It is very simple: Steve Jobs thinks he knows better what you want than you do. And if we go by the last ten years of history, I would say that Steve Jobs is probably right.
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Apple concerns me, Windows 7 intrigues...
- Thread starter bananabar
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It is very simple: Steve Jobs thinks he knows better what you want than you do. And if we go by the last ten years of history, I would say that Steve Jobs is probably right.
Maybe we see "touch screen" the wrong way. I find the concept of MS Surface quite interesting. Give them a couple years to bring down the cost so Surface becomes a product for the mass market. I think this time, Microsoft is leading the innovation on 'stationary' computing and not Apple. And IMHO MS will completely rewrite Windows when they are ready for this next stage in computing. Till then, they will most likely 'just' try to stay in the game.
Well I've got to disagree on this one. After reading about windows 7, and seeing them run it on a netbook with 1gb ram and an atom processor, I would say you're wrong. Oh, and I am running vista ultimate 64 bit on my 2.53 ghz mbp with no problems or slow downs with it and it's pretty awesome.
Snow Leopard and Windows 7 are about optimizing things to make them run even better. Windows 7 looks very exciting and so does Snow Leopard. I plan on getting both
BTW, when was the last time you tried vista and on what hardware did you try it on? I've seen people using it with 1gb ram with no problem. I'm also not noticing a problem with the GUI.
Why the hell would I want a touchscreen trackpad? It's a computer, not a Nintendo DS. As someone who owns a tablet PC, I think touch is great, it really "humanizes" the computing experience. Just because Apple hasn't yet produced a touch computer, doesn't mean it's a bad idea.
Apple is not god.
Touch screen is a gimmick
I didnt read the whole thread and frankly i'll be surprised if im the first to point this out. but im gonna show my arguement anyways.
Honestly, apple is being extremely intelligent, and im sure the company spent hours, maybe weeks in a meeting discussing the right move in the next decade of technology.
We all like ot tell ourselves the next step for computer is giant multi-touch touch screens. But truth is, thats not really an efficient, or productive advancement. Its funny how people are getting excited to move on from something that has been practically perfected (keyboard and mouse) into something new that will be horribly plagued with issues.
Let alone how much less efficient it would be. We have come to the point of efficientizing computers with keyboard shortcuts and gesters so much, that we can literally control a computer for a day and hardly have to move our arms.
Yet this supposedly "new, and revolutionary" multi-touch screen is gonna make us moving our arms tons all day long. Please dont ignore this arguement, honestly think about it, it might seem cool at first but as the novelty wears away it will just get annoying.
That brings me to my next point, as soon as the novelty wears away... microsoft will be stuck with an OS that just annoys its customers (particularily the customers who will spend 5 or more hours using that computer every day). Thats not to say windows 7 wont support keyboard and mouse... in fact if it turns out that it doesnt then microsoft is really setting themselves up for another disaster.
In summary... multi-touch isnt a good idea for computers... its a VERY good idea for handhelds, which apple has obviously figured out. Meanwhile microsoft is ignorantly going for the "wow... multi-touch is really cool!!!" factor. Just what happens when its not really that cool anymore? In fact, apple has already stolen the hype and excitement of multi-touch because they were first to release a mainstream product that takes advantage of it.
Do you still get excited when you use your iPhone? Of course not... thats exactly what i mean by the multi-touch excitement will go away and then your stuck with an inefficient computer.
Kudos to apple for again being the ones thinking outside of the box, and not just buying into how cool and technologically advanced it looks.
I didnt read the whole thread and frankly i'll be surprised if im the first to point this out. but im gonna show my arguement anyways.
Honestly, apple is being extremely intelligent, and im sure the company spent hours, maybe weeks in a meeting discussing the right move in the next decade of technology.
We all like ot tell ourselves the next step for computer is giant multi-touch touch screens. But truth is, thats not really an efficient, or productive advancement. Its funny how people are getting excited to move on from something that has been practically perfected (keyboard and mouse) into something new that will be horribly plagued with issues.
Let alone how much less efficient it would be. We have come to the point of efficientizing computers with keyboard shortcuts and gesters so much, that we can literally control a computer for a day and hardly have to move our arms.
Yet this supposedly "new, and revolutionary" multi-touch screen is gonna make us moving our arms tons all day long. Please dont ignore this arguement, honestly think about it, it might seem cool at first but as the novelty wears away it will just get annoying.
That brings me to my next point, as soon as the novelty wears away... microsoft will be stuck with an OS that just annoys its customers (particularily the customers who will spend 5 or more hours using that computer every day). Thats not to say windows 7 wont support keyboard and mouse... in fact if it turns out that it doesnt then microsoft is really setting themselves up for another disaster.
In summary... multi-touch isnt a good idea for computers... its a VERY good idea for handhelds, which apple has obviously figured out. Meanwhile microsoft is ignorantly going for the "wow... multi-touch is really cool!!!" factor. Just what happens when its not really that cool anymore? In fact, apple has already stolen the hype and excitement of multi-touch because they were first to release a mainstream product that takes advantage of it.
Do you still get excited when you use your iPhone? Of course not... thats exactly what i mean by the multi-touch excitement will go away and then your stuck with an inefficient computer.
Kudos to apple for again being the ones thinking outside of the box, and not just buying into how cool and technologically advanced it looks.
Excellent post, and one I fully agree with. Having to move your arms to touch the thing you want works for kiosks and handhelds. Not for "regular" computers.
Bull****
Firstly Windows 7 is based off the Windows 2008 Server kernel.
Secondly I'm running Vista right now on 1gb RAM and a Core Duo, and it runs swimmingly well for every day purposes, and according to reports Windows 7 runs much better on less specs than Vista does.
I wonder if the same argument was given with the move from command-line to mouse-based UIs.
And I think that the GUI has to be designed for multi-touch, like the iPhone OS. Mac OS X and Windows Vista are primarily mouse-and-keyboard-driven.
Going from command line to GUI's that involve a mouse is different to going from a mouse to actually touching the screen. Because, you are effectively doing the same function as the mouse.
Even if OS X and Windows were optimised for touch screen, it still doesn't solve the issue if having to stretch your arms out.
Plus the fact that when you are using the touch screen, your hands will be obscuring the rest of the screen..
I bet there were people like you who thought the same of the first printing press.
"The pen and ink is perfected!"
"How is it productive to print each letter like that? My calligraphy is so much faster and cleaner-looking than that."
Newsflash: Most great things in the world that we have in common use today first started off looking like gimmicks to reasonable people like you. They get improved upon over time and soon you will wonder how you ever got through life without it.
As a user that was waiting for Vista to be the OS that made me switch back or grab another Windows machine built with far superior hardware, I must say that I am not going to hold my breath for either Windows 7 or Windows Mobile 7.
I'd rather Apple not add any more gimmicky crap to their OS right now as well. Leopard was enough of a breakthrough in computing but stuffed and bloated with 'tard' ware. I want Snow Leopard to be the greatest update to an OS ever in the sense that it will be virtually FLAWLESS when interacting with other Apple/3rd party hardware and software.
Forget about touch screen laptops. Leave those for the Star Trek geeks still living at home with their mothers. Give the professional a solid OS.
I'd rather Apple not add any more gimmicky crap to their OS right now as well. Leopard was enough of a breakthrough in computing but stuffed and bloated with 'tard' ware. I want Snow Leopard to be the greatest update to an OS ever in the sense that it will be virtually FLAWLESS when interacting with other Apple/3rd party hardware and software.
Forget about touch screen laptops. Leave those for the Star Trek geeks still living at home with their mothers. Give the professional a solid OS.
Stop the FUD please.
Windows is not perfect, but atleast try to attack it with truth.
I for one am not like the "IE" everywhere...and Ribbon Interfact hasn't sold me yet
Some of you seem to think that a touchscreen would be the exclusive method of interacting with the system. In reality, you still have a mouse and keyboard, but can switch to touch for the tasks that need it. For example, most Windows machines don't have horizontal scrolling (or at least didn't a few years ago) so you could reach up to the screen and scroll when you need to. That'll be no different to what I do now: I use my mouse and keyboard most of the time, and reach over to my trackpad to scroll horizontally.
I've seen a touchscreen laptop (I think it was either HP or Toshiba) and it still had a keyboard and trackpad. The touch interface was just another option.
I've seen a touchscreen laptop (I think it was either HP or Toshiba) and it still had a keyboard and trackpad. The touch interface was just another option.
I see your point/logic. I do agree that things get improved over time.
But I still think multi-touch is a gimmick. The ONLY advantage it poses over a regular mouse, is the ability to control multiple points at the same time (with the mouse, you only have one mouse cursor, hence you can only do one task at a time)
ex. clicking the ok button in a window, then opening an item in the dock. with multi-touch you could tap both at the same time, and both operations occur (assuming the developer of that OS is smart
)So i will give that ONE advantage to multi-touch.
But, still think of the disadvantages (tired arms, inefficient)
Plus the GUI has to be completely designed for multi-touch for it to work well. This makes me partly doubt windows 7, because knowing microsoft they will stick to the old cliche's of the windows OS (start button, task bar, lots of lists ) rather then re-design windows GUI. Dont quote me though... who knows though, I could be completely wrong.
I just think multi-touch isnt worth the hassle its gonna cause (force consumers to buy new hardware) force developers to re-write their softtware, OS's have to be re-designed.
All just for the ability to react with your GUI in multiple ways at the same time?
I hate to sound snobby and throw in an old out-grown quote but it just fits way to well
"Dont fix what isnt broken"
The phrase "Don't fix what isn't broken", I understand why some people think that; it's safe, it works, why risk breaking stuff and wasting time? But it is this way of thinking that is the bane of innovation.
In my opinion, it has been Microsoft and many manufacturers that have been chanting that mantra in the past, while Apple has been the company daring enough to throw well established ideas, such as the trackpad button amongst countless other things, out of the window and really innovate. I'd be willing to put a wager on Apple R&Ding touch screen macs in some form or another at the moment.
In my opinion, it has been Microsoft and many manufacturers that have been chanting that mantra in the past, while Apple has been the company daring enough to throw well established ideas, such as the trackpad button amongst countless other things, out of the window and really innovate. I'd be willing to put a wager on Apple R&Ding touch screen macs in some form or another at the moment.
Well I've got to disagree on this one. After reading about windows 7, and seeing them run it on a netbook with 1gb ram and an atom processor, I would say you're wrong. Oh, and I am running vista ultimate 64 bit on my 2.53 ghz mbp with no problems or slow downs with it and it's pretty awesome.
Snow Leopard and Windows 7 are about optimizing things to make them run even better. Windows 7 looks very exciting and so does Snow Leopard. I plan on getting both
BTW, when was the last time you tried vista and on what hardware did you try it on? I've seen people using it with 1gb ram with no problem. I'm also not noticing a problem with the GUI.
came on a laptop 1.8 single core 512 mb ram
did not run well maxed ram to 2 gb still took several minutes to load ie
bought a new computer less than a month ago
AMD Athlon LE-1640 Single-Core Processor (2.7GHz)
1GB PC2 6400 DDR SDRAM
still crap same problems as laptop
So everyone knows i have used windows 7
I'd wager that too. Certainly microsoft isn't resting on their laurels for windows 7, it'd be silly and detrimental to count them out. However, the winner of this round won't be who's first, but who incorporates a touch interface right. I don't think the right or smart thing to d would be to simply add a touch interface on top of what we're already used to. Rather I think we'll continue to see specialized devices from both apple and ms (and others).
Look at HP, they're not waiting for anybody. Personally, I think it would be cool to have a netbook-sized nintendo ds-like device from apple.
I'm excited to see what they all have cookin for the next year or two.
-DCBass
As for me the last thing I want on my monitor, laptop or other wise, is finger prints and Lord save me from anyone touching my screen, ever.
Then go for it, life is too short to not get what you want when you want it if you can get it. Any thinking person should always consider all the tools possible of getting his work done well and under budget.
Touchscreen laptops are just retarded and quite frankly I'm glad Apple isn't wasting their money on R&Ding it. Who wants to hold their arm up to a screen to use their computer?
To your point exactly... I can not even reach my iMac screen. Fingerprints... yuk...