Apple adopting Merom (Core 2 Duo) Processors?

[daneoni]

I got a question ... is the MacBook & MBP batteries Li-Ion or Li-Polymer? If the former then what i want MOST in the MBP is Li-Polymer and really fold the polymers and compress them to get a higher density of energy for longer battery life.

> The next generation of the MBP I'd really like to see the Intel technology for sub display (not unlike that on flip cellphones) to display AudioCD or running app information on the display or AirPort Ex hotspots within range (SSID, Signal Strength, VoIP signals etc). I'd also like to see a higher resolution - that maintains the same or much higher focus and zoom+Auto Focus - iSight thats built in and somewhat rotable (maybe somehow in the sell without external finger control).

> Magnesium or some kind of Metal Polymer combination that is very resistance or displaces heat efficiently but absorbing enough heat for hours of DVD, Video editing on our laps without burning them. Something thats much like ceramic tiles and how they displace heat efficiently.

> Me ... I'll settle for minimum 256MB video memory for ALL MBP and the built to order 512; and built to order 128MB on the Mac Books.

Question why do the old G4 powermacs of 933mhz or lower STILL selling highly used for such a high price - their almost obsolute in their abilities compared to new hardware. as an example on another forum sight someone is trying to sell a Dual 1Ghz QuickSilver for $1000 1.5GB total memory capacity (not that its filled with that much). Isnt this ridiculous?

I dunno its just something about the G4's. I recently put my PowerBook up for sale and mid-sale i had bids up to £800+ but i cancelled the listing. I just love this machine.Yes its not a core duo but its very comfortable, doesnt run hot, sexy and has novelty and infact i find myself using this more than my BlackBook. I may just sell the BlackBook and get a new one when merom/santa clara chipsets start shipping or if a moderately priced MacPro and Display is released. For now the PowerBook and i remain friends.

 

[shawnce]

You know, considering that Sony has been able to cram a DL drive in something as tiny as the TX series (not to mention the SZ series), I'm not sure why Apple couldn't do something similar with the 15" MBP.

Why not compare the sizes?

If you look both MBP are 1" tall with the lid closed while the Sony TX series is 1.12" tall and the SZ is 1.5" tall (at the thickest... which is up near the drive area).

 

[Zadillo]

Because the TX is thicker than the MBP...at least in the area of the optical drive. (Sony likes to use the tapered design that's thinner toward front edge and thicker near the back edge...it's always looked weird to me.)

OK, that doesn't make sense to me though. The dimensions of the Sony TX series are 0.82"-1.12" thick, with the thick part being the back half of it (where the battery, etc. are).... the tapered design you mentioned.

But the optical drive is right in the front of it, so that would be in the area that is only 0.82" thin or so:

-Zadillo

 

[Zadillo]

Why not compare the sizes?

If you look both MBP are 1" tall with the lid closed while the Sony TX series is 1.12" tall and the SZ is 1.5" tall (at the thickest... which is up near the drive area).

That's not really true of the SZ series either. The SZ ranges from 0.9 to 1.33" or so, and the drive area is in the thin part of it at the front:

 

[jeff303]

i do not know the technical stuff, but i do know that if you had all 64-bit stuff, then it'd be a lot better than all 32-bit stuff. (i know i should use better termanology, but oh well)

Ummm, that's not so clear to me. The only thing 64-bit gives you is more addressable memory. Oh, and some operations (like adding two doubles or longs) would only take one cycle on the integer unit, instead of more. Yeah... that's about it.

 

[mav728]

Merom still aways off

I have heard the opposite of this. My source has said that Apple will most likely wait until the next product cycle until the merom will be put in apple computers. But this is his own guess, but he his very connected in the technology world.

 

[shawnce]

The only thing 64-bit gives you is more addressable memory. Oh, and some operations (like adding two doubles or longs) would only take one cycle on the integer unit, instead of more. Yeah... that's about it.

..and in the case of x86-64 (Intel and AMD) the 64 bit mode of operation allows the CPU to expose more registers for use at compile time (and few other improvements). This can improve optimizations that the compiler can make which can improve the performance of the application it builds.

Also the ability to do integer math using 64 bit wide registers with 64 bit wide functional unit can be a decent performance win for several types of tasks.

 

[shawnce]

That's not really true of the SZ series either. The SZ ranges from 0.9 to 1.33" or so, and the drive area is in the thin part of it at the front

with many things moved up into the thinker area.

If you can find the specs for the different drive mechanisms and compare them to the case designs you should find your answer (note the MBP uses a slot loading drive not a tray system).

 

[Bengt77]

New iMacs next Tuesday!

New iMacs next Tuesday. I'll take one if it comes with a Conroe, Apple, thank you. But of course, if that's too hot, a Merom would do fine, too. Unless it will still use that dull 667MHz FSB, of course. At least put in an X1800 in it. Oh, and 1GB of RAM. And, while you're at it, throw in a 24" display too. And get rid of the lower bevel of the 'display design'. All that, and I'm buying straight away. If it will come pre-loaded with Leopard and will have a universal BlueRay/HD DVD-burner built-in, that is.

🙄

But seriously, I'm soooo ready for a new iMac. This 800MHz G4 iMac is getting old. It works like a charm, still, and is plenty fast for most stuff, but it just doesn't feel right anymore. Also, I never had quite the relationship with it as with my old 233MHz G3 iMac. I WANT A NEW iMAC! AND I WANT IT NOW!

 

[twoodcc]

..and in the case of x86-64 (Intel and AMD) the 64 bit mode of operation allows the CPU to expose more registers for use at compile time (and few other improvements). This can improve optimizations that the compiler can make which can improve the performance of the application it builds.

Also the ability to do integer math using 64 bit wide registers with 64 bit wide functional unit can be a decent performance win for several types of tasks.

yeah, what he said 😛 i knew someone would back me up

 

[Mac Rules]

New iMacs next Tuesday. I'll take one if it comes with a Conroe, Apple, thank you. But of course, if that's too hot, a Merom would do fine, too. Unless it will still use that dull 667MHz FSB, of course. At least put in an X1800 in it. Oh, and 1GB of RAM. And, while you're at it, throw in a 24" display too. And get rid of the lower bevel of the 'display design'. All that, and I'm buying straight away. If it will come pre-loaded with Leopard and will have a universal BlueRay/HD DVD-burner built-in, that is.

🙄

But seriously, I'm soooo ready for a new iMac. This 800MHz G4 iMac is getting old. It works like a charm, still, and is plenty fast for most stuff, but it just doesn't feel right anymore. Also, I never had quite the relationship with it as with my old 233MHz G3 iMac. I WANT A NEW iMAC! AND I WANT IT NOW!

We can all hope! 😉

Cheers

 

[digitalbiker]

1 - This is nothing new, and Apple is just being honest...the PB 12 and 15 were famous leg toasters as well...the times of the cool G3 are over long ago.

2 - it's at least 3 hours...no similar PC notebook does that...and the G4 wasnt better either.

3 - more space, perhaps?

Well this depends upon which G4 PB you compare it to.

I have the last PB G4 revision 17 inch. It runs comforably cool and I easily get 5+ hours of battery life under normal use. I don't even use the power saving functions. I usually run my display brightness about 3/4 of the way up.

I play DVD movies quite often and I can play two back to back 2 hour movies before my batteries need recharging.

 

[AidenShaw]

Yes - both AMD 64 and Intel EM64T are 64 bit extensions to the 32 bit x86 processor.

From what I understand the registers are still 32 bit, but the chips have a 64 bit address space and more registers.

In 64-bit mode, the integer registers can be used as 8/16/32/64 bit wide integers (just like the PPC970).

Floating registers are 32-bit or 64-bit wide, on both 32-bit x86 and 64-bit x64. 64-bit floats have always been there in 32-bit x86.

No-one has the need for a truly 64 bit machine at this point - just machines that can address more RAM. The 4GB RAM limit on 32 bit processors is beginning to be an issue for pro users.

Considering that 32-bit x86 chips have been able to address 64 GiB of RAM for many years - if your statement is correct then there would be no need for x64 at all.

In other words, lots of people need 64-bit for the addressing PER PROCESS, not per system (processor) as you say. (Actually, there's no "per processor" limit - a 2-way can't address more RAM than a 1-way.)

 

[darrens]

Afterall it's just a couple lines of code. 😀

Shouldn't be much code - the Adobe apps are already cross platform so there shouldn't be many endian issues to sort out. It's just a matter of changing development environments to use XCode and re-testing.

Not simple, but not something that should take almost 2 years either.

 

[Bengt77]

We can all hope! 😉

Cheers

Yeah, that's probably what it will turn out to be: hope, rather than reality. But when an iMac comes out with any Core 2 Duo processor and Leopard pre-loaded, I'm buying. An updated graphics card is higly welcome, as is more standard RAM, but the processor and OS are most important to me. Too bad Leopard is still quite some time off...

Does anyone know, if a new OS comes out soon after the release of a new computer model/revision, how long that 'soon' may be for Apple to offer a free upgrade to that new OS to all buyers of that particular computer? (Is that still understandable English? Worse, is it still English?)

 

[CJM]

Don't look now but the current Intel iMac has a laptop/SFF chip and chipset in it it. 😱

:O *faints*

 

[darrens]

In other words, lots of people need 64-bit for the addressing PER PROCESS, not per system (processor) as you say. (Actually, there's no "per processor" limit - a 2-way can't address more RAM than a 1-way.)

Too true. I have a Win2k app I've been developing which could use more than 4GB RAM - in fact more than 2GB RAM (Win2k won't let a process use more than 2GB for various reasons).

Even with the 32 bit processors supporting more than 4GB RAM, does Windows support it? Microsoft has a habit of not supporting things unless "a lot" of people will use it.

I don't think any of the current intel Macs support more than 4GB anyway, so it's a bit academic for Macs right now. Hopefully for not much longer...

 

[Erasmus]

New iMacs next Tuesday. I'll take one if it comes with a Conroe, Apple, thank you. But of course, if that's too hot, a Merom would do fine, too. Unless it will still use that dull 667MHz FSB, of course. At least put in an X1800 in it. Oh, and 1GB of RAM. And, while you're at it, throw in a 24" display too. And get rid of the lower bevel of the 'display design'. All that, and I'm buying straight away. If it will come pre-loaded with Leopard and will have a universal BlueRay/HD DVD-burner built-in, that is.

🙄

But seriously, I'm soooo ready for a new iMac. This 800MHz G4 iMac is getting old. It works like a charm, still, and is plenty fast for most stuff, but it just doesn't feel right anymore. Also, I never had quite the relationship with it as with my old 233MHz G3 iMac. I WANT A NEW iMAC! AND I WANT IT NOW!

Sounds like someone wants an iMac Ultra! (Really final Propaganda)
We Apple customers want an iMac with at LEAST (preferrably >>) 2.4 Conroe, at least an X1800 with 512 MB (Which should be quite likely if the PMs (sorry MPs) get SLI), a 23" screen, which Apple should have plenty of from their Cinema D's, and more RAM slots than you can polk a 2Gb RAM stick at (Meaning >=4), with most of them filled.

All for under AU$4 Grand.

That should take care of all gamers, any professionals who require a reasonably portable Desktop with awesome power, and in fact, anyone else.

--------------------

MBPs do use Lithium Polymer batteries. It says so on the Apple MBP website. I'm sure the MBs do too.

--------------------

As an aside, is anyone else here as happy as I am that we will never see one of those evil "Pentium" chips in our precious Macs? Hooray, there will be no Pentium 5! (Unless they call the Conroe line Pentium, like they keep calling Core Duo "Centrino Duo", to my utmost annoyance. Isn't Centrino the "Budget" brand name?)

Death (Or severe overheating and frying) to all Pentiums!

--------------------

Anyone else here interested in an iMac Ultra?

Anyone else have an extreme and probably unwarranted hatred of the Pentium moniker?

 

[Bengt77]

Sounds like someone wants an iMac Ultra! (Really final Propaganda)

All for under AU$4 Grand.

Yay! I'll take one the minute it comes out! How much is one AU$ in €? Let's see... AU$4000 is about €2400. Sounds reasonable to me. But I'm all for stretching it a bit. Let's say €2100/AU$3530. That's €400 more expensive than the current top model, which is €400 more expensive than the low-end iMac. Seems logical to me, maybe not so reasonable, but reason is soooo overrated these days! 😀

Anyone else here interested in an iMac Ultra?

Anyone else have an extreme and probably unwarrented hatred of the Pentium moniker?

Yes! (And yes to c.q. about that Pentium name, too, by the way.)

 

[darrens]

(Unless they call the Conroe line Pentium, like they keep calling Core Duo "Centrino Duo", to my utmost annoyance. Isn't Centrino the "Budget" brand name?)

Centrino is the name of Intel's mobile platform - the chipset, wireless capabilities and a mobile processor - originally the Pentium M, but now its replacement, the Core Solo/Duo.

The budget name is Celeron.

 

[Erasmus]

Centrino is the name of Intel's mobile platform - the chipset, wireless capabilities and a mobile processor - originally the Pentium M, but now its replacement, the Core Solo/Duo.

The budget name is Celeron.

Ugh! Damn names that all sound the same...
How am I supposed to remember that?
Well, anyway, I find it annoying. It's called Core Duo, and companies should not change the name on a whim.

Another thing I find annoying is that places like Domayne, Harvey Norman, Dick Smiths, etc, never mention what graphics card is in their computer. Granted, they all no doubt have integrated GPUs, but I would think the graphics card is pretty much the second most expensive computer component. Don't some high end graphics cards price upwards of a grand? that's more than these damn computers cost!
No doubt the world keeps saying Macs are too expensive. A Mac is advertised in a magazine, but they never mention they have graphics cards in them worth many hundreds of dollars, and are instead compared to integrated graphics systems, which come out looking better (more RAM, bigger screen, bigger HDD, etc.)

At least Macs seem to win out in Graphics and CPU speed.

End of Grump.

 

[digitalbiker]

Adobe addressed this already

Shouldn't be much code - the Adobe apps are already cross platform so there shouldn't be many endian issues to sort out. It's just a matter of changing development environments to use XCode and re-testing.

Not simple, but not something that should take almost 2 years either.

How many times does it have to be repeated? Adobe came out immediately after the Intel transition was announced that they would have an Apple UB version released simultaneously with the release of CS3.

They didn't want to slow development of CS3 for the Mac. CS2 was just released and a UB version would have taken significant effort for a very small market share. Since the only benefit would be to intel mac users which didn't even exist at the time.

Soon, probably first quarter 2007, a UB version of CS3 will appear about the sametime that the mac intel user base reaches a relavent market size.

The company that really deserves criticism is intuit. They recently released quicken 2007 and it was not UB. They were releasing a new product and they chose to ignore intel Mac users. Makes you wonder if they are going to stay in the mac market at all. Maybe in the future they will just recommend running parallel and windows, to use quicken on an intel mac.

 

[Multimedia]

Quicken 2007 Not Fast Enough In Rosetta?

The company that really deserves criticism is intuit. They recently released quicken 2007 and it was not UB. They were releasing a new product and they chose to ignore intel Mac users. Makes you wonder if they are going to stay in the mac market at all. Maybe in the future they will just recommend running parallel and windows, to use quicken on an intel mac.

That version of Quicken doesn't run fast enough in Rosetta? Seems like it would. 😕 😱

 

[WildCowboy]

That's not really true of the SZ series either. The SZ ranges from 0.9 to 1.33" or so, and the drive area is in the thin part of it at the front

Looking closer, I can immediately see how they squeeze it into both of these computers...the trackpad isn't in the center of the laptop. How freaking messed up is that? They slid it over the to the left so that the optical drive could fit. That would bug the heck out of me.

 

[Erasmus]

Looking closer, I can immediately see how they squeeze it into both of these computers...the trackpad isn't in the center of the laptop. How freaking messed up is that? They slid it over the to the left so that the optical drive could fit. That would bug the heck out of me.

And obviously the guy who decided to design it that way was a leftie...
It would be OK, if you could choose what side ou put the track pad and CD drive on. It would be OK if it was off centre to the right, as I'm right handed, but moving my right hand to the left side would no doubt feel wierd and awkward.