Apple Has Given Up on the Vision Pro After M5 Refresh Flop

[zenodux]

Apple has all but given up on the Vision Pro after the M5 model failed to revitalize interest in the device, MacRumors has learned. Apple updated the Vision Pro with a faster M5 chip and a more comfortable band in October 2025, but there were no other hardware changes, and consumers still weren't interested.

Rumors of the Vision Pro’s demise have been greatly exaggerated. It’s the most exciting device Apple has released in a while. And that’s saying something. The price and weight will come down over time – that’s the cost of being an early adopter. The reward, of course, is early access to transformative experiences. This paves the way for everyone else to enjoy an Apple Vision product…

“The Macintosh was introduced by a television commercial titled "1984" during Super Bowl XVIII on January 22, 1984, directed by Ridley Scott. Sales were strong at its initial release on January 24, 1984, at US$2,495(equivalent to $7,700 in 2025), and reached 70,000 units on May 3, 1984. Upon the release of its successor, the Macintosh 512K, it was rebranded as the Macintosh 128K. The computer's model number is M0001.”
Excerpted from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macintosh_128K

- posted from my face computer

 

[powerbook911]

The comfort / weight is such a big deal. I would have kept mine had it been comfortable, even with that price tag that was a stretch for me at the time.

However, it wasn't comfy, the bones in my face were sore for days.

It was impressive technology otherwise.

 

[eifelbube]

Really? What are yours?

I'll tell you mine. I browse the web to do research, shopping, news, whatever. I use a few news programs. I communicate with people, write emails, messaging apps, every once in a while social media. Scheduling stuff. Sometimes I Remote Desktop into my computer. I consume media every now and again. I play music in my car. Sometimes I mess around with a music creation app, rarely. I control my home automation system, I use ChatGPT, I use some claude code interfaces. That's what I do on my iPhone.

Those are my killer apps. Maybe you have some other specialized needs? I don't know.

Let's see how Vision Pro stacks up:

• Web, yes. Much better than iphone
• News? Yes, I don't tend to use news on AVP though, since I'm usually doing something more productive than scrolling
• Messaging - awesome messaging device, especially for FaceTime. Crazy good, far far better than iPhone could ever be where you have to like hold your phone up awkwardly
• Social media - works, not a core use case for me, but if you can access it via the web it's there
• Calendar - all there
• Remote Desktop - I use Screens and Mac Virtual Display extensively. Vastly better than iPhone
• Media consumption - core use case. I don't do this a lot but people seem to love it. It's really an incredible experience sometimes, and that's coming from someone who basically never watches content
• I can't play music in my car with it. Point iphone
• Music creation - the apps exist. Vision Pro can run most iPad apps, and there are a few native AVP music apps
• Home automation - has apps for the stuff I use + web interface. I don't put it on just to control my lights but it's trivial to do it when I'm already using it
• ChatGPT - native app
• Claude Code interfaces - haven't tried, still messing with the workflow

So out of the core things I do on my iPhone, all of them besides "playing music on my car stereo while I'm driving" is trivially available on AVP. Some are marginally worse, I'd say Facebook and Amazon are a step down since you need to use the web ui vs a native app. Some are much, much, much better (like browsing the web in general, and screen share / virtual display). Some are about equivalent. I'm not at all saying Vision Pro has everything, but it does have the stuff I actually use.

Of course, this is just my own personal list. If you measured my time spent on a device, this would cover most of it. You mentioned there are hundreds, or thousands, of apps that are very compelling on the iPhone and which just aren't available on the Vision Pro. You should be able to name a few of them, right?

Yes, Remote Desktop on AVP is “vastly better” than on iPhone, web surfing better too, etc. And Virtual Desktop as well as 3D immersion are exclusive to the AVP. Why then were only 600k headsets sold in 2 years but 245 million iPhone 17 units in just 2 months?
In reality, what you can do on iPhone, Mac, or iPad or a combination is enough or good enough or simply functional enough for most people.

 

[eifelbube]

It’s the most exciting device Apple has released in a while. And that’s saying something.

The AVP technology itself is undoubtedly exciting. But is also the Apple device with the highest return rate by far. And that’s saying everything.

 

[basehead617]

I still love mine. Every new piece of immersive content released has been really enjoyable for me. I don’t expect they’ll release much more than they already have but maybe they’ll continue the line in the future.

 

[CBlakeston]

This story is completely debunked by Gruber. https://daringfireball.net/2026/04/on_the_future_of_apples_vision_platform

 

[Arlena]

iPad does not need a killer app at a price tag of [$3499 divided by 10]

Adjusted for inflation the first iPad cost 750$ at launch. At what price point do you think a new device needs a killer app?

 

[Arlena]

That’ll make for an extraordinarily high number of stupid people. 😊

Source needed

 

[Arlena]

Are you kidding?
There are hundreds, if not thousands, that could fit the description.

The software situation on iPhone is literally the polar opposite of that on VisionOS.

Which fit the situation when the iPhone launched?

 

[turbineseaplane]

This is a really important point from Steve.

That said, I think he's still in his enthusiast developer bubble and not realizing how unappealing it is to the mainstream to be fully enclosed in a socially isolating VR HMD.

 

[visualseed]

600,000 units total since February 2024, with about 450,000 in 2024. Unusually high number of returns, apparently the highest return rate of any Apple product ever.

The three articles you linked all repeated the same rumor, using figures I dispute. Production of the M2 model ended in 2024 due to manufacturing moving from China to Vietnam, which during that time Apple also halted production of the M2 processor and depleted inventories. The upgrade to the M5 wasn’t about boosting sales, but about keeping them going. The total number of units out there, including those with corporate customers, is likely closer to a million. Maybe more.

 

[visualseed]

The AVP technology itself is undoubtedly exciting. But is also the Apple device with the highest return rate by far. And that’s saying everything.

If so many were returned, why are there none for sale on Apple's refurbished site? They even sell refurbished airpods.

 

[MrWayne]

If so many were returned, why are there none for sale on Apple's refurbished site? They even sell refurbished aipods.

What surprised me is that Apple, removed all AVP ads online. This is strange.

 

[turbineseaplane]

If so many were returned, why are there none for sale on Apple's refurbished site? They even sell refurbished aipods.

The costs of refurbishment may not pencil out.

They are reportedly very expensive to make, and make the margins they want even at MSRP.

They also may not want to further extend the fleet (in terms of support) in the wild, especially the OG M2 version, which is surely destined for Apple Watch OG status.

 

[mudflap]

But in a few years, hopefully the tech progresses and Apple can build an even better device for $1000. At that price level, suddenly you have a viable product.

The original Vision Pro used a 1.25-inch Sony micro OLED display with a resolution of 3,660×3,200 pixels per eye. 54 Vision Pro pixels fit inside a single iPhone pixel, with each pixel roughly 7.5 microns from the next. That's an insane, unheard of pixel density. Apple was paying $228 per display from Sony, so $456 just for the two eye displays alone.

That's 23,424,000 pixels total. 11,712,000 per eye. 3.4 million pixels more — per eye — than that 4K OLED TV for the family. 🙂

 

[zenodux]

The comfort / weight is such a big deal. I would have kept mine had it been comfortable, even with that price tag that was a stretch for me at the time.

However, it wasn't comfy, the bones in my face were sore for days.

It was impressive technology otherwise.

Fair enough. Have you tried the new dual knit band? For me, it is leagues more comfortable than the other two Apple bands. I can wear it for hours on end - I think my record is something like 6 or 8 hours. Also, it’s easy-on, easy-off, which is key. YMMV of course…

-posted from my hand computer

 

[N3ur0n79]

I respect everyone’s opinions and decisions to refund the device or simply to not find it useful. However I genuinely think the complaints solely around the price and comfort may unintentionally leaning too far into their own biases and expectations of what XR is being marketed as. This is an evolving space and most people haven’t used either glasses or head mounted displays and rely on what has been written.

I do find that influencers have not done a great job with setting expectations. I remember all the videos of people walking outside and trying to navigate life on life’s terms as they say. Head mounted displays at the enthusiast level are around $1800 USD. I am not arguing that the price shouldn’t be cheaper, but price shouldn’t have the focus it does. Of course everyone would get one at $1000 USD for those who say that is their budget or that “I wouldn’t get it if it were free” for those that don’t like it. It isn’t much different than people who don’t think super cars are worth it because a car needs to go from A to B from those who aren’t car enthusiasts, or the complaints about the price of a Lamborghini when a Chevy corvette is cheaper and faster.

Neither of those points are “wrong” but it is reductive. I have had head mounted displays like the Valve index that I lost interest in within a day but have been floored by how much better the AVP has been in exceeding my expectations. There are reasons why the halo products are founded that extend beyond use cases such as with cars or watches. The V6 mustang is so popular because of the V8s that create the iconic benchmarks in people’s minds. The Apple Watch would never have been successful if the argument was merely that time shouldn’t be expensive to wear.

I’ll admit that the Samsung XR does make a more compelling challenge to the AVP in regard to price but it still is far inferior to the current HMD benchmark setter in the Vison Pro. The M5 is far superior to the SoC on the galaxy and the user interface and overall image quality is inferior despite having higher number pixel rendering capability. This again speaks to the aspects of the technology that are a sum of the whole integration of components.

This is long already but consider that no one really discusses the downsides of the glasses while comparing only the perceived benefits to the HMD. I should have led with this as it is probably the strongest succinct argument. I came to the AVP after releasing that my thoughts about grabbing a pair of glasses to play flat games on a giant screen is nothing how it is marketed to sound. There are a TON of incentivized influencers to read marketing points and makes having unbiased information accessible for the benefit of the customer instead of the company. Slight movements will be able to change the quality of the on screen image. The lack of processing power in the glasses can also make one have to wear a variety of other accessories and anchor points to even get decent functioning. And even with having USB type C inputs to plug into a local high end PC, doesn’t make for the most comforting ability to play games on a giant screen, let alone at 1080p.

Ternus, I imagine would better explain what I’m fumbling about, but it is worth considering. The truth is, we aren’t even close to having the throughput and compute to even render what many would like to see with a dedicated VR headset. The amount of pixels needed to run VR can exceed the RTX 5090 because that can struggle with current Unreal engine games at 4K without using technologies that are pretty bad in VR such as frame generation and heavy upscaling.

And that completes my argument because why would people assume the prices get cheaper in a few years at the enthusiast level when we can see how much further the tech has to mature (node shrinks and efficiency gains) just to create the ultimate XR spatial rendering computer? The price for the high end spatial device is expensive but computers themselves were much more expensive decades ago and they really didn’t do much the average user couldn’t do with a calculator and a pen and paper.

The Halo allows the R&D to trickle down to other products in the same vertical like XR glasses or spatial wearables. The use case and purpose of those devices are indeed differnt and therefore will have different benefits (weight and price) BUT also different drawbacks and limitations as well. The only thing to wait and see is if the device does get abandoned and makes my entire dissertation a futile exercise in writing. But since I got the M5 AVP in February, YouTube app launched, the lakers games were ridiculously amazing experiences and nvidia and valve have released some very promising stuff too.

 

[Naraxus]

I think there would be a ton of interest in VR walkthroughs (perhaps with spoken/dsiplayed narratives) of various places around the world.

A few off the top of my head: Italy's Coliseum, the Louvre, the 20,000 year old cave paintings in Lascaux, France, visiting Niagara Falls, touring Egyptian pyramids, seeing a collection of Diego Rivera's fresco murals, walking through some of architect Frank Gehry's buildings all over the world, participating in Formula One races, and much much more.

You bring up an interesting use case I never considered - "Vacations" for those who aren't able to take them. I could see going on virtual tours to various places such as the ones you mentioned. Very remote locals like the Antarctic, Mt. Everest and so on. Me, I've always wanted to go to Japan but due to medical issues I'm not able to fly or travel far. It'd be great for situations like that.

 

[eifelbube]

a killer app is the application or use case that converts a product from technically interesting to obviously useful for a large enough market to drive adoption.

At $999, the (Extended) Virtual Display would have been the killer app. At $999 + 2,500, there hasn’t been and there is not going to be anything in the foreseeable future to make the AVP useful enough “for a large enough market to drive adoption”. A Studio Display costs quite a bit more than $999 and can’t travel.

 

[eifelbube]

You bring up an interesting use case I never considered - "Vacations" for those who aren't able to take them. I could see going on virtual tours to various places such as the ones you mentioned. Very remote locals like the Antarctic, Mt. Everest and so on. Me, I've always wanted to go to Japan but due to medical issues I'm not able to fly or travel far. It'd be great for situations like that.

That use case I was actually expecting from the start. I was disappointed at the lack thereof. The AVP has the tech that can create a sense of being in a place despite not being physically present. A potential for mass appeal, it seems, that has not been tapped.

Or this virtual experience of being there: Since before the AVP was released, the World Cup soccer tournament was set for the US, Canada, and Mexico. Apple could have talked to FIFA (world governing body for the sport). Great opportunity missed to showcase a perfect use case for high resolution VR.

 

[mw360]

That use case I was actually expecting from the start. I was disappointed at the lack thereof. The AVP has the tech that can create a sense of being in a place despite not being physically present. A potential for mass appeal, it seems, that has not been tapped.

Or this virtual experience of being there: Since before the AVP was released, the World Cup soccer tournament was set for the US, Canada, and Mexico. Apple could have talked to FIFA (world governing body for the sport). Great opportunity missed to showcase a perfect use case for high resolution VR.

I can't think of many better ways to engineer a commercial failure than trying to sell VR to soccer fans.

 

[TFOuttaHere]

It’s a flop. I knew it the moment I tried it on during a demo. What an uncomfortable headset. That lame battery pack. Desperately trying to find a proper ‘why’ to use it.

It’s not the price tag or even the form factor or battery pack that killed the product. It’s their hubris surrounding control and turning it into an iPad on your face. The UI/UX breakthroughs are incredible. The complete uselessness of it is also incredible. Apple ironically has zero vision for a product it calls Vision. visionOS should not be a clone of iOS/iPadOS. The app model is DEAD and not relevant to VR/AR/“spatial computing”. This product needs to be fully immersive with almost no standard OS interface elements, especially not a damned keyboard. With the abysmal state of Siri, this product doesn’t stand a chance. If they discontinue this, it’s an admission the company is too stagnant to produce anything compelling and novel any longer. They’ll die a slow death to competition until they remember how to innovate more than incrementally. Good riddance to Tim Cook.

 

[turbineseaplane]

It’s not the price tag or even the form factor or battery pack that killed the product. It’s their hubris surrounding control and turning it into an iPad on your face. The UI/UX breakthroughs are incredible. The complete uselessness of it is also incredible. Apple ironically has zero vision for a product it calls Vision. visionOS should not be a clone of iOS/iPadOS. The app model is DEAD and not relevant to VR/AR/“spatial computing”. This product needs to be fully immersive with almost no standard OS interface elements, especially not a damned keyboard. With the abysmal state of Siri, this product doesn’t stand a chance. If they discontinue this, it’s an admission the company is too stagnant to produce anything compelling and novel any longer. They’ll die a slow death to competition until they remember how to innovate more than incrementally. Good riddance to Tim Cook.

Well said. You've cut through so much of the issue here.
👏

 

[vantelimus]

This is a really important point from Steve.

That said, I think he's still in his enthusiast developer bubble and not realizing how unappealing it is to the mainstream to be fully enclosed in a socially isolating VR HMD.

View attachment 2626948

VR is far less socially isolating than radio, television, or internet streaming. Those media invite you to isolate yourself by locking your attention on one-way information flows. There is no back and forth, no social dialogue, no camaraderie, no shared experience with your favorite YouTube influencer. VR as it is implemented in the Vision Pro, on the other hand, integrates all modern forms of multi-way communication media: phone, web, social media, video conferencing, experience sharing, etc., and does it all within environments that support entertainment, education, travel, and recreation. Is it the same as walking down the street in Paris with your best friend talking? No. But it will allow you to have that experience when you and your best friend are separated by thousands of miles.

 

[vantelimus]

... Good riddance to Tim Cook.

For everyone hoping Ternus kills the Vision Pro, you might want to know that he spent his first four years after graduating from college working on VR headsets at Virtual Research Inc.