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App Store Developers Form a 'Union' Ahead of WWDC Calling for Free App Trials, Better Rates

LordVic said:
it's so "Simple" that you completely misunderstood what they are asking for

They want people to be able to do limited trials of their Applications before buying. This is important because people who are on the fense about certain applications might not buy the application if they can't try it first to find out if it's any good, OR if it fills their need.

Right now, you have to pay up front for an app, test it within a few minutes, and then if it's NOT a good App, or an App that doesn't solve the persons need, they have to go through the refund process.

Free Trials of programs has been a thing since the very early days fo computing and is a big method developers have to get word out on their programs. Apple seems to be very alone in their desire to prevent free trials.
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You don't need a "Union" (even though this isn't a Union) for that. If Apple wants to make it happen, they will. Not because "50 developers banded together to do something". I have nothing against free trials. However the refund process is SUPER EASY these days.
 
slimtastic said:
You don't need a "Union" (even though this isn't a Union) for that. If Apple wants to make it happen, they will. Not because "50 developers banded together to do something". I have nothing against free trials. However the refund process is SUPER EASY these days.
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yeah. the "union" idea is quite silly. If Apple is refusing to provide the services that are wanted, than as I mentioned earlier. Go elsewhere and develop for platforms that do.

The issue becomes:

if Enough developers are frustrated and leave, Apple will have an App problem. So it might be in Apples Better interest to listen and provide compromise, or what they're asking for.

but a union? yeah, that's kinda silliness.
 
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slimtastic said:
What a joke. Make good apps, people will buy. Make ****** apps, no one will buy.

Simple.
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Yup...

Apps in the first category that come to mind are Fantastical for iOS/macOS and apps by The Omni Group for macOS.

There's a reason those relatively expensive apps (and their developers) are doing well.
 
Apple's app store is a monopolistic enterprise. Let Apple maintain their terms but petition for the right of consumers to buy and install apps from outside vendors. Let consumers and developers decide if Apple's control of the app portal is necessary. Of course, you don't have to look any further than the MacOS app store to know that Apple's involvement is self-serving and unnecessary.
 
groovyd said:
No doubt they will collect a lot of signatures (members) and it will probably push Apple to make some concessions but unlikely to put a real dent in the App Store either way. A few million apps plus or minus a few thousand indies won't be missed. Guessing the apps that actually make Apple any respectable profit are also making their developers respectably profitable too. Would help in getting rid of a lot of slop apps.
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To be fair, there might be considerable money in high value apps, if Apple would allow free trials. Else they have little chance.
 
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it's not a terrible idea but also not a surprise that the people pushing the idea make useless software. this only has merit if developers of popular apps say it does.
 
citysnaps said:
Yup...

Apps in the first category that come to mind are Fantastical for iOS/macOS and apps by The Omni Group for macOS.

There's a reason those relatively expensive apps (and their developers) are doing well.
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Do you really believe that out of the other 2.1 million apps in the Apps Store that there aren't some other awesome apps in those numbers that never succeeded?

I'm sure there are some amazing apps out there that devs have made but unfortunately have never taken off for numerous reasons....marketing mainly because they can't afford to advertise in the way others do.

It also became much harder to find new apps when Apple changed their layout.

At one time devs/new apps used to get some reasonable exposure but as soon as you add your app to The App Store now, it disappears into the ether of the other 2.1million immediately.
 
MikhailT said:
I understand what they're trying to do but this:

> Today, we are asking Apple to commit to allowing free trials for all apps in the App Stores by the tenth anniversary of the App Store this July.

...no. I'm sorry, if you're going to ask a big company to commit, setting an unreasonable timeframe is one sure way of making it not happen.

Apple legally cannot change contracts everyone signed on its own and do it in time for July, that's less than two months.
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Yeah, their timetable tells me they don't understand how things really work, and are nothing but a bunch of "entitled" millennials.
 
Free app trials already exist, kind of, as customers can request a reimbursement from Apple for any bought app within 14 days of buying it, no questions asked.
 
It would be like telling google who makes all of its revenue from advertising to say they should give that away.

Apple has had it this long strategy of making money through software sales and they made an incredible platform to do it on.

I agree with the free trials and the App Store could be better but who doesn’t want more money but at the same time there’s no such thing as a free lunch
 
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Captain_Flannel said:
What reason would Apple have for now allowing trials? Seems like it something that would benefit everyone.

Just this morning I was thinking of buying Pocketcasts, but I wanted to see how well it worked for me before I purchased it. Elected to shelve the idea instead of purchasing - a free trial would have been ideal.
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This isn't about being against it. It's far more likely that there are 10000000 things people would like added and only so much Apple can do each release. Building a trial mechanism involves a lot of work. Is it more important than the other things they've added each cycle? They have to prioritize. Frankly, as a developer the trial option isn't high on my list, but many of the things they've added over the years were.
 
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Captain_Flannel said:
Just this morning I was thinking of buying Pocketcasts, but I wanted to see how well it worked for me before I purchased it. Elected to shelve the idea instead of purchasing - a free trial would have been ideal.
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You can buy it and try it. If it does not work as expected, report a problem with Apple within two weeks of buying it, asking for reimbursement.
 
mi7chy said:
Apple should implement Google's hassle free way to get automatic app refund by simply uninstalling the app within two hours. No artificial barriers or hoops to jump through and simplifies the need for free trial.

And, I'm all for supporting devs through lower rates until Apple figure out how to increase marketshare otherwise devs will end up jumping ship to a platform with much greater marketshare.
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The flaw in your logic is that Devs. Dev. for iOS because it is the ONLY "App Store" that makes any money for the Devs.
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Shaun said:
It’s about time the competition authorities investigated Apple for abusing their App Store monopoly.
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I hope you simply forgot your sarcasm tag.
 
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CanadianGuy said:
It's only be up for 3 hours. Might want to give it some time for devs to sign up before mocking the count.
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It's just fine to mock this. 50 signatures on the internet? Anyone can get that in a matter of minutes. I ran a Twitter poll yesterday and got more than 500 votes in under 30 minutes. No different than signatures in the digital world.

Don't make this "union" out to be a big thing if it has yet to attract even 100 developers out of the more than 1.5 million iOS developers.
 
Can I swear? Cause I really want to swear at this whole thing, really I do.

A union for rates that developers want cause they can reap so many dollars more on income?!

This is what development for apps on mobile devices has come to right?
 
Rogifan said:
Why should Apple get a cut of the monthly fee someone pays to Spotify? Apple doesn’t allow apps to offer their own payment system in-app or even provide a link in-app to take you to a website to pay.
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Because it is Apple's platform, they're entitled to control the overall experience on iOS, just as Microsoft does, just as Sony does on their consoles, etc.

Apple is not obligated or required to open their ecosystem to any stores. If they do not want their iOS apps to be riddled with other app stores or open sites to other stores, they can make that rule.

Spotify isn't entitled to Apple's customers, no one is. If you want access to Apple's ecosystem and their customers, you have to pay your way in. Just as Costco is entitled to only allow Visa cards or cash, customers aren't entitled to use any payments they want in Costco.

Spotify can operate their own store and let their members pay there, release a free app on App Store and people sign in to their Spotify accounts.
 
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Here's why you never hear Google developers complain because the return is so much greater. Let's look at how well Pocket Casts app does on Apple App Store vs Google Play Store as an example. Apple hides download stats but we can extrapolate review stats.

Pocket Casts iOS
https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/pocket-casts/id414834813?mt=8
630 reviews

Pocket Casts Google Play
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=au.com.shiftyjelly.pocketcasts
50,750 reviews

So, you might be paying similar cuts but your return with Google Play Store is about 80x more. Would you rather pay Google 30% on $202,000 income or Apple 30% on $2,500 income? With such small marketshare Apple should be paying developers an incentive.
 
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SeaFox said:
Retailers have limited physical space to display products. Part of that 40% goes to pay for the lease on their building and the parking lot in front of it that allows customers access to buy the products. They also have all the utilities for the building and a staff of employees to keep that store running.

Apple has bills for the App Store, too, but the cost per product within the store is just a little bit different. Especially when they have "unlimited" shelf space and product stock.

You could almost say your argument is an "Apples to Oranges" comparison. LOL.
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They have to rent/buy storage, rent physical space or build it to host servers, pay utilities, etc.
 
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LordVic said:
yeah. the "union" idea is quite silly. If Apple is refusing to provide the services that are wanted, than as I mentioned earlier. Go elsewhere and develop for platforms that do.

The issue becomes:

if Enough developers are frustrated and leave, Apple will have an App problem. So it might be in Apples Better interest to listen and provide compromise, or what they're asking for.

but a union? yeah, that's kinda silliness.
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Yep, agreed. People need to vote with their wallets (or in this case, their developer skills). Apple provides a great platform and very high quality tools for developers. Nothing is going to be handed to them (nor should it be). The App Store will morph into what it needs to be with time. If that includes app trials, ****, that would be cool! If not, oh well.
 
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