The software alone is very restrictive on Mac. The interface is pretty locked as well. All you can change is the wall paper. The peripherals are also limited. In addition most games don't port to Mac. Most of the top CAD and 3D programs are also left behind unless you boot into Windows. OneDrive is ten times more usable and powerful than iCloud. Cortana can be ignored and not used just as Siri on Mac. And why would you want to disable the firewall? And at least you can edit the registry in Windows. Try to get rid of Safari on Apple. You are talking about very basic operations, I am talking about the whole user experience. Many Mac users are so locked in to Mac that they cannot even comprehend a life outside of it. I am very familiar with Mac. I have been around and supporting them since way back on System 6 and 7.
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Anyone else abandoning ship?
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The software alone is very restrictive on Mac. The interface is pretty locked as well. All you can change is the wall paper. The peripherals are also limited. In addition most games don't port to Mac. Most of the top CAD and 3D programs are also left behind unless you boot into Windows. OneDrive is ten times more usable and powerful than iCloud. Cortana can be ignored and not used just as Siri on Mac. And why would you want to disable the firewall? And at least you can edit the registry in Windows. Try to get rid of Safari on Apple. You are talking about very basic operations, I am talking about the whole user experience. Many Mac users are so locked in to Mac that they cannot even comprehend a life outside of it. I am very familiar with Mac. I have been around and supporting them since way back on System 6 and 7.
Whether it’s Windows or macOS, I’m sure a lot of people can’t comprehend switching operating systems because they’re generally happy with them. Many also use both + Linux. No one is “locked” into anything.
What software is restrictive on a Mac? And how?
How is interface locked when compared to Windows? Windows is as locked in with UI as is Mac OS. If you said locked more then linux distros, I would agree. But windows?
Actually, you can now change the theme of entire OS (dark and light). And works like a charm. You can do that on Windows as well, but lots of Microsoft apps don't work in dark mode, let alone 3rd party apps.
And yes, you can install additional software on Windows to change theme. And that will cause problems eventually. But that isn't changing interface, interface remains the same. Only thing you will change are few icons and colors. Interface? Well, you can't change it. Every app will remain the same.
Peripherals aren't OS. And 3rd party apps aren't OS either. This doesn't prove that Mac OS is more locked down then windows.
Registry on Windows is one big pile of mess to begin with. And since MS didn't have the 'courage' to get rid of it 15 years ago while they were on top, now they are in a tight spot.
And I simply don't understand one thing... What do you people do with your computers that Edge or Safari bothers you? install any other browser, set it as default, use it. You don't even have to look at edge or safari.
P.S.
I had a lot of criticism on MBP. Faulty keyboards, T2, flext gate, etc. That's why I moved on. MBP isn't a reliable machine anymore. At least not to me. So I'm writing this post on my Thinkpad X1E.
Blame Apple for hardware failures, or any other mistake that they did. But Mac OS? Restrictive? Not opened? Mac OS is the only reason I'm still on these forums. If apple fixes MBP with update, I will come back in a heart beat. If not, I will make due with Windows 10 and what ever linux distro is the best for me at that moment.
[QUOTE="Mendota, post: 27167018, member: 1162164"Many Mac users are so locked in to Mac that they cannot even comprehend a life outside of it. I am very familiar with Mac. I have been around and supporting them since way back on System 6 and 7.[/QUOTE]
The main reason im not jumping ship is because i can use alternative programs on my macs. I think system prefences is the only apple app i use, and disk utility. I even tranfer music on 3 ipods without usung itunes
[doublepost=1552169640][/doublepost]Hey C0opo, would you purchase a pinebook 64? They are $100 linux laptops, made to order ...i think
The main reason im not jumping ship is because i can use alternative programs on my macs. I think system prefences is the only apple app i use, and disk utility. I even tranfer music on 3 ipods without usung itunes
[doublepost=1552169640][/doublepost]Hey C0opo, would you purchase a pinebook 64? They are $100 linux laptops, made to order ...i think
I actually just switched back to Mac and the iPhone. I am a Microsoft IT Pro and I always used Windows, until some day 12 years ago I made the switch to Mac. Three years ago I was angry at for not emphasizing Mac as I wanted them to, so I went back to Windows. I also switched to Android..
I can tell you my experiences in detail, but the main takeaway is that is offering the best ecoystem. Nothing is perfect, but the way macOS works, is much better than Windows. After I made the switch to Windows I had to lose functionality and some great apps that were available on the Mac. Video editing apps like iMovie do not exist (I know that there are many apps in Windows, but none works so well). I wanted to use something like iFlicks, but not possible. I tried finding an app like Things, but nothing satisfied me. Even things that someone would expect to find in Windows, are not really functioning well. The photos app on Windows is unstable and cannot be compared with the Mac photos app. Quicktime is much better than the movies and videos app on Windows. File Explorer has remained stagnant for years..
On top of that add the lack of a Time Machine based backup. A 3rd party app is required. The default browser, Edge is garbage and things like synchronisation do not always work. Windows is in a state where nobody really knows where it is going. Universal apps are dead, the Windows store is also bad.
On the Mac everything works great. The quality of the apps is better, and the system has been designed in a way that everything works together. In Windows you see many different ideas that work separate from each other. Like in Android..
I am not going back to Windows any time soon, but for those that do, good luck. Many good ideas in Windows, with bad implementation.
One last thing: text rendering on macOS is amazing. Also support for HiDPI displays..On Windows it is not really good..
I can tell you my experiences in detail, but the main takeaway is that is offering the best ecoystem. Nothing is perfect, but the way macOS works, is much better than Windows. After I made the switch to Windows I had to lose functionality and some great apps that were available on the Mac. Video editing apps like iMovie do not exist (I know that there are many apps in Windows, but none works so well). I wanted to use something like iFlicks, but not possible. I tried finding an app like Things, but nothing satisfied me. Even things that someone would expect to find in Windows, are not really functioning well. The photos app on Windows is unstable and cannot be compared with the Mac photos app. Quicktime is much better than the movies and videos app on Windows. File Explorer has remained stagnant for years..
On top of that add the lack of a Time Machine based backup. A 3rd party app is required. The default browser, Edge is garbage and things like synchronisation do not always work. Windows is in a state where nobody really knows where it is going. Universal apps are dead, the Windows store is also bad.
On the Mac everything works great. The quality of the apps is better, and the system has been designed in a way that everything works together. In Windows you see many different ideas that work separate from each other. Like in Android..
I am not going back to Windows any time soon, but for those that do, good luck. Many good ideas in Windows, with bad implementation.
One last thing: text rendering on macOS is amazing. Also support for HiDPI displays..On Windows it is not really good..
I'd say that users have more freedom to make different changes, and even completely re-theme windows if they feel so moved. Apple has the UI locked down to prevent much changing.
Agreed, Peripherals are not the OS, but for consumers its the experience, is OS based and is very much macOS vs. Windows; Windows comes out on top with more drivers and more support. Epson stopped supporting their scanners in macOS instead directing people to use Image Capture (provided by Apple), where as for windows they provide the driver that they continually update and a very powerful application to use/manage your scans. They used to have that app for macOS, but dropped it, I basically needed to use Windows in a vm or boot camp, just to scan stuff (back when I had a MBP).
Both operating systems have their positives and negatives, but I think one of Window's positives is that you have more ways to make changes to the OS.
I don't hate macOS, it has many advantages over windows, and there are things I miss so don't take my post wrong. I agree the registry was something that needed to go, MS is incredibly inconsistent with its UX. Do I go into the settings app to make a change, or the notification tray or the control panel. I can make battery/performance changes in all three and sometimes I need to make changes in all three. That's just horrible, they need one cohesive design and they started too, but never finished it.
Maybe its how I use my computer, but I have to disagree. I find using say Excel in Windows to be way better and I mean specifically how the text is rendered. On the mac, I have to boos the zoom to 150, to 200%. Likewise with Outlook vs. Apple Mail. Maybe you're using windows/macs differently then i am but I feel windows is easier on my eyes.
@maflynn I am using an LG 4K external monitor and when switching between the external monitor and the laptop's display, macOS handles text scaling much better than Windows. Especially Win32 apps have problems with text scaling. Just have a look at Microsoft's apps, including Excel.
Anyway, it's good that we have both systems. I use both, but for me at least Windows will be used only when I use the company laptop. Apart from that I will be using Macs only in my private life. I missed them a lot these years, and I don't want to use Windows privately. I had too many issues with Windows and I just don't want to deal with them anymore.
Anyway, it's good that we have both systems. I use both, but for me at least Windows will be used only when I use the company laptop. Apart from that I will be using Macs only in my private life. I missed them a lot these years, and I don't want to use Windows privately. I had too many issues with Windows and I just don't want to deal with them anymore.
I use two 2k monitors for both my Mac and my work provided Lenovo. I’d have to say that actually windows has gotten much better at scaling the fonts for high res monitors (I use Excel, Access and Word, 32 bit versions). There are a couple of old (and I mean old) applications in Windows that won’t scale right for the text smoothing, but most have no issue.
Prominent YouTuber (13M subscribers) explains why he has switched away from Apple laptops:
tl;dr
Windows has improved
Macbook keyboards suck
tl;dr
Windows has improved
Macbook keyboards suck
So that means that he is right? I also felt like this and left , so I understand. The thing is that Windows is not better. It is weird mix of UWP apps, Win32 apps, ideas that never got completely implemented and from a usability perspective it is not even close to a Mac. Personally, I couldn't find an app that impressed me, and I am talking about all normal things. The browser for example: If Edge were stable enough, it would be a wonderful alternative to Safari. Its scrolling, text rendering and HiDPI support is second to none. The problem is though, that everything else in Edge sucks. Chrome on the other hand works great, but I cannot stand its text rendering and awful scrolling.
I am still trying to find a photos app for Windows that doesn't suck. The default app is buggy and lacks many features (no keyword support). Adobe Photoshop Elements is great if you are stuck with an old PC with no touch support. Its interface is stuck in the past. On the other side, macOS has Photos, which is really great. Even Microsoft Outlook is buggy on Windows and slow. I had a Surface Book 2 with 16GB RAM and i7 CPU, but sometimes Outlook was really slow. On the Mac, Outlook flies.
Even the most expensive laptop (Surface Book 2) has issues with power management. The available power management profiles do not work as well as the automated power management of macOS.
I can continue for a long time listing all the things where Windows is not on par with macOS. The problem is that in order to discover these things, you need a lot of time. Do not believe people on YouTube saying how better Windows is, unless they convince you that they have been using the OS for a very long time. Otherwise comparisons are not to be taken seriously.
I am sure that even this YouTuber with the million subscribers will use macOS again. Also remember that he has a big audience and such videos make people watch, and that brings more money to his business..
Windows and MacOS are not the complaint in the video. Hardware is compared. Faulty keyboards, Flexgate and that kind of stuff. Nobody claims that Windows is better (or worse) than MacOS.
Operating systems are not the discussion here. In the Apple ecosystem you can only buy Apple hardware including the design errors and disadvantages. You can not buy Apple hardware from another manufacturer. In the PC (Windows/Linux) ecosystem you can buy hardware from dozens of manufacturers. If you don't like a Microsoft Surface? Simple, buy a Dell or a HP or a Lenovo etc.
That you prefer MacOS over Windows is your opinion but I don't see how this has anything to do with the video/post you are reacting to.
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Actually I do use Edge. As for software - here is an example. My brother in law is an architect. He uses Autodesk software. AutoCad is not the top produc, Revit is. Autodesk doesn't make it for Mac, so all of the users in his office have to use bootcamp.
The registry is not a pile of crap. It works quite well. This is one of the propaganda points Apple users (just like the blue screen shrill) like to make. The registry give you complete access and control over everything. Microsoft has not need to get rid of it, because they have no need to. Microsoft doesn't hide things from the user in order to "protect" them as Apple does.
Here is an example (I have used before): On my Mac I wanted to use Painter. Of course there are no built in digitizers on Mac... Doing it the Mac way I hooked up my iPad pro to use as a tablet. It set up as an extended desktop. I thought to myself... "Not sure I want that." So I searched and found the monitor setting and set it to mirror instead. Then later I decided that the extended desktop was best. I went back to the setting... And it wasn't there! It took me awhile to figure out that MacOS had decided to take the setting away because?!?!? It decided that I didn't need it...? Since I was mirroring. It told me that I was really only using one monitor! I didn't feel like fighting it or going on the web to try and get information on how to get the setting back. I just left it.
This is just one example of the many frustrations I run into with Mac. And I never have to reset the SMS on Windows or lose permissions, etc.
[doublepost=1552239799][/doublepost]
This is an example of what I mean about how Apple has trained it's users... Apps in the store. On Windows I use Paint shop Pro, Adobe Photoshop, and Affinity photo. The built in App on Windows is just meant to be an extension of Explorer with basic tools. Windows users don't think about getting apps from the app store for most serious work.
I have no issues with power management or things being slow, to include outlook, but then I tend to run most of the time on "high performance." But you can go in and tweak power setting to your exact needs if you like.
No question that Apple does the walled garden very well. I like to visit it, but I don't want to live in the wall garden full time. As for scaling, Apple just changes the resolution and everything defaults to that. I haven't found it to be the best solution for me as I only want some things at the default resolution. In Windows I can change the resolution for programs separate from the overall resolution for the system and I prefer that.
I was thinking the same thing, I don't really get all the hate Windows Registry gets. Indexed, hierarchical binary file with human readable GUI vs bazilion of plist files stored in different directories and in couple different formats on Mac.
And how different is this on Mac? You will get awful scrolling outside of Safari and if using non-apple hardware (like logitech mouse). I'm running smoothscroll in chrome and smooze outside of it on MBP to overcome this. Yeah, touchpad + Safari scrolling is glorious. Any other combination not so much.
Outlook for Mac is missing over 40 features from Windows version, it is pretty much a different app. Although I don't experience any slowdowns on both Win and Mac side. For the power management - this boils down to the fact that Apple can fine tune this for the very limited number of hardware combinations. Put a third party SSD in previous gen MBP and look at your battery life being cut in half, while Windows has to handle infinite number of combinations and it does good enough job. In addition, on Windows you can (still) customize a power plan in ways not available on MacOS and close the gap to it.
This fine-tuning is what is really important. At the end of the day the user experience is what is important.
Scrolling on Safari is amazing and unfortunately there is nothing equivalent on Windows, unless you are using Edge, which has many issues though.
At the end of the day it is about personal choice and it's good to have many options.
[doublepost=1552242201][/doublepost]
Yes, you are right. I will not defend Apple. I also prefer the keyboard found in many Windows laptops. I cannot say about the 2017 and 2016 MBP models, but the MBP 2018 has a worse keyboard than the one found on the Surface Book 2 for example. If it is also unreliable then I will be angry. I have to say though that I like the typing experience on the MBP, but just not as much as on the Surface. I just hope it is reliable. I paid 2600€ for my MBP and reliability is very important.
In any case, if the MBP's 2018 keyboard is reliable, then I see no issue. Maybe because I am not someone that types extremely fast. For me, the keyboard is ok. As I wrote before, everybody is different, so it's good that there are choices out there.
But we aren't talking about 3rd party software here, you said mac os is limited when compared to windows 10. We are talking about OS, not 3rd party software.
If you are a gamer, dumbest thing to do would be to purchase any mac. Every decent PC will crush it in gaming. So goes for CAD software. And if you use office all the time, and rely on it, well, mac is no way to go.
But the same thing could be said in other direction. Your work depends on Sketch app? Or on Final Cut? Or Logic? Well, you could throw 100 000$ on a PC, and it still wouldn't work out for you.
Windows has some 3rd party and in house app advantages over mac os. But the same goes in other direction.
Actually, registry is a complete pile of crap. And I'm not talking some propaganda here, I'm talking about facts. I used windows since 3.11 version. And I'm also a .NET developer for about 15 years or so, so I do believe I know what I'm talking about.
Registry does give you a complete access, that is true. But is that good?
Nope. ANY 3rd party app if developed badly could do a complete mess in registry. And I do mean any app.
Want some more examples? Try moving 99,99% of Windows 10 apps to another hard drive. In 99% of the cases, only way to do that is to uninstall that app, and then reinstall it to the second drive. And in 99% of the cases, that app will have dual footprint in registry, and that can sometimes cause problems.
Want to do that on a Mac OS? Just drag the app wherever you like. It will work.
Want to move user profile to another drive on mac os or Linux? Easy.
Want to do that on Windows? Good luck.
Why? Because of registry. It's not just bad design, it's the worst possible design ever.
Now I would really like that you explain to me why you consider registry to be a good thing. Because I literally met no one in my profession that thinks it's even a ok thing. Everybody hates it. It's almost impossible to maintain, it causes lots of issues, makes simple tasks impossible (my examples above), and it's fairly easy to mess it completely up.
I can't speak for iPad, I don't use tablets at all. And I don't use drawing tools, and can't draw. So I can't really argue there.
But removing options isn't only a mac thing. It's a windows thing as well. And on a lot worse scale then you described. Windows update is the worst update mechanism out there. And how about controlling it? Well, good luck in that department. MS made some 'nice' decisions for you. Sure, you could use a few hacks just to avoid updating for as long as possible, but how many users could actually achieve that? And still, MS removed some really important and basic options.
Now, every OS has it strengths and weaknesses. But for the life of me, no one can really explain why Windows is more opened then Mac OS? They are basically the same in that aspect.
You want a complete freedom? Go for Linux, because stuff you can do on Linux, no one is able to do on either macOS or Windows.
The OS exist to run software... Not to sit there and look pretty. The sketch apps are just that apps. If you want power for professional use Pro Photographer for example, you will need Photoshop or Paintshop Pro etc.
The registry doesn't need to be "maintained". What do you mean? Are saying you just open it and curse at it? Why? This is another example of what I mean by so called power Mac users. The computer exist to run software either for work or play. The computer itself is not the plaything. You can do that, but that has nothing to do with it's actual purpose.
And it is very easy to control Windows update, all it takes is just reading and following the directions. It asks you to pick a time. It warns you, and tells you what it is doing. Everything that you are saying is nothing more than the usual made up complaints about Windows that don't bare any resemblance to actual user reality.
As for Linux it is even more limited than MacOS. Your issue seems to be that you are assuming that everyone wants to just play around with their computer and mess with it's settings. Most people buy computers to get work or play done... period and they don't much care about how it is set up as long as they can do what they need and want. Windows offers that greatest opportunity in terms of possibilities in computing. Everything from Visual Studio for programing, to the best 3D software, to the latest and greatest gaming experience.
Disregarding all the other irrelevant stuff you posted (because no one was talking about Windows being better than MacOS anyway) I would like to take issue with your assertion that Outlook 'flies' on the Mac. The greatly inferior implementation of Microsoft Office on MacOS was one of the major factors that caused me to switch back to Windows 10. I cannot believe anyone would really advocate MS Office on MacOS over the Windows version.
I didn't say that Office on Mac is better than Windows. On the contrary. Office on Windows is better, but Outlook is slower on Windows. I know that Outlook on Mac has less features than on Windows, but that is for me no reason to use Windows privately. As I wrote, I still use a Windows laptop from my company. Office on Mac has around 80% of the features of the Windows version. This is sufficient for me. If other people need more, then they should use Windows.
Indeed. OS does exist to run software.
But that's not the theme of discussion here. YOU said Windows is more opened then Mac OS. I asked how it is more opened then Mac OS. And all you can say is 3rd party software? That doesn't prove that it's more opened. It could prove it has more 3rd party software, but we aren't discussing that at all.
All I asked is a proof that it's more opened. And all you do is to derail the subject completely.
Just like mentioning pro photographer and photoshop. They aren't even Sketch alternatives, and that is besides to point completely.
Registry does need to be maintained. Have you ever maintained Windows server for example?
I named my examples why registry is a complete pile of crap. Not good, not ok, not bad, but a complete failure. And I asked that you provide some examples why it's superior to how Mac OS or Linux does it.
Instead of examples, you're again moving away from subject. And calling some 'power mac users' and using simple name calling? Do you want from me to provide a picture to you what I'm writing this on right now? I don't even OWN a mac any more. Only Apple product I do own are airpods!
So please, can you answer simple questions with direct answers? Or you want to go to name calling and avoid answers because it doesn't suit your agenda here?
I gave you few examples why registry is a complete failure. Am I wrong? If so, how am I wrong?
And give me your examples why registry is so good. Just one or two would do. I can name at least 10 more of basic OS operations that are really easy on macOS/Linux, but completely impossible on Windows because of registry.
So either show some respect, and not just name calling, and answer direct questions with direct answers, or just continue to prove you have completely no idea what you are talking about.
Now, I could be wrong. I always like to learn from others. But in this case, you provided me with nothing to learn.
Easy?
And this is probably the part where we part ways.... I just hope that you are trolling me and not being serious
I'm assuming that everyone wants to play? Dude, you mentioned GAMES as a example that Windows 10 is more opened then MacOS. Games!
Linux is not for games. Most of the stuff you use are based on linux, so I wouldn't call it playing. But since you can't argue with facts, go play some games then
Even though I don't agree that Outlook is slower on Windows, that's just my experience and yours differs, so fair enough
Even though I don't agree that Outlook is slower on Windows, that's just my experience and yours differs, so fair enough
I am with you in that I don't find Outlook slower on Windows. I am not sure that it would make much sense that it would be. But without knowing the configurations of both machines, add-ons used and so on, it is impossible to quantify another users experience
Whan i ran windows office on my macs, the program ran smoothly, i composed booking projects while being an apartmant manager which needed detailed and acurate computing.
And the rest of you lot, stop quoting each other and arguing over the same topics and themes itls getting tiring there are other things in life than xchanging quotes all day, go stare at a tree!
You will thank me later!
And the rest of you lot, stop quoting each other and arguing over the same topics and themes itls getting tiring there are other things in life than xchanging quotes all day, go stare at a tree!
You will thank me later!
That's what a forum is for: quoting each other and discussing things. If you find that tiring, simply don't read it.
I am sure all people on this forum are perfectly capable of doing other things in life as well