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And shame on all the people on here who say that people are destined to remain in the same class they were born into. Everyone in this country has the ability to excel. I doubt all these Apple execs were born to "rich" parents, but they're doing just fine now. Look at most immigrant families sacrificing their generation just so their child can get a U.S. education.

Joke post?

Nobody said that everyone is destined to be in the same class in which they are born. Your post reeks of naivety. Not everyone in this country has the ability to excel. People are born with different strengths and weaknesses (biological mutations, etc), and some are just not smart enough to create vast wealth for themselves. They are destined to live paycheck to paycheck - working for someone else. I believe I already said this earlier: Most people will remain in the economic class they are born into for their entire lives.

A more defensible position for you would be to say that the country provides ample opportunity for those with the skills, initiative and ambition to succeed (with appropriate connections). Notice, not only do you have to have the innate skills, you have to recognize and take advantage of the opportunities that present themselves, or rather, go after the opportunities.

And the point you raise about Apple execs is a statistical fallacy. You completely ignore the vast majority (thousands) of engineers that graduate from MIT, Stanford, U Penn, etc, who fail to find decent employment, and the many thousands more who do find employment but never make it to the upper echelons of wealth. Think of it like evolution, we can all look at the vast amount of extant species we are familiar with and think "Wow, there are so many species, it's probably fairly easy to survive and create offspring". Yet when you look at each species individually and follow their ancestors back through time, you realize that there were hundreds of thousands of cousins of that extant species that went extinct through the ages. Only a very small minority actually survived to pass on their genes, even though all technically could.
 
No, that is exactly what this is about. The high numbers are to prevent that.

You may not think that an executive is worth $60 million, but Apple does.

They don't have to publicly file SEC reports for increasing iOS engineer wages, so you can't know they didn't.

Let me ask you this, if you are really a shareholder. Are these 7 executives worth $0.45 in Apple's stock price? If they all left, would Apple's stock drop more or less than $0.45 per share? $0.45 a share is about what it is costing Apple to pay out these bonuses.

Look, I'm not saying that anyone deserves $60 million. I'm just saying that's what they are worth to Apple. Note the distinction.

arn

Come on arn. You've been around long enough to know that logic has no place with some people.
 
Look, I'm not saying that anyone deserves $60 million. I'm just saying that's what they are worth to Apple. Note the distinction.

arn


Do you think these individuals would seriously put their loyalty to one side if they were offered $80 million by a competitor in a similar retention deal and they weren't tied into a 5 year contract with Apple?

Makes you wonder, after all the heartache and sorrow during Jobs' passing, could they really be that callous and just turn their backs on what was such a big part of their lives as well as being the legacy of a 'visionary' co-worker? All for what? A few more million? Jobs left the company to these people so I doubt they'll be thinking of screwing it over.

I know the whole Jony moving to GB story was a bit of a damp squib, but if he's seriously considering moving back home at some point in his life he should spend the next 5 or so years building a rock solid team of designers there at Apple HQ. Oh, and fire whoever designed the iPod Nano.
 
Do you think these individuals would seriously put their loyalty to one side if they were offered $80 million by a competitor in a similar retention deal and they weren't tied into a 5 year contract with Apple?

No, I think $80 million vs $60 million probably isn't enough if they love their jobs. But that's not the question, is it?

If Apple didn't offer these bonuses, the question would have been a $10 million or $20 million offer vs $0 for staying. These bonuses have essentially taken the money off the table in any competitive recruitment process.

arn
 
Smart move by Apple. With the loss of Steve Jobs it is more important then ever they keep as many of their key people around for as long as possible.

I still worry what happens when their current cycle of products ends in a few years. Who is going to be the visionary who sees the future when nobody else can? That is going to be when Steve Job's loss is felt at Apple and to apple customers.
 
This is ridicoulius, I understand where arn is coming from and the point he is making BUT if all these apple managaments love apple as much as they claim to, and love where they work and blah blah blah there SIMPLY ISNT any other choice in terms of competition on where to go.

They constantly rant about how the culture is ingrained in them and proud of what they do with their peers, so essiently if apple paid a top brass 10 million a year, and google or microshit offered 20 million per year, one reasonable person would expect them to turn down the offers and stay at apple.

Anyone who would jumpo ship is not someone i would like in my company. This pay out of shares with this much value is totally the wrong way to go about keeping the top folks.

Its ridicoulsy obscene and i dont doubt jobs would be turning in his grave seeing how easy board allowed this money whoring come into effect.
I would imagine if steve was around and anyone demanded that much money he would have told them to **** off.
 
I think it's a ridiculous sum of money to be paid out to people who are essentially just doing their jobs.

And they'd get more if they went elsewhere to be CEOs in their own right. Apple has good broad leadership and it is fair to compensate them according to market rates. You can gripe about free market economy but you either believe in it or you don't. There is no such thing as being a little bit pregnant
 
Apple share holders that are mad can voice their own opinion on the boards decision by voting in the next annual meeting. You know that proxy voting packet you get in the mail that you instantly throw away?

You can vote these people out. To bad you will be in the minority of shareholders. Instead, the majority will be too busy figuring out what to do with a 400% appreciation in their stock value over the last 5 years.
 
god. not you people again.

first, i think Apple makes great products. Steve's vision has changed the world, and I hope Apple can continue to create great products. BUT - this is an example of exactly what the OWS protests are about. And I support them completely, even though I'm probably in the 3%.

These types of payouts are obscene, whether it's our beloved Apple or the evil Goldman Sachs. I agree that the execs work hard and help Apple be successful. The point is, they don't contribute 20,000 times as much as the factory workers putting together iPhones. Or 1,000 times as much as a mechanical engineer or software engineer. This is the out-of-control theft of the people's labor for the benefit of the elite that we have been trying to bring to light.

It's disgusting. And it has nothing to do with all the disinformation and propaganda seeking to discredit OWS (e.g. that the protesters don't want to work, want handouts, are uneducated, or are "mad" at the rich.) We are mostly mad at their enablers like you who defend the very people who are raping the world of its natural and human resources to satisy their own avarice. (Granted, there are degrees of guilt - oil companies do more to destroy the environment, clothing companies exploit cheap labor more, etc. But any time a company is benefiting from the labor of thousands of employees and redistributing the spoils of their work as hundreds of millions of dollars in bonuses to executives, there is a perversion of society)

This belies a fundamental lack of understanding of how businesses work and what makes them successful. You think there is some kind of fold scale to balance out the factory worker versus the CEO. I am not a big fan of ridiculous CEO salaries, but I am all for performance based payments.

I also know that without the proper management the business would not exist and would be making no money and none of those people would have jobs.

Does the factory worker have to deal with the pressures of being responsible for the livelyhoods of 1000s and 10000s of thousands of people? Only someone who has never born the responsibility of operating a business could be so cavalier in their attitude about such things. The engineers are in the best position, they make the most money versus responsibility of anyone. Every company has a similar tier of employees.

Do you think Apple became the biggest market cap company in the world because of their factory workers? It is insulting and ignorant and your bleeding heart is getting all over my linen.

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I think it's a ridiculous sum of money to be paid out to people who are essentially just doing their jobs.

People who do their jobs really well get rewarded for it.
 
If this isn't a sign that Johnny Ive is leaving, then nothing is. As Steve's "spiritual partner" at Apple, it seems that without Steve, Johnny will not go on. Akkhh, the truth hurts.
 
If this isn't a sign that Johnny Ive is leaving, then nothing is. As Steve's "spiritual partner" at Apple, it seems that without Steve, Johnny will not go on. Akkhh, the truth hurts.

God you people are dull

There were only two people from Apple’s senior leadership team for whom Apple did not disclose stock grants on Friday. One is Jonathan Ive, the company’s senior vice president for industrial design, whose position at the company does not trigger S.E.C. rules requiring public disclosure of stock awards.

The other person is chief executive Timothy D. Cook.
 
Before I even clicked on this thread I knew right away that there would be a smattering of whining and complaints about executive salaries, etc.. here's what I don't get.

Why are people so angry with this? Apple is taking money out of its profits and paying its executives. Why aren't you people angry instead, with the government? They take OUR tax money and waste it. I don't get the whole OWS protests either.. yes, Wall St is bad.. but who's worse? Isn't the government worse for accepting bribes, donations, etc?

As things get worse, it's sad to see the poor/middle class direct their anger towards the rich. I'm middle class but I have no problems with a CEO being paid overly large amounts of money *if* they are doing a good job.
 
Appalling toughing by the 1%. What bonuses are the rank and file going to get? How about the Foxxcon workers? Perhaps Apple could fund a suicide hotline for them?

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As things get worse, it's sad to see the poor/middle class direct their anger towards the rich. I'm middle class but I have no problems with a CEO being paid overly large amounts of money *if* they are doing a good job.

That's just the thing. If they do a bad job they'll usually have a contract that gives them a lottery win if fired.

Plus the poor and the middle class are being trampled into the mud - the cost of living, the cost of an education, the cost of housing and insurance, the need to pay more and more for things that used to be free. That's what top execs at companies that sell beautiful but ultimately expensive and futile tat should be worried about - Henry Ford new that unless business people paid their workers well the market for their products could never grow.
 
In Germany typical CEO pay ranges from around 30 times to 100 times the salary of a typical worker in the business.

Imagine a poor working person. They may have a roof over their heads. Clothes. A TV. Probably a laptop these days. In the US they may own a beat-up car.

Now imagine someone with twice as much. More mod cons, better accommodation, better car, better diet, etc.

Imagine someone with three times as much. Then four times as much. Then five times as much.

When you get to 30 times as much the person is ridiculously richer than a poor person.

So thousands of times better paid than typical worker?

Huh?

I guess this kinda worked when the middle class wasn't shrinking and getting poorer, when offshoring wasn't so much of a factor, when the rich were less lightly taxed, and so on. But they'd better watch out - either people won't be able to buy all the crap a consumer economy demands or, worse, they'll deal with the 1% like Gaddafi or Ceaușescu.
 
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Hmmm, trouble brewing at Apple? I fear some are wanting to jump ship or something. And this reward is a 'blessing of sorts'.
 
Not true. U.S. workers are getting progressively "poorer" and the disparity between the working class and the elite continues to expand. From Kiplinger.........

You're my freakin hero! Well said, well said indeed. To bad you probably won't even come close to touching some of the people here arguing against your stance.
Funny part are the one's defending the system that is set up to screw them.

So are you the one who decides what they deserve? In your infinite wisdom, you can let us in on what a reasonable "modest" bonus is?
Suppose someone else thinks they do deserve whatever amount it is that they are compensated? You're right, and they're wrong?
This forum is loaded with people with divine knowledge. I'm seriously impressed.

I'm just a guy stating his opinion. Any company is obviously able to pay their people what ever they want..... but why pay these people this insane amount of money? Don't you think giving them a much smaller (yet a large sum to "normal" people) bonus and then spreading the rest amongst the other workers would be better for all involved? Just a thought.
 
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If I offered you $10 million to leave your job, and join my company, would you?
You shouldn't have that $10 million to offer, just like Apple shouldn't have $60 million to offer these 7. That's the entire point.
 
Plus the poor and the middle class are being trampled into the mud - the cost of living, the cost of an education, the cost of housing and insurance, the need to pay more and more for things that used to be free. That's what top execs at companies that sell beautiful but ultimately expensive and futile tat should be worried about - Henry Ford new that unless business people paid their workers well the market for their products could never grow.

So shouldn't people protest against healthcare companies, insurance companies, colleges, etc for these obscene costs? An iMac at $2000 seems pretty reasonable if you compare it to a MRI which costs the same on an average.. and yet the same MRI costs $200 in India (same scanner, equipment, etc) So why such a huge disparity in costs? Why is it $40,000+ for a year of college (Mba)?

Healthcare should be cheap enough that there wouldn't be any need for health insurance. I never heard of anyone going bankrupt because of health costs until I moved to this country. It's insane.. and yet, people seem to vent their fury towards companies that make luxury goods or non-essential items, when in reality they should be targetting the essential services sector.

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You're my freakin hero! Well said, well said indeed. To bad you probably won't even come close to touching some of the people here arguing against your stance.
Funny part are the one's defending the system that is set up to screw them.

Workers are not getting poorer because their salary is reducing. Heck, people in this country get paid a LOT, and have a lot of benefits compared to other countries.

The problem is, that people are fleeced by the government and by basic services (as I mentioned in my previous post) which is why they are getting 'poorer'.
 
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