Anti-Vista Marketing at Apple Stores

[sparky672]

I'll make it short and sweet by saying that rubbinjg salt in another's wounds never got anyone anywhere.

What does that have to do with anything? Apple's marketing in recent years has been very successful. There's no reason to believe they will suddenly throw it all away.

Microshoft knows they screwed the pooch, and the average consumer knows enough to be certain that the new Vista version fiasco is way too confusing.

I know it and you know it. But have you seen any of the posts at C/Net lately? There are millions of happy Windows zombies.. err I mean users that will somehow get through the confusion and install Vista. If Apple continues with their smart marketing, they will pick up some new Mac converts thanks to M$'s mistakes.

Apple's continued beating of the same horse will not prove anything further and only runs the risk of tarnishing their image.

I'm sure Apple will not tarnish anything. They've worked too hard to get to this point... you don't seriously believe they'll just started shooting from the hip at this point. Besides, we haven't even seen this new campaign yet.

 

[Maxx Power]

All this bickering and name calling is getting really old. A good product should be able to stand up on its own and pointing fingers and making snarky comments is simply asking for trouble IMHO.

Yeah, it cheapens our Apple products which we already own. I guess its not enough to hype your own products, but you also have to bash others, kinda reminds me of the "my dad is stronger than your dad" argument...

This is stupid. This is getting really old and it is no longer fun. We know mac is a good oprating system but it is time to stop macing fun of Microsoft. Since macs are better lets find another way to convert PC users not by macing fun of them. Instead show them what mac is and not hat microsoft is not.

I've always wondered about this marketing tactic based on "ridicule". While not ethical, ridiculing the competition only works if you are holding the dominant power in market share, to let the consumers fall prey to peer pressure, but it doesn't work if you only hold 5% of the market share, exactly who is ridiculing who is at question.

That tactic might work really well for, say, Nike, though.

 

[smueboy]

That's great, but the best anti-vista marketing would be a release of Leopard.

I agree. The best way to sell your product is not to belittle the competitor (too much anyway). Maybe this will work and draw people in who are frustrated with the thought of Vista, or maybe it will put some people off Apple.

 

[F.D.]

Apple's Latest Ad

And here it is...

 

[morespce54]

...
If you own Macs because you think they are better, then don't be shy. Screw up your testicular fortitude and shout it from the mountain tops...

Well, I also think Macs are better. Actually, I'm pretty sure...
That's why I don't feel the need to tell everybody else that their computer sucks... If anyone asked me about my computer, I'll tell them I have the best one. If they don't, then they don't want to know my opinion. (which is just fine by me...they just don't know what they're missing )

 

[notjustjay]

Apple is just trying to stress the point that we had it first... otherwise, when Leopard is finally released, Microsoft users will think that APPLE is the one stealing the features out of Vista when it's really the other way around. They need to make it known to the masses how much Vista copied from Mac OS X so that when Leopard comes out and surpasses Vista entirely, people will see how out of date Vista is compared to Leopard. People agree... no?

Who cares who had it first? It's the one who has it better that wins.

Frankly, even if all Apple did was take all the features that Microsoft invented (supposing this was true), I'd be OK with that, because Apple has a knack for taking a feature and doing it right. That's what I care about, not a pissing contest about who had it first.

The penultimate example is the iPod. Apple never invented the mp3 player, nor a hard-drive based mp3 player. They just came onto the bandwagon with one that actually worked well. And look where it got them.

 

[wizzerandchips]

ive said it before and I ll say it again, in the 16 years I have been using macs, and that's about 5 models, I have never had one CRASH on me, I was bought up on macs and nothing else, so some could say I was spolit, some would say left in the dark, when I finally got round to using a PC, I was lost in translation. It was like going back in time, and the amount of times it crashed. I took great pleasure in smashing it to bits.

 

[ryanyogan]

Get over it

You guys need to get over it, its not like Steve jobs has the time or care to come up with commercials, this is there tv marketing division trying something a little different to see if they can't bonus this year.

What it all comes down to is the paycheck at the end of the year, coders at Microsoft could care less, and the guys working all night at Apple could care less either. Bill Gates and Steve Jobs probally have a decent relationship, and they are both loaded laughing to the bank.

Guys these are OS's, I could imagine if this was a car argument, but this is a virtual peace of software that handles interrupts from the CPU.... come on!

Mac OS X is nice, Vista is nice enough is enough whatever gets your work done, then so be it.

To the people that say Office is on the way out the door on 08 you couldn't be any more incorrect, Office 2007 is great. You obviously have never been in a enterprise environment. Microsoft makes a majority of there money off Exchange server, and exchange services. Not selling word to you at best buy.

I will say a majority of apples innovations are purchased / out sourced / accquired not because they are lazy but why re invent the wheel? Microsoft does it, every major software vendor does it. Apple TV <= Slingbox..... etc... Widgets = Konflab, Spaces = Virtual Desktops (been using it since 2000 server), Indexed searching = Indexing services a services since NT 4 SP3, dont forget prior to OS x in mac you had to allocate your ram on your own.... I could go on all day about XP and OS X.... not to mention if any of you have ever used OSX Server you know damn well every feature in there has been around since NT/2000 server and or Linux distros with samba....

The point is Microsoft isn't at fault, and neither is Apple they are just companies that report to shareholders, and if there was no shareholders to keep happy then they would probally innovate even less!

 

[Hunabku]

The point is Microsoft isn't at fault, and neither is Apple they are just companies that report to shareholders, and if there was no shareholders to keep happy then they would probally innovate even less!

Probably not.

Do you have any idea how many projects and technologies that apple pioneered or significantly advanced only to drop later? The apple of yesterday was even more known for that - only more recently have they got the focus better on the bottom line.

Yes apple buys/aquires many innnovations, but the ratio of inhouse technologies relative to aquired ones is higher than microslurps. Not to mention what apple does with a technology once they aquire it - they significantly improve it and integrate it into an exceptional user experience.

MS on the other hand tends to downgrade aquired technologies into a generally complicated and microsofty kinda of agonizing user experience. you know Cancel or Allow?

 

[ryanyogan]

Probably not.

Do you have any idea how many projects and technologies that apple pioneered or significantly advanced only to drop later? The apple of yesterday was even more known for that - only more recently have they got the focus better on the bottom line.

Yes apple buys/aquires many innnovations, but the ratio of inhouse technologies relative to aquired ones is higher than microslurps. Not to mention what apple does with a technology once they aquire it - they significantly improve it and integrate it into an exceptional user experience.

MS on the other hand tends to downgrade aquired technologies into a generally complicated and microsofty kinda of agonizing user experience. you know Cancel or Allow?

The UAC is kind of pointless and I turned it off since beta 1 if that is what you're referring to? They will most likely take a good 6 months of complaints to really turn it into something bearable. I will say this, vista is a breath of fresh air as I havn't had any issues with it for the most part, and we really beat the hell out of it work. There alot of services and such in windows that 99% of the population have no idea and or care to use, that is why IT(me) have jobs.

In the home I could care less and I might even try a mac for the basics. But in medium to enterprise sized business, I am sorry you will not see Apple with any kind of a margin worth talking about. Even if Apple opens up to all x86 manufactures, Microsoft was smart from the begining make as many products as you can, integrate them all and boom your in. To be honest there is no reason to switch in business, if Microsoft felt threatened they could cut prices by a 1/3 in a heart beat and still pull huge profits. Not to mention the fact that Apple servers are extremelly overpriced / inconsistent machines.

For the record our company had to buy a MacPro for an employee that just had to have it for photoshop (********) and she loves..... We keep it off the network, but she never calls with problems about it.

 

[eddyg]

For the record our company had to buy a MacPro for an employee that just had to have it for photoshop (********) and she loves..... We keep it off the network, but she never calls with problems about it.

Hell yes - my company does the same, keep Macs off the network.

IT don't have any tools to autoupdate the SW/OS or the virus checker. Without that the a computer may catch something and infect the whole network. So just don't allow it to be connected.

It's a lot safer having a homogenous network of easily infected but monitored and controlled Windows PCs. If one gets a virus you'll know really quickly as your entire companys computers go down, but on the flip side you can fix them all in just a couple of days downtime.

 

[zephyrus54]

Are Apple and MS duping us?

I find it interesting that everyone's always talking about the whole Apple vs MS situation...here's some food for thought

1) MS still profits from each Mac that's sold...most people use Microsoft Office, and now that Apple is intel-based MS is also profiting off of sales of Windows and will continue to do so with the release of Vista.
2) My friend is a programmer for MS, and I have learned that she gets discounts off of Apple products, because MS and Apple are officially partners...that's right she gets 20% off of apple products, including hardware.

Does this sound like two companies trying to squash each other?...sounds more like they wouldn't mind us being super-zealous, side-taking consumers, because in the end both companies can benefit.

 

[gregorsamsa]

I find it interesting that everyone's always talking about the whole Apple vs MS situation...here's some food for thought

1) MS still profits from each Mac that's sold...most people use Microsoft Office, and now that Apple is intel-based MS is also profiting off of sales of Windows and will continue to do so with the release of Vista.
2) My friend is a programmer for MS, and I have learned that she gets discounts off of Apple products, because MS and Apple are officially partners...that's right she gets 20% off of apple products, including hardware.

Does this sound like two companies trying to squash each other?...sounds more like they wouldn't mind us being super-zealous, side-taking consumers, because in the end both companies can benefit.

Methinks, that's bang on! Also, Steve Jobs has said something very similar (paraphrasing): For Apple to win doesn't have to mean that MS lose.

 

[ready2switch]

Methinks, that's bang on! Also, Steve Jobs has said something very similar (paraphrasing): For Apple to win doesn't have to mean that MS lose.

True, but many would love to see MS lose.

 

[kingtj]

I don't think some people get it.....

Advertising that attacks or pokes fun at the competition isn't so much meant to get people using the competition to switch over. It's meant to make the people who already switched feel better about their purchase!

If you can turn your customers into true "fans" of your products, then you generate indirect sales through their efforts to promote your products.

Especially in the case of Vista, you've got a lot of people who recently switched to a Mac, only to have a lingering doubt, now that MS just released their big operating system upgrade (that people were waiting 5 years for).

Apple's latest commercials serve to help that crowd feel a little bit better about their decision, if nothing else.

The general computer-using public perceives the Mac community as "smug" because overall, they ARE. Mac users are a vocal minority, with only 5-6% of the total computer market, yet media attention and coverage that makes that percentage seem MUCH larger than it is. Apple products get copied and imitated as a rule in the computer marketplace, because they innovate in areas where everyone else is imitating and regurgitating the same old thing.

What people don't realize until they actually BUY a Mac and give it an honest try is that the Mac community has GOOD REASON to be smug.

This sort of behaviour disappoints me and does nothing to help the perceived smugness of mac users. I was detered from the Mac by what I considered their superiority complex and it was only when I eventually tried the product that I changed my mind.

 

[Pac a Mac]

This cannot be a serious campaign. I'm sure its just a bit of fun on Apples part. OSX is not in the same marketplace. You cannot run it on a PC. Lets face it 95% of users don't give a monkeys what operating system they run, it comes with the computer and they live with it. The other 5% run OSX or A N Other. This will not change significantly unless OSX is produced to run multi-platform even then PC suppliers will have to be persuaded to offer OSX as opposed to the clear best seller. The only potential is for people who may buy a new PC just to run Vista, but if your'e desparate enough to buy new just to get Vista, why would OSX suddenly appeal. The market potential is as it has always been , Vista changes nothing, people fed up with crashes, quirks and viruses may consider a Mac on their next upgrade. The problem area for Apple is that Vista may actually eradicate these gripes (perhaps not this version but the next service pack may do it). Now thats a challenge

 

[sparky672]

This cannot be a serious campaign. I'm sure its just a bit of fun on Apples part. OSX is not in the same marketplace. You cannot run it on a PC. ...

Sure, Apple is blowing millions of dollars on advertising just to have a little fun.

You can't be serious.

 

[anonicon]

I don't understand what the hubbub is about. Comparing yourself with competitors is a cornerstone of advertising. If people are satisfied with what they have they'll never buy your product. Make them dissatisfied, that's how the game is played.

It's fine and dandy to compare your products to the competition's while pointing out why you're better than them, but to do so in the kind of immature Fanboy fashion that marked Apple ads from the 1990s is LAME. Encouraging this kind of Jr. High School mentality is an image I wouldn't want to associate myself with.

Apple's done a good job of avoiding it for the last few years since OSX came out and presented themselves as a company with products that *adults* want to use, not just 'litist metrosexual graphic designers.

 

[sparky672]

It's fine and dandy to compare your products to the competition's while pointing out why you're better than them, but to do so in the kind of immature Fanboy fashion that marked Apple ads from the 1990s is LAME. Encouraging this kind of Jr. High School mentality is an image I wouldn't want to associate myself with.

Apple's done a good job of avoiding it for the last few years since OSX came out and presented themselves as a company with products that *adults* want to use, not just 'litist metrosexual graphic designers.

I like Apple and have been using Macs since the beginning. I've owned about a dozen over the last 20 years...

and I don't care what other people think.

Apple does...

and Apple will continue to market the Mac in whatever way they think will sell more Macs. They're certainly not going to curtail their efforts so the more sensitive Mac users aren't accidently confused with a metro-sexual.

Apparently many fail to recognize the reality of corporate marketing. Tens of thousands of dollars are spent on research and test marketing these advertising ideas to various demographic groups before release to the general public. Advertising ideas are quickly scrapped if they're proven ineffective in their goal.

They certainly won't avoid extremely effective advertising if a tiny percentage of people get hurt feelings when the competition gets the truth slammed in their face.

 

[janstett]

ive said it before and I ll say it again, in the 16 years I have been using macs, and that's about 5 models, I have never had one CRASH on me, I was bought up on macs and nothing else, so some could say I was spolit, some would say left in the dark, when I finally got round to using a PC, I was lost in translation. It was like going back in time, and the amount of times it crashed. I took great pleasure in smashing it to bits.

Yeah that's all wonderful but they're just computers.

My PPC Mini got fried (motherboard, disk controller, and SuperDrive). My MacBook Pro has already had one catastrophic disk crash that required a reformat and reinstall. And I've gotten some of the dreaded slow-refill "your computer is hosed, reboot" screens (equivalent to BSOD, require a hard restart) 4 or 5 times in my one year of MacBook Pro ownership. Of course, the other Mac zealot kool-aid drinkers tell me it must be my problem, how can I crash a mighty Macintosh?

They're just computers, sorry. If you can't crash it, you aren't using it hard enough

 

[janstett]

It's fine and dandy to compare your products to the competition's while pointing out why you're better than them, but to do so in the kind of immature Fanboy fashion that marked Apple ads from the 1990s is LAME. Encouraging this kind of Jr. High School mentality is an image I wouldn't want to associate myself with. .

Exactly. Imagine if BMW had its salespeople wear shirts saying "Audi Sucks!" or something like that, and sales literature poked at the fact that they're overweight wrong-wheel-drive Volkswagens. If you're selling BMWs, you don't need to do it because the merits speak for themselves and the consumer KNOWS what the other guy is up to and can make an intelligent, rational decision on their own.

 

[sparky672]

Exactly. Imagine if BMW had its salespeople wear shirts saying "Audi Sucks!" or something like that, and sales literature poked at the fact that they're overweight wrong-wheel-drive Volkswagens. If you're selling BMWs, you don't need to do it because the merits speak for themselves and the consumer KNOWS what the other guy is up to and can make an intelligent, rational decision on their own.

If BMW thought that selling T-shirts saying "Audi Sucks" would be good for the bottom line, they'd do it.

What's up with all this exaggeration and fear? Is Apple going to sell T-shirts now that say "Vista Sucks"? Are you afraid some angry Vista user is going to make fun of you?

Automobile advertising routinely contains feature comparison charts. Pickup trucks: Toyota vs. Chevy vs. Ford. Who's got the biggest payload capacity, who's got the most HP, the most torque, etc. And if you've ever mentioned a competing brand at an auto dealership, the salesman will not hesitate to say something negative. Yeah, that never happens.

Corporate giants make marketing decisions only after months of careful research. Anything else would be about as wise as setting stacks of $100 bills on fire.

Apple and Microsoft are multi-million dollar companies with thousands of employees, dozens of departments, a board of directors, and millions of shareholders.

None of this is "personal".

Each company's respective marketing departments and leadership teams will do what they think is in the best interest of their company and its shareholders.

If you seriously think these organizations are run by one man making silly, rash decisions based on something pissing him off, you've been watching way too much TV.

Apple will proceed with whatever advertising strategy as long as it continues to increase the Mac customer base.

Microsoft will continue to support Office for Mac as long as it's profitable.

Any consumer who's that concerned about their own image being tarnished by a "juvenile" advertising campaign should not buy the product. Problem solved.

 

[janstett]

If BMW thought that selling T-shirts saying "Audi Sucks" would be good for the bottom line, they'd do it.

What's up with all this exaggeration and fear? Is Apple going to sell T-shirts now that say "Vista Sucks"? Are you afraid some angry Vista user is going to make fun of you?

Did you not read the article, that Apple employees are going to wear anti-Vista T-shirts in the Apple stores?

I took place in the OS wars already. I was a big OS/2 zealot. I still have my old OS/2 advocacy T-shirts. Including one that says "NT" in big letters, but reveal to say "Nice Try" in smaller letters. Sounds remarkably like what Apple is doing now.

I used to hate Apple, going back to the Apple II days. I hated them in the 68k days. I hated them in the PPC days. Check comp.mac.sys.advocacy or whatever it's called on deja.com. I took pleasure in bashing the Apple fanboys (and turns out I was right, especially with my comparisons of SpecMark scores between PPC and X86 that oh so ironically Apple highlighted when it switched).

Last year I decided to let go of my past hatred of Apple and just enjoy their products and enjoy the fact that there are still alternatives to the Windows juggernaut. I also run Fedora Linux for that same reason. And I don't hate Windows. I enjoy all three OS's.

Snarky, juvenile nonsense like this makes me regret giving Apple my money.

Any consumer who's that concerned about their own image being tarnished by a "juvenile" advertising campaign should not buy the product. Problem solved.

See above. I'm past the wars and garbage like this makes me regret fueling it with my money.

 

[MonkeyHugger]

I like it.

It doesn't seem arrogant. Just seems a bit tounge in cheeck. A bit of informality is always good from a global company IMO.

 

[sparky672]

Did you not read the article, that Apple employees are going to wear anti-Vista T-shirts in the Apple stores?

I took place in the OS wars already. I was a big OS/2 zealot....
....

Snarky, juvenile nonsense like this makes me regret giving Apple my money.

It's been a couple days since I read the article so I admit forgetting about the T-shirts. Wearing anti-Vista t-shirts sounds like fun though.

Maybe I'm just getting old but when you talk about "the OS wars", I must admit I snicker just a bit. Did you lose a limb? Of course you didn't... don't take it all so seriously, you'll be a happier person.

I'm past the wars and garbage like this makes me regret fueling it with my money.

No one should have regrets. Perhaps you shouldn't give them any more blood money.