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The Founding Fathers were in many ways far more influenced by Greek and Roman forms of government than anything having to do with christianity... since christian form of government is a celestial dictatorship controlled by fear masquerading as 'love'.
Interestingly, North American colonialization by Europeans was actuated by two primary motivations: 1) economic expansion by companies such as the Hudson Bay Company, and 2) to escape from religiously dominated European governmental control. The three primary colonial powers of the 17th and 18th centuries were wed to organized religious authorities. The British by the Church of England, and the French and Spanish by Catholicism. The Spanish were equally motivated by economic and religious expansion, explaining why most of Central and South America is Catholic and speaks Spanish. The French were predominantly economically motivated, establishing the fur trade and the French language in Canada. The French became largely secular after the French Revolution. The British were both economically and religiously motivated, explaining why most of the U.S.A. is predominantly protestant and speaks English. A primary push by the "founding Fathers" in composing the Constitution was in emphasizing freedom of religion and non-interference by the government in religious affairs (one consequence is that churches and religious organizations are not taxed). The idea that the U.S.A. was founded on "Christian values" is fairly unfounded, and it is only in the 20th century that religion began to assert itself into governmental dealings. An example: it wasn't until 1956 that "E Pluribus Unum" was replaced with "In God We Trust" on U.S. currency. Sorry, TL;DR. Happy <your favorite word goes here>!
 
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Tim Cook wasn't saying it to "somebody," he was saying it to "everybody."

There's a difference when speaking to an individual and a group.

Saying "Merry Christmas" to a group, excludes non-Christians from the message, while saying "Happy Holidays" includes everyone.

I'm willing to bet that in person, Tim Cook wishes "Happy Hanukkah" or "Merry Christmas" to personal acquaintances when appropriate.

The converse of claiming "Happy Holidays" is a war on Christians would be to claim that saying "Merry Christmas" is a war on Muslims, Jews, and non believers.
The tolerance of religions :rolleyes:
 
How about wishing people simply: "Happy Holidays and a Merry Christmas."
Isn't Christmas originally a Christian holiday; what's wrong in acknowledging it? In my family we celebrate
both Hanukkah and Christmas as I guess many others do too. I don't understand why people get so spazzed out
over this stuff. Why is expressing Peace on Earth and Goodwill to All a crime nowadays? That's what Christmas is about, that and presents. Oh the horror of it all...
That’s exactly what Tim Cook did on Twitter last Christmas Day https://twitter.com/tim_cook/status/945302021648793600?s=20
 
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How does any of this make sense?

Tim Cook has been working in tech longer than you have been posting silly nonsense to be frank,
Are you always pointing out different opinions as silly nonsense? I always try to be respectful and try to argue with facts. If I don’t agree, I try to ignore instead of telling you most of your posts are nonsense.
 
Saying the US is a Christian nation is not correct (at least not literally in the sense of other theocracies), but the US certainly is founded on Christian values. You may say it's founded on values of enlightenment, but they are in their own right heavily influenced by Christian ideals. Same goes for most Western civilizations. I think nothing is won by relativizing those roots and pretending like we were just lucky that liberalism fell into our laps. It didn't just magically appear, it came a long way.
If you think the US is based on Christian values, you should compare the first Commandment and the first Amendment.
 
Tim Cook wasn't saying it to "somebody," he was saying it to "everybody."

There's a difference when speaking to an individual and a group.

Saying "Merry Christmas" to a group, excludes non-Christians from the message, while saying "Happy Holidays" includes everyone.

I'm willing to bet that in person, Tim Cook wishes "Happy Hanukkah" or "Merry Christmas" to personal acquaintances when appropriate.

The converse of claiming "Happy Holidays" is a war on Christians would be to claim that saying "Merry Christmas" is a war on Muslims, Jews, and non believers.
A lot of the people here who get upset about this seem to have a difficulty differentiating messages to themselves from messages the group. They process everything as a message to them. That also explains why they become so enraged when Apple includes a new product feature that they personally dislike or will never use.

"New emoji? I'M never going to use this? Why are you forcing it on ME?"
 
A lot of the people here who get upset about this seem to have a difficulty differentiating messages to themselves from messages the group. They process everything as a message to them. That also explains why they become so enraged when Apple includes a new product feature that they personally dislike or will never use.

"New emoji? I'M never going to use this? Why are you forcing it on ME?"
Yep. Same came from people who don't use wired headphones. Get rid of the jack. I don't need it so you don't either.
 
Interestingly, North American colonialization by Europeans was actuated by two primary motivations: 1) economic expansion by companies such as the Hudson Bay Company, and 2) to escape from religiously dominated European governmental control. The three primary colonial powers of the 17th and 18th centuries were wed to organized religious authorities. The British by the Church of England, and the French and Spanish by Catholicism. The Spanish were equally motivated by economic and religious expansion, explaining why most of Central and South America is Catholic and speaks Spanish. The French were predominantly economically motivated, establishing the fur trade and the French language in Canada. The French became largely secular after the French Revolution. The British were both economically and religiously motivated, explaining why most of the U.S.A. is predominantly protestant and speaks English. A primary push by the "founding Fathers" in composing the Constitution was in emphasizing freedom of religion and non-interference by the government in religious affairs (one consequence is that churches and religious organizations are not taxed). The idea that the U.S.A. was founded on "Christian values" is fairly unfounded, and it is only in the 20th century that religion began to assert itself into governmental dealings. An example: it wasn't until 1956 that "E Pluribus Unum" was replaced with "In God We Trust" on U.S. currency. Sorry, TL;DR. Happy <your favorite word goes here>!

A few things:

A) It's both freedom of religion AND from religion, which is why the US Constitution (Article VI, Clause 3) reads: "but no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States."

B) The Puritans 'escaped' England not because they wanted religious freedom due to persecution, but because they were trying to impose their religious thinking onto others and were driven from England. When they arrived in the new world, they continued trying to force their religion down everyone else's throats.
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Yep. Same came from people who don't use wired headphones. Get rid of the jack. I don't need it so you don't either.

Bingo. I always want to point them to the Steve Jobs video where he is saying 'we are all about choice at Apple'. Also, BT headphones NEVER sound as good as wired, period. Wired everything: electricity, headphones, hardware, etc, etc, etc... is always superior to wireless.
 
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A few things:

A) It's both freedom of religion AND from religion, which is why the US Constitution (Article VI, Clause 3) reads: "but no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States."

B) The Puritans 'escaped' England not because they wanted religious freedom due to persecution, but because they were trying to impose their religious thinking onto others and were driven from England. When they arrived in the new world, they continued trying to force their religion down everyone else's throats.
Yes, good point - that tradition has remained among the fundamentalist inclined Christian sects. Regardless of the proselytizing various religious sects pursue, the main point is that the Constitution was intended to prevent governmental interference and favor with or for any particular sect, with a concurrent duty to protect citizens from religious persecution by various of those sects. I don't doubt that the original authors of the Constitution faced a lot of resistance to those intentions. The document still remains under attack by the same forces, either directly or through selective interpretation.
 
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Actually no there wasn't and never has been.

Facts. Matter.

http://www.uscourts.gov/about-feder...ational-activities/first-amendment-activities

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press, or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for redress of grievances."

~First Amendment, U.S. Constitution

And for clarification, so there are no misinterpretations:

"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties."

~Th. Jefferson (Letter to the Danbury Baptist Association, January 1, 1802)

https://www.loc.gov/loc/lcib/9806/danbury.html
 
Nothing.

But also nothing wrong with not mentioning it.

"SJW" is a thing of the past cos now we have "ACMW".

Just as bad only 20 time more boring.
I thought and I could be mistaken but wasn't Christmas originally a Pagan Holiday? A winter solstice celebration or something.
 
I thought and I could be mistaken but wasn't Christmas originally a Pagan Holiday? A winter solstice celebration or something.
You are correct. Many cultures celebrated the winter solstice. Friends, family, community all getting together on the shortest day of the year, bringing light into the darkness. It was the perfect occasion to drop the birth of your messiah into if you wanted to convert a continent.

Then there's Easter, named after the old Germanic goddess Ēostre (the etymological root of the word estrogen), which falls around the spring equinox. A celebration of the world coming back to life after the harsh winter, complete with images of fertility like eggs and rabbits. A perfect occasion to drop the rebirth of your messiah into.

Also, it's no coincidence Christianity never goes into detail about these occasions being the solstice and equinox. The idea was to erase the pagan idea and replace it with a Christian one. Ever wonder why 13 is such a reviled number? Because there's 52 weeks of the year... divided into 4 seasons of 13 weeks. 13 was an important pagan number, and our modern deck of playing cards (4 houses of 10 numbered cards and 3 face cards) was developed specificallly to disguise pagan rituals, like tarot.

There's a whole lot to unpack in what the bible demonizes.
 
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Once you get beyond the Daily Mail hysteria, in most cases it's members of the majority who actually make these patronising decisions for fear of offending a minority based on no significant evidence, yet the minority then suffers the backlash. As a Muslim guy I used to work with once told me: "I have no problem with Christmas, Easter, whatever. What does annoy me is when people decide on my behalf what offends me. It's as if they feel I'm incapable of having my own opinion or ability to voice it".

Yeap, the minority of the minority or minority of the majority that speak for everyone, apparently. But sometimes it’s those minority’s who shout loudest and ruin it for the majority they claim to represent, because they are deemed to all think the same way then..

Was just about to post the same thing. Why is a holiday party a “rumour” or even newsworthy.

Great, they had a party...

Would appear I woke up on the salty side of my bed. Lol

I know right? I think I got out the wrong side too lol..
 
You know Jews make up about 1.5% of the country while Christians make up about 75%, right?

Incredible how it's come to a point that the vast majority has to bend over for a select few.

Who's bending over? Incredible how people get so easily offended these days. Do you also right angry letters to Starbucks?
 
It's gotten to the point where the 'Due to the political nature of the discussion regarding this topic...' disclaimer needs to be included on pretty much every article on this website. #ClownWorld
 
Facts. Matter.

http://www.uscourts.gov/about-feder...ational-activities/first-amendment-activities

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press, or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for redress of grievances."

~First Amendment, U.S. Constitution

And for clarification, so there are no misinterpretations:

"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties."

~Th. Jefferson (Letter to the Danbury Baptist Association, January 1, 1802)

https://www.loc.gov/loc/lcib/9806/danbury.html
Nice misquote but as you said fact matter. There is no separation of Church & State and never has been. Read that 1A again and get back to me when you figure it out.
 
Interestingly, North American colonialization by Europeans was actuated by two primary motivations: 1) economic expansion by companies such as the Hudson Bay Company, and 2) to escape from religiously dominated European governmental control. The three primary colonial powers of the 17th and 18th centuries were wed to organized religious authorities. The British by the Church of England, and the French and Spanish by Catholicism. The Spanish were equally motivated by economic and religious expansion, explaining why most of Central and South America is Catholic and speaks Spanish. The French were predominantly economically motivated, establishing the fur trade and the French language in Canada. The French became largely secular after the French Revolution. The British were both economically and religiously motivated, explaining why most of the U.S.A. is predominantly protestant and speaks English. A primary push by the "founding Fathers" in composing the Constitution was in emphasizing freedom of religion and non-interference by the government in religious affairs (one consequence is that churches and religious organizations are not taxed). The idea that the U.S.A. was founded on "Christian values" is fairly unfounded, and it is only in the 20th century that religion began to assert itself into governmental dealings. An example: it wasn't until 1956 that "E Pluribus Unum" was replaced with "In God We Trust" on U.S. currency. Sorry, TL;DR. Happy <your favorite word goes here>!
So well (and accurately) said. What people forget is that, although our "founders" where predominately religious, they did not base our government or its governing document, the Constitution, on religion. That was their greatest brilliance. Read the Constitution fully, and count the number of times it uses the word "God". Hint: Zero. So when people claim that our government is "founded on Christianity", it could not be farther from the truth (or intent) of our founders.

That freedom we have as a people to offer our greetings as we choose, without being bullied to respect a particular religion or belief, is priceless. And it is a the core of what makes us a truly free nation. Happy Holidays Everyone!
 
If the circle lit up with lights. that would have been ever better.

It does.

879B23B0-0B44-4C2D-8C13-901E4DFE23C0.jpeg
 
Nice misquote but as you said fact matter. There is no separation of Church & State and never has been. Read that 1A again and get back to me when you figure it out.

You have asserted no evidence. That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence. Or, to simplify it for you: You've got nothing and you're done.
 
God you "But Muh CHRISTMAS!" pearl clutchers are funny. Who gives a crap what anyone else calls seasonal celebrations? I thought you were all about freedom of expression? Nobody is *stopping* anyone from calling it Christmas. Everyone can make their own choice to call it what they like and should be able to do so without a bunch of baying from "traditionalists" who just want something to whine about.

Merry Saturnalia.
 
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