Apple Accused of 'Hypocrisy' by Ad Industry Coalition Over Its Anti-Tracking Policy

[I7guy]

You can say the same thing about Alphabet (Google) too then.

Google’s parent company briefly hits $2 trillion valuation

Alphabet has almost joined the ranks of Apple and Microsoft.

www.theverge.com

But somehow people call them evil

Google's 'Be Evil' business transformation is complete

I've read this stuff, says one dev. 'Either Google is screwed, or society is screwed'

www.theregister.com

If it's possible for Alphabet to be "evil" and reach $2T market cap, then the same can be true of Apple. Maybe it's just that Apple's better at hiding it/covering it up than others through their marketing. Reality distortion field?

You can’t force people to buy your products. When the product is free, you are the product and give up your security. Reminds me of the Ben Franklin quote paraphrased:

Those who give up liberty for security deserve neither.

 

[jz0309]

when someone from the ad industry speaks up - they do not have your best interest on their mind

 

[jimbobb24]

You think Apple got to 2 trillion dollars worth by being fair and moral?

LOL

How much can people get in a free market by being fair and moral? Is there a cap?

To clarify Your statement is dumb. Being successful is not evidence of corruption. In a free society…It’s often the opposite.

 

[I7guy]

I say yes. Apple likes to talk up how their privacy setting allows you to control what/when/where/how information is shared

Privacy - Control

Apple products, including Apple Intelligence, are designed to protect your privacy, because privacy is a fundamental human right.

www.apple.com

"Settings have been carefully designed to put you in control of your data. You can adjust what information is shared, where you share it, and when it is backed up. And starting with iOS 14.5 and iPadOS 14.5, you’re more in control of how apps use your personal data to track you.

Your devices carry the story of your life. We believe you should have a choice in how apps track and share your data with other companies for advertising or with data brokers.

Apple gives you transparency and control over the data you share with apps. Apps may request access to things such as your location, contacts, calendars, or photos. You’ll receive a prompt with an explanation the first time a third-party app wants to use this data, so you can make an informed decision about granting permission."

Privacy

Apple products, including Apple Intelligence, are designed to protect your privacy, because privacy is a fundamental human right.

www.apple.com

"Privacy is a fundamental human right. It’s also one of our core values. Which is why we design our products and services to protect it. That’s the kind of innovation we believe in."


But when it comes to Apple's own apps, you have no such control. With Apple, it's always "the other companies" and "third-party apps"

If Apple truly cared about user privacy and truly believe it to be a fundamental human right, they would allow users to see and control what information is shared with Apple's own apps. Not doing so is hypocrisy.

Apple (Tim Cook) likes to give users more control over how their data is used and the choice with whom to share it... except when it comes to Apple.

View attachment 2147377


I still want to contol what data I share with Apple even if they're less evil than others by not selling it off.

View attachment 2147384

Don’t see what the issue is. Apple doesnt track me across the web. I have no issues in them using my data to feed me adverts about relevant apple products.

 

[Silverado]

Isn’t the whole issue that Apple can, but don’t, and would give users the same ATT notice to either agree or disagree to be tracked?

The beef seems to be that the power to decide has been handed to the consumer, by Apple.

The ATT is about sharing data with other companies’ apps. No warning is needed for sharing data between the same company’s apps. Apple can do it, Google and Meta can do it, without asking.

 

[mrochester]

You honestly think government and politicians have "no skin in the game?"

They shouldn’t, but I don’t think that.

 

[nt5672]

Of all of the big tech companies, Apple is the one I trust the most when it comes to security and privacy. Apple makes money by selling hardware, software and services, not with targeted advertisements like Meta and Google.

While I agree, I also think Apple has a lot of room to improve. I know Apple won't improve without complaints and media focus. So please don't let them off the hook simply because all of the others are worse.

 

[sw1tcher]

Don’t see what the issue is. Apple doesnt track me across the web. I have no issues in them using my data to feed me adverts about relevant apple products.

Just because you have no issues with them using your data to feed you adverts about relevant apple products doesn't mean others feel the same way.

Either Apple/Tim Cook believes "Privacy is a fundamental human right" or they don't. When they carve out exceptions for themselves, then that (IMO) means they don't and it [privacy] is NOT one of their core values despite their claim it is.

 

[I7guy]

Just because you have no issues with them using your data to feed you adverts about relevant apple products doesn't mean others feel the same way.

Either Apple/Tim Cook believes "Privacy is a fundamental human right" or they don't. When they carve out exceptions for themselves, then that (IMO) means they don't and it [privacy] is NOT one of their core values despite their claim it is.

With Google and meta you’re the product. Meta flat out lied about the way it was using your data. Google hasn’t lied but they do track me across the web.

With any of these tech companies I suggest you vote with your $$$ if you disagree. Oh wait, that only applies to apple.

People often conflate privacy with security. Privacy is the handling of your PII and extended PII. That doesn’t mean because apple believes in privacy they should flush your information down the toilet. So I do t see where apple is hypocritical or there is a disconnect.

 

[davidf18]

For over a decade since the iPhone first was released and even earlier for web browsers such as Safari, firms like Facebook, Google, and their clients made a lot of money, a lot of money by spying on our data without our consent.

This spying without our consent should have been made illegal, but even if not is highly unethical behavior on the part of these firms.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

"They are the same. Of you investigate, Apple is using your data illegaly too."

@Kulfon: You sound certain about this. Can you please provide the receipts showing actual evidence, not accusations or lawsuits? You may be right, but I'd like to see actual evidence before believing it is happening. Thanks.

Right? I mean folks think that a “certain MacRumors user” got their account the way everyone did, but I’m PRETTY sure they offed, like, 43 people. Can’t prove me wrong!

 

[Robert.Walter]

You can’t force people to buy your products. When the product is free, you are the product and give up your security. Reminds me of the Ben Franklin quote paraphrased:

Those who give up liberty for security deserve neither.

The actual quote was much more nuanced:

Ben Franklin's Famous 'Liberty, Safety' Quote Lost Its Context In 21st Century

He once said: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." That quote often comes up in the context of new technology.

www.npr.org

 

[MacConvert07]

It’s a shame that we are having to rely on private companies to enact user privacy protections instead of having governments enact law in a timely manner to deal with this.

Be careful what you wish for. Laws/Governments, once entrenched, are notoriously difficult to change, or remove. They hardly innovate and have a history of being glacially slow to respond to criticism. Private companies, on the other hand, come and go all the time and we, the public, exercise an amazing amount of control over them with our dollars. There are times when government oversight is necessary, but I can’t say I trust the government to protect my rights and privacy MORE under the circumstances. To me, my dollar often seems more powerful than my vote.

 

[Chaos215bar2]

Cohen said "while there are no shortage of extremists attacking our industry from the outside, there are some attacking it from the inside out…"

It's kind of hard to take anything Cohen says seriously after he calls anyone trying to stop the ad industry from tracking literally everything and anything they can legally get away with an "extremist".

I have some words for people like Cohen, but I'll spare the audience here. They're not especially kind.

 

[hooptyuber]

Google and Meta would find a way to rationalize harvesting your organs if they felt like it. I utterly loathe both companies. They are post-morality psychopaths in love with their money and power.

Apple at least has some incentive to preserve user privacy in its hardware/software “walled garden.” No, I don't particularly trust Apple either but I happily choose them over the likes of Google.

 

[Kulfon]

If it’s between Apple and Google/Facebook, my trust will go to Apple every time.

They are the same. Of you investigate, Apple is using your data illegal too.

None of these companies use our data "illegally," which is exactly the problem—the US doesn't have any data privacy laws.

But you're absolutely wrong that they're all the same. Apple is better by leaps and bounds.

In what sense is Apple better? I lead organizations that deal with Privacy in big goobal companies.

 

[I7guy]

They are the same. Of you investigate, Apple is using your data illegal too.

No they are not. (Since we’re just throwing around stuff without proof)

In what sense is Apple better? I lead organizations that deal with Privacy in big goobal companies.

So facts instead of hyperbole would be in order.

 

[d686546s]

Just because you have no issues with them using your data to feed you adverts about relevant apple products doesn't mean others feel the same way.

Either Apple/Tim Cook believes "Privacy is a fundamental human right" or they don't. When they carve out exceptions for themselves, then that (IMO) means they don't and it [privacy] is NOT one of their core values despite their claim it is.

I agree, but I think there has to be room for nuance in this debate. Again, I hate people tracking me and I really don't want any personalised recommendations unless I agree to it or there is a a really strong case that it improves the very product I'm using and I'm aware of it. An example of the latter might be Netflix, Apple, Spotify or whoever tracking my watching/listening habits to serve me stuff aligned with my taste. Fine as long as they don't sell it.

But Apple looking at data from Apple apps to serve me an ad for an Apple product is not the same as another company tracking my every move across the web to build a profile to sell ads to basically everyone.

I don't like either, and I would very much like to have control over how data about me is collected and used, but these are very different scenarios and they would interact with a fundamental right to privacy very differently.

 

[sw1tcher]

People often conflate privacy with security. Privacy is the handling of your PII and extended PII. That doesn’t mean because apple believes in privacy they should flush your information down the toilet. So I do t see where apple is hypocritical or there is a disconnect.

Your definition of privacy is different from mine (and the dictionary's) then.

Privacy: the state or condition of being free from being observed or disturbed by other people


If Apple collects data on me, even if it's anonymized, then I have no privacy... not the type of privacy Apple claims.

Legal - Apple Privacy Policy - Apple

www.apple.com

Personal Data Apple Collects from You

At Apple, we believe that you can have great products and great privacy. This means that we strive to collect only the personal data that we need.

Usage Data. Data about your activity on and use of our offerings, such as app launches within our services, including browsing history; search history; product interaction; crash data, performance and other diagnostic data; and other usage data

 

[jarman92]

Your definition of privacy is different from mine (and the dictionary's) then.

Privacy: the state or condition of being free from being observed or disturbed by other people


If Apple collects data on me, even if it's anonymized, then I have no privacy... not the type of privacy Apple claims.

Legal - Apple Privacy Policy - Apple

www.apple.com

Personal Data Apple Collects from You

At Apple, we believe that you can have great products and great privacy. This means that we strive to collect only the personal data that we need.

Usage Data. Data about your activity on and use of our offerings, such as app launches within our services, including browsing history; search history; product interaction; crash data, performance and other diagnostic data; and other usage data

Yeah, higher-order concepts often differ from their dictionary definitions. It doesn't take a deep thinker to open the OED and read some words.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

If Apple collects data on me, even if it's anonymized, then I have no privacy... not the type of privacy Apple claims.

No one on the internet typing words for other people to see is neither “free from being observed” (‘cause I’m observing it) and not “free from being disturbed by other people”. Towards that end, anyone that posts on the internet that privacy important to them? They’re attacking their own statement just by posting it.

 

[terrapinjess]

I hope AT&T sues IAB for use of “App Tracking Transparency (ATT)” and causing “brand confusion.”

 

[Kierkegaarden]

These days, it seems like allegations are cheap and proof is optional.

 

[rictus007]

Today: According to CNN: DOJ sues Google over its dominance in online advertising market…. So now we know why they shifting the attention to apple

 

[npmacuser5]

Ad tracking no different than wiretapping. Reality hundreds of times worse.