro 6200. As fast single core as the fastest current iMac, and keeping pace with an 8 core 2009 Mac Pro.

--------------------

Playing devils advocate, Intel could be announcing these to save face from all of the delays and they may in fact not be ready. Apple has had processors available shortly after update in prior years so one would think they could still get that access if it were available.
If those scores hold water in OS X, this is a bigger upgrade than Sandy to Ivy Bridge. The only reasonable explanation for this half-hearted 2015 upgrade is that the fully redesigned skylake rMBP is just right around the corner. It wouldn't make sense to abandon Broadwell if Skylake was coming out early 2016 instead...
 
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ubercool

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Jan 31, 2008
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I have a simple question for you: How long did you wait for Broadwell?

Now, how long do you think you'll have to wait for Skylake?

Repeat after me: Forever. :D
 
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magbarn

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Oct 25, 2008
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I have a simple question for you: How long did you wait for Broadwell?

Now, how long do you think you'll have to wait for Skylake?

Repeat after me: Forever. :D
Been waiting about 6 months realistically. Now there's a big difference between waiting in 2013 when you knew the next rMBP would have a 'Haswell refresh' vs choosing now between essentially the same CPU today vs a huge CPU/GPU/TB3/USB-C upgrade....
 
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