Apple Hit With Securities Fraud Lawsuit for Hiding iPhone Sales Drop

[Wanted797]

This drives me crazy. Investing is gambling. You can sue when it goes bad.
[doublepost=1555573067][/doublepost]

Let's try this again…

View attachment 832663

In this case, we're talking about the head that revolutionized Apple's supply chain, buying up millions of CNC machines the early 200s, and enabling Jony Ive's designs to be realized on a mass scale, right? Prior to Cook's intervention, Macs were made in multiple countries with parts being flown back and forth at various stages of assembly. A part from California would by flown to Amsterdam for additional work before being flown back to California.


Again, he's responsible for coordinating manufacturing that every tech company on the world has adopted as standard. I just got done with Ive's biography, and it seems to me that people advocating against Cook have a rather myopic view of Apple.

At the turn of the century, Apple was like every other tech company; engineers made things and then designers added their "skinned" them. Jobs returned a few days before Ive wanted to quit and reemphasized Apple's ethos: to make great products.

Everything was turned on its head. Function followed form; if the Mac mini were a couple mm larger, it could've housed a less expensive full-sized drive, but Ive and Jobs had twenty models constructed and liked the feeling of the ever-so-slightly-smaller design.

The unibody enclosures that are now characteristic of Apple products were only possible because of the manufacturing Tim secured, the complaints that Animoji and other superficial **** are taking focus away from functionality mirror those of people who believed that Apple's stupid attention to form inhibited function. And Apple's prices have always sucked; the Mac, the iMac, and the iPod were all extremely pricey relative to the competition and their own intended prices.

Nonetheless, Apple has pushed the industry forward, and each of Ive's reductionist designs are copied by all of the competition about half a decade later. No disk drive on the iMac, no CD drive on 2012 MacBooks, and no headphone jack on the iPhone. Some of these decisions were executed under Jobs and are now carried out by Tim.

tl;dr: you can put an "r" between "C" and "ook" all you want, you can claim you're thinking different (even though it's similar to a lotta thinking on this site), but that doesn't change the fact that the Animoji-obsessed, price gouging Tim Cook has pushed the industry forward and is partially responsible for all of Apple's success since the early 2000s.

You should write comments more often.

 

[ginkobiloba]

Let's try this again…


In this case, we're talking about the head that revolutionized Apple's supply chain, buying up millions of CNC machines the early 200s, and enabling Jony Ive's designs to be realized on a mass scale, right? Prior to Cook's intervention, Macs were made in multiple countries with parts being flown back and forth at various stages of assembly. A part from California would by flown to Amsterdam for additional work before being flown back to California.


Again, he's responsible for coordinating manufacturing that every tech company on the world has adopted as standard. I just got done with Ive's biography, and it seems to me that people advocating against Cook have a rather myopic view of Apple.

.

He is certainly brilliant at designing the perfect supply chain, and he should have remained in that job. He did not design the future of Apple or personal computing, Steve Jobs did. Tim Cook should have been an iterim CEO after Jobs death, until someone with a real vision emerges and takes the place of Jobs. Maybe there is no one to fill that position right now, so Tim Cook is better than nothing I guess.

 

[FyerFyer]

These lawsuits are so dumb.

What if I told you Apple stock is back at $200 now?

I would say that is specifically irrelevant to providing false numbers in regards to iPhone sales however may be the reason it is currently at that number.

 

[yngrshr]

Pride and GREED. Just lower the prices and the products will sell. Simple.

Randomly capitalizing a word doesn’t make you more accurate when you clearly don’t understand the underlying issue in the first place.

 

[PickUrPoison]

I would say that is specifically irrelevant to providing false numbers in regards to iPhone sales however may be the reason it is currently at that number.

False iPhone sales numbers were provided?

 

[Remy149]

He is certainly brilliant at designing the perfect supply chain, and he should have remained in that job. He did not design the future of Apple or personal computing, Steve Jobs did. Tim Cook should have been an iterim CEO after Jobs death, until someone with a real vision emerges and takes the place of Jobs. Maybe there is no one to fill that position right now, so Tim Cook is better than nothing I guess.

So you know what’s better for the company then Jobs did. People act like cool wasn’t hand picked by Steve to take over after he was gone. Folks also act as if Jobs single handed came up with every product released during his tenure

 

[Kabeyun]

People always attribute Apple's successes 'single handedly' to Tim.

Or, in the real world, no one does. What a weird thing to suggest. Everyone here who attributes Apple’s success solely to Tim Cook, speak up.

Bueller? Bueller?

 

[FyerFyer]

False iPhone sales numbers were provided?

https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...-selling-iphone-since-october-launch.2157594/

I believe this quote from Apple will be used in conjunction with the accusations in these new lawsuits.

There is no doubt, imho, Apple purposely provided false numbers in relation to their IPhone sales for the XR and XS during the quarter they were launched.

 

[Tiger8]

The fish rots from its head: Tim Crook

Really don't like what the guys been doing over the years, stalling consumer technology progress.

I'm not his biggest fan, but I have to say this statement is neither correct nor fair. What a lot of people don't understand is that the Apple that Tim inherited is a much different company than the one Jobs inherited a decade earlier, so we can't keep using the 'Steve would never do that' line.

 

[PickUrPoison]

https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...-selling-iphone-since-october-launch.2157594/

I believe this quote from Apple will be used in conjunction with the accusations in these new lawsuits.

There is no doubt, imho, Apple purposely provided false numbers in relation to their IPhone sales for the XR and XS during the quarter they were launched.

Whether you realize it or not, your “opinion” has no relevance to whether false iPhone sales numbers were or were not provided.

So apparently the answer to my question is that there’s no evidence that false iPhone sales numbers were provided, but you don’t need evidence; you just make crap up and try to pass it off as fact.

 

[FyerFyer]

Whether you realize it or not, your “opinion” has no relevance to whether false iPhone sales numbers were or were not provided.

So apparently the answer to my question is that there’s no evidence that false iPhone sales numbers were provided, but you don’t need evidence; you just make crap up and try to pass it off as fact.

Imo you seem very ignorant. You seem to have never properly read any of the financial documents Apple produce, perhaps you don't know how to, perhaps a balance sheet is enough to satisfy you.
Nevertheless, opinions vary, some are made up based off of feelings, others from reading current, available evidence and forming an opinion.

I would suggest you learn how court cases and rulings are actually decided, opinions play a huge part (omg did I really have to explain that) and furthermore how business and financial statements are written.

First thing would be to read the link I sent you, form your own opinion of how it is linked to these new claims, but I don't know, judging by your last comment, Im not sure your really interested in "facts", maybe more so venting frustration.

 

[Carnegie]

https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...-selling-iphone-since-october-launch.2157594/

I believe this quote from Apple will be used in conjunction with the accusations in these new lawsuits.

There is no doubt, imho, Apple purposely provided false numbers in relation to their IPhone sales for the XR and XS during the quarter they were launched.

Which numbers related to iPhone XR and XS sales, which Apple provided, do you think were false?

 

[neuropsychguy]

Imo you seem very ignorant. You seem to have never properly read any of the financial documents Apple produce, perhaps you don't know how to, perhaps a balance sheet is enough to satisfy you.
Nevertheless, opinions vary, some are made up based off of feelings, others from reading current, available evidence and forming an opinion.

I would suggest you learn how court cases and rulings are actually decided, opinions play a huge part (omg did I really have to explain that) and furthermore how business and financial statements are written.

First thing would be to read the link I sent you, form your own opinion of how it is linked to these new claims, but I don't know, judging by your last comment, Im not sure your really interested in "facts", maybe more so venting frustration.

I'm with the poster you're replying to (I'm not him/her). I have read Apple's financial documents (I'm a shareholder and pay close attention). I read through the link you posted and there is no evidence of what you're suggesting. It's all speculation and opinion. You might think you're posting facts but they are not.

 

[Carnegie]

This complaint is pretty weak. If the actual statements which it identifies as materially false and misleading are the best the plaintiff can come up with, this case has no merit.

It was clear to me 4 paragraphs in that this wasn't going to be a serious complaint when I read this BS assertion:

Apple also aggressively increased the pricing of its iPhones from the $99-$399 range maintained through 2013 to a top offering price of $1,449 for the Apple XS Max with 512 gigabytes in September 2018.

 

[FyerFyer]

I'm with the poster you're replying to (I'm not him/her). I have read Apple's financial documents (I'm a shareholder and pay close attention). I read through the link you posted and there is no evidence of what you're suggesting. It's all speculation and opinion. You might think you're posting facts but they are not.

I don't get your argument Im afraid. I clearly pointed out using the facts and evidence out there already to form an opinion; hence my original post stating "imho".

Furthermore, Im very confused as to how you have read the statements and see no discrepancies between Apple press releases and the reported numbers for Q3&4 2018. The fact they didn't report certain parts for their first time is a red flag.
They mislead to inflate the stock price to avoid a potential 9 billion loss, clear as day - misleading predictions with shifted numbers. It's in black and white.

Nevertheless, it will come out in court if the lawyers these claimants know what they are doing.

 

[thadoggfather]

I'm not his biggest fan, but I have to say this statement is neither correct nor fair. What a lot of people don't understand is that the Apple that Tim inherited is a much different company than the one Jobs inherited a decade earlier, so we can't keep using the 'Steve would never do that' line.

Sounds like an excuse that may have carried some weight when leadership initially shifted, but how long has he been CEO for now? 8 friggin years? You sure are patient before "rushing" to any conclusions

How very non judgmental of you, in the corporate world. Also, you dont really refer to anything specifically "its a different company" which means nothing. It sure is a different company. Innovation halted, prices hiked, and more people than ever defending their every decision without even being compensated for it. its incredible.

 

[I7guy]

Sounds like an excuse that may have carried some weight when leadership initially shifted, but how long has he been CEO for now? 8 friggin years? You sure are patient before "rushing" to any conclusions

How very non judgmental of you, in the corporate world. Also, you dont really refer to anything specifically "its a different company" which means nothing. It sure is a different company. Innovation halted, prices hiked, and more people than ever defending their every decision without even being compensated for it. its incredible.

Don’t forget also, the company hit $1T, is looking at further avenues for the ecosystem and more people criticizing Apple for free.

 

[thadoggfather]

Don’t forget also, the company hit $1T, is looking at further avenues for the ecosystem and more people criticizing Apple for free.

I havent forgotten,

Supply chain 'genius', market valuation, what does any of this MATTER if you are just a non-investing consumer of Apple products for argument's sake? I dont get it

Tim Cook EVEN said $1t value "isnt what drives us." We know that's total bogus as a profound bean counter billionaire obsessed with his bottom line, but he discredits it himself. If that were true, we would tangibly see it with lower prices. That would necessarily mean that that isnt what drives them, especially with high margins to play around with / have as buffer. When we have a $1000 phone standard now in 2019, its obviously not reflected in their actions.

But as average nobodies, we're supposed to give weight to that, for why there's no innovation? 'They got lots of moneys' Cool I'm not saying they're doomed or poor. I'm saying they could do much better, and are relatively dry on ideas, even factoring in that Steve Jobs is dead, never coming back, and will never be able to be truly 'replaced'. Tim is still a very poor 'sequel' with all that in mind in my opinion.

'That guy's a total jerk of a neighbor, he blasts his music all day and night, has his dog poop in my lawn, never waves at me when he passes in the neighborhood"

"BUT HES A BILLIONAIRE!"

so what? Is this forum that vain that money excuses everything? Sad

 

[I7guy]

Supply chain 'genius', market valuation, what does any of this MATTER if you are just a non-investing consumer of Apple products for argument's sake? I dont get it

Tim Cook EVEN said $1t value "isnt what drives us." We know that's total bogus as a profound bean counter billionaire obsessed with his bottom line, but he discredits it himself. But as average nobodies, we're supposed to give weight to that, for why there's no innovation? 'They got lots of moneys' Cool I'm not saying they're doomed or poor. I'm saying they could do much better, and are relatively dry on ideas, even considering that Steve Jobs is dead and never being able to be truly 'replaced'.

'That guy's a total jerk of a neighbor, he blasts his music all day and night, has his dog poop in my lawn, never waves at me when he passes in the neighborhood"

"BUT HES A BILLIONAIRE!"

so what? Is this forum that vain that money excuses everything? Sad

This is a thread about a suit for securities fraud. Because you don’t like Tim’s style or the way he’s running Apple doesn’t mean a judgment will be found for the plaintiff.

 

[thadoggfather]

This is a thread about a suit for securities fraud. Because you don’t like Tim’s style or the way he’s running Apple doesn’t mean a judgment will be found for the plaintiff.

Weird how you switch subjects like that rather than respond to what i said from something you wanted me to respond to. Cool.

This comment hits the nail on the head in the comments section (and I didnt write it):

When a company is making lots of money the CEO takes full credit and gets his big bonus. When the company starts loosing money then it's someone else fault. The reason why apple is loosing money is because TIm Cook doesn't know what he's doing.

--

Why couldnt it be possible Tim was dishonest? That's totally beyond belief? Don't you remember how hard he fumbled publicly blaming everyone and everything (macro economic factors, China, etc) except himself and the company for hiking prices? Their trade-in marketing shilling on Apple.com and lowering price on iPhones in some markets where its really struggling, is all but an admission that it's their fault -- using unprecedented strategies to push units

Of course the lawsuit will fail, you think Apple has a weak team of lawyers on standby for when things get hairy? But that's totally besides the point, isn't it, the reality of things?

 

[citysnaps]

Oh the irony. Fanboys applaud Tim and use high stock values to evaluate his success. What else is Apple hiding?

Fixed:
Apple customers applaud Tim and his company's outstanding products, purchased by several hundred million happy customers year after year after year, to evaluate his success.

 

[I7guy]

Weird how you switch subjects like that rather than respond to what i said from something you wanted me to respond to. Cool.

This comment hits the nail on the head in the comments section (and I didnt write it):

When a company is making lots of money the CEO takes full credit and gets his big bonus. When the company starts loosing money then it's someone else fault. The reason why apple is loosing money is because TIm Cook doesn't know what he's doing.

--

Why couldnt it be possible Tim was dishonest? That's totally beyond belief? Don't you remember how hard he fumbled publicly blaming everyone and everything (macro economic factors, China, etc) except himself and the company for hiking prices? Their trade-in marketing shilling on Apple.com and lowering price on iPhones in some markets where its really struggling, is all but an admission that it's their fault -- using unprecedented strategies to push units

Of course the lawsuit will fail, you think Apple has a weak team of lawyers on standby for when things get hairy? But that's totally besides the point, isn't it, the reality of things?

I didn’t respond point by point because your post looks like some typical anti-Apple rant that unfortunately is prevalent on this site.

That is not to say Apple can’t improve or do things different, however I like to think Apple has done a great job over the last x years, and that is my opinion. The proof is in the pudding with apple’s financial success.

 

[thadoggfather]

I didn’t respond point by point because your post looks like some typical anti-Apple rant that unfortunately is prevalent on this site.

That is not to say Apple can’t improve or do things different, however I like to think Apple has done a great job over the last x years, and that is my opinion. The proof is in the pudding with apple’s financial success.

Nevermind point by point, you didnt respond to anything: you pivoted.

And that's where I agree to disagree with you, and that's what I've been trying to say over and over and over again: Financial success isn't a direct indicator of quality. It's an indicator of financial success.

Look at McDonalds, mega blockbuster films, vapid forgettable NYTimes best sellers, etc etc etc.

I would encourage you to be more un-phased by criticism of Holy Apple. But by the end of the day, you do you.

 

[CntryClub007]

Powerful post, powerful. Kudos to you, seriously. One of the best I’ve ever read from you. As a mechanical engineer, all I can say is “yes”

Let's try this again…

View attachment 832663

In this case, we're talking about the head that revolutionized Apple's supply chain, buying up millions of CNC machines the early 200s, and enabling Jony Ive's designs to be realized on a mass scale, right? Prior to Cook's intervention, Macs were made in multiple countries with parts being flown back and forth at various stages of assembly. A part from California would by flown to Amsterdam for additional work before being flown back to California.


Again, he's responsible for coordinating manufacturing that every tech company on the world has adopted as standard. I just got done with Ive's biography, and it seems to me that people advocating against Cook have a rather myopic view of Apple.

At the turn of the century, Apple was like every other tech company; engineers made things and then designers added their "skinned" them. Jobs returned a few days before Ive wanted to quit and reemphasized Apple's ethos: to make great products.

Everything was turned on its head. Function followed form; if the Mac mini were a couple mm larger, it could've housed a less expensive full-sized drive, but Ive and Jobs had twenty models constructed and liked the feeling of the ever-so-slightly-smaller design.

The unibody enclosures that are now characteristic of Apple products were only possible because of the manufacturing Tim secured, the complaints that Animoji and other superficial **** are taking focus away from functionality mirror those of people who believed that Apple's stupid attention to form inhibited function. And Apple's prices have always sucked; the Mac, the iMac, and the iPod were all extremely pricey relative to the competition and their own intended prices.

Nonetheless, Apple has pushed the industry forward, and each of Ive's reductionist designs are copied by all of the competition about half a decade later. No disk drive on the iMac, no CD drive on 2012 MacBooks, and no headphone jack on the iPhone. Some of these decisions were executed under Jobs and are now carried out by Tim.

tl;dr: you can put an "r" between "C" and "ook" all you want, you can claim you're thinking different (even though it's similar to a lotta thinking on this site), but that doesn't change the fact that the Animoji-obsessed, price gouging Tim Cook has pushed the industry forward and is partially responsible for all of Apple's success since the early 2000s.

 

[macsimcon]

This is a civil case. Nobody will be found guilty of breaking any law. And the allegation in the complaint are allegations, not facts.

Not to be pedantic, but The Securities Exchange Act of 1934 IS federal law, so when Tim and Luca lied, they broke the law. And they also committed crimes under 15 U.S.C. § 78j. Each lie Tim and Luca told is a separate criminal act under 15 U.S.C. § 78j.

Again, READ the complaint. The quotes from Tim and Luca are prima facie evidence of their violations. Is Apple going to claim that they never said those things? That would be tough, as the calls were recorded.

Tim may be a great guy, but he belongs in prison.