Apple Launches 'Touch Disease' Repair Program for iPhone 6 Plus

[tallscot]

Costs them $249 to make a 16 gig iPhone 6S that costs $650. That's what crap quality control and slave labor wages in China does – it gives Apple over $250 billion in cash reserves. Screw them. Can somebody please create a decent mobile OS? I tried Android on my son's phone and I thought it was crap. How hard is it?

 

[macfanjoe]

i'm just annoyed I need to take it in to a Store, and can't mail it. I will pay the $150 so I can finally resell it.

 

[sdwaltz]

149?! Should be free. What a rip.

 

[luddx]

Yep. Here's what happens. Many of today's chips have so many connectors, that they're placed underneath in what's known as a BGA (ball grid array). Here is the touch controller desoldered from its pad on the board:

View attachment 673187

Now, normally to prevent the balls from coming loose because of circuit board flex, thermal expansion, etc... a polymer called "underfill" is injected underneath.

View attachment 673188

This stabilizes the connection points.

View attachment 673189

In addition, in previous iPhones, there was a full metal shield that helped make the board more rigid:

View attachment 673190

But in the iPhone 6, BOTH the full shield AND the underfill were designed out

View attachment 673191

Those board design decisions, along with a comparatively weak case with a mechanical brace design mistake (Bendgate), allow the board to flex and the BGA solder joints to separate over time.

It's probably not even a question of IF it will happen, but more of WHEN it will happen. Thermal expansion alone could cause it sooner or later, much less any natural flexing during normal use.

Hmm. I think what might have happened, was that Apple was planning to begin using spray top coatings that can double as a shield and a kind of overlayment brace, but had not quite gotten to that point for some reason. IIRC, some avionics makers have gone to this method.

Is there an apologist available to refute this ? I don't think so.

So Apple is lying AND charging 150 bucks for a replacement that should be free.

 

[Moorepheus]

Just out of curiosity, wanted to see what the current trade in is for the 6 Plus (under AT&T)
A 64GB Space Gray, Good condition...NO Touch issues right now.

$180 trade in at ATT
$225 from Apple (Brightstar)
$230 at Best Buy..which is not TOO bad for a 2 year+ old phone.

Now the question becomes..trade in the 6 Plus now and avoid a possible $150 repair problem, repair obviously is over 1/2 of what the value of the phone is right now...if you did the trade in and it's on a carrier.

Risk it..wait until Sept 2017 for the 8 (or something else?) - and hope there is no issue between now and next year... drop money on a phone that will continue to devalue as weeks and months pass.

I keep thinking...I haven't had the Touch IC problem, but hey..it might show up at any given moment for no rhyme or reason. Then the value of that now useless phone becomes close to $0.

It's a legit gamble.

If the repair was $0, as it should be...I wouldn't be dwelling on this right now.

ATT

Best Buy

I know AT&T was give up to 650 for the iPhone 6/6s for the 7. In fact, I got 650 for my iPhone 6s+128GB for my 7+. It's the only reason I upgraded.

So you're argument is I should simply believe random people on the internet claiming something without providing me any proof or evidence to back up their claim? If I tell you I'm a billionaire who masquerades as a crime fighter will you take me at my word too?

And no, it doesn't "cut both ways" like that. If you are going to assert something is a design flaw you have to prove it. Apple doesn't have to prove its not unless you can make a compelling case against them. They are under no obligation to prove to a bunch of people in a forum and provide the evidence for random internet people to evaluate.

If you (or any other poster) want people to take you seriously, then present your case without all the histrionics, without all the assertions of absolute truth, without the "OMG APPLE IS THE WORST" or "OMG TIM COOK JUST WANTS MY MONEY". Seldom in life is it black and white, evil villains vs. virtuous super hero. Or you can keep yelling on the internet. Your choice.

So, with your logic, why is it automatically assumed that it is user error when there is no DAMNAGE done to the phone or when the phone is opened at the APPLE store and exhibits the same issue? What ever TEST Apple did to make the statement that it take repeated drops onto hard surfaces to cause this issue doesn't hold water when it comes to all the others who have never dropped their phone on hard surface or it has happened right in the Apple store, out of a factory sealed box. I will say, however, if the phone does show physical damage, then I agree, Apple has every right to charge for the repair. But to sit here and say that EVERY phone with this problem is caused by DROPS, is just wrong. Also, it should be upon APPLE to prove that I, the consumer was the one that damaged my phone, not the other way around. What you are asking is that everyone that buys an iPhone understand the engineering and processes that go into manufacturing the iPhone, and that's not going to happen.

 

[kdarling]

So Apple is lying AND charging 150 bucks for a replacement that should be free.

They're not lying per se. Apple is doing what Jobs taught them to do: tell the truth, but not the whole truth.

Everyone knows the best way to hide something, is to tell something else that's true, to misdirect people. Apple is a pro at doing this. (Just like Jobs did with AntennaGate.)

They're right that a drop can cause the problem. Thus they are telling _a_ truth that cannot be refuted, and is something for which they can blame users instead of their own design.

But some other truths that they conveniently left out, are that thermal expansion, vibration from say, the buzzer motor, and circuit board flexing can cause the problem as well. It's all why underfilling was invented decades ago, as well as matching the thermal expansion characteristics of the chip and the circuit board.

 

[FrankieTDouglas]

I had to replace my 6+ twice while it was under warranty. I never had the gray part, the screen would just suddenly stop responding to touch. Had to turn it off and back on to resume usage. Each time I replaced the phone, I wasn't charged.

 

[luddx]

They're not lying per se. Apple is doing what Jobs taught them to do: tell the truth, but not the whole truth.

Everyone knows the best way to hide something, is to tell something true to misdirect people. Apple is a pro at doing this. (Just like Jobs did with AntennaGate.)

Of course a drop can cause it. They're cleverly telling _a_ truth that cannot be refuted.

The other truths that they conveniently left out, are that thermal expansion, vibration, and circuit board flexing can cause the problem as well. They're why underfilling was invented decades ago, as well as matching the thermal expansion characteristics of the chip and the circuit board.

Sure, but the bottom line (the 149$ bottom line) pretty much feels like a fraud / a lie / call it whatever you want. I mean, that's how it'll feel to someone who's having the problem, but yet has taken great care of their phone...

Apple is playing with fire these days...

A company that has moved on to the luxury niche can't afford to be this cheap

 

[kmanvan]

Apple should offer a free repair.

Because it's a design defect.
And we know it's a defect.
Because we're world-class chip designers.

EDIT:
Not saying whether Apple is or is not in the wrong here, just saying a company renowned for their customer support shouldn't be judged too quickly. Apple probably had multiple engineering teams looking into it, and this is their conclusion.

Perhaps Apple is greedy. But perhaps consumers are more clumsy than they choose to admit. Perhaps both.

Definitely both.
Of course lots of users damage their phones by dropping it. I'm shocked at how many (mostly young) people I see using phones with massively broken/cracked screens.

On the other hand, this issue has been so widely reported on phones with no visible damage that it certainly sounds like a design flaw, which is par for the course with Apple.

You don't have to look farther than charging cords to see that Apple treats durability as one of their lowest priorities. Why would they when there loyal customers have proven willing to repeatedly shell out $20 for super high margin replacement cords. Their new dongle business line is going to be a huge profit center too. Its shameful.

 

[JoeG4]

Also looks like people with the problem either dropped it or bent it. Even slight bent can probably cause damage eventually I mean it is bent.

I doubt it, the issue is caused by pressure being applied on the chip located underneath the Touch ID button. The flexing and twisting issues are always up at the top of the phone by the volume buttons.

It sounds like apple is claiming the shock of dropping the phone can weaken the bga solder joints. I'd expect that they'd know the limits from shock testing - which should drop a phone way more than anyone would in daily use. Besides, we can't guarantee our phones have never been dropped due to shipping! Vibration from cars also counts lol.

Usually bga failure comes from bad metallurgy or too much board flexing I suppose. Constantly being pushed down on could totally do it!

 

[Sedulous]

Erm Apple started the argument by saying without proof that it was our fault? You really don't get it do you?
[doublepost=1479487185][/doublepost]
Yet your earlier post said it was nothing to do with the solder? Now you say it does? Also, I guess you didn't know devices are made in BATCHES, they aren't all made the same and hence subject to batch to batch variability and production issues. Keep posting, it's hilarious.

Seriously? No, the solder is not defective nor have I written any such thing. The solder breaks when torqued/flexed. That is solder. Are you saying Apple should weld chips to boards instead?

 

[luddx]

check this out : https://hardware.slashdot.org/story...ften-than-android-units-during-q3-says-report

 

[JayIsAwesome]

Not surprised at all by this response from Apple. This is the same company that said "you're holding it wrong" when antennagate was happening. And what's even worse is you have apologist defending it, instead of calling Apple on their BS.

If the phone is physically damaged, then yes charge them. But to say that every phone that has touch disease is b/c of drops is a bit much IMO. Apple should be fair about this

 

[kagharaht]

I doubt it, the issue is caused by pressure being applied on the chip located underneath the Touch ID button. The flexing and twisting issues are always up at the top of the phone by the volume buttons.

It sounds like apple is claiming the shock of dropping the phone can weaken the bga solder joints. I'd expect that they'd know the limits from shock testing - which should drop a phone way more than anyone would in daily use. Besides, we can't guarantee our phones have never been dropped due to shipping! Vibration from cars also counts lol.

Usually bga failure comes from bad metallurgy or too much board flexing I suppose. Constantly being pushed down on could totally do it!

Um what does bga mean? lol sorry I seriously don't know that.

 

[skinned66]

What tungsten balls to charge money for this. I hope they lose the class action now.

Um what does bga mean? lol sorry I seriously don't know that.

Ball grid array.

 

[TeamMojo]

But they have important things to do, like produce coffee table books.

 

[phoneme]

I tried Android on my son's phone and I thought it was crap. How hard is it?

you really should try the new pixel phone it's 100% google and the smoothest os i have ever used and yes that includes ios. ios has become unstable lately with force closes and jankyness. and the pixel is just super duper butter smooth. give it try.

on a side note about this whole TD issue. apple should replace the units with new ones. like the way samsung did with the note7. ever tho they eventually pulled them. atleast they went above and beyond to do the best they could for the note7 buyers. were as apple is just out to take customers for a ride and take there cash.

 

[Pez555]

Apple are gradually turning into a company that I do not want to be a part of...

 

[tubeexperience]

Not surprised at all by this response from Apple. This is the same company that said "you're holding it wrong" when antennagate was happening. And what's even worse is you have apologist defending it, instead of calling Apple on their BS.

If the phone is physically damaged, then yes charge them. But to say that every phone that has touch disease is b/c of drops is a bit much IMO. Apple should be fair about this

This is why Apple is the best:

Rarely do companies (other than Apple) have loyal fanboys who defend them even after they screwed over their fanboys.

 

[Pentium]

Happened to one of my friends while visiting Italy, we visited the Apple Store and they told us its a US phone and we need to call the Apple Support in the US to authorize the repair.
We did that and the next day they replaced the iPhone with a new one (6 Plus)
They didn't even repair it (the phone was out of the 1 year warranty and he didn't have Apple Care)

 

[kemal]

The chip is cracking due to the PCB flexing. Underfill might help as well as a steel shield / stiffener. See the video.

Shame on you all Apple for passing the blame and cost.

 

[indychris]

No, I don't have the link. It was May or June, July or August 2010. The article was on Google. I-Tunes hacked. It was only a few hundred accounts with weak passwords, and mine was stupidly simple.

The main point is that they tried to convince me it was my fault--when it wasn't, just like now with telling people oh you must have dropped the phone. This behavior of Apple's is downright insidious.

That was big news in the day, but as I recall, iTunes was NOT HACKED. It was the result of phishing and, IIRC, it was mostly using Paypal.

Beyond that, while I am at the front of the line of complainers who don't care for the way that Apple is currently conducting business and dismissing their core customer base in lieu of profits, the fact is your complaint is not in any way similar to this. Apple was not hacked in 2010 and therefore wasn't directly responsible for the losses incurred. They did eventually respond to the situation responsibly, I believe.

 

[PJL500]

And what about the 6s when on a dash mount? Touch is very unreliable when the stabbing motion is used. This is dangerous!

 

[swajames]

I personally find this to be pretty disingenuous on Apple's part. To my mind what should happen is simple and fair. Apple should own up and take responsibility for what does appear to be a design issue, and don't try to stiff your customers *unless* the device in question shows unreasonable levels of abuse/wear/damage - in which case the $149 would be justified.

 

[TheHorrorNerd]

Surely it should be free if it's a manufacturing issue...

Not if its outside the 1 year warranty...

Also Im a former Genius Bar employee...
This used to happen to devices straight out of the box...
This is part of the reason I left Apple...