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Apple CEO Tim Cook and CFO Peter Oppenheimer Testify In Front of Senate Committee on Tax Strategies [Hearing Over]
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Go Rand Paul
http://www.businessinsider.com/rand-paul-congress-not-apple-should-be-on-trial-for-taxes-2013-5
Well said!
http://www.businessinsider.com/rand-paul-congress-not-apple-should-be-on-trial-for-taxes-2013-5
Well said!
Media Circus and the Spotlight for Carl Levin
And now we know why Carl Levin invited the Apple CFO and CEO to testify. It was not so he could hear their testimonies, it was so he could draw some cameras on himself and spout of the same narrative he has been posting on his website. Cook and Oppenheimer were there to draw the attention, but Carl Levin made sure he was in the center ring of this little media circus.
What a joke. He did not let either Oppenheimer or Cook finish answering a single question he asked. Citizens of Michigan should ensure this man does not get re-elected.
Because of the constant interruptions we never resolved many of the issues he has been stating that contradict Apple's written statement because he never let them finish a single answer without cutting them off. I tend to believe Apple's written statement over Levin since Levin was so anxious to shut down any answer that might contradict his narrative.
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Wow... Levin just failed to let them answer a single question by cutting them off and sticking to his narrative. That man is a failure.
And now we know why Carl Levin invited the Apple CFO and CEO to testify. It was not so he could hear their testimonies, it was so he could draw some cameras on himself and spout of the same narrative he has been posting on his website. Cook and Oppenheimer were there to draw the attention, but Carl Levin made sure he was in the center ring of this little media circus.
What a joke. He did not let either Oppenheimer or Cook finish answering a single question he asked. Citizens of Michigan should ensure this man does not get re-elected.
Because of the constant interruptions we never resolved many of the issues he has been stating that contradict Apple's written statement because he never let them finish a single answer without cutting them off. I tend to believe Apple's written statement over Levin since Levin was so anxious to shut down any answer that might contradict his narrative.
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Wow... Levin just failed to let them answer a single question by cutting them off and sticking to his narrative. That man is a failure.
No, they didn't not pay taxes on anything.
They sold products all over Europe. They paid taxes on the products they sold in the country they sold them in. They took what was left over after they paid the taxes and put it into the companies in Ireland, and paid taxes on them per the agreement with the Irish government.
Do you at least understand that this "loophole" is mainly because of Ireland's laws? You're closer than I am, give them a call.
Actually, Levin, the guy doing the most grilling now, is a Democrat. McCain has left already. It's hard to generalize this one...
Levin didn't even seem to know what he was talking about and mis-used terms and definitions. The only word he seemed to know was the word "shifted" not even knowing the profit was not "shifted" from the US to Ireland. A complete fool.
If by "grilling" you mean controlling the floor like a judge in a courtroom and preventing somebody from finishing an answer to any question because you know the answer contradicts the narrative that you've been trying to tell, then sure "grilling". Levin should be served a "dear john" letter by citizens of his home state.
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Exactly.... How is it a "shift" if it is the same thing that has been going on since 1980? He kept saying the 2008 agreement "shifted" things when in fact it was a renewal of an agreement that had existed for thirty years. The only thing that is shifting is the ground beneath Carl Levin's narrative.
McCain and Levin are both going after Apple, with McCain making statements that he has been guilting of himself. The "Keating Five" scandal in addition to Karl Rove who gave $70 million tax free dollars to republican candidates in 2012 by calling his group a social welfare organization. Republicans talk about re-writing the tax code but when republicans get control the house, the subject is rapidly dropped. Both parties are guilty of questionable tax responsibility and campaign contributions, yet it is the Republican party who is generally dipping their hands in the honey pot while crying "Bloody murder" in a grand standing effort by calling fowl for their same actions.
EDIT: In a multi-tasking fail, I erroneously addressed an article about PAUL Ryan, after searching for "Rand Paul". My apologies. Egg, meet face.
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Because Apple is an "American company".
Apple sells products all over the world. That seems to be beyond this process's head.
Not to mention that most of its revenues come from OUTSIDE the US of A.
To say that Apple is "American" (whatever the hell that means, since everyone in the Americas is American) is to disregard that basic financial information, as well as the fact that thousands of non-US citizens are and have been involved in the design and production of Apple devices over almost 40 years.
Ugh, watching this from the UK and from the perspective of a UK tax-payer, this was a bloody pointless media circus.
Everyone was adamant to recognise that Apple has not broken any tax law, it has simply ran its business for the past years abiding by a tax law that allowed them to do what they've done regarding transfer of capital to Ireland.
If the United States has a defective, outdated tax law, it's not Apple's or any other company's fault to use the loopholes of that law to maximise profits. The average citizen does it by finding expenses they can claim from the taxman.
Plus, if Apple's abroad money cannot be invested in the US what is Levin's problem with Apple using US government benefits for their R&D when the company is paying tax on its US profit? That abroad money can't be used in the US so it's not like Apple is using non US taxed profits to expand in the US.
Apple sells abroad and is taxed for their sales abroad. Why on Earth should it pay tax again in the United States? Because it's an American company? So being an multinational "american" company means that you have to pay taxes twice?
This is ridiculous and such a topic of no-discussion that I don't know how it became an issue to start with. IF the US Government needs to reform its Tax Code, then go ahead and do it without turning everything into a freaking reality TV circus.
If these people have such a big problem with Apple's "unallocated" money, then by all means create an efficient tax system that allows multinational companies to bring that money back to the US and invest it there. If not, a company as the single average John Doe has all the right to protect their assets from being stolen by an inefficient Government Tax Office.
I don't advocate tax evasion. I think everyone needs to pay taxes especially in countries with decent public services (which, again, isn't really the case of the US where everything is either private or public-private), but even in the case of countries governments who care minimally for their citizens, their very citizens have the right to protect their assets when the tax rates start edging on legally accepted robbery (such as is the case in Spain, Portugal, etc. where the tax rates have gone way above what is socially acceptable).
Cut on the expenditure. Don't steal your citizens.
I don't mean to offend any of the american members of this board, but some of the sheer stupidity of the claims that were made at this hearing are at the same level of stupidity of "we can't have that communist monstrosity which is a public healthcare system".
It's like these people are raised in such a "view-centric" way that they just can't see past their own individual agendas. It's ridiculous.
Everyone was adamant to recognise that Apple has not broken any tax law, it has simply ran its business for the past years abiding by a tax law that allowed them to do what they've done regarding transfer of capital to Ireland.
If the United States has a defective, outdated tax law, it's not Apple's or any other company's fault to use the loopholes of that law to maximise profits. The average citizen does it by finding expenses they can claim from the taxman.
Plus, if Apple's abroad money cannot be invested in the US what is Levin's problem with Apple using US government benefits for their R&D when the company is paying tax on its US profit? That abroad money can't be used in the US so it's not like Apple is using non US taxed profits to expand in the US.
Apple sells abroad and is taxed for their sales abroad. Why on Earth should it pay tax again in the United States? Because it's an American company? So being an multinational "american" company means that you have to pay taxes twice?
This is ridiculous and such a topic of no-discussion that I don't know how it became an issue to start with. IF the US Government needs to reform its Tax Code, then go ahead and do it without turning everything into a freaking reality TV circus.
If these people have such a big problem with Apple's "unallocated" money, then by all means create an efficient tax system that allows multinational companies to bring that money back to the US and invest it there. If not, a company as the single average John Doe has all the right to protect their assets from being stolen by an inefficient Government Tax Office.
I don't advocate tax evasion. I think everyone needs to pay taxes especially in countries with decent public services (which, again, isn't really the case of the US where everything is either private or public-private), but even in the case of countries governments who care minimally for their citizens, their very citizens have the right to protect their assets when the tax rates start edging on legally accepted robbery (such as is the case in Spain, Portugal, etc. where the tax rates have gone way above what is socially acceptable).
Cut on the expenditure. Don't steal your citizens.
I don't mean to offend any of the american members of this board, but some of the sheer stupidity of the claims that were made at this hearing are at the same level of stupidity of "we can't have that communist monstrosity which is a public healthcare system".
It's like these people are raised in such a "view-centric" way that they just can't see past their own individual agendas. It's ridiculous.
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No actually it was to point out that Apple shells its money in Ireland at 2% and has the audacity to say theyd like thier taxes lowered by 10% and would consider bringing back the shelled money if they could pay the same percentage of tax on it that you pay on a cup of coffee.
Well, they never really answer the question anyway, right? A simple question that only needs a yes or no, ends up with 10 sentences where 9 of them were irrelevant, and only there to confuse you.
Obviously not as simple as that, otherwise why are these loopholes being exposed with the premise of them being closed? Not just in the US, but in Europe too.
Nice try in your attempt to shift the thread to something completely different. You made a statement about how Republicans would have a "wet dream" if Hillary Clinton could be tied to this. I was merely replying, stating that this hearing was headed by a Democrat.
If someone asked you a question that's specifically worded in a way that makes it look like you did something wrong, would you simply agree with it?
"Sir, you specifically avoided your full tax obligations by taking the mortgage deduction on your 2012 taxes, DIDN'T YOU?"
and a Republican. First, I was joking. Second, read my post below. I stated both parties are equally to blame, yet pointed out Rand Paul's actual stance regarding tax reform in the U.S. as of March, 2013. This is in repsonse to those who claim Rand Paul to be correct in his remarks on these hearings, which I do agree with, yet deeper investigation into his economic policy and proposals are not beneficial long term for the U.S. economy and tax reform.
I would like to restate my point that I am not blaming any one party. I do state evidence that the Republican party is generally more associated with tax cuts for the private sect and have more personal/business connections to that sect. However, the majority of my comment addresses some inconsistencies in Rand Pauls comments here compare to his actual ideology.
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You are considerably misrepresenting what is happening.
Apple makes profits in many countries. In each country, they pay taxes on their profits. Since the tax rate isn't 100%, there is money left over.
Apple could now do many things: They could move the money to the USA and pay 35% tax. Which would be stupid. They could leave the money all over the place, in the UK, Germany, France, Italy, China, Japan and so on and pay no tax. Which would be difficult because the money would be in many different places. Instead they move it to Ireland so it is all in one place, and pay 2% tax. On top of the taxes that were already paid. Which means the money is still not in the USA, and can't be used to pay dividends or buy back shares which would get the money back into the economy, and tax is still due when the money is moved to the USA.
And Rand Paul argued against both as you would expect from a small government Libertarian.
Interesting that Cook is advocating something similar to what Paul and Ryan have been suggesting.