Your company has given people an incentive to move further away. Odd choice.
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Apple Employees Reportedly Petitioning Against Plan to Return to Office 3x Per Week
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Thats intense. My job is medical adjacent so we never worked from home unless suspected CV19. Everyone just kept coming in like normal.
"The only employee that can work from home 100% efficiently and profitably....is that Nigerian Prince that keeps sending email to my spam box every day." - Groucho Marx' ghost
And before you ask, yes, I used to live in the states for a few years. But paying up to 45% in taxes, no healthcare, and absolutely everyone (yourself included) just absolutely bent on making sure everyone is as miserable as they are and try to get rid of as many rights as possible for themselves and especially those around them on topics that do not concern them. Supposed to be coming back next year, but think I might just skip.
I’ve never seen so many people care about how someone else does their job.
Get a grip people.
Get a grip people.
That's how it goes these days. Folks will fight tooth and nail on taking away others' rights.
That’s simply unbelievable. Perhaps in rare cases, but I laugh when people say that work has more distractions and “the guy” that keeps talking to them stops them from being productive.
At home, if you have kids and a family - they WILL be a disruption and you can’t tell me they don’t talk with you and disrupt a work flow. I don’t buy you get 3x the work done. I think you feel that way without a commute and that’s fair. But if what you say was true, there wouldn’t be a battle between employers and employees. It would be obvious how much more productive people were - if they were 3x better.
I work from home. Don’t claim that there are fewer distractions. And I don’t even have kids. The number of times my wife needs me to do something during the day or calls from work or there is some house project appointment.
I literally will drive over an hour to an office to get things done at times. At an office, it is your space, you can shut the door, and you can ask an intruder to leave. I cannot see the logic of fewer distractions at home. I think that’s just what people say because they don’t consider their family a distraction when, from the employers point of view, they are.
I work from home. I did for years pre-pandemic. I don't have to get up, get dressed up, put on "outside" makeup, do my hair for something more than Zoom quality decent appearances, and I don't have to pack a lunch or spend money and time on a purchased meal from a cafeteria or offsite restaurant. I don't have to work in a godawful "open office" where I am constantly distracted by noises, people, and the lack of privacy to do heads' down work. I get to spend more hours of my week doing stuff I want to do rather than deal with all of that.
My house isn't distracting. I don't feel obliged to do laundry during my workday or clean the house unless it's me wiping up a spill as I grab some lunch from my stocked kitchen. If I get a hankering to get out for a minute, there's stuff closer to my house than there was to my office.
I have an entire home office that's my own. So does my husband. My kids are in college and they live at home but they also have their own stuff going on and they know we work remote so they don't bug us at all. The most distracted I get is by the cats, but they like to hang out with me while I work and that's minor.
There's no down side. I dislike people in my face all day.
Ps. If you are distracted by home improvement projects, praytell who handled that while you were in the office? Your wife, by herself? So, what you are saying is that you want to go away and focus only on your job while she runs everything else?
Also... most people don't have an office door unless they work from home.
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Your logic is since Apple hasn’t done it then they’re not going to do it. There’s one flaw with that. Apple wants their employees in the office so they can’t outsource employees who they want present physically in their Cupertino office to India. If Apple is somehow pressured into allowing these employees to work remotely they are giving Apple an additional option of outsourcing their work. That was my point.
I think we’re going to see more outsourcing in other companies who just realized wait we survived just fine with employees not physically present. There was this belief that if you had an employee working in an office they had to be in the office building and could not work remotely because that would be terrible. In many instances that has proved to be false and employees are successfully working remotely.
Of course this is all just speculation but I feel it’s possible. Just because there’s not a whole lot of difference between working remotely 500 miles away or 3000 miles away.
Superiority/inferiority complex aside, there are no mental gymnastics. What works for you doesn’t necessarily work for others or equate to consensus of the majority. Some have the ability to “flip the switch” between work and home. I can do it, maybe you can’t. Your opinion is noted. It’s wrong, based on available data, but noted.
many years ago: ... just because it's nicer not to smoke in office rooms does not mean they now have the right to demand a change in their working conditions... oh, wait...
I cannot lie, i totally understand Apple wanting employees to return to the office. At least they not require 5/6 days a week. Working together face to face is different than isolated at home. How convenient it may be.
It’s a right to work from home? I wasn’t aware of that.
I don’t think anyone is trying to take away someone’s rights or even stop them from working at home. It’s just a group of people discussing whether it’s good or bad and the aspects of it. It’s a discussion forum and no one here is actually in charge of Apple employees to my knowledge. If there was someone here in charge I don’t think they would reveal that and any discussions here aren’t going to change what’s going on at the company.
Gotta keep the value high in that corporate real estate.
Apologies. I should’ve stated, “informed ideas”. Your opinions are anecdotal, at best.
And lumber yards can be terribly fun. Think of the potential for lost digits or limbs! Not to mention the daily, “will the saw cut <insert object name here>” contests. Plus, the employee discount would be very nice with the price of lumber these days.
I'm pretty sure that if one stays at a company long enough, the company will change the terms without alerting the employee so why's this even a thing you're talking about? If one was with a company long enough, one would go from having an actual office space that is private, with a door that closes... to a cubicle... to an open space... and back and forth because companies love to do that to people. So, the pandemic comes along and a lot of people who were stuck in open office hell realized that they could repurpose a room in their house for a PRIVATE office and zero commute time and expense. It went well. The end.
If enough do Google can offer smaller packages and be more choosy. Emplyees leaving and giving up options, etcc. may find Google won't matcch them becasue tehy have more potential workers to chose from. A supersatr I slikely able to dictate their own terms, but Apple is likely to be flexible in such a case as well.
The employer gets to dictate the place of work, not the employee.
A lot depends on what is being done. I've told potential clients no because the work could not be done remotely but required actual in person interaction; and I would not take the job because I knew it would not end well for either of use.
In other case, remote was fine with just an occasional in person checkin because some things are just easier to go over in person.
Your new company policy is BS. Reminds me of when I worked for the government in Canada. To qualify for limited parking spots at the office there was a point system. One of the key categorires was the distance one lived from the office. Cheap Charlies who chose to live far away because housing was less expensive or because they enjoyed the country environment were unfairly rewarded in the parking situation. They made a voluntary choice, why should that give them an advantage in the parking pool?
You forgot to list all the reasons why WFH is better, or I guess the main reason, what driving into the office actually benefits the employee and company. With everyone doing WFH now, is Apple faultering?
The commute, gas cost, etc., "just because"? Please...
Not if you work in an open-space. You can politely ask some people near you to talk more quietly, but discussing stuff can be part of the work and there is no avoiding that. In my home I have my home-office and the only discussions I hear are those between me and my remote colleagues.
And that is a door I can actually close, whereas I cannot prevent other employees in the office from bothering me, even indirectly, since the open-office is by definition a shared space.
As per example above, how many distractions you have at home and how many distractions you have at work can be a much different situation depending on a case-by-case basis. It's not always true that there are less distractions in the office as it's not always true that there are less distractions at home.
For me and basically all my colleagues, the home is the more distraction-free environment, but that's because there is this insistence of organizing the office in open-spaces which are complete BS for doing conceptual work which requires both focus and collaboration between other employees.
Our employer is actually considering restructuring in part the office layout to better accommodate this kind of work since many provided feedback in that direction and clearly motivated the reasons why working from home is in some situation a better deal than coming in the office for them.
Oh for goodness sake... IT DEPENDS ON THE JOB!!!
There are millions of jobs out there..... millions of permutations of roles and responsibilities...
Some, sure, can adopt the WFH model... of course they can.... SOME....... and sure, for those people there are benefits as you started to list... but thats not the point of this discussion...
But, if a company such as Apple deems that a role that they are paying for is best performed in an office environment then thats that.... no amount of whinging and whining will make the blindest bit of difference.
As someone said earlier. at what point did employees think they can start to dictate terms to their employers? Especially when those terms were set at the point the employee accepted the job in the first place and has been performing that job perfectly fine in the existing paradigm before being allowed, by necessity, the WFH temporary option. Temporary.....
I guess it is hard to explain to people that they just have been used to try out some new society model by Klaus Schwab or something and now they have to go back to the usual until the next experiment will take place.
People are not stupid and felt on some level that they have been used and now they have a right to say "It is not OK to use me for your experiments" and whoever chooses to continue working from home have a right to do so.
People are not stupid and felt on some level that they have been used and now they have a right to say "It is not OK to use me for your experiments" and whoever chooses to continue working from home have a right to do so.
you missed amount of time spent in commute. Companies in Bay Area have increased work load taking into consideration that people are saving at least 2/4 hours/day by working from home, now they don't want to reduce work load even if we start traveling to office.
And i was talking to councilmember representing my district he said that City doesn't make much money from resedential property taxes, most of the City's income is from commercial realestate. So if every employee wants to work from home how are cities supposed to make money for services they provide ?
I do agree that cities in bay area waste lot of money so may be this is good thing.