Apple and Google Strengthen Privacy of COVID-19 Exposure Notification System, Targeting Next Week for Beta Release

[mscice]

this is all coming together NWO.. mantidory vaccines are coming.. you will need the vaccine to go to work, shop or travel ... this is the bill gates plan ..

ID2020 | Digital Identity Alliance

The ID2020 Alliance is a global partnership maximizing the potential of digital ID to improve lives.

id2020.org

this vaccine will have a chip inside with your location, name, address etc ...

 

[Vjosullivan]

I love how people are willing to give up privacy on social media, by having a gmail account, or to avoid traffic, but not so much to avoid death, go figure...

Conspiracy theories have never required logical thought.

 

[szw-mapple fan]

Exposure notification ... new world order speech

Right.... how is this functionally different in terms of privacy and control from traffic data on maps?

 

[szw-mapple fan]

Its not either OR

USA is dumping every single death into the covid category now so the numbers climb but this BS will end soon hopefully...

European countries with severe restrictions are already recovering

More interestingly, European countries without any restrictions are also recovering - ie everything is just fine in Sweden, who did not participate in the media generated and government perpetuated lies about estimated death rates meant to scare everyone ********.
Restaurants were open the entire time, no mask order, nobody was locked up at home, people were told to wash their hands and be a little bit careful... no run on the hospitals happened, no ICUs were overwhelmed, basically nothing happened, everyone's just fine. Just like many virologists had predicted.


The virus is definitely novel but it's not particularly dangerous. More dangerous is the fear, and obviously the economic devastation. Fear lowers the immune response - this is a fact.

In any case, people are waking up to the scamdemic or plandemic, whichever you wanna see it. Turns out there's many interest groups which want to have people locked in their homes, politicians first and foremost, becasue on the one hand they can play little dictator and finally tell everyone what to do and no todo, while simultaneously looking like the rescuer of the nation! Wow - double bonus!

And then all those who say, um, hello, virologists have found more problems with the official story than can be named here, they are considered un-patriotic. And shamed for their lack of compassion. No, it's not lack of compassion, it's lack of stupidity.

Don't get fooled by the raw numbers. Sweden has a tiny population. It's cases per capita cases was easily in the top 20 and even now it is the 27th most infected country in the world and it is only testing for symptomatic cases.

That said, Sweden is more under control because they took it seriously early on and people started voluntary distancing early on. People trusted the government and the health system and did what they were supposed to do. The U.S. could have done just that, except the media downplayed the significance early on and chalked the lockdown in China as authoritarianism. The federal government was just as incompetent in informing the public and encouraging social distancing when it was still controllable. The virus is definitely not very dangerous to the vast majority of people, but that's not the point. It's deadly to many people who have pre-exisitng conditions or are elderly, especially when a large number of them overwhelm hospitals.

 

[lunarworks]

this is all coming together NWO.. mantidory vaccines are coming.. you will need the vaccine to go to work, shop or travel ... this is the bill gates plan ..

ID2020 | Digital Identity Alliance

The ID2020 Alliance is a global partnership maximizing the potential of digital ID to improve lives.

id2020.org

this vaccine will have a chip inside with your location, name, address etc ...

You guys have been talking about that NWO for like 50, 60 years now. For such a grand conspiracy they're sure taking their sweet damn time, lol.

 

[gnasher729]

What if you don’t have a mobile phone, are you going to be forced to purchase one for employment.

Most jobs are impossible to get if you don't have a mobile phone.

But if you have that problem, I'd say you post here and state that you don't have the money for a phone, and we'll start a collection for you. Obviously another requirement is that you state you know that lying about this would constitute fraud and would be a crime.
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Permit me to provide you an example. Let say this app provides you an “anonymous identifier” for sake of an example it is 19XYM05. Now let say you interact with another with an identifier 15CDR03. That “anonymous Identifier” becomes your ID and every cell phone region your cross, every wifi network you ping, every other person you come into contact with will be collected for this to work and for “them” to send you a notification.

Wrong from the start. 19XYM05 will be your identifier for five minutes, then the identifier changes. So does the 15CDR03. For this to work, every cell phone _that comes within a few meters of you_ will have its identifier recorded, which is valid for a whole of five minutes. Now your phone knows all the identifiers you used (nobody else), and the other phone knows all the identifiers they used (nobody else). If the other guy is infected, they press a button and send Apple a list of IDs they used. And your phone asks Apple if it was near anyone infected, and Apple says "Yes" or "No".

Nobody including Apple can do anything useful/nefarious with the data except telling you whether you were near a phone whose user pressed the "infected" button.

 

[gnasher729]

The German government wants Apple and Google to store all those randomly generated anonymous handles in a centralized government database for data mining purposes rather than distributing them across everybody's phones. France and the UK are having the same privacy failure. Apple and Google are thankfully pushing back and refusing to do so and refusing to make BLE available to any app even when it is not running.

Let's be generous and assume that these governments don't have experience how to implement something with privacy in mind, and they are suggesting a solution that would be obvious if you ignored privacy. And of course Apple and Google will give them what they need for this purpose, not what they want.
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What if you lend your phone to a friend who borrows it to make a phone call due to a dead battery on their own phone, then goes to an area for privacy and walks past someone infected. Does that inform the owner of the phone they must isolate or go to get tested while the friend who may be infect is unaware.

Let me just say that you seem to be completely ignorant of how a highly infectious disease works and needs to be fought.

In average every person infected infects X other persons. If that number X is greater than 1 then the disease spreads exponentially. If the number is equal to 1 then the number of diseased and the daily death rate stay constant. If the number is less than 1 then the number of diseased and the daily death rate go down every week.

This is one tool that helps to reduce the number X. X is the average over 330 million Americans, or 500 million Europeans. Your "what if" about a friend with a dead battery is completely irrelevant. And a second ago you were too poor to buy a phone, and now you lend it to your mates. Idiots who think some imagined threat to their privacy is more important than anyone's lives keep the number X higher and cost lives.

 

[glowplug]

Nobody including Apple can do anything useful/nefarious with the data except telling you whether you were near a phone whose user pressed the "infected" button.

Hypochondriacs with "infected" buttons. Sounds like a plan.

 

[ghanwani]

Had no idea they were intending to ignore all these aspects of privacy earlier. Now which aspects of privacy are they continuing to violate?

Apple and Google — I can understand your extreme desire to be of “help”. We don’t need you to save the world. The world would have and would continue to be fine even if you never existed.

 

[I7guy]

Had no idea they were intending to ignore all these aspects of privacy earlier. Now which aspects of privacy are they continuing to violate?

Apple and Google — I can understand your extreme desire to be of “help”. We don’t need you to save the world. The world would have and would continue to be fine even if you never existed.

The world isn’t fine and won’t be fine for a long while. And maybe the world needs this “Help” to get better.

 

[redbeard331]

It’s quite amazing how these forums have become so popular with conspiracy loons peddling dangerous mis-information, and Macrumors is totally ok with it.

 

[glowplug]

It’s quite amazing how these forums have become so popular with conspiracy loons peddling dangerous mis-information, and Macrumors is totally ok with it.

It’s quite amazing how people are willing to throw away privacy for some questionable contact tracing API. By all means install whichever apps you like, but don’t expect others to follow along out of fear.

 

[ix.heart]

This family will pass on this satanic technology cooperation. Pretty soon they will have us all comparing our blood type to T Hanks and any other BS they can think of to try and control society with their little made for depopulation experiment.

 

[cmaier]

when this thing goes live- there's going to be scores of people cowering in their homes for 14 day isolation stretches after they get ONE notification that someone they passed somewhere several days ago now is sick.

That'll keep people in their homes

Good. That’s the point. If you’ve potentially been exposed, you should either be (1) tested or (2) quarantine yourself for long enough that you can be sure you didn’t catch the disease.

Because otherwise, as you walk around, you have a good chance of getting someone else sick and potentially killing them.
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This family will pass on this satanic technology cooperation. Pretty soon they will have us all comparing our blood type to T Hanks and any other BS they can think of to try and control society with their little made for depopulation experiment.

This sounds like the sort of thing I hear weirdos in rural PA say about credit cards. “Number of the beast!”

People are stupid.
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It’s quite amazing how people are willing to throw away privacy for some questionable contact tracing API. By all means install whichever apps you like, but don’t expect others to follow along out of fear.

What privacy are you giving up, exactly? I’ve read the specifications, and from what I can gather, the only time you give up any privacy is that if you mark yourself as having caught the disease, your random number, which cannot be used to identify who you are and which no entity knows is you, is marked as having the disease in a database, and anyone else using the system who has information on their phone indicating that they’ve been near that random number, see a warning.

What is it I’m supposed to be concerned about here?
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Had no idea they were intending to ignore all these aspects of privacy earlier. Now which aspects of privacy are they continuing to violate?

Apple and Google — I can understand your extreme desire to be of “help”. We don’t need you to save the world. The world would have and would continue to be fine even if you never existed.

Try and imagine the shelter-in-place, with kids at home being remote schooled or being too young for that, with parents trying to work, and now try imagining that with MS-DOS 15.0 and blackberry technology instead of iPads.

I think the world would not have continued to be “fine.”

 

[ghanwani]

It’s quite amazing how people are willing to throw away privacy for some questionable contact tracing API. By all means install whichever apps you like, but don’t expect others to follow along out of fear.

Adding to what you said -- And what happens when the app is required by decree and you have to show an "all clear" from the app so you can enter a grocery store or a convenience store? What happens when the decree is influenced by these companies using their political influence? What happens when they use the learnings from this technology for other unintended uses in the future?
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Try and imagine the shelter-in-place, with kids at home being remote schooled or being too young for that, with parents trying to work, and now try imagining that with MS-DOS 15.0 and blackberry technology instead of iPads.

I think the world would not have continued to be “fine.”

These companies engage in monopolistic business practices, a side effect of our regulators being asleep at the wheel while we debate which color iPhone is the best looking. Without them we would likely have tons of better options instead of a choice of exactly two. By acquiring companies and building their empires, they have all but killed innovation. Do not for once think they are angelic in any way. If you do, you have likely been brainwashed by their PR.

 

[827538]

I believe you mean Sweden, aren’t you?

Lots of people here mention that when office/factories open employers will track you in the one or other way. Since Volkswagen e.g. opens it factories already since last week at least they don’t do such a thing. There are mask requirements in certain areas and temperature controls at the gates. That’s it.

You can see some photos and details here: https://www.volkswagen-newsroom.com...th-step-by-step-resumption-of-production-5961

No I was specifically referring to Switzerland, but I guess Sweden is taking a more pragmatic and measured approach too.

 

[cmaier]

Adding to what you said -- And what happens when the app is required by decree and you have to show an "all clear" from the app so you can enter a grocery store or a convenience store? What happens when the decree is influenced by these companies using their political influence? What happens when they use the learnings from this technology for other unintended uses in the future?
[automerge]1587838343[/automerge]

These companies engage in monopolistic business practices, a side effect of our regulators being asleep at the wheel while we debate which color iPhone is the best looking. Without them we would likely have tons of better options instead of a choice of exactly two. By acquiring companies and building their empires, they have all but killed innovation. Do not for once think they are angelic in any way. If you do, you have likely been brainwashed by their PR.

What happens when the genetically-engineered dog people created by the government rise up to Kill us all?

I mean, if you’re going to buy into nonsensical paranoid delusions, you may as well go all the way.

BTW: if you get a “you’ve been exposed” message, and you don’t get tested and instead of quarantining you go to a “grocery store or a convenience store” knowing that you may be infectious, you are an ******. So I really don’t mind if someone says I can‘t enter their property if the app says I have been exposed.

 

[glowplug]

What privacy are you giving up, exactly? I’ve read the specifications, and from what I can gather, the only time you give up any privacy is that if you mark yourself as having caught the disease, your random number, which cannot be used to identify who you are and which no entity knows is you, is marked as having the disease in a database, and anyone else using the system who has information on their phone indicating that they’ve been near that random number, see a warning.

I've read the specifications too, but quite simply I don't trust Google or Apple to implement this in a way that truly preserves privacy. Nor do I trust that their implementation would not be misused.

There has been little evidence, let alone research done to show contact tracing by phone is even useful. The whole thing is a knee-jerk reaction to "do something".

 

[ubersoldat]

No I was specifically referring to Switzerland, but I guess Sweden is taking a more pragmatic and measured approach too.

Do you have more details? I understood that they had also quite drastic measures. Friends of ours told us they were not allowed the leave Zurich (they were not under quarantine).

 

[I7guy]

....
There has been little evidence, let alone research done to show contact tracing by phone is even useful...

No research to show this is not useful either.

 

[code-m]

Most jobs are impossible to get if you don't have a mobile phone.

But if you have that problem, I'd say you post here and state that you don't have the money for a phone, and we'll start a collection for you. Obviously another requirement is that you state you know that lying about this would constitute fraud and would be a crime.

I hope you are not assuming that I am unable to afford one or more for that matter, this was an example of possible hinderances some may face due to income and age (e.g. not providing a child a phone). Way to jump on the lying and fraud bandwagon, you are lied to and cheated everyday may it be intentional or unintentional. Just because participation trophies are awarded that does not change the fact one team lost the competition or game.

Which job mandates a potential employee or a present to have a mobile phone? Are these employers also requiring a social media presence to monitor.

Wrong from the start. 19XYM05 will be your identifier for five minutes, then the identifier changes. So does the 15CDR03. For this to work, every cell phone _that comes within a few meters of you_ will have its identifier recorded, which is valid for a whole of five minutes. Now your phone knows all the identifiers you used (nobody else), and the other phone knows all the identifiers they used (nobody else). If the other guy is infected, they press a button and send Apple a list of IDs they used. And your phone asks Apple if it was near anyone infected, and Apple says "Yes" or "No".

Nobody including Apple can do anything useful/nefarious with the data except telling you whether you were near a phone whose user pressed the "infected" button.

Regardless if the identifiers change on your local device, the matter of fact remains that this information is sent to Apple/Google/XYZ agency to be processed and notified. At that end you are still identified regardless of the fuzzy feeling you get by believing the smokescreen of anonymized.

Apple has your AppleID, AppleCard or other credit card, purchasing and shipping info, DeviceID, etc. Marry that info with cellphone provider, wifi location of possible other Apple hardware such as HomePod/AppleTV, health provider due to wifi and cell pinging, social media account(s) and it’s not difficult to have a 70% or higher accurate picture of who you are. Plus with Wallet including digital drivers license, public transportation cards, loyalty card, etc you get the picture.

One can honey, sugar, chocolate, whatever coat a turd, at the end of the day it is a turd coated in whatever you prefer.

There was a DW documentary that demonstrates how “contact tracing” worked and one tourist in Hong Kong was alerted on his mobile of a potential contact with an effected individual and it provided that infected individuals age, home address, etc. This in my opinion is a breach of privacy.

Whatever you prefer to call it or justify the means, it is an ankle bracelet similar to the ones prisoners are provided when released on probation. If the location is misreported and it was a situation that occurred to another tourist in China, the police were at that individuals door within 15 mins to confirm quarantine procedures were followed.

So I ask do you prefer to live in a Nation where it is the “Land of the Free” or an authoritarian regime, make a choice because once it’s widely accepted there is no going back without a fight or if you want to experience it now, there is the option of a one way flight.

 

[chucker23n1]

Regardless if the identifiers change on your local device, the matter of fact remains that this information is sent to Apple/Google/XYZ agency to be processed and notified.

No it isn't. There is no server-side processing in Apple/Google's proposed system. The processing is on your device.

Apple has your AppleID, AppleCard or other credit card, purchasing and shipping info, DeviceID, etc. Marry that info with cellphone provider, wifi location of possible other Apple hardware such as HomePod/AppleTV, health provider due to wifi and cell pinging, social media account(s) and it’s not difficult to have a 70% or higher accurate picture of who you are. Plus with Wallet including digital drivers license, public transportation cards, loyalty card, etc you get the picture.

This entire paragraph is based on the prior false assumption.
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The Swiss once again showed a measured, sensible approach. Keep the vulnerable and sick isolated, introduce wide scale testing but not shut everything down. I'll say it again, we are so comfortable and soft in our modern lives that we have been completely unable to gauge risk correctly.

Not sure what you mean by "not shut everything down", given that they shut down schools, bars, shops, etc., and meetings over five people. I guess it's not literally everything, but it's far from your implication that only "the vulnerable and sick" (which… first of all, literally everyone is vulnerable to this, and second, many who are sick don't even know) have been isolated. Everyone has.

Switzerland does have a fairly good testing rate, though.

 

[cmaier]

I hope you are not assuming that I am unable to afford one or more for that matter, this was an example of possible hinderances some may face due to income and age (e.g. not providing a child a phone). Way to jump on the lying and fraud bandwagon, you are lied to and cheated everyday may it be intentional or unintentional. Just because participation trophies are awarded that does not change the fact one team lost the competition or game.

Which job mandates a potential employee or a present to have a mobile phone? Are these employers also requiring a social media presence to monitor.



Regardless if the identifiers change on your local device, the matter of fact remains that this information is sent to Apple/Google/XYZ agency to be processed and notified. At that end you are still identified regardless of the fuzzy feeling you get by believing the smokescreen of anonymized.

Apple has your AppleID, AppleCard or other credit card, purchasing and shipping info, DeviceID, etc. Marry that info with cellphone provider, wifi location of possible other Apple hardware such as HomePod/AppleTV, health provider due to wifi and cell pinging, social media account(s) and it’s not difficult to have a 70% or higher accurate picture of who you are. Plus with Wallet including digital drivers license, public transportation cards, loyalty card, etc you get the picture.

One can honey, sugar, chocolate, whatever coat a turd, at the end of the day it is a turd coated in whatever you prefer.

There was a DW documentary that demonstrates how “contact tracing” worked and one tourist in Hong Kong was alerted on his mobile of a potential contact with an effected individual and it provided that infected individuals age, home address, etc. This in my opinion is a breach of privacy.

Whatever you prefer to call it or justify the means, it is an ankle bracelet similar to the ones prisoners are provided when released on probation. If the location is misreported and it was a situation that occurred to another tourist in China, the police were at that individuals door within 15 mins to confirm quarantine procedures were followed.

So I ask do you prefer to live in a Nation where it is the “Land of the Free” or an authoritarian regime, make a choice because once it’s widely accepted there is no going back without a fight or if you want to experience it now, there is the option of a one way flight.

Your premise is wrong. The way it works is that your phone keeps track of randomized IDs of other phones that it sees as you move about. The information about what other IDs you have been near is kept on your own phone, and not sent anywhere. The information about who *you* have been near is kept on *those* phones, and not sent anywhere.

So each phone has a list of randomized identifiers, each meaning “you were next to a device using this identifier for some period of time up to a half hour.”

The only time any information leaves your device is if you go to a doctor, get tested, are found to have the disease, and then you voluntarily agree to have the randomized IDs you have used (they vary many times an hour), marked as “positive.” In that case, the next time your own phone checks the database to see if any of the devices it has come into contact with are marked positive, it sees that ID, and it gives you a warning notification.

 

[code-m]

No it isn't. There is no server-side processing in Apple/Google's proposed system. The processing is on your device.

Similar to AirDrop but cross platform. A medical professional has to enter this information, where locally on your phone and a central database or just your phone, is your phone going to be synced at your medical professionals office for any reason. If you upgrade your phone does this data sync to iCloud.

Big tech has issues releasing annual OS upgrades that are stable and we are to believe that this is going to be rock solid and airtight after what one months or less worth of coding.

Curious to see the outcome of the beta-test but still not interested, thanks.

This entire paragraph is based on the prior false assumption.

I suspect you do not work in this field. Pass granted.

 

[code-m]

Your premise is wrong. The way it works is that your phone keeps track of randomized IDs of other phones that it sees as you move about. The information about what other IDs you have been near is kept on your own phone, and not sent anywhere. The information about who *you* have been near is kept on *those* phones, and not sent anywhere.

If the app on your phone is collecting and storing random identifiers, is it not theoretically possible for hackers to collect and reverse engineer. There is order in chaos

So each phone has a list of randomized identifiers, each meaning “you were next to a device using this identifier for some period of time up to a half hour.”

Theoretically with a list of limited identifiers numbers randomized, one could process these to associate it to a particular device. Considering it is cycling through the list every interval.

For example one could have two devices with the app running and pinging each other over the course of a week and collect the list of random identifiers. If hacker communities have jail broken iOS and companies who sell their software to hack into iOS devices and even iOS Mail.app vulnerability anything is possible.

Imagine HVT being bombarded with false notification or people paid to approach them. Your daily routine is altered or disrupted as a HVT that could mean lost income and opportunities.

The only time any information leaves your device is if you go to a doctor, get tested, are found to have the disease, and then you voluntarily agree to have the randomized IDs you have used (they vary many times an hour), marked as “positive.” In that case, the next time your own phone checks the database to see if any of the devices it has come into contact with are marked positive, it sees that ID, and it gives you a warning notification.

What if your phone is erased, lost, stolen? If erased, when you go to your doctors office to reload your profile, is the information locally stored and if so that seems like a potential data breach or accident waiting to happen.

Please don’t misunderstand me, I am not attacking you. Chances are none of us know all the details, which is even more concerning because sensitive information is a goldmine to be exploited by entities. None of those two big tech giants have flawless data storage or software exploited track record's and there is more potential for harm then the fear of dying from a virus.