It’s not about a device working well anymore, it’s how thin Ive and his team can make it. Jobs is gone, it no longer has to function.
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Apple Exploring New Glass Panel MacBook Keyboards That Could End Sticky Key Problems
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This is where Apple really misses Steve Jobs. The best thing about Steve was making things easy for the everyday user, which meant reigning in Jony Ive's crazy designs and making them usable.
As a former Atari 400 owner (those of you old enough will know what I mean), I am currently using a 2015 MacBook Pro at work and a 2016 at home. I honestly am not sure what to think. For me, I gave up tapping on the iPad on-screen keyboard once it became a device with enough usefulness that I could work on it daily. For short bursts of work, I do not mind it, but for all day, no way. I love my Smart Keyboard cover and I can jam on it all day long.
I do find the Touch Bar useful in my everyday workflow, but I prefer a traditional keyboard. I find the 2015 keyboard good, but the keys are a bit too wobbly after using the Magic Keyboard with Numeric Keypad day in and day out. The butterfly keyboard on my 2016, reliability concerns aside, is better to me than the 2015 MBP keyboard, but still lacks just that little extra bit of key travel to assure your brain that you actually did type the key. The Magic Keyboard, to my fingers and my mind, is the best compromise between the two. I would not mind a slightly thicker, much better cooled MacBook Pro using the Magic Keyboard mechanism.
I tend to give Apple the benefit of the doubt that the changes they make are in user’s best interests, but to my way habits and work style, I am dubious as to the need to replace a physical keyboard with this concept. Although I understand the benefits of easily reconfiguring it for different languages or keyboard layouts (Dvorak), etc. I suppose it would not be that much more fragile than an iPad at the end of the day, and yet, I wonder if this “innovation” is simply change for the sake of change, or a really useful thing.
Honestly, I do not need the MBP to be thinner. I need it to be reliable, comfortable and as performant as possible.
I do find the Touch Bar useful in my everyday workflow, but I prefer a traditional keyboard. I find the 2015 keyboard good, but the keys are a bit too wobbly after using the Magic Keyboard with Numeric Keypad day in and day out. The butterfly keyboard on my 2016, reliability concerns aside, is better to me than the 2015 MBP keyboard, but still lacks just that little extra bit of key travel to assure your brain that you actually did type the key. The Magic Keyboard, to my fingers and my mind, is the best compromise between the two. I would not mind a slightly thicker, much better cooled MacBook Pro using the Magic Keyboard mechanism.
I tend to give Apple the benefit of the doubt that the changes they make are in user’s best interests, but to my way habits and work style, I am dubious as to the need to replace a physical keyboard with this concept. Although I understand the benefits of easily reconfiguring it for different languages or keyboard layouts (Dvorak), etc. I suppose it would not be that much more fragile than an iPad at the end of the day, and yet, I wonder if this “innovation” is simply change for the sake of change, or a really useful thing.
Honestly, I do not need the MBP to be thinner. I need it to be reliable, comfortable and as performant as possible.
Seriously, I have an iMac Late 2012 (Bought Jan2013) and I'm still using the keyboard that came with it. Recently something spilt over and some keys became harder to press. I was planning to get the MK2. But overtime of 3-4 weeks it just fixed itself, now all perfect.
I looks like this might be the penultimate step of the real end game to combine the super flat keyboard design with the touchbar.
For many years in the mechanical keyboard community, there has been a running joke of this ultimate keyboard that everyone had heard of, but nobody had ever laid eyes on. It's the Optimus Maximus, the keyboard geek's dream of a fully mechanical keyboard that was also fully customizable via a teeny OLED display embedded under each keycap. it would give you the advantages of a virtual touch screen keyboard with the tactility that keyboard geeks couldn't live without.
Taken together with that Apple seems so committed to the touchbar and are working on a solid state glass keyboard that's super flat, it sure looks like there's a possibility that they very well could be making a run at producing a real deal version of the mythical Optimus Maximus.
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The best keyboard experience that I have found on the market currently is the Surface line. If they had better support from writing apps like Scrivener and Ulysses I would jump over tomorrow just for the keyboard. Apple’s lack of key travel and the poor feel of the keyboard is just not pleasant to me.
There are many cool possibilities yet people are so fixated on complaining they don't see it.
except that it doesn't have a backlight. Oh, my kingdom for a backlight!
I gotta disagree, the best laptop keyboards in the industry are found on the ThinkPad's and i've tried both.
I don't really like the current keyboard but I wouldn't want them to go back to the old keyboard either. I still have my old 2013 macbook pro and when I use it occasionally I have to say that old keyboard also suck.
The industry has moved forward - there are quite a few windows laptops with much much better keyboards now. Apple need to step up their game.
The industry has moved forward - there are quite a few windows laptops with much much better keyboards now. Apple need to step up their game.
The extended warranty is limited. If you're not concerned about resale values, you can easily enjoy the butterfly keyboards. I'd avoid 4-year-old time bombs if I were in the market for pre-owned MacBooks.
I have been waiting for years for a customizable keyboard. This would be awesome.
https://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/2005/0715/lebedev_4.jpg
https://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/2005/0715/lebedev_4.jpg
I know. Sometimes I want to say something and ask people to just hold up on the snark and actually consider that most of the time progress isn't something they recognize at the time and that even companies that pour millions into R&D totally F-up more often than they get it perfect... but who am I kidding? Nobody's going to care. There's no dopamine hit involved in trying to understand the imperfect process of design.
Will this be on the 2019 model? Honestly I’d take it over the butterfly keyboards from the more recent models. Though I would LOVE a return to the original MacBook Pro keyboards. Scissor keyboards were by far THE BEST KEYBOARDS ever made. Apple took away many things we loved when they took away our scissor keyboards: traditional USB 3.0, HDMI, MagSafe charging port, and of course the keyboards themselves. Very sad you did this Apple. Maybe these new keyboards will be higher quality than the butterfly but they can never replace the classic scissor keyboards.
Apple is exploring a new keyboard design that could eventually replace its butterfly switch MacBook keyboards and finally solve the problem of "sticky" or inconsistently functioning keys.
Issues that Apple has acknowledged can occur with some current MacBook keyboards are widely believed to be caused by dust or other particulates getting lodged in the butterfly mechanism underneath the keycaps, which are shallower than those on previous-generation MacBook and MacBook Pro keyboards with traditional scissor switch mechanisms.
In its 2018 MacBook Pro models, Apple quietly introduced a thin silicone membrane underneath keyboard keys, which is an attempt to solve the issue of dust and crumbs from getting stuck. But a new patent suggests the company is researching a totally new approach to the way keyboards are designed that could eradicate the problem for good.
Published last week by the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office and first spotted by AppleInsider, the patent application called "Computer with keyboard" describes a keyboard that replaces movable keys with a glass sheet that includes raised sections to designate the tactile location of individual keys.
When a raised key section is pressed, the keyboard detects the input pressure for that key and processes as a typical key press. The concept differs from the featureless plain of a virtual onscreen keyboard because the raised sections allow the user to feel where their fingers should rest in relation to the individual keys.
Raised glass key concepts from Apple's patent application
The patent describes how an additional level of tactile feedback could be provided by a raised side wall around individual raised keys that could deform with each press, while an underlying layer could serve to "push" the key back into place.
Meanwhile, key symbols could lie on a separate later underneath the glass panel, which would make it easier to change the layout for different regions, languages, or even applications. The patent also proposes using side sections around the keyboard that could double up as a trackpad.
As expected, the glass keyboard could have the effect of making the keyboard thinner and allowing more room for other components to be housed in the notebook chassis.[*]How to Get a MacBook or MacBook Pro Keyboard Repaired Free Under Apple's Service ProgramApple has filed patents for keyboards in the past, included one that uses a touchscreen panel similar the Touch Bar, but that extends to the entire keyboard layout, but this is the first patent to emphasize the use of individually raised glass elements that mimic traditional tactile feedback.
Article Link: Apple Exploring New Glass Panel MacBook Keyboards That Could End Sticky Key Problems
It's not the lawn mower in your backyard, it's innovation. With your kind of thinking there would be no apple and actually no computers at all. The stone wheel worked actually pretty well when the Greeks invented it.
For all we know, it might never be anywhere. Apple patents a lot of stuff they do research on. Doesn't mean they end up using it.
Real professionals don't want this. Give us a good keyboard again. My MBP 2018 is barely tolerable, I still mostly have to use it with an external Magic Keyboard via Bluetooth. The butterfly keyboards are not good for people that actually use the keyboards all day long.
If this is the future of Apple laptops, they will lose a lot of professional customers. There's still gonna be a crowd of couch-surfers and geekbench geeks with the highest speced MBP's of course, but professionals will flee to better and more suitable laptops that actually cater for real work.
It's really sad being pushed out of your favorite operating system by crappy hardware design, and having no other hardware options except external keyboards (seems like they're gonna be as necessary as USB-C dongles).
If this is the future of Apple laptops, they will lose a lot of professional customers. There's still gonna be a crowd of couch-surfers and geekbench geeks with the highest speced MBP's of course, but professionals will flee to better and more suitable laptops that actually cater for real work.
It's really sad being pushed out of your favorite operating system by crappy hardware design, and having no other hardware options except external keyboards (seems like they're gonna be as necessary as USB-C dongles).
Great, put more breakable glass in this laptops. Soon you will have to carry them in styrofoam pouches...
Regarding the keyboard thought, I am kind of ok with the newer one, so much that the pre TB keyboard is too mushy for me. But somehow I am happy typing on an older apple membrane keyboard. Full layout and long key travel.
I think laptop keyboards will always have to have some tradeoff. Something between the 2015 and 2017 model would probably be the best for me.
Regarding the keyboard thought, I am kind of ok with the newer one, so much that the pre TB keyboard is too mushy for me. But somehow I am happy typing on an older apple membrane keyboard. Full layout and long key travel.
I think laptop keyboards will always have to have some tradeoff. Something between the 2015 and 2017 model would probably be the best for me.
Not to mention people who are merely echoing what they've heard on the forums, yet have never touched a Butterfly keyboard, lol. Gotta get those likes!
There are plenty of us real professionals who like the butterfly keys. You just don't hear from us because we'd get our arses flattened by the MacRumors mob for having an unpopular opinion.
I'm lovin USB-C too. I love only having to connect one cable to access my external display plus all the crazy pile of peripherals that I have hooked up.
They're not actually my favorite keyboard though, but I do find them better than the old scissor switches.
Well, nobody wants a MacBook Pro that bends as easily as the new iPad's. It's stupid! A laptop should be built to be a reliable work tool, not a media consumption device that bends just because you lean on it.
I have a sneaking suspicion that my 2013 13" rMBP is going to have to keep chugging along until 2020 for even the slightest possibility of (what I consider) a better keyboard and a 15" MBP without the $300.00 Touch Bar option. I also think there's about a 1% chance that either of those desires will ever be filled.
If it existed today I would have a new Mac in front of me right now. My measly 4GB of RAM is maxed out every time I use the computer. What to do? On one hand I'm saving money, but on the other I need the right computer for business reasons. Darn keyboard. If they do make another model I love (like the 2013) I am going to max that thing out like it's nobody's business and hang on to it for a good long time. Frustrating.
If it existed today I would have a new Mac in front of me right now. My measly 4GB of RAM is maxed out every time I use the computer. What to do? On one hand I'm saving money, but on the other I need the right computer for business reasons. Darn keyboard. If they do make another model I love (like the 2013) I am going to max that thing out like it's nobody's business and hang on to it for a good long time. Frustrating.