Apple Launching A9X-Based 12.9" iPad Pro in November for $799+

[manu chao]

meh. Apple misnamed the device... it isn't an "iPad Pro", it's an "iPad RT".

The difference is that the Surface RT had the full desktop experience but no apps. And the iPad Pro has almost no 'desktop' features (split-screen could qualify) but many apps.

So, in terms of hardware they are similar conceptually. In terms of software they are almost complete opposites.

 

[Renzatic]

Yet...

It'd been even more dramatic if you said "...for now".

 

[macguy360]

In 2012 Apple had a big iPad cover patent that covers all that was revealed in today's keynote (the folding pattern, the keyboard, the data and power contact points, etc., and about twenty other innovations that didn't make this rev 1 release. In 2013, Apple licensed to Microsoft a portfolio of iOS design patents. You could look it up, perhaps on PatentlyApple.com or other web sites. The dates might be slightly off, but I didn't make it up.

No.... We all know that Apple sues the pants off anyone that even slightly tries to use a similar design as them. And Apple doesn't license out their patents to other companies either. Microsoft was awarded its own patents for keyboard covers. Here's the link...

http://www.computerworld.com/articl...ign-patents-for-surface--keyboard-covers.html

 

[manu chao]

Seriously. I'm way more open to changing my workflow slightly than dealing with the host of nagging issues presented by the Surface Pro. It's an okay device, but some of us prefer the simplicity of the iPad and iOS. No battery issues, no sluggish software, no display scaling issues, no confused hybrid touch/mouse OS, no fan and no heat throttling. And no over-engineered kickstand. If you need the full OS or a laptop, yeah the Surface might be a better buy, but I happen to like iOS and there are tons of productive apps and more on the way I'm sure. Plus with the new multitasking features in iOS9 it's becoming a lot more functional (draw in one app with references on the side). I already have a beastly desktop workstation and a Cintiq, I don't need to duplicate all that on the go.

This is the difference between comparing general types of devices (and software) on paper and actually using the devices. Though this is naturally a bit of a simplification.

 

[macguy360]

The difference is that the Surface RT had the full desktop experience but no apps. And the iPad Pro has almost no 'desktop' features (split-screen could qualify) but many apps.

So, in terms of hardware they are similar conceptually. In terms of software they are almost complete opposites.

Surface RT never had a full desktop experience. It has the RT software which ran similarly to IOS.

Surface 3 is the first non pro surface to have full os.

 

[teslo]

Thanks for judging me, - it is refreshing, especially because you seem to know me well...

We did more jobs using iPad and Procreate, than you might think. And yes, we do use the Cintiqs and Intuoses on a daily basis, but I am still very happy about the growing competition. Hopefully it brings Wacom to finally pop the heads out of their bottoms and finally innovate!

i have to ask - what jobs can you do on procreate? i've mood boarded on the way to work, but really?

and i'd venture to claim that cintiq's companion Innovated the pants off apple's newest addition to the tablet world. i'm sure it won't flop or anything, because in a way, they were SMART for making it an approachable tablet for the prosumers and 'experimental' trust fund kids with no talent (i kid...). but man, did they let down a whole lotta pros today.

 

[Jess13]

Microsoft guy with an apple watch on - am I watching the right keynote..?!

Adobe guys had Apple Watches, too. Either [lended] requirement for on-stage guests, or gifts from Apple.

 

[Pilgrim1099]

Thanks for judging me, - it is refreshing, especially because you seem to know me well...

We did more jobs using iPad and Procreate, than you may think. And yes, we do use the Cintiqs and Intuoses on a daily basis, but I am still very happy about the growing competition. Hopefully it brings Wacom to finally pop the heads out of their bottoms and finally innovate!

Then why hold the negativity towards Wacom? Sure, their Cintiqs are expensive devices but the Intuos I use gets the job done. I thought it was well manufactured.

I question the Apple Pencils' exclusive use to iPad Pro because they never state the actual pressure sensitive levels. And what happens if the nib wears out? How would that be replaced?

The closest thing I can find as a cheaper alternative to a Cintiq is the Surface Pro because it can run desktop apps on the go with files and color profiles intact.

iPad Pro may be good for conceptualization phases but for actual professional apps like Photoshop, InDesign ( not the crippled version ), Manga Studio and such, it doesn't show that capacity.

I'm not saying Sketchbook Pro and Procreate are bad apps. The desktop SB pro does a lot more than the iOS version I had. I could clearly see that.

And then there's Mischief that's growing in popularity due to being a free form drawing and painting tool. I've used it and it works like a charm. I don't know if it'll ever go to iOS but it's unlimited canvas is incredible.

 

[spiderman0616]

The question is what is wrong with using your tablet only for Netflix and Facebook (which stands for media consumption, ie, video, audio, reading, and light Internet usage, ie, 'web surfing', short communication). I think there is nothing wrong with that, except that Apple might have increasing trouble selling their tablets at their current prices.

The question is how large the niche is for applications beyond consumption and light communication that work better on a touch-device (eg, because they don't need a desk) and better enough that they warrant getting an extra device for that (including getting data on and off that device) compared to getting a dual-use device. That niche certainly exists and is growing but again, maybe dual-use devices will be the one serving it in the end.

There's nothing wrong with it, but in my particular case, I wasn't running to get my iPad anymore when I needed to do any of these things. This was a bi-product of both having a bigger iPhone and not commuting as much as I used to. It just wasn't worth it to me to have the iPad sit in my bag most of the time. Honestly, if I'm going to watch TV in my bed, I'm much more comfortable doing that on my iPhone than my iPad.

This is all just MY experience though. There are still people out there who live on their iPads, and I'm sure the Pro will appeal to them.

 

[Even Longer]

i have to ask - what jobs can you do on procreate? i've mood boarded on the way to work, but really?

and i'd venture to claim that cintiq's companion Innovated the pants off apple's newest addition to the tablet world. i'm sure it won't flop or anything, because in a way, they were SMART for making it an approachable tablet for the prosumers and 'experimental' trust fund kids with no talent (i kid...). but man, did they let down a whole lotta pros today.

Illustrations, for the most part.
Of course, they were then finished on a Desktop, mainly because of the lack of an appropriate precise iPad Stylus and all convenience of having access to the file system. Yet...

I hope, their Pencil is as good as they advertise... And, even being naive, I do think, it can find its way into the Mac world someday. I really do. Otherwise you may be right...

 

[manu chao]

I want to want one, but I can't. I've tried to use Excel and Numbers on an iPad and it's a miserable experience compared to a full laptop (macbook air). To be a truly functional enterprise computer replacement, it needs trackpad or mouse support when docked to the keyboard. Trying to select a range of cells, input formula, etc with your finger on the screen and using the keyboard is a PITA.

One could rephrase that as saying that you could only justify the purchase of a tablet only if it can double as a laptop. And that position is perfectly understandable.

I use my laptop for photo editing, and the iPad Pro would be PERFECT for this if only it ran full Creative Cloud apps, like Photoshop and Lightroom. It won't since it doesn't utilize OS X which just totally kills the usefulness of the Apple Pencil add-on for me.

The usefulness is there once you can start work on a computer and pick it up later on your iPad and vice versa. That doesn't mean the iPad applications have to offer the full capabilities of their desktop siblings but that LR for example could offer its image adjustment tools on the iPad. So you would import images into LR on your computer and then do the adjustment work on your iPad with both devices syncing automatically in the background.

 

[Glideslope]

Amazing device. But no file system no buy.... It still can't replace fully a MacBook.

Agreed. Just a larger device to watch videos on.

 

[manu chao]

I think in the UK this will retail for £649 (inc VAT) for the 32GB version and £799 (incl VAT) for the 128GB version. That doesn't include the keyboard, which looks like it'll retail here for possibly as high as £149 (incl. VAT). The high end just isn't worth it, you can get a refurbished 2015 13 inch retina Macbook Pro for £849 (incl VAT) with 8GB ram and 128GB SSD. Unless you're desperate for a giant iPad, which you draw on and attach to a smart keyboard.

I don't see why this iPad Pro suddenly has to be mainly used with a keyboard or pen? Many people use their iPad without a pen or keyboard. Just as some people could see value in both the Mini and the Air (size-wise), there will be plenty of people that see value in both the Air and the Pro (size-wise) and will use the iPod Pro much like they used their 9.7" iPads.

 

[Wiesenlooser]

Illustrations, for the most part.
Of course, they were then finished on a Desktop, mainly because of the lack of an appropriate precise iPad Stylus and all convenience of having access to the file system. Yet...

I hope, their Pencil is as good as they advertise... And, even being naive, I do think, it can find its way into the Mac world someday. I really do. Otherwise you may be right...

Procreate is good and all but even you have to admit, that besides a few apps like procreate -> there aren't really many that can keep the pace up to SERIOUS productivity desktop class apps.

There is no photoshop, no illustrator, heck not even sketch or rhino 3d in a way that makes it comparable to their desktop siblings.


Will these ever be coded? I dont know , the iPad Pro would need some serious traction for that. because these apps could barely be used on the smaller ipads. Whereas on the surface pro line the apps already exist all you would need is a skin to make it a bit more touch friendly perhaps.

 

[niun]

I think the confusion here comes from the name. Pro tends to lend itself to a product that people can actually use.. professionally. This is not that.

Flat keyboard with those atrocious butterfly keys and no way to change the view angle. WTF?
Pencil. Not details, no specs. WTF?
No Pro apps. WTF?

How is this beast being compared to the MS Surface Pro?
Oh and for any of those bleating about the MS Surface not having apps. It doesn't need them. It runs real software!

Pro in this case just means Product.

 

[manu chao]

No trackpad area for the smart keyboard.... just saying.

No cursor in iOS (beyond text selection). That's how it is and how it will stay. Third-party apps could easily add a cursor and a bluetooth mouse or trackpad support. But they haven't done so because if their apps don't work well without a mouse or trackpad, most people would consider the app useless most of times.

 

[xitongzou]

Jobs is rolling in his grave now... Apple playing catchup to Microsoft by making a MS Surface clone. Man... complete with detachable keyboard and stylus. Now tell me is this just a Retina Macbook Air running iOS with a stylus or not?

 

[manu chao]

It's targeting roughly the same market the Surface 3 is

I doubt that. The Surface 3 is for people who need a laptop replacement. The iPad Pro is for people who want a 'better' tablet to complement their computer.

 

[Dirtfarmer]

Apple: A vertically-integrated marketing company.

 

[Even Longer]

Then why hold the negativity towards Wacom? Sure, their Cintiqs are expensive devices but the Intuos I use gets the job done. I thought it was well manufactured.

I question the Apple Pencils' exclusive use to iPad Pro because they never state the actual pressure sensitive levels. And what happens if the nib wears out? How would that be replaced?

The closest thing I can find as a cheaper alternative to a Cintiq is the Surface Pro because it can run desktop apps on the go with files and color profiles intact.

iPad Pro may be good for conceptualization phases but for actual professional apps like Photoshop, InDesign ( not the crippled version ), Manga Studio and such, it doesn't show that capacity.

I'm not saying Sketchbook Pro and Procreate are bad apps. The desktop SB pro does a lot more than the iOS version I had. I could clearly see that.

And then there's Mischief that's growing in popularity due to being a free form drawing and painting tool. I've used it and it works like a charm. I don't know if it'll ever go to iOS but it's unlimited canvas is incredible.

I agree with you here, - this is the reality. For now.


But I really want Wacom to be innovative again.

For example, by:

- developing new or drastically improving their never-changing ancient input tech (still awful parallax, precision on the edges and ever buggy drives, especially for OSX).

- releasing a Cintiq Companion product, which is silent and with battery lasting more than 3-4 hours of use.

- making such Companion finally lightweight, with screen aspect ratio suitable for artists and Adobe RGB colour gamut coverage (instead of current sRGB).


As you see, my wish list is rather short...
I wouldn't even complain about the price, then...

 

[xitongzou]

I doubt that. The Surface 3 is for people who need a laptop replacement. The iPad Pro is for people who want a 'better' tablet to complement their computer.

I can't think of why anyone would use this over the Retina Macbook except for artists and stuff. Cause they are almost the same except the Macbook runs OSX

 

[Renzatic]

Will these ever be coded? I dont know , the iPad Pro would need some serious traction for that. because these apps could barely be used on the smaller ipads. Whereas on the surface pro line the apps already exist all you would need is a skin to make it a bit more touch friendly perhaps.

There's no real reason why Adobe and the like can't program an iOS version of Real Honest To God Photoshop And/Or Illustrator by this point, other than maybe RAM limitations. The A8x is in most respects at least as good, if not better than the recent batch of Intel Atom chips, which can run Photoshop and Illustrator well enough to get by in all but the most extreme use cases.

I think the major reason why Adobe never did was because they assumed most people wouldn't want to use Photoshop or Illustrator on an iPad without a stylus. With the Pro now here, they might end up giving it an attempt.

 

[mazz0]

Three times louder. Cos yeah, the problem with the speakers on the Air 2 is they're not loud enough...

 

[Daws001]

It looks nice but w/o usb-c and a file system, I'll hold onto my Air 2 and wait for the Skylake MBs. I really wanted this to be a bit more than just a bigger screen (and I have zero use for the stylus).

Bummer.

 

[Renzatic]

I doubt that. The Surface 3 is for people who need a laptop replacement. The iPad Pro is for people who want a 'better' tablet to complement their computer.

Eh, I'd say the 3 is more like a tablet that can do some laptop related tasks in a pinch, moreso than a proper laptop replacement. That's more the Pro's area of expertise.