Apple Announces Ads Are Coming to Apple Maps

[frownface]

To be honest, I don't use apple maps often so it doesn't impact me directly; but i'm concerned that it's something where they'll continue to push the boundaries.

There are OS level ads within the settings app for their services like applecare and icloud; there are also pop up ads for their first party apps like fitness+, atv & music. There are ads within their news app, and of course ads in their app store. But the majority of these are apple advertising their own first party services.

With map changes they're getting deeper into third party ads, which like i said before already exist for the app store and news; but I think this is the first time they're advertising physical businesses within any of their first party apps. After we normalise it, there will be more.

 

[Lerxt]

There goes the only advantage Apple Maps had over Google Maps.

 

[SFjohn]

For all those people that were cheering about governments acting to lower the commission rate on apps for the Apple ecosystem, you won. It should come as no surprise that ads are what you get instead. 🤷

 

[freedomlinux]

I disagree on that Apple Maps to me at least been a nicer experience than Google Maps

Do they still tie in all the POI info and reviews from Yelp, for some inexplicable reason?

 

[MallardDuck]

I use Apple Maps, putting up with its inferior features, specifically because it was ad free. Now that they’re there, I might as well use a good mapping app.

 

[baconcat_8964]

iAd never left.

If Apple Map pushes advertisement like Google Maps, merchants pop out first when I zoom in, it will be so disappointing.

 

[goku_vegeta]

For all those people that were cheering about governments acting to lower the commission rate on apps for the Apple ecosystem, you won. It should come as no surprise that ads are what you get instead. 🤷

They would have done it anyway…

 

[steviewondercansee]

No it doesn't "scare me away", but I think it makes using the device less nice

That's fine. Apple and plenty of us can accept you thinking the device is less nice.

and is unnecessary given the vast amount of profit Apple makes.

Agree to disagree. Saying Apple makes a lot of profit doesn't mean complaints against Apple not being charitable enough to their users makes sense.

Apple has spent of time and energy explaining how they put user experience first, but here is a great example of that not being true.

Except you don't know where they're going with Apple Maps. Like I said, you're in the minority that thinks Apple Maps is in a great place. I and very likely Apple disagrees. If we want Apple to be at least on par with Google Maps (to put the user experience of using Maps first essentially), more investments need to be made.

So let's put ads in Apple Health! ("Your blood pressure is high, ask your doctor about this medicine!").

Apple Health is paid for in large part by Apple Watch and doesn't require nearly as much investment as Apple Maps.

Photos: "Adobe charges $120 a year for Lightroom/Photoshop,

Same as above

Messages: "iMessage servers don't pay for themselves! So enjoy these ads. We promise we aren't reading the content of your messages so it's ok!"

iMessage is paid for in large part by iCloud storage pricing.

Do you have thousands of people driving around cars or wearing specially equipped lidar sensors to map out the entire world every year, have 2 entire teams working on Maps software, with hundreds on staff adjusting the map data for thousands of map error reports a day? Nope. You have maybe dozens of engineers working on iMessage at most.

You've spent a couple of pages saying Apple "has" to charge for maps because Apple has lots of costs to support maps. In the App Store, Apple is getting $99 + 15/30% of sales. My point is that is more than enough to support the App Store without the addition of ads. The cost is already paid for, but they're still slapping ads on the top.

1. Ads solve an issue developers are asking for (they want their app exposure on top) which may be relevant based on what the user is searching for (which could be a good thing for users).
2. Again $99 hardly pays for app reviews to break even.
3. It's very easy to argue that App Store 15/30% can pay for a lot of things. Why not give us Apple Arcade for free for example? Or make Final Cut / Logic free on iPad/Mac. It's only a few dozen engineers that work on these apps so 15/30% *easily* covers that.

Just because a company can make $10 billion in profit doesn't mean the company should set aside $2-4 billion of that $10 billion for free things for the users because the user thinks the company is making too much money. They're already reinvesting where it makes sense.

 

[steviewondercansee]

Do you have a source for those presumed costs?

I didn't give any hard figures for cost, so not sure why you're asking for source. Do I have a source that it costs money to develop this service? Yes. See Apple jobs listings.

That sounds like an assumption

It was a job listing I applied for that said it was the team that handled Garageband and Logic. I don't know if that's still the case today (I applied over 10 years ago).

Yes it would be crazy, but to many it is also crazy to see Apple place ads in that product as it isn't the norm, or normally part of their culture.

Ads are in App Store. Ads are in Settings. Ads are in Apple TV. All other for profit mapping services have ads. It's pretty much the norm.

I thought you knew the costs of supporting the previously mentioned apps in comparison to the cost of Maps?

I never gave hard figures for cost, no. You thought wrong apparently.

I feel I made that clear.

It wasn't, unfortunately.

They had a maps program that was backed / sourced by google, which many people liked and reliably used. They decided to come up with a replacement that was (initially) fraught with problems.

They needed to provide features that the user wanted (turn by turn navigations for example). That required pushing Google Buzz/Latitude onto the user (Google's terms for including turn by turn directions at the time). That's way worse than ads. So they dropped it and built their own. Users were asking for turn by turn directions. You argued "we didn't ask for Apple Maps" but many have asked for turn by turn direections.

Valid, but like Maps, they chose to bundle those

To respond to user demand for turn by turn directions. I highly doubt you would accept Google Buzz/Latitude over Apple ads. If you do, then that's just where we will agree to disagree there.

 

[steviewondercansee]

Bu that’s exactly how it works,

Nope.

and exactly how their customer base thinks

It is unfortunately.

, and for good reason

Hard disagree.

- companies who have a massive net worth and a healthy income are inevitably seen as greedy when they pull stuff like this.

Seemingly, but not objectively.

If a company made $1 trillion in one quarter, and then makes $2 trillion next quarter, it *seems* greedy but in reality, Apple is just solving problems and making money off of solutions like it always has.

 

[steviewondercansee]

If you think Maps is a charity

Giving away free services would be a charity.

, you have no clue why Apple created maps, what the benefit is to them, or how their business even works

I'm well aware of how Apple avoided including Google Buzz/Latitude into their default map before Apple Maps because users wanted turn by turn directions. You have no idea what I know.

 

[Jetscreamer]

For all those people that were cheering about governments acting to lower the commission rate on apps for the Apple ecosystem, you won. It should come as no surprise that ads are what you get instead. 🤷

Is unbridled capitalism at work. ‘Murica, **** yeah!

 

[platinumaqua]

yay for paying a premium and not getting a premium experience anymore! (/sarcasm)

 

[steviewondercansee]

From the premium prices they charge for their hardware. That’s always how it worked.

I already mentioned they dedicate a portion of purchase price to Apple Maps

Now they are just being greedy.

Now they want Apple maps to be on par with Google Maps by increasing budget. Do you want iPhones to be $100 more expensive just to make Apple Maps better? I wouldn't.

 

[Zwhaler]

Suggested* places.

 

[01cowherd]

There are no privacy violations since no personal information tied to you went back to Carls Jr.

Here it how it works:

• Carl Jr provides and ad for Apple
• Carl jr asks Apple to show the ad to males over 30 years of age in California
• Apple, who mostly know who you are, shows this ad to people fitting the requirements
• Apple reports back to Carl Jr how many times the ad was shown and other statistics

No information about you went from Apple to Carl Jr, thus no privacy issue.

It's more the Apple users' attention which is the product, not Apple user's (personal) information.

Isn't this the same as Google's approach? Google does not sell your personal information either - they also use it to sell ads shown to you, based on groups you're in.

Ads are bad, and this significantly reduces Apple as a premium brand. And of course - not only is this bad by itself, but opens a really bad road ahead, when they want more ad revenue. Junk everywhere.

Yeah, basically no advertiser sells personal information. Not even Facebook, the poster child for privacy invasions. It's a huge cop-out. The main "advantage" that Apple has over Google or Facebook is that they don't have tracking pixels and scripts surveilling you across the entire web. Instead, they know every app you download, every book you buy, every song you play, every TV show you watch, ...

Does Facebook sell my information?
No, we don't sell your information. [...] We can show you ads without telling advertisers who you are. We allow advertisers to tell us things like their business goal, and the kind of audience they want to see their ads. For example, we can help advertisers reach an audience of people between the ages of 25 and 34.

Does Facebook sell my information? | Facebook Help Center

Facebook does not sell your information.

www.facebook.com

 

[zilchfox]

For all those people that were cheering about governments acting to lower the commission rate on apps for the Apple ecosystem, you won. It should come as no surprise that ads are what you get instead. 🤷

Maps have been part of iPhone since *DAY 1* in 2007, which predate the App Store. It didn't need ads back then, either.

Apple, this is a big step in the wrong direction.

 

[steviewondercansee]

There goes the only advantage Apple Maps had over Google Maps.

The only reason why that's the *only advantage* is because Apple Maps never had the same budget Google Maps has for investing into the platform. Maybe, just maybe, having "no ads" being the only advantage isn't something most users are looking for. "I'd sure love to get to my destination in the best way possible, but I'm willing to arrive at the wrong place because of no ads" is not something people generally say.

 

[steviewondercansee]

Maps have been part of iPhone since *DAY 1* in 2007, which predate the App Store. It didn't need ads back then, either.

Apple, this is a big step in the wrong direction.

Back then, Google was making money off of you. Back then, there were no turn by turn directions for the default Maps app. Back then, Google required Apple to incorporate their social media app right into the default maps app if Apple wanted turn by turn directions, so Apple said no and they had to build their own.

 

[Martin Bland]

There are ads in app store. How is it different than that?

The App Store is a... store. Maps is not. It's a tool that should work in my best interest when I use it for navigation. Not lead me astray in the interest of an advertiser so that Apple can make a penny.

 

[eifelbube]

So?
It’s been in the name:
What do you get when you spell “Maps” backwards?

/s

 

[maxoakland]

Giving away free services would be a charity.

So Apple has been running a charity for a decade?

I'm well aware of how Apple avoided including Google Buzz/Latitude into their default map before Apple Maps because users wanted turn by turn directions. You have no idea what I know.

So then I’m sure know that Apple Maps prevents Google from controlling the map service, and that Apple directly benefits from its users not using Google for maps, which makes your charity argument nonsensical. So if you knew that, why’d you make a nonsense argument?

 

[maxoakland]

Yup.
Once one gets a taste of the juicy AD revenue, the only thought is "how do we get more of it!??".

It's like introducing someone to crack.

You said it. It’s like ******tification accelerant. Look at Microsoft. Look at the way Apple started with reserved notifications for its own products and now it nags you nonstop

This doesn’t bode well if users don’t talk back and make them change course due to outcry

 

[steviewondercansee]

So Apple has been running a charity for a decade?

No. See below.

So then I’m sure know that Apple Maps prevents Google from controlling the map service, and that Apple directly benefits from its users not using Google for maps

Getting directions wrong in Apple Maps practically forces users to use Google Maps. How do you fix that? Investing more into Apple Maps. How do you pay for that? Certainly not charging $$$ / year just for Maps on top of portion of device cost currently paying for Apple Maps service.

, which makes your charity argument nonsensical. So if you knew that, why’d you make a nonsense argument?

It's odd that you would ask the question "has Apple been running a charity" and then proceed to make statements under the assumption that I said Apple has been running a charity for Maps (which I didn't) and then ask questions based on that erroneous assumption. Even worse is I already said running a service as a charity is "not how it works" so why did you even bother following up with that ridiculous question? Nonsensical.

Perhaps ask the question and wait for my response before doing that.

 

[steviewondercansee]

Yup.
Once one gets a taste of the juicy AD revenue, the only thought is "how do we get more of it!??".

It's like introducing someone to crack.

Seems like someone forgot about iAd during Steve Jobs era.