iPhone X Apple is losing its mainstream, non-fan core with the X

[The-Real-Deal82]

Two guys on the factory floor where I work own iPhone 8’s and they are on just above minimum wage. Suggesting low earners don’t own current iPhones is ignorant in the extreme. It’s a lie and deliberately disingenuous. That sort of snobby attitude is what gets you laughed at repeatedly.

Incidentally the guy who owns the group I work for uses an iPhone 7 Plus and his personal worth is over €100m. He’s a modest guy too.

 

[lsutigerfan1976]

People don’t have to pay real money. You can get 0% carrier financing for flag ship phone whether it be an iPhone X or Samsung S8, Note8 etc from the premium carriers.

We are talking flagships not the lower end Android devices or pre paid carriers.

But just cause ppl can finance phones at zero percent. Doesn’t mean they are going to. If you are going to ask someone to finance that much for 2 years. Your advertising for why you should better be more than look at your phone to unlock it, and then send someone poop Animoji. lol

 

[boltjames]

Two guys on the factory floor where I work own iPhone 8’s and they are on just above minimum wage.

I'm sure I can find two billionaires who drive Toyota's, so what does that prove? That each of us can find individual anomalies? Good for us.

What I can tell you is that without a $0 iPhone and the lowest price of entry for a new model at $350 there will be hundreds of millions fewer people owning them in the next few years. We are just at the beginning. Those last free iPhone's circa 2014 are just starting to get to the point where their owners need to replace them. And they aren't going to find $0 iPhone's. They are only going to find $0 Android's.

And there is nothing wrong with any of this. This is Apple's business model. Notebooks, watches, streamers, pick a product category, Apple makes the most expensive versions on the market. The only reason that iPhone's went "mainstream" is because wireless carriers spent the money to give them away for a decade in a race to acquire new subscribers. Those days are over. Welcome to the new world.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I'm sure I can find two billionaires who drive Toyota's, so what does that prove? That each of us can find individual anomalies? Good for us.

What I can tell you is that without a $0 iPhone and the lowest price of entry for a new model at $350 there will be hundreds of millions fewer people owning them in the next few years. We are just at the beginning. Those last free iPhone's circa 2014 are just starting to get to the point where their owners need to replace them. And they aren't going to find $0 iPhone's. They are only going to find $0 Android's.

And there is nothing wrong with any of this. This is Apple's business model. Notebooks, watches, streamers, pick a product category, Apple makes the most expensive versions on the market. The only reason that iPhone's went "mainstream" is because wireless carriers spent the money to give them away for a decade in a race to acquire new subscribers. Those days are over. Welcome to the new world.

Free iPhones have never existed outside of America. The rest of your post is only relevant to your small part of the globe.

 

[cardfan]

As I said before. A smaller form factor may have turned a percentage of ppl off. The price seems ridiculous for a phone. And in the end the biggest things Apple tries to promote is face id. And Animoji. Which if I had a phone that was still serviceable. I would keep it. Those two features they promote so much aren’t really moving the needle.

I know I did some Apple dumping recently. Their stocked surged 51% this year so it's not like that wasn't an easy call. Apple has some PR issues right now with the processor throttling. But IMO, they could never tackle that 1000 dollar phone stuff. Their marketing really hurts right now pushing features that aren't that exciting. FaceID, while it works fine for me, isn't an exciting feature. I haven't even used the animoji stuff.

My daughter got excited to get airpods this xmas. Along with an apple watch. Phone wise, she's fine with her SE. It's the ecosystem and the way these devices work with each other that is changing her experience. An iphone X doesn't really change this or offer any more. I'm enjoying the Apple tv 4k but it still could use a lot of improvement and another area the iphone X doesn't really offer any superior experience. I'd probably buy some more Apple stuff if they made it. They don't. Routers, monitors, homekit or iot, more mac compatibility, anything that adds to ecosystem really. Apple isn't pushing it. Instead, it's animoji. Even the upcoming speaker, i don't want just a single speaker, i want a 2.1 or 5.1 system.

The real problem is that you don't hear about people getting macs for xmas. As Apple continues to neglect the heart of their business, it won't bode well long term. Hopefully..there's a renewed focus coming here soon as rumors of ios apps coming to macs are floating around.

 

[Martyimac]

If I may be so bold. Years ago Apple released the 6 series conceding that many folks had clamored for a larger screen to match their Android using friends. Approximately 1.5 years later the SE was released after  realized there was still a huge demand for a small phone.
I am guessing here that  will realize they overstepped their fan base, and their non fan base, and will release a phone that does not have all the wizbang that the X has, and it will be cheaper. This phone may be the rumored Iphone SE 2.
Not much of what I posted here has facts to back it up, but it sure does feel like the temperment that lead up to the release of the SE.

 

[Falhófnir]

The iPhone X is $1,250 or 40% more than the most expensive Android and exactly $1,250 more than 'free'.

"Even my cleaning girl has an iPhone" ain't happening anymore. Sure, she can buy a used iPhone 5C for pennies on Craigslist, but she's not getting an iPhone 8 or an iPhone X. Those cost actual money now, no more carrier subsidies. That gravy train is over. She can help herself to about a dozen Android's if she wants a new no-cost smartphone.

So the other side of the "Apple is pricing consumers out of the market" is that "Apple is making a premium product for elites". You can argue that anyone can get $1000 in credit and I can show you 40% of the population that either can't qualify or won't pay that much and will therefore be leaving the Apple ecosystem. Besides myself, the other people I've seen with an iPhone X are wealthy executives and their offspring.

Haha, but in all seriousness if your goal in life is to impress people with possessions (pro tip: they won't be) I'd seriously go with the Bentley, that can't be faked

Certainly here iPhones have never been subsidised - you could pay less up front if you increased the monthly payment, but that usually leads to paying more over the duration. In fact it's the same as in the USA, only the networks were honest about how it works. It never stopped people on welfare getting £7-800 iPhones before, so another £200 isn't going to deter people who are determined to have the new one. I know multi millionaires who would call you stupid for spending a grand on a phone, and I know people who don't have two pennies to rub together who will absolutely have the latest iPhone whatever. It has more to do with what you personally put value on than what you've got to spend. iPhones aren't elite or exclusive, they're usually individually the best selling phones of each generation - and that's what keeps apple rolling in it. They could put out a $10,000 iPhone but they'd not make much cash on it as only a few people would but it - even amongst those who'd not notice $10,000 missing from their accounts. People don't like being ripped off, however much money they have.

 

[Harthag]

I just LOL at some of the sanctimonious posts here. I see tons of 10s out in the wild and all walks of life where I live here in DT Chicago. Heck, my dad got a 10 over the weekend through AT&T for $250 with trade in of his 7+ and obviously some other perks, I wasn't present when he got it. Quite a bit less than $1000. A woman in the office I rent space out of got her 10 a couple weeks ago and was flaunting it, walking down the entire hallway telling everyone "look what I just got", thinking she was so special. I wanted to do a Shawn Michaels super kick right to her chin. Tons of "casuals" are sporting the 10, hate to break it to the so-called "rich".

I also can't believe the guy here who actually thinks a Range Rover or BMW is a status symbol. Lol. BMW is bush league compared to Mercedes-AMG, McLaren, Ferrari, Lambo, to name a few. You are prob this guy:

 

[Abs_p]

The iPhone X is $1,250 or 40% more than the most expensive Android and exactly $1,250 more than 'free'.

"Even my cleaning girl has an iPhone" ain't happening anymore. Sure, she can buy a used iPhone 5C for pennies on Craigslist, but she's not getting an iPhone 8 or an iPhone X. Those cost actual money now, no more carrier subsidies. That gravy train is over. She can help herself to about a dozen Android's if she wants a new no-cost smartphone.

So the other side of the "Apple is pricing consumers out of the market" is that "Apple is making a premium product for elites". You can argue that anyone can get $1000 in credit and I can show you 40% of the population that either can't qualify or won't pay that much and will therefore be leaving the Apple ecosystem. Besides myself, the other people I've seen with an iPhone X are wealthy executives and their offspring.

iPhone X Starts at $999 not $1250 and then there are tricks to get them for cheaper.

And my cleaning lady uses an iPhone 8 Plus FWIW. She said she got it BOGO from TMO. So while I see where you are coming from , your argument is not entirely valid.

 

[boltjames]

If I may be so bold. Years ago Apple released the 6 series conceding that many folks had clamored for a larger screen to match their Android using friends.

I am guessing here that  will realize they overstepped their fan base, and their non fan base, and will release a phone that does not have all the wizbang that the X has, and it will be cheaper.

I like you Marty, but you couldn't be more wrong. Some data to go with your hypothesis:

Apple has sold 35 MILLION units of the iPhone X in 7 weeks. That's $43.7 BILLION dollars in revenue from the iPhone X in 7 weeks.

As a point of comparison, the iPhone 6 sold 66 MILLION units in Q4 of its first year. At $649 that's $42.3 BILLION dollars in revenue.

As if besting the best selling iPhone of all time is not impressive enough, the iPhone 6 was 100% in stock for the entirety of the 4th quarter of that year where the iPhone X launched with major shortages in November. You can add another 10 or 15 MILLION to the X numbers considering the Christmas crush.

As if that's not impressive enough, the iPhone 6 had no competition within Apple to speak of whereas the iPhone X was up against a simultaneous release of the iPhone 8 with both 7's and SE's available as well.

This theory that Apple has left the little people in the dust with expensive phones they cannot afford is true. The theory that Apple is going to get what it deserves for that elitist decision is dead wrong. It's working. They invented the plus-$1000 smartphone pricepoint and by the time this 4th quarter is over they will have shattered the record of the best-selling smartphone of all time.

Apple has moved on from the gutter. Just like they don't sell $499 laptops to go up against HP at Best Buy, they don't make $0 smartphones as giveaway's at discount carriers. That title belongs squarely with Android.

 

[DNichter]

I don't find the X to be too expensive and I think it's worth the money. I have been really happy with it. They may be losing out on potential X sales from people who can't afford it, but they still have plenty of more affordable options for people that prefer iOS. I don't think they are losing anyone. That's a big reason they offered choices this year.

 

[Blondie&Dagwood]

Folks, you are missing the big elephant in the room here. Yes, the days of subsidized iPhones in the States are gone, however, as long as Apple still have the IUP and the US carries offer similar programs, the lower class will still believe that they are getting their phones cheaper than paying over $1,000 in cash upfront. American's absolutely love credit, so yes, your cleaning lady will get an iPhone 8 or X, and believe that she afford it.

 

[boltjames]

I don't find the X to be too expensive and I think it's worth the money. I have been really happy with it. They may be losing out on potential X sales from people who can't afford it, but they still have plenty of more affordable options for people that prefer iOS. I don't think they are losing anyone. That's a big reason they offered choices this year.

This. Exactly.

From $349 to $1250 there's an iPhone for almost everyone. But the large swath of budget business done by aggressive carriers at $0 is now over, Apple is not participating. No different than their posture with notebooks, media streamers, smart watches, etc. Apple makes premium products at premium prices.

So, yes, "mainstream" consumers (which is a nice PC way of saying what we all won't say) will have to go to 7-11 and get a prepaid phone or a low cost carrier like MetroPCS and get a $0 Android. It's what Android is for.

 

[Shanghaichica]

I don't find the X to be too expensive and I think it's worth the money. I have been really happy with it. They may be losing out on potential X sales from people who can't afford it, but they still have plenty of more affordable options for people that prefer iOS. I don't think they are losing anyone. That's a big reason they offered choices this year.

I do find the X to be expensive but obviously not too expensive otherwise I wouldn’t have bought it. My main gripes were with the loss of Touch ID and the difference in screen size going from the 7 plus. However now that I have the X I’m not disappointed and despite it being expensive it’s worth it for me.

 

[boltjames]

Folks, you are missing the big elephant in the room here. Yes, the days of subsidized iPhones in the States are gone, however, as long as Apple still have the IUP and the US carries offer similar programs, the lower class will still believe that they are getting cheaper phones than paying over a $1,000 in cash upfront. American's absolutely love credit, so yes, your cleaning lady will get an iPhone 8 or X, and believe that she afford it.

Well, I didn't say it but he did. LOL.

Yes B&D, you are correct, leasing phones makes these $900 outlays more palatable but remember that iPhone 8 is $35 a month on credit which for most doubles the cost of their monthly phone bill. Remember, these are the people who steal wi-fi from neighbors, sit hogging tables with chargers and free wi-fi at Starbucks for 6 hours at a clip, and usually purchase their iPhone's from Craigslist ads. That $35 a month is real money to them, it's the difference between taking the bus for a week or buying a tank of gas.

 

[jerryk]

I think the decrease in forecasts for iPhone X sales speaks volumes. As are result of these forecast Apple stock has lost 2% of it's value in one day. So a lot of people are betting with their feet and selling shares.

The slowing of sales of the X is not a reason to panic, but a concern. But, it also may represent a buying opportunity if the shares fall a bit more.

 

[Blondie&Dagwood]

I also can't believe the guy here who actually thinks a Range Rover or BMW is a status symbol. Lol. BMW is bush league compared to Mercedes-AMG, McLaren, Ferrari, Lambo, to name a few. You are prob this guy:

He is probably a BMW driver himself. So true though about the Beamer not being close to same leaque of the others you mentioned. I always get a kick when I see a Beamer in the left hand lane of the Autobahn in Germany trying to keep pace with the big boys - hahaha. When I see one in the rear view mirror, I tip the brakes every so slightly, and then watch as he inserts himself right up my backside and start signaling like a crazy person for me to get out oh his way. Then with a subtle smirk, I hit the gas and say goodbye

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I don't find the X to be too expensive and I think it's worth the money. I have been really happy with it. They may be losing out on potential X sales from people who can't afford it, but they still have plenty of more affordable options for people that prefer iOS. I don't think they are losing anyone. That's a big reason they offered choices this year.

There are alternative options to the X but they are not exactly thrilling are they? Those that can’t afford the X are more likely to keep the phone they have for longer and that is rumoured to be an increasing worrying trend for these manufacturers.

As of the 18th December 2017 the more repeated stat for the X is that it’s sold between 25 million and 30 million units. Nobody really knows the true figure yet. That is significantly down on the iPhone 6 in its first 8 weeks. Therefore it’s successful by some measure but not breaking any records like a couple of people suggest. If Apple want to continue maintaining their place in the high end smartphone arena then they need to listen to the market. The iPhone 8 isn’t cutting it and the X is priced too high, especially outside of America. If their core user base are keeping older phones longer or upgrading to the iPhone 7, it will eventually be a big problem. Those that got the X this year might not necessarily upgrade again next year too.

 

[Shanghaichica]

He is probably a BMW driver himself. So true though about the Beamer not being close to same leaque of the others you mentioned. I always get a kick when I see a Beamer in the left hand lane of the Autobahn in Germany trying to keep pace with the big boys - hahaha

I’d be disappointed if I were the trophy wife as shes’s placed second to last on his signature list. Does that mean that he values his Apple devices, Rolex and car more highly than her

 

[Mark Booth]

For what an iPhone X costs I got a DJI Mavic Pro Fly More Combo package. The amount of technology DJI gives you for that $1100 seems vastly superior to what you get with an iPhone. The iPhone, and smart phones in general, have become appliances. Tools. Boring. Not the content you view with them, but the technology underneath. FaceID is ho-hum and proven less reliable than TouchID.

Despite the many claims that the iPhone X is the best product Apple has ever made, I have absolutely zero desire to own one. Most of my iPhone-owning friends feel the same way. They are in no big hurry to get an iPhone X. Most say that, if their current iPhone were to be lost today, they'd get an iPhone 8 or even the 7. Apple has failed to build an X that is a "must own" device. Except, of course, for the most avid of Apple enthusiasts that still believe the company walks on water.

Wall Street appears to understand this. New report this morning:

Is the iPhone X a disappointment? Investors think so

Mark

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

This. Exactly.

From $349 to $1250 there's an iPhone for almost everyone. But the large swath of budget business done by aggressive carriers at $0 is now over, Apple is not participating. No different than their posture with notebooks, media streamers, smart watches, etc. Apple makes premium products at premium prices.

So, yes, "mainstream" consumers (which is a nice PC way of saying what we all won't say) will have to go to 7-11 and get a prepaid phone or a low cost carrier like MetroPCS and get a $0 Android. It's what Android is for.

iPhones have never been free outside of America. Repeating it over and over again and being constantly corrected doesn’t turn it into a fact.

 

[ToroidalZeus]

If I may be so bold. Years ago Apple released the 6 series conceding that many folks had clamored for a larger screen to match their Android using friends. Approximately 1.5 years later the SE was released after  realized there was still a huge demand for a small phone.
I am guessing here that  will realize they overstepped their fan base, and their non fan base, and will release a phone that does not have all the wizbang that the X has, and it will be cheaper. This phone may be the rumored Iphone SE 2.
Not much of what I posted here has facts to back it up, but it sure does feel like the temperment that lead up to the release of the SE.

The problem is Apple tried to apply the Gold Apple Watch marketing to the iPhone X.

 

[DNichter]

There are alternative options to the X but they are not exactly thrilling are they? Those that can’t afford the X are more likely to keep the phone they have for longer and that is rumoured to be an increasing worrying trend for these manufacturers.

As of the 18th December 2017 the more repeated stat for the X is that it’s sold between 25 million and 30 million units. Nobody really knows the true figure yet. That is significantly down on the iPhone 6 in its first 8 weeks. Therefore it’s successful by some measure but not breaking any records like a couple of people suggest. If Apple want to continue maintaining their place in the high end smartphone arena then they need to listen to the market. The iPhone 8 isn’t cutting it and the X is priced too high, especially outside of America. If their core user base are keeping older phones longer or upgrading to the iPhone 7, it will eventually be a big problem. Those that got the X this year might not necessarily upgrade again next year too.

Well that's up to the individual buying a phone to decide, but I certainly think Apple has the most appealing phone lineup out there. It's just a matter of time before someone wants to upgrade. That 25-30 million number is still really impressive considering it retails for $1,000. I ultimately don't think it matters to Apple. They are happy to sell you an SE, an X, a 7, or an 8 Plus. It's all money to them and it likely locks that person in as an Apple user for the foreseeable future. I don't think Apple has anything to worry about. Android doesn't come close on things that will end up being the deciding factors when it comes to your smartphone purchase.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Well, I didn't say it but he did. LOL.

Yes B&D, you are correct, leasing phones makes these $900 outlays more palatable but remember that iPhone 8 is $35 a month on credit which for most doubles the cost of their monthly phone bill. Remember, these are the people who steal wi-fi from neighbors, sit hogging tables with chargers and free wi-fi at Starbucks for 6 hours at a clip, and usually purchase their iPhone's from Craigslist ads. That $35 a month is real money to them, it's the difference between taking the bus for a week or buying a tank of gas.

You don’t like people who earn less than you do you? Some of your judgemental insulting comments here are dreadful.

You can’t generalise people who buy the iPhone 8 the way you do because it is laughably misinformed and down right ignorant. What phone people own is never a correct metric to judge how much they earn or what kind of person they are. You should be ashamed of yourself.

 

[ToroidalZeus]

You don’t like people who earn less than you do you? Some of your judgemental insulting comments here are dreadful.

You can’t generalise people who buy the iPhone 8 the way you do because it is laughably misinformed and down right ignorant. What phone people own is never a correct metric to judge how much they earn or what kind of person they are. You should be ashamed of yourself.

why do you keep responding to him. it's only going to fuel him.