Apple Engineers Reportedly Pessimistic About Apple's Living Room Hardware Strategy

[4jasontv]

what ads???

Voice control creates you anxiety because you haven't tested Google Assistant

Every platform I’ve seen (fire, roku, chromcast) have ads.

I don’t think it’s possible to build a better voice assistant because the issue isn’t how well it understands commands but rather the input method for issuing them.

 

[Icaras]

Better UI, more powerful hardware makes it more fluid, no advertising, no spats from app developers because they don't have to pay to be on the platform, ecosystem (HomeKit Hub, AirPlay, Photos, Apple Music, AirPods/Spatial Audio, Podcasts, Fitness+), Apple Arcade...

Add to that excellent list accessibility options on par with Mac, iPhone and iPad. I know that’s a small subset of users but my partner really appreciates that feature. We would never get anything less than an Apple TV.

 

[turbineseaplane]

They should be working on a way to get the current Apple TV down in price. There is absolutely no justification for being $179 other than the ease-of-use, and that’s not good enough.
The 2015 Apple TV needs to go away, and they need to find someway to drop the current Apple TV in price. Even $129 would be better than $179, but if they could get it down to that old $99 price point, and get a good marketing strategy behind it involving the HomePod mini, AirPlay and enough crossovers, I think that would help a lot

Best summary I've seen in here.

It's just flat out all too expensive to ever go more mainstream given what most people are trying to do.

 

[Adf85]

Do many of you use it for things like Fitness Plus or to Airplay fitness apps like DDP Yoga? Due to the small amount of TV's with Airplay integrated, I've found it worth getting a cheap Apple TV HD for that alone and being able to view my iTunes/Movies library.
I've also ended up getting rid of my soundbar, and now have a HomePod (not the little one with no power) linked and its a great experience. The only way they could smash the home cinema game is to do a Bose sound platform type device with the sound and tv functionality through a hdmi

 

[0128672]

Although my TV has Airplay, it doesn't have Bluetooth so keeping the ATV is how I can use my headphones. I'm an Apple TV+ fan and I like to use home sharing for movies on my Mac, so all around it makes sense to keep it. I won't upgrade it unless it becomes completely unusable.

 

[4jasontv]

Best summary I've seen in here.

It's just flat out all too expensive to ever go more mainstream given what most people are trying to do.

Really? Maybe I missed something because to me it reads as a list of prices that are lower than it’s current cost without ever justifying a price cut and yet they do provide a reason why it should cost more than the competition.

 

[donguevas]

What I find odd about the story is that the engineers have spoken directly to a reporter, and that it isn't a leak. I can't imagine Apple is going to be too pleased about that.

I am a senior Tech at the fruity computer company and that story is absolute ********. I am not anywhere near that high on the org chart and I am not even allowed to speculate with what I even imagine what the company is doing. If I were to speak to a report about what I thought the weather was going to be like on Campus at Cupertino I would have to get permission from the press side of the business.

I worked for two years in the Apple TV department when it was niche department. We supported Apple TV and our Routers, that was it, then they added home pod, to it.

However, I can say this, in 4 years since I left that department that the Apple TV growth in user base has grown exponentially.

 

[zero.id]

The Apple TV would be nice if would not be a TV only device.
I can imagine a TV and music streaming device with HDMI output for TV and a Coax SPDIF output for a DAC or amplifier with DAC to stream music ONLY, eventually with a small popup or front panel screen to show the played album artwork and the internet radio logo.
Not AirPlay!!!

 

[contacos]

My TV has Android TV build in with all possible apps so I do not see the need for an AppleTV anymore. I have one, but it has been collecting dust since the last remaining app (TV+) was also ported to Android TV

 

[randian]

I might be one of the few, but I actually don't use the Apple TV app. I just use the Up Next / Continue Watching within the respective app. The fact that not all apps are in the Apple TV app, causes a little more friction to use if you happen to use one of those apps.

The fact that Apple allows that is the problem. Permitting apps that don't play well with, or simply ignore, the Apple UI ecosystem is and always was a bad idea. It leads to jerks who want to "control the user experience", which basically means making the ATV software work like a Roku or Fire Stick because that's a "consistent user experience" across platforms. It leads to apps that don't work with the built in features of the ATV because they're rolling their own player rather than using Apple's.

 

[Sam Squanch]

The disinterest by upper management shows by their decisions. I mean they finally make the HomePod what it should've always been. People complained on day one that it should've been integrated better with AppleTV and when they finally do it it gets immediately discontinued.

You know what I don't want in an AppleTV is something with a screen and speakers. I like my AppleTV discreetly tucked away unnoticeable never thought of. What I'd pay extra for and would like to see? A gaming AppleTV. It is possible to do a Switch power level AppleTV maybe even more powerful and I'd buy that in a minute. I am not a gamer I am a casual gamer but playing Apple Arcade games that are optimised for AppleTV is the way I use Arcade. Some on my iPhone and none on my computer.

 

[hagar]

They should have released an actual TV, surround speaker system and smart speakers for your entire house years ago. And then start to expand and innovate.

 

[4jasontv]

My TV has Android TV build in with all possible apps so I do not see the need for an AppleTV anymore. I have one, but it has been collecting dust since the last remaining app (TV+) was also ported to Android TV

I’m a little confused on your perspective. I feel like you’re normally very pro-privacy but now you have the hardware to stay private and you choose to use a data aggregation platform. Maybe what they collect is different where you live?

 

[jz0309]

I have 2 ATV4k (3rd gen), we love them ... it is overpriced, not like almost every Apple product is overpriced, it is WAY overpriced ... I think this is the main reason for its place in the market.
I find it hard to believe that the Marketing and the engineering folks at Apple are not talking. coming up with a strategy or roadmap is not just Marketing's responsibility, Engineering is usually heavily involved. Yeah I get the Engineers want 100% and then they have to deliver 80%, but part of the complaint is their own fault ... or is Gurman talking to some disgruntled employees? Every company has those ...

 

[Blowback]

Do many of you use it for things like Fitness Plus or to Airplay fitness apps like DDP Yoga? Due to the small amount of TV's with Airplay integrated, I've found it worth getting a cheap Apple TV HD for that alone and being able to view my iTunes/Movies library.
I've also ended up getting rid of my soundbar, and now have a HomePod (not the little one with no power) linked and its a great experience. The only way they could smash the home cinema game is to do a Bose sound platform type device with the sound and tv functionality through a hdmi

Yes. I use Fitness Plus at least 3x/week. Much better on the TV. iPad is good for privacy or when you need to jump around/ use weights or do any of the dance activities.

 

[The_Martini_Cat]

They need to work on Apple TV usability. Like, if I've already watched an episode of Ted Lasso I don't want it to queue up again. Like, under no circumstances to I ever want to watch the ad for another show when I start up one show. The button at the lower right that says "skip?" I ne'er want to see that sh-boom. Do I ever want to go through a bunch of shows I've wattched and mark them as "already watched?" Did I say that already? Yes, I did. All best && cheers The_Martini_Cat

 

[lsutigerfan1976]

There really isn't a benefit to apple tv over any competitors

Not unless you are in the ecosystem. I was saying this before. But I don’t think there is a strategy for their Apple TV products. Or speakers etc. They make a few products for their dedicated die hard fans. But outside of that. I don’t think they would even bother.

 

[turbineseaplane]

The fact that Apple allows that is the problem. Permitting apps that don't play well with, or simply ignore, the Apple UI ecosystem is and always was a bad idea.

They don't have a choice

They have no leverage because they have no market penetration with their box.

It costs too much and thus nobody buys it (relatively speaking) and thus they have too little market share and thus no leverage and thus Apps that Apple has to have on their device get to do whatever they want.

It's all connected and it all starts with: "The ATV is too expensive"

 

[apparatchik]

They should do both: a cheaper Apple TV stick and a more expensive Apple TV console with a proper AAA console gaming strategy that would permeate the whole Apple Silicon ecosystem (from iPod touch to Macs), think the money spent on Apple TV+ but for blockbuster gaming exclusives.

 

[Der Keyser]

I have wondered for years what keept Apple from doing ”their thing” with Apple TV, and in one swift stroke disrupt the marked. It would have been the simplest thing for Apple to do back in 2015’ish:

They should have released the Apple TV 4K in 2015 with a built in quad channel TV tuner (so there is always 3 tuned channels (the one you are using and one on each side for very fast channel browsing). The last tuner could be doing DVR to built-in storage (H.265 encoded), and that storage should be tiered to iCloud if 32Gb was not enough (and you elected to pay for the iCloud storage).

In one fast stroke you would have turned every TV into a simple monitor and made Tivo’s/DVRs redundant. At the same time you had the best streaming device on the marked, and effectively opened the door to owning the whole streaming marked with your own content service.

Then next up came the Pro version with a CPU/GPU that could handle decent arcade gaming, the HomePod version with built in speakers … and so on.

Now it’s too late as OTA TV and Flow tv is dead. So capturing the marked now will be much more difficult.

PS: Perhaps they didn’t do it because the consequenses of killing the intire TV manufacturing industry would have made to many powerfull enemies (The very group that manufactures most monitors and supplies allmost all display panels at the time?)

 

[RickyB]

I wanted to watch Ted Lasso, but the Apple TV was too expensive - the 4K Amazon Fire stick was only £49 and did everything we needed. I might have been tempted if Apple still did the year’s free Apple TV+ but to be honest I think I prefer the Fire Stick. Although the interface is a bit quirky but now I’m used to it, I like it better than Apple TV. Apps integrate better - unless tvOS has improved since the last time I had an Apple TV. It supports AirPlay with an app, and it works well. It integrates well with the Echo we have in the kitchen as well as the LG TV it is connected to.

Don’t get me wrong, tvOS is better for games and it would be handy to have Photos and better integration with the Apple ecosystem, but the Fire stick does everything we need and more, as well as being hidden behind the TV. We used to have an Apple TV but sold it when we got the LG tv because we never used it. We use the Fire stick all the time.

 

[PlainBelliedSneetch]

Really? Maybe I missed something because to me it reads as a list of prices that are lower than it’s current cost without ever justifying a price cut and yet they do provide a reason why it should cost more than the competition.

Unfortunately it seems like Apple has been spoiled by the extreme financial success of the iPhone. The original HomePod for example probably could sell at the same price and have sufficient sales and profit to make most companies happy. Hopefully, they do have a strategy for the home that includes premium devices for those of us willing to pay. While they are at it, a new AirPort Extreme would be great.

 

[jk1221]

I've always wished my Apple TV had a coax input with an ATSC 3.0 tuner so it could perform all the functionality I want from my TV and I wouldn't need to worry about the software of whatever TV manufacturer comes up with and drops support of. I like the UI and functionality of my Apple TV, I think it's a great device but having to switch to the TV remote and UI to watch TV then back again has always been a pain point.

There is my biggest issue. It doesn't support many (any? I just know it doesn't Xfinity and their app is not available either to stream TV) major cable providers. Lots of people still do have cable and dont want to pay $10 per service for multiples (a whole other discussion how unbundling despite its promises now costs more overall contrary to the original goals claims of not paying for channels you didn't want to save money). So unless you watch Apple TV+ or use streaming service, a LOT, it has few benefits.

If I could input my Cable box in the Apple TV for sure I would probably own one right now. When I was looking at a device as a Homekit hub it was between a Homepod mini at $99 or Apple TV. REALLY like the camera display popup for Homekit. But when you watch regular cable you don't get that; and since I have 0 streaming services it was useless.

If you could route your cable through the Apple TV and use Apple's interface and services, then sure. I would've spent the extra $50-60 for sure to get to view my porch (and possibly others to come) camera on the TV.

But for $99 the Homepod mini was the right price for a Homekit hub.


In general, for a streaming service box it is just too expensive. It's beefed up hardware just for the sake of it. Id love to see stats of who is actually playing games on it. $100-120 would've been the sweet spot even on the high end of boxes. And they need a mid-tier option still.

Everyone keeps claiming others are laggy but hold 95%+of the market. If they were THAT bad as claimed, then people would be buying up Apple TVs. Clearly, they are good enough for the market; and at a price point people will choose.

 

[KrisLord]

I love my Apple TV and Homepods, but they’ve had minimal investment from Apple for years.

a lot of the new features aren’t available in all markets (eg channel packs) and gaming remains pretty terrible despite apple arcade.

I would like to see:

cheap hdmi stick - get Apple TV to the masses at a good price point
soundbar HomePod - adding ARC to Apple TV is great but a proper sound bar is needed with homepods as surround.
FaceTime TV. We need a way to FaceTime from our TVs. Whether that’s some camera on a HomePod/Apple TV or a boring old webcam I don’t care.

what I don’t want:

some copy of a Amazon show.

 

[BWhaler]

Except quality.

+ privacy