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I mean, we Europeans have always been second-class users for Apple, so what else is new? We still haven’t received features from older iOS versions. They are killing their own incentive to upgrade to a new phone. iOS 18 already has nearly zero new features for non-US, non-English speaking countries.
 
I think it’s pretty clear the DMA is about services they make money from… Unless Apple intends to charge 30% from a developer because you were mirroring your screen to a Mac or whatever (which at this point I don’t necessarily doubt)
Apple's claim is that this has to do with security and privacy - which implies that something related to this would need to be opened in a way that makes the user vulnerable. Not that the EU is going to smack them down for doing this.
 
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THIS is what we mean when we say that the EU has created a bureaucratic nightmare for companies, which resulted in the EU being unable to compete in the global marketplace with digital technologies.

When there is overly burdonsome regulations, when you grant the power to Margrethe Vestager to be a designer of the OS, when companies can't read the letter of the law but will be subject to the subjective "spirit of the law" interpreations by regulators, then the cost of doing business in the EU become burdensome. And that directly contributes to an unfriendly business environment...

WHICH leads to LESS consumer choice. Less consumer freedom. Less consumer benefit.
 
Margrethe Vestager did design the market in which Apple can design the best OS it can to compete in that market. If Apple can't do that, they loose.
And who do they lose to, exactly? If Apple needs to open itself up like Android, which compromises multiple differentiating strengths and philosophies around their product models, that is already losing. So lose-lose.
 
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You know what would be funny? If the EU actually came out with a statement that said something like “Actually we do not deem Apple Intelligence and IPhone Mirroring unconstitutional.”. What would Apple do then?
 
I mean, we Europeans have always been second-class users for Apple, so what else is new? We still haven’t received features from older iOS versions. They are killing their own incentive to upgrade to a new phone. iOS 18 already has nearly zero new features for non-US, non-English speaking countries.

They're saving you money

The iPhone upgrades are just rearranging the deck chairs each year

A little faster .. a camera tweak ... yet another slightly different shade of "black" ... slight shape change to force new accessory upgrades

This space is dead on innovation (at least from Apple)
 
I dont know how iphone screen miroring affects DMA? This feature is awailable on android phones for a while in EU without any problems with DMA. It is between my computer and my phone. WTF Apple????
As already mentioned earlier in the thread, probably they are worried that the EU will decide that Apple has to open up the screen sharing APIs to other hardware manufacturers, and there are probably security/privacy concerns in doing so.

Not knowing how the feature works behind the scenes, I'd venture they'd need pretty deep access. I wouldn't want Microsoft to be able to see everything that happens on my phone because I happen to be using a Windows computer, for example.

Long story short, DMA defenders reap what they sow.
 
this is complete and utter bantha poodoo!

nothing in our dma says apple can't bring it to our markets in the way they've announced it at wwdc in fact I would say and hazzard a guess with them offering an external ai processor from the start, in this case OpenAI's ChatGPT, it is already in complete compliance with the spirit of the DMA. Add to that the fact they spent a long time going on about their private cloud compute and then I assume it's also in compliance of GDPR and even goes beyond what GDPR stipulates.

So, this is just Apple being spiteful for their other troubles with eu lawmakers, the spotify case and the epic thing....
Sure sure. Or this is the (un)intended consequence of overregulation.
 
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I mean, we Europeans have always been second-class users for Apple, so what else is new? We still haven’t received features from older iOS versions. They are killing their own incentive to upgrade to a new phone. iOS 18 already has nearly zero new features for non-US, non-English speaking countries.
Ummm...perhaps you can start to realize that it is the business unfriendly regulatory environment in the EU that's harming you. Not Apple.
 
I mean, we Europeans have always been second-class users for Apple, so what else is new? We still haven’t received features from older iOS versions. They are killing their own incentive to upgrade to a new phone. iOS 18 already has nearly zero new features for non-US, non-English speaking countries.
Exactly. It wasn’t coming to Europe then anyway because it’s US English only for now. And if you’re outside the US you benefit from half the features announced each year. Not that that’s different from Google, but at least Android was available in my language from the start. It took Apple 16 years to translate iOS into my language.
 
You're confusing an EU member with Apple

Apple is the one trying to tell you what you can and can't do with your device

The ironic part is that you're actually proving the existence of the syndrome here
Four key components of Stockholm Syndrome -- pay attention to #1 and #4

  • A hostage's development of positive feelings towards the captor
  • No previous relationship between hostage and captor
  • A refusal by hostages to cooperate with police and other government authorities
  • A hostage's belief in the humanity of the captor, ceasing to perceive them as a threat, when the victim holds the same values as the aggressor
No, I'm not confusing anything, you're just ignoring the other side of the same conversation...
 
How is Apple supposed to implement iPhone mirroring without letting any other company have access to core APIs that would allow this sort of interaction? That would violate the DMA

How is Apple supposed to implement Apple Intelligence without giving third party AI programs the same core OS access that Apple Intelligence will have? (Chat GPT does not have that same access, it will be more akin to a wrapper that Siri will pass requests to)

This was something people were screaming out when the DMA was being debated. And now it's happening
But what about the kids?!!
 
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They're saving you money

The iPhone upgrades are just rearranging the deck chairs each year

A little faster .. a camera tweak ... yet another slightly different shade of "black" ... slight shape change to force new accessory upgrades

This space is dead on innovation (at least from Apple)
Can you show an example of what you do consider “innovation” in the smartphone space? It’s a pretty well defined and mature market nearly 20 years in…
 
Margrethe Vestager is a Danish politician and currently the EU Commissioner for Competition. Her job is design markets, and she can't do it alone, 27 member states and the European Parliament are involved too.
Politician shouldn’t be deciding what an OS can or can’t do. There is a reason very few EU companies innovate, and lag behind countries like China and India. EU is losing the startup tech war to Asian countries, dont bother comparing to us.
 
Do not be fooled - they can very well do it. They are just trying to strong-arm the EU Commission by upsetting EU customers. Do not cave in. This is not an issue with the DMA.

I think there is some of that yes.

It could be a double-edged sword though …

If other big tech companies start restricting their product offering in the EU as well, consumers are indeed likely to turn against the European Comission.

But if Apple are isolated in doing it, their EU customer might actually turn against the company and look into the competition (thinking: “why paying for Apple premium prices if I am not even getting the full products?”).
 
It doesn’t matter, if it is a judgement call. Companies will not take a chance, the moment EU inserts itself in to the OS. Apple or any other company will not risk even if there is a hint of DMA lurking over the head. It’s enterprise risk management 101.

So, how is an operating system feature the same as a digital market? By this contrived logic the 100% safest thing to do would be to leave the EU.

The only way this would make sense would be if Apple Intelligence was going to be a premium service that users had to pay for. So far, there's been no indication of that.
 
Why do things like Handoff, Continuity Camera, etc. work in the EU then? These don't have all of those core APIs available either.

I believe things like Handoff and Continuity are subject to the DMA and Apple is required to allow access if/when developers request it. But the fact you're even asking the question kinda proves the point—the DMA is hopelessly vague and incoherent.

EDIT: On second thought, Handoff and Continuity may not be subject to the DMA because they're considered features of macOS, which is not considered a gatekeeper, rather than iOS, which is. Regardless, the DMA is hopelessly vague and incoherent.
 
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So, how is an operating system feature the same as a digital market? By this contrived logic the 100% safest thing to do would be to leave the EU.

The only way this would make sense would be if Apple Intelligence was going to be a premium service that users had to pay for. So far, there's been no indication of that.
DMA has lot more than OS feature, basically arbitrary definition of making APIS and features available to others. Tomorrow a company can go to EU and demand same level of access as Apple to its own device and OS. Why would Apple bother to go through this process. It’s basic common sense and risk management. Roll out safe features, and leave the non EU cutting edge for other countries.
 
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