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I didn’t think a 15 minute fill up is reality yet in most cases. If it is, that’s a decent step. 15 minutes versus 5 still isn’t negligible to me. I spend 0 time at gas stations besides filling the car up which takes under 5 minutes.

15 minutes is a reality. V3 Superchargers are already open. They even recently opened up the V3 superchargers on Las Vegas strip.

I mean if you want to nitpick the details, you spend 5-10 minutes going to a gas station to fill up every week (include the round trip traveling time away from your route and time staying there). For Tesla owners, it only takes 5 seconds to plugin everyday. In a year, you spend 4-9 hours of "busy time" with a gas station. That equates to about 16-36 visits to a Supercharger in a year which is more than what a typical Tesla customer does. But even then, a Tesla driver isn't waiting at the Supercharger, they're having a meal, so they aren't really wasting time. You however can't really do anything at a gas station, so you're wasting 4-9 hours of your life at a gas station every year.

Civic is $19K. $16K extra plus tax buys a lot of maintenance and gas. Civics need practically 0 maintenance besides oil changes for the better part of 100,000 miles.

And in the end, energy isn’t free or green. You have a free charging station, but most people will have to pay most times and definitely if you want the fast fill up.

“According to the cost calculator available from the independent website Teslanomics, consumers would need to pay roughly $712.80 in charging costs annually for the lowest-cost Model 3, assuming a daily commute of 40 miles.”

Teslanomics calculator is not an indication of what people are doing on average. Regardless, $712.80 per year is still far cheaper than gas.

For a Civic, the 105,000 mile maintenance schedule is (taken from a Honda dealer website):
  • Oil and filter change
  • Inspect brakes for wear
  • Lubricate throttle linkage
  • Check and correct fluid levels
  • Inspect tires and set tire pressure
  • Rotate tires
  • Lubricate chassis and hinges as required
  • Replace oil drain plug, gasket
  • Rotate and balance wheels and tires
  • Inspect undercarriage
  • Inspect crankcase filter
  • Inspect shocks and struts
  • Torque throttle body mount bolts
  • Inspect throttle leakage
  • Check and adjust clutch pedal freeplay as applicable
  • Inspect distributor cap-rotor-wires
  • Inspect A/C and heater operation
  • Service transmission
  • Check park brake adjustment
  • Inspect all lights and wipers
  • Oil and filter change
  • Replace air filter
  • Inspect for trans. leaks
  • Level control
  • Steering systems
  • Fuel and break systems
  • Replace spark plugs (if necessary)
  • Inspect and adjust drive belts
  • Inspect air filter elements
  • Rotate tires
  • Inspect brake system
  • Adjust parking brake
  • Check all exterior and interior lamps, windshield washer systems
  • Lubricate throttle shafts
  • Inspect drive shaft boots
  • Inspect differential oil
  • Inspect exhaust pipes and mountings
  • Inspect steering gear box
  • Inspect steering wheel, linkage, and boots
  • Inspect road test vehicle
  • Inspect ball joints and dust covers
  • Inspect brake lines and hoses
  • Inspect brake linings/drums and brake pads/discs
  • Inspect automatic transmission fluid
  • Replace windshield wiper insert(s)
  • Re-torque drive shaft bolt
  • Re-torque propeller shaft bolt
  • Lubricate all hinges and latches, door locks and door weather-strips
  • Lubricate propeller shaft
  • Replace air conditioning filter


87 gas is like $2.65/gallon and the civic gets almost 40mpg. Assume 400 gallons of gas for a year driving 40 miles per day...that’s only $1,060 in gas for the Civic and it cost $16,000 less for the car.

Installing a charging station in your house also costs money.

Assuming $2.65 doesn't change, sure. When was the last time your electric rates changed (and how many times in the past several years)? I mean Just a few months ago, gas was $4.2/gal in California which is 58% more than what you calculated. Potentially you could be paying $1,540.30.

$1,540.30 - $712.80 = ~$800 which could pay for an installation of a home charger and a few months of charging just from one year of savings. Even better if you have solar.

Teslas do require some maintenance. The same site a referenced earlier says it’s $2800 over 5 years. They’ve also been unreliable, so million mile warranties mean nothing.

No. Go back to the site and plug in $0 for car loan, insurance, and energy costs, you'll see $0. There's no maintenance. The number you saw was for car payments, insurance, and energy costs. See: https://i.imgur.com/QKIlLN5.png

You seem to be assuming Tesla is somehow bad without having any evidence to back it up. You're refusing to listen to the facts. Also you seem to be brainwashed by all the false articles written about Tesla. So I'm going to end the conversation here. I wont be reading more comments from you.
 
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15 minutes is a reality. V3 Superchargers are already open. They even recently opened up the V3 superchargers on Las Vegas strip.

I mean if you want to nitpick the details, you spend 5-10 minutes going to a gas station to fill up every week (include the round trip traveling time away from your route and time staying there). For Tesla owners, it only takes 5 seconds to plugin everyday. In a year, you spend 4-9 hours of "busy time" with a gas station. That equates to about 16-36 visits to a Supercharger in a year which is more than what a typical Tesla customer does. But even then, a Tesla driver isn't waiting at the Supercharger, they're having a meal, so they aren't really wasting time. You however can't really do anything at a gas station, so you're wasting 4-9 hours of your life at a gas station every year.



Teslanomics calculator is not an indication of what people are doing on average. Regardless, $712.80 per year is still far cheaper than gas.

For a Civic, the 105,000 mile maintenance schedule is (taken from a Honda dealer website):
  • Oil and filter change
  • Inspect brakes for wear
  • Lubricate throttle linkage
  • Check and correct fluid levels
  • Inspect tires and set tire pressure
  • Rotate tires
  • Lubricate chassis and hinges as required
  • Replace oil drain plug, gasket
  • Rotate and balance wheels and tires
  • Inspect undercarriage
  • Inspect crankcase filter
  • Inspect shocks and struts
  • Torque throttle body mount bolts
  • Inspect throttle leakage
  • Check and adjust clutch pedal freeplay as applicable
  • Inspect distributor cap-rotor-wires
  • Inspect A/C and heater operation
  • Service transmission
  • Check park brake adjustment
  • Inspect all lights and wipers
  • Oil and filter change
  • Replace air filter
  • Inspect for trans. leaks
  • Level control
  • Steering systems
  • Fuel and break systems
  • Replace spark plugs (if necessary)
  • Inspect and adjust drive belts
  • Inspect air filter elements
  • Rotate tires
  • Inspect brake system
  • Adjust parking brake
  • Check all exterior and interior lamps, windshield washer systems
  • Lubricate throttle shafts
  • Inspect drive shaft boots
  • Inspect differential oil
  • Inspect exhaust pipes and mountings
  • Inspect steering gear box
  • Inspect steering wheel, linkage, and boots
  • Inspect road test vehicle
  • Inspect ball joints and dust covers
  • Inspect brake lines and hoses
  • Inspect brake linings/drums and brake pads/discs
  • Inspect automatic transmission fluid
  • Replace windshield wiper insert(s)
  • Re-torque drive shaft bolt
  • Re-torque propeller shaft bolt
  • Lubricate all hinges and latches, door locks and door weather-strips
  • Lubricate propeller shaft
  • Replace air conditioning filter




Assuming $2.65 doesn't change, sure. When was the last time your electric rates changed (and how many times in the past several years)? I mean Just a few months ago, gas was $4.2/gal in California which is 58% more than what you calculated. Potentially you could be paying $1,540.30.

$1,540.30 - $712.80 = ~$800 which could pay for an installation of a home charger and a few months of charging just from one year of savings. Even better if you have solar.



No. Go back to the site and plug in $0 for car loan, insurance, and energy costs, you'll see $0. There's no maintenance. The number you saw was for car payments, insurance, and energy costs. See: https://i.imgur.com/QKIlLN5.png

You seem to be assuming Tesla is somehow bad without having any evidence to back it up. You're refusing to listen to the facts. Also you seem to be brainwashed by all the false articles written about Tesla. So I'm going to end the conversation here. I wont be reading more comments from you.
So you didn’t get to the $16,000 price difference at all. Unless you think the Tesla is just that much nicer of a car? I don’t.

The maintenance schedule you posted is almost entire “inspect” steps. If you’ve ever owned a Civic, you know practically the only thing you do are oil changes and tires.

You took the worst case gas scenario. The national average is under $3 and the civic gets 40MPG. 1 gallon per day in the Tesla comparable star on the website for average commute. That’s $1100 versus $713 for the Tesla or about $400 difference. You’d have to drive 40 years to make up the difference in gas.

Motortrend just tested the V3 and it charged a Model 3 from 5 to 90% in 37 minutes...hardly 15 minutes or fast enough to disprove my point.
https://www.motortrend.com/news/teslas-v3-supercharger-tested/

Furthermore, V3 superchargers are not nearly as widely available as necessary.

Tesla’s own website recommends service on brakes, brake fluid, lubrication, air conditioning, and filters. You could and should also inspect things.

You also ignore real reliability issues that have been highly publicized. https://www.google.com/amp/s/techcr...recommendation-over-reliability-problems/amp/

Solar is not free. Ever priced installing panels? I worked at an energy company. Terrible investment. Electric prices change all the time, particularly in my state as much of the electricity is produced with natural gas.

Say what you want. Tesla just again lost $408M in 90 days and has not proven their business model, namely the Model 3, is profitable. Their cars have terrible fit and finish, questionable reliability and they use an old Toyota manufacturing plant.

Competition is going to come eventually and losing $500M per quarter isn’t giving them the cushion or lead they should be getting as a first mover. They are squandering it.
 
tech is here with model 3 with supercharging v3 already released. car manufacturers are actually going hard into EV, but it takes them several years to react with a new product.
[doublepost=1563951922][/doublepost]

very sad that you failed to read properly.

i said #1 in USA for 2018.

did i say "it's the #1 best selling car in the Netherlands for 2018"? no. of course it wasn't the best selling car in Netherlands in 2018 because Tesla didn't start selling Model 3 in Netherlands until 2019.

all i said was "it's the #1 best selling car in the Netherlands" which is currently (present day) true as of this moment.

read carefully next time before you accuse someone of being a liar.
And yet again that is also not true, you seem to be a persistent liar who rather than admitting to have made a mistake starts digging and then shifting the goal posts.

Tesla - 16th Place with only 3.35% of the market, upto May 2019 -> https://www.autoweek.nl/verkoopcijfers/2019/

And if you want the official first 6 months of the year from the RAI then it doesn't make the Brand top 5 either, and just incase you want shift the goalposts again, yes based upon individual models it is not doing badly with the model 3 in 3rd place. Still not the best selling model either according to the official figures, as it is only 2.7% of the market.
https://autorai.nl/de-5-best-verkochte-merken-en-modellen-van-eerste-helft-2019/

What has happened, and that you can see in the link above is that the Tesla Model 3 had the most registrations in June 2019. That is not the same as best selling car by a country mile.

So if you don't want to be called out as a repeat liar perhaps put some evidence behind your wild statements.
 
And yet again that is also not true, you seem to be a persistent liar who rather than admitting to have made a mistake starts digging and then shifting the goal posts.

Tesla - 16th Place with only 3.35% of the market, upto May 2019 -> https://www.autoweek.nl/verkoopcijfers/2019/

I never said Tesla is #1 brand in Netherlands, so why are you linking BRAND SALES? Are you trying to move the goal post?

And if you want the official first 6 months of the year from the RAI then it doesn't make the Brand top 5 either, and just incase you want shift the goalposts again, yes based upon individual models it is not doing badly with the model 3 in 3rd place. Still not the best selling model either according to the official figures, as it is only 2.7% of the market.
https://autorai.nl/de-5-best-verkochte-merken-en-modellen-van-eerste-helft-2019/

What has happened, and that you can see in the link above is that the Tesla Model 3 had the most registrations in June 2019. That is not the same as best selling car by a country mile.

So if you don't want to be called out as a repeat liar perhaps put some evidence behind your wild statements.

No I don't want the first 6 months because Tesla didn't start selling in the Netherlands until late January/early February. So why would I want figures that includes January? Talk about moving goal posts.

In June 2019, Tesla Model 3 is the best selling model. And we're talking SALES.
Link which takes figures from RAI Association, BOVAG and RDC:
https://www.bovag.nl/nieuws/autoverkopen-eerste-half-jaar-10-5-procent-in-de-m

I'm done talking with you. You seem to not be reading anything properly and yet you keep accusing me of being a liar when I've been truthful the entire time. Feel free to reply but I won't be reading anymore replies from you.
 
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Google's top link also says that McDonalds sells more burgers than any other chain in the world.

I know where I'm not going if I want a good burger.
This is a poor analogy. A bit more research goes into a $50K car purchase than a $1.50 budget burger purchase.
 
I never said Tesla is #1 brand in Netherlands, so why are you linking BRAND SALES? Are you trying to move the goal post?



No I don't want the first 6 months because Tesla didn't start selling in the Netherlands until late January/early February. So why would I want figures that includes January? Talk about moving goal posts.

In June 2019, Tesla Model 3 is the best selling model. And we're talking SALES.
Link which takes figures from RAI Association, BOVAG and RDC:
https://www.bovag.nl/nieuws/autoverkopen-eerste-half-jaar-10-5-procent-in-de-m


I'm done talking with you. You seem to not be reading anything properly and yet you keep accusing me of being a liar when I've been truthful the entire time. Feel free to reply but I won't be reading anymore replies from you.

I know the article says sales, but it is registrations as per my previous link. And that is for just June, just think why there is such a spike in just one month. The clue is is your own post...

And interesting you talk about moving the goal posts...This is what you said in post #43 in response too....

Tesla has terrible interiors, all the way up to their more expensive models.
[doublepost=1563831310][/doublepost]
Teslas aren't popular either. The brand may be popular, but they hardly sell any cars.

it was the best selling luxury car of 2018 in the USA. it's the #1 best selling car in the Netherlands. they only recently started selling international too. what are you smoking?

There is no limit to just June 2019, there is no limit to just the model 3 either...Funny that when I responded to that and disproved it you start changing your tune but aren't man enough to admit that actually what you wrote was simply not true. And even in June it wasn't sale it was registrations, an accumulation of sales from the previous months being delivered through the backlog of the supply chain...
 
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