Apple Finishing Up Work on an Ultra-Thin 15" Notebook

[Pegamush]

anyway, if we all agree this would come with ivy bridge, then it will be at least Q2 2012.
in this case they will maybe do a speed bump/new bto in late 2011 mantaining the same design.

and who knows, maybe in 2012 we won't use optical drives anymore..
ps. i made a quick google and find out: CDs are out since 1982, DVDs since 1997!!

 

[CLWelch]

Insert swastika symbol here!!!

Wow so you can in no way have a thin laptop and a more workstation oriented cause everyone is stupid? You can have simple choice, you dont need 3 versions of a 15 inch PC like a lot of companies do but 2 versions wouldnt hurt a damn thing. For proof see below.

90% windows 5-7% macintosh. Seems Gates figured that out and your hero did not. People rather would have choice, Apple will never get any good traction in the market with their rules. Their market cap is most all from iDevices. Choice will burn them over time there as well since competitors catch up.

Negative votes incoming...my heart cant take it. LOL 1 negative vote is my own

Microsoft doesn't offer "3 versions of a 15 inch PC." They don't even make computers. That's what you don't understand.

Apple's computer sales have grown faster than PC sales every quarter for the past five years. The PC market is shrinking, and yet Apple is posting double-digit gains.

People don't want choices. If I'm going to architect, I don't want to be presented with ten possible plans for my house. I want one, and I want it to be right. The architect should make that decision because he knows what he's doing. I don't. That's why I hired the guy—to make informed decisions.

 

[manu chao]

Have you ever heard of being on a long bus journey and thinking "oh! i know, I'll stick on a DVD... oh, no, wait, I WONT! BECAUSE I DIDNT WANT TO LUG AROUND A WHOLE OFFICE FULL OF EQUIPMENT JUST TO WATCH A DVD!!!! *hijacks bus, crashes into wall*

If you had the foresight to pack some DVDs, you can also have the foresight to pack a DVD drive. It is not like that busses have DVD vending machines. Same way as packing a charger when you pack almost any electronic device.

 

[Steve121178]

An ultra-thin 15" would be very popular with just about everyone. I look forward to more info...

 

[manu chao]

The day will come when they can't make it thinner.

You mean the point when we are longer allowed to put them into our carry-on luggage because they are classified as knifes.

Enjoy your slower booting and app loading.

I have two words for you: dual drives (SSD+HDD), a very real option since the ODD moved to a SATA port with unibody MBs in October 2008. Why schlepp around an external HDD or suffer from slow disk access if with a small application of funds none of that is necessary?

Besides, I have two words for you: external HDDs. They're not expensive.

I love it. Carrying around an external HDD to have access to your music, images, and videos (which you likely access on most days) is considered a better option than carrying around an external ODD for those rare occasions when you need an optical drive (who watches a DVD or buys a new CD every day).

 

[seveej]

What does anyone need an optical drive in 2011 for? USB sticks FTW!

Believe it or not, my MBAlu is the platform we in our family are using to watch movies (I use it for many things - this post among others).
Why?
'cause we do not have a tv set, do not intend to get one, and are (considering the crap tv programming is today) happy about it. And we're not alone.

Before some "the world stops at the US borders"-dimwit comments about buying movies online (in stead of on optical discs) - I'd like to point out that localized (subtitles etc.) movies are not available for download, and local movies are neither.

- - -

Considering the main topic of the post: let me tell you an anecdote. Back in 2006 (or something) I was doing a dvd-project for a client. I was working in a Wintel environment back then, and generally mostly happy about it. My workstation's PSU broke down, causing an energy spike, ruining not only the machine, but all my attached discs (containing one week of work on the project). With two days to the deadline I walked into the local apple shop, walked out with a brand new MBP and, redid my work and finished the project in time (with time to spare to be honest).

Albeit 5 years ago, the world has not changed enough. Although normal broadband is 5-10 times faster nowadays, transferring multiple gigs over the net is still not a feasible transport medium.
True, you do no longer need optical discs for installing software, listening to music on your computer, or (in some cases), viewing movies, but they still have their uses.

I welcome a 15" MBA, but not if they come at the cost of a 15" MBP.

My 2 cents.

Pekka

 

[435713]

Microsoft doesn't offer "3 versions of a 15 inch PC." They don't even make computers. That's what you don't understand.

Apple's computer sales have grown faster than PC sales every quarter for the past five years. The PC market is shrinking, and yet Apple is posting double-digit gains.

People don't want choices. If I'm going to architect, I don't want to be presented with ten possible plans for my house. I want one, and I want it to be right. The architect should make that decision because he knows what he's doing. I don't. That's why I hired the guy—to make informed decisions.

I know MS doesnt make computers. They allowed their OS to be used more Universal. Apple is the other game in town and it is a bit sh***y that you dont have a wider variety. Say a mini tower for example. Or a 15 inch computer that doesnt run near 2k. It isnt worth near that anyway.

Double digit gains are normal for their small share. Overall % #'s wont ever change much at those price points they want. Mac's are a growing trend in the consumer market but there will be a wall they are going to hit. They might get to 10% overall but never anything like 20+ %. Which they could obtain easily.

I dont get your architect analogy and dont do e-fighting. People not wanting choices is plain naive to say though.

 

[manu chao]

Well sorry but a laptop with no ethernet port is still laughable in the 15" and above range, my point was when you call for help and you say I have no ethernet, you will be told tough, get one. Removing the ethernet port for style is ridiculous.

There is a big fricking difference between needing an Ethernet port occasionally AND wanting to carry it around with you 100% of the time. And I really love it how you consider your experience with ISPs so universal. Your cable/FIOS/whatever modem might include a WiFi access point but for a lot of people they have their own WiFi access point, and you can do all the diagnosis of the modem via the WiFi access point's interface (which plugs into the modem's Ethernet port).

And is my laptop with a mDP port laughable because the DVI cable from my monitor has a mDP-to-DVI adaptor on it? My monitor hardly travels, and thus this adaptor hardly travels. Same would apply to any Ethernet cable at work or at home (if I had one at home). And if you complain about cost of any of the adaptors, that is just the cost of doing business. I don't complain about the cost of my laptop charge, I just bought three of them and placed them in the three locations I am regularly.

 

[AidenShaw]

Old news...

You mean the point when we are longer allowed to put them into our carry-on luggage because they are classified as knifes.

Been done:

(click to enlarge)​

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

With 25 pages, I'm sure someone by now has figured out this simply means Apple is starting to remove the DVD drives from all future models and thus they will all become 'thinner'. Whether or they're "Air" thin or not remains to be seen, but it's apparent Steve's obsession with thinness is going full tilt into every model out there. I wouldn't be shocked to see some bizarre new Mac Pro tower that looks more like an electrostatic speaker than a tower in the future.

The problem, of course, is that thin means other problems. It means less heat distribution and that means slower parts, overall. It's why you don't get a quad-core Mac Mini with a Radeon card. But that model is particularly stupid since it has room for the DVD drive still in the case, but no option for it (let alone BD).

The real reason Steve wants rid of DVD drives is so that software distribution has to go online, and this will push most towards the Mac Store. Don't be surprised when OSX has all other methods of software installation removed in the next OSX version for "security" reasons. In other words, they'll tell you that it's for your own good. They will then have 100% say what you can and cannot run on your Mac. They will also demand 30% from everyone.

And before people say that's absurd, consider that they are already now only 1 company and $50 Billion short of being the highest valued corporation in the entire world! Clearly, they are starting to think like Microsoft did in the late '90s. Power corrupts everyone.

 

[435713]

With 25 pages, I'm sure someone by now has figured out this simply means Apple is starting to remove the DVD drives from all future models and thus they will all become 'thinner'. Whether or they're "Air" thin or not remains to be seen, but it's apparent Steve's obsession with thinness is going full tilt into every model out there. I wouldn't be shocked to see some bizarre new Mac Pro tower that looks more like an electrostatic speaker than a tower in the future.

The problem, of course, is that thin means other problems. It means less heat distribution and that means slower parts, overall. It's why you don't get a quad-core Mac Mini with a Radeon card. But that model is particularly stupid since it has room for the DVD drive still in the case, but no option for it (let alone BD).

The real reason Steve wants rid of DVD drives is so that software distribution has to go online, and this will push most towards the Mac Store. Don't be surprised when OSX has all other methods of software installation removed in the next OSX version for "security" reasons. In other words, they'll tell you that it's for your own good. They will then have 100% say what you can and cannot run on your Mac. They will also demand 30% from everyone.

And before people say that's absurd, consider that they are already now only 1 company and $50 Billion short of being the highest valued corporation in the entire world! Clearly, they are starting to think like Microsoft did in the late '90s. Power corrupts everyone.

+10 spot on!

And more than likely they will fly under the radar of anti-trust since they have small marketshare. Maybe the overlord intentionally wanted a smaller marketshare to begin with come to think of it.

 

[accessoriesguy]

I don't know why computer companies don't do this. But if they put a small flash memory of like...4-8GB they can put the whole opperating system on it, to boot from. As well as still have your conventional hard drive.

This would give you SSD performance for a fraction of the price. If set up correctly, it can be used to hold any programs and applications installed on the computer aka the applications folder. Or not for security.

Either way, this will take up little room and increase boot speeds and over all performance.

 

[linux2mac]

Been done:

(click to enlarge)​

Thanks for sharing. What is funny is that's the same guy that said,

"Every executive in the PC industry should use an Apple notebook," Sood tweeted today, implying that they were of higher quality than those that come with Windows by default.

http://www.engadget.com/2011/03/01/microsofts-rahul-sood-says-every-pc-industry-exec-should-use-a/

 

[KingCrimson]

Thanks for sharing. What is funny is that's the same guy that said,

"Every executive in the PC industry should use an Apple notebook," Sood tweeted today, implying that they were of higher quality than those that come with Windows by default.

http://www.engadget.com/2011/03/01/microsofts-rahul-sood-says-every-pc-industry-exec-should-use-a/

He should be fired for being an Apple shill on MSFT payroll. How many Windows licenses he will cost the company with that remark?

 

[apolloa]

There is a big fricking difference between needing an Ethernet port occasionally AND wanting to carry it around with you 100% of the time. And I really love it how you consider your experience with ISPs so universal. Your cable/FIOS/whatever modem might include a WiFi access point but for a lot of people they have their own WiFi access point, and you can do all the diagnosis of the modem via the WiFi access point's interface (which plugs into the modem's Ethernet port).

And is my laptop with a mDP port laughable because the DVI cable from my monitor has a mDP-to-DVI adaptor on it? My monitor hardly travels, and thus this adaptor hardly travels. Same would apply to any Ethernet cable at work or at home (if I had one at home). And if you complain about cost of any of the adaptors, that is just the cost of doing business. I don't complain about the cost of my laptop charge, I just bought three of them and placed them in the three locations I am regularly.

1: You did not read what I stated about the ISP issue, an ISP isn't going to be interested in you if you cannot connect with ethernet and the BB connection is up.

2: Please stop comparing an ethernet port being ditched to the same thinking and logic as the ODD drive.

Like I said, people like you are utterly short sighted, hell if Steve launched a pencil and said it was a revolution you'd defend it to your coffin!

Oh and if companies refuse to buy Apple, well that just the cost of doing business, they like value for money and profit just like Apple and do not think spending $29 plus tax on a machine costing FROM $999 plus tax just so they can plug it into the corporate network as value.

Funny that............... Hence why they buy Windows.

 

[mganai]

I have two words for you: dual drives (SSD+HDD), a very real option since the ODD moved to a SATA port with unibody MBs in October 2008. Why schlepp around an external HDD or suffer from slow disk access if with a small application of funds none of that is necessary?

Yeah, I know. I was responding to that guy being disgusted with the idea of SSD replacing HDD. Though an internal HDD still counters the advantages of losing the internal ODD a little: no moving parts, better battery life.

Besides, you can never really rely on Apple giving you a lot of drive space for your money in their build options.

I love it. Carrying around an external HDD to have access to your music, images, and videos (which you likely access on most days) is considered a better option than carrying around an external ODD for those rare occasions when you need an optical drive (who watches a DVD or buys a new CD every day).

Exactly.

 

[CmdrLaForge]

As long as the Pro is still a Pro Notebook I am fine with making it thin.

 

[cmaier]

The problem, of course, is that thin means other problems. It means less heat distribution and that means slower parts, overall. I

That's simply not true. Heat can be conducted in lots of ways, not only by turbulent air flow. What matters is heat generation per unit area, not unit volume.

 

[fpnc]

...The most relevant thing you do in this comment is comment on how my predictions in January were wrong. Fair point, they were wrong. Now get off your high horse and talk about the 15" MacBook Air that the rest of us are talking about...

That's odd, because I did talk about the next major MacBook Pro redesign. IMO, to recap, probably not until Ivy Bridge in early 2012, see full details in my previously one and only post to this thread which you seem to want to dismiss as nothing more than being on a "high horse."

In any case, I guess what you are objecting to is my mention of our disagreements back in January when we also debated the removal of the optical drive from the MacBooks (Pro or otherwise). From what I can see your arguments for keeping the optical drive are basically the same now as they were back then and that's what I meant by "nothing has changed since -- except the following" where I list the steps which Apple has taken since January that sure seem to foretell the removal of the optical drive from even more Apple products.

Past performance and events are a likely indicator of future performance and events. That's even more true for Apple than it is generally true for people.

 

[manu chao]

1: You did not read what I stated about the ISP issue, an ISP isn't going to be interested in you if you cannot connect with ethernet and the BB connection is up.

I don't need a computer with an Ethernet port to figure out whether the (cable) modem is dishing out IP addresses to my WiFi base station or whether the WiFi base station can connect to the internet. The configuration tool of the WiFi base station can tell me all that. And if the ISP tech support insists that does not count, ignore them, just tell you had your computer connected to the Ethernet port, for diagnostic purposes that is the same.

2: Please stop comparing an ethernet port being ditched to the same thinking and logic as the ODD drive.

Why? Just because it might undermine your position? In terms of space saving, infrequent usage, and solvability via peripherals, they are quite similar.

Like I said, people like you are utterly short sighted, hell if Steve launched a pencil and said it was a revolution you'd defend it to your coffin!

No, I think people have voted with their feet by flocking to the MBA (from the same-screen-sized MBs and 13" MBPs). But I guess anybody who does not agree with you must be stupid and bases their decision on the Apple's marketing and not on what product makes him or her a satisfied customer.

 

[manu chao]

Yeah, I know. I was responding to that guy being disgusted with the idea of SSD replacing HDD. Though an internal HDD still counters the advantages of losing the internal ODD a little: no moving parts, better battery life.

Besides, you can never really rely on Apple giving you a lot of drive space for your money in their build options.

If I had enough money (or were much more profligate) I would have dual 512 GB (or rather those 480 GB with some storage set aside for wear-levelling) SSDs. But I don't, therefore I make do with a 256 GB SSD + 500 GB HDD and a 15 min shorter battery. And most of music, podcast, and movie files can be recreated (in addition to being backed up multiple times) and apart from images imported while on the go, all my images are backed up in multiple locations anyway.

And I don't think I ever used the stock hard drive in any of my Macs for anything really (probably the 6 GB drive in my Pismo for three or four months). I always get the smallest drive from Apple and put in the biggest drive available right after purchase.

 

[Inconsequential]

*snip*

Your in the minority tho.

My MacBook Pro DVD drive has *never* been used in years, I wondered why I didn't put a second drive in their earlier.

As long as the MacBook Pro line keeps the ability to fit two drives and increases the battery size due to the lack of a DVD drive than so be it.

Optical drives are going the way of the floppy.

That is just how it is.

 

[Ragnar-Kon]

As long as it doesn't replace the current setup of Macbook Pros I'll be happy. I use my DVD drive on a daily basis, and I frequently use both USB ports and the Firewire port at the same time. I also use the SDXC slot at least once every 2 weeks.

I'm afraid they're going to remove the DVD drive and various ports, then sell an external DVD drive and firewire/usb hubs separately. The objective of a laptop is to NOT have to carry around a bunch of extra accessories.

15" Macbook Air I have no problem with. A replacement for the 15" Macbook Pro is bad news. If it is true, I might have to hurry and come up with the cash to buy the current true 15" Macbook Pro before they disappear forever.

 

[Liquinn]

As long as it doesn't replace the current setup of Macbook Pros I'll be happy. I use my DVD drive on a daily basis, and I frequently use both USB ports and the Firewire port at the same time. I also use the SDXC slot at least once every 2 weeks.

I'm afraid they're going to remove the DVD drive and various ports, then sell an external DVD drive and firewire/usb hubs separately. The objective of a laptop is to NOT have to carry around a bunch of extra accessories.

15" Macbook Air I have no problem with. A replacement for the 15" Macbook Pro is bad news. If it is true, I might have to hurry and come up with the cash to buy the current true 15" Macbook Pro before they disappear forever.

Yeah I see what you mean, everything is spot on in your post.

I'm scared this is going to be the MBP 15". Thunderbolt port and a few USB ports, that'll force other users to get the expensive Apple Cinema Display.

I hope I'm wrong.

 

[AppleScruff1]

Insert swastika symbol here!!!

Wow so you can in no way have a thin laptop and a more workstation oriented cause everyone is stupid? You can have simple choice, you dont need 3 versions of a 15 inch PC like a lot of companies do but 2 versions wouldnt hurt a damn thing. For proof see below.

90% windows 5-7% macintosh. Seems Gates figured that out and your hero did not. People rather would have choice, Apple will never get any good traction in the market with their rules. Their market cap is most all from iDevices. Choice will burn them over time there as well since competitors catch up.

Negative votes incoming...my heart cant take it. LOL 1 negative vote is my own

Evidently many people here don't like choice and aren't capable of making decisions on their own. They need someone to tell them what to do all the time. They should just get married and get it over with.

I know MS doesnt make computers. They allowed their OS to be used more Universal. Apple is the other game in town and it is a bit sh***y that you dont have a wider variety. Say a mini tower for example. Or a 15 inch computer that doesnt run near 2k. It isnt worth near that anyway.

Double digit gains are normal for their small share. Overall % #'s wont ever change much at those price points they want. Mac's are a growing trend in the consumer market but there will be a wall they are going to hit. They might get to 10% overall but never anything like 20+ %. Which they could obtain easily.

I dont get your architect analogy and dont do e-fighting. People not wanting choices is plain naive to say though.

Good points.

With 25 pages, I'm sure someone by now has figured out this simply means Apple is starting to remove the DVD drives from all future models and thus they will all become 'thinner'. Whether or they're "Air" thin or not remains to be seen, but it's apparent Steve's obsession with thinness is going full tilt into every model out there. I wouldn't be shocked to see some bizarre new Mac Pro tower that looks more like an electrostatic speaker than a tower in the future.

The problem, of course, is that thin means other problems. It means less heat distribution and that means slower parts, overall. It's why you don't get a quad-core Mac Mini with a Radeon card. But that model is particularly stupid since it has room for the DVD drive still in the case, but no option for it (let alone BD).

The real reason Steve wants rid of DVD drives is so that software distribution has to go online, and this will push most towards the Mac Store. Don't be surprised when OSX has all other methods of software installation removed in the next OSX version for "security" reasons. In other words, they'll tell you that it's for your own good. They will then have 100% say what you can and cannot run on your Mac. They will also demand 30% from everyone.

And before people say that's absurd, consider that they are already now only 1 company and $50 Billion short of being the highest valued corporation in the entire world! Clearly, they are starting to think like Microsoft did in the late '90s. Power corrupts everyone.

Bravo. Extremely well said and quite true.