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Well, fine why is everybody then saying the Surface is better because it runs 'full' Windows and all third-party apps? Either you look at the package or you don't. And if you only look at the hardware, Apple is still doing the opposite by (a) sticking with ARM whereas the Surface has now moved completely to Intel and (b) by using hardware that is equipped to run iOS (which is significantly lighter in its requirements than OS X or Windows) whereas the Surface has the hardware to run Windows.

They are talking about the physical appearance with typing cover and a pen accessory. it looks like they copied the Surface design and accessories and then slapped in Ipad internals and iOS.
 
How dare they call watching a movie on a 4:3 screen a 'cinematic' experience? I keep waiting for a 16:9 iPad ...
Um, you can still watch movies in 16:9 on a 4:3 screen. And on the iPad Pro, it'll probably still be bigger than watching it on a 16:9 version of a 10" iPad.
 
The hardware is great. But iOS cannot be used for professional desktop-class work, because iOS is designed for people whose only computer needs are web browsing, email, social networks, and minor file editing. Apple needs to add iOS touch paradigms to OS X and then, and only then, using OS X, the IPad Pro will be Pro.

To start with, professional work without a file system is plain impossible. Do you really think a Pixar movie, or a car, or a building, or an airplane, or even a software project, can be completely designed, created, an finished, on iOS, without a file system? That's professional work. And you just can't call "Pro" the IPad Pro until you can perform such tasks on it.
 
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The hardware is great. But iOS cannot be used for professional desktop-class work, because iOS is designed for people whose only computer needs are web browsing, email, social networks, and minor file editing. Apple needs to add iOS touch paradigms to OS X and then, and only then, using OS X, the IPad Pro will be Pro.

To start with, professional work without a file system is plain impossible. Do you really think a Pixar movie, or a car, or a building, or an airplane, or even a software project, can be completely designed, created, an finished, on iOS, without a file system? That's professional work. And you just can't call "Pro" the IPad Pro until you can perform such tasks on it.
No. I don't even know where to begin.
 
I don't see why this iPad Pro suddenly has to be mainly used with a keyboard or pen? Many people use their iPad without a pen or keyboard. Just as some people could see value in both the Mini and the Air (size-wise), there will be plenty of people that see value in both the Air and the Pro (size-wise) and will use the iPod Pro much like they used their 9.7" iPads.

I think this IPad Pro is aimed at Surface Pro users, hence most users will get a smart keyboard and stylus, especially if they are creating content, hence the Pro moniker. Typing on iPad is ok for short texts, but if you wanted to write a long e-mail or essay then a keyboard is more comfortable. Stylus can only be used on IPad Pro as far as I am aware. For average consumers, i don't think it's worth the price, plus all the accessories.
 
Yes, generally I agree, BUT after the evaluation of Surface Pro 3:

- it is still getting loud and hot while using most of pro apps, especially Mischief.
- it's stylus doesn't have any tilt sensitivity and I couldn't get the pressure curve to feel natural, even after adjustments in Surface Hub.
- it is running Windows. Yes, it is a "full" OS, but getting back to it after using OSX/iOS exclusively for years was hard (of course, this one is more or less reflectin my personal tasted an experience).

It is getting hot and loud, but I can imagine that the next iteration(s) of intel chipsets will solve this given the fact that we are finally getting fanless laptops.

-Yes the Stylus does not have tilt sensitivity, but give them some time. The surface pro 3 was the first generation with an N-trig digitizer and since then they bought the company so I think there is more to come.

How many people use the desktop versions of those apps using only a touch screen?

Probably not many but the keyboard has a decent trackpad and you can use the stylus on top of that.

People complaining that this doesn't run OSX just fundamentally don't understand Apple, it's history, and where it's going. The Surface is retarded, so is Windows, and Apple shouldn't be trying to emulate MS in any way shape or form.

Having said that, they need to allow mouse/pointer input across all iOS devices. Now.

Hate to break it to you, but they already did with the keyboard ;)
 
In terms of stylus support, is the screen as pressure sensitive as the note 5/surface pro 3?

Either way all it is is a slightly larger iPad. Same mobile OS that doesn't have the applications most people use to make money as a pro.

I'm talking about desktop class software by the way.
Apple should really release an OSX tablet. It's the future considering what Intel are doing.

See, some of us aren't convinced it is. The Surface Pro 3 is "OK" as a laptop, and "OK" as a tablet, but it masters neither. I'd rather just have a laptop OR a tablet. Until someone "gets" the tablet/laptop combo, I'll take a tablet or a laptop. Not both. The iPad Pro is still unmistakably a tablet (even with adding a keyboard), and I'm glad for it. Because it will be a darn good one.
 
I think a lot of you are missing the point of a device like this vs a Macbook. Creative apps particularly for music will benefit in a way that Macbooks can't. A touch interface will be far superior to modulating controls on say for example, a drum machine or synthesizer. For creative types, this device could be pretty huge. A bigger screen means more controls. I know quite a few people who are going to be in line to instantly buy this.

All true, but

1- You have to have some apps that allow you to do so
2- You have to have enough storage if you want to record an album
3- There are plenty of touch interfaces (including iDevice) that can be used via OSC. Logic itself is controllable via iPhone, as well as many Korg and Arturia, or Ableton.
 
Look, I'm a big iPad fan, have an Air2 think it's great ..for some things. Key word is "some".

At the end of the day, this is just a very large device running ....a freaking phone OS. That's right an OS designed and taylor made for a phone for cryin out loud.

Until the underlying software is revolutionized, I stay put. Believe me, I've tried in every way to function a full day in a business environment with just a tablet. No way. Not yet.

The underlying OS is absolutely fine. What it needs in my opinion is improved multitasking access and a better way to collaborate (file, data and UI sharing) between apps. Once this is resolved it'll be a really good OS.
 
It is getting hot and loud, but I can imagine that the next iteration(s) of intel chipsets will solve this given the fact that we are finally getting fanless laptops.

-Yes the Stylus does not have tilt sensitivity, but give them some time. The surface pro 3 was the first generation with an N-trig digitizer and since then they bought the company so I think there is more to come.

Let's wait and see. Competition is always favouring the customer.

In the mean time, I am really thrilled about that Pencil and iPad Pro.
 
Let's wait and see. Competition is always favouring the customer.

In the mean time, I am really thrilled about that Pencil and iPad Pro.

I too think that it is a great device. I think that the Surface Pro Line and the iPad Pro are both coming from different directions and they are both emerging to the sweet spot. Let us see who gets there quicker.
 
Source please :)
Here.
https://blogs.adobe.com/conversatio...ivity-apps-during-apple-ipad-pro-keynote.html
If you scroll down, there's one part where they mention the iPad pro has 4 gb of ram.

"During Apple’s keynote, we also demonstrated the extraordinary speed and precision of Adobe’s Creative Cloud mobile apps on Apple’s new iPad Pro. iPad Pro is great for creative workflows with a high res 12.9″ touch screen display at 2732 x 2048 pixels, A9X chip, and 4GB RAM."
 
I don't see what's wrong in terms of ergonomics with having a laptop screen support touch.
Have you ever used one for extended periods of time? It's fatiguing. Every single dedicated commercial touchscreen solution has its angled somewhat.

It might work, but not like this. It's more comfy to just pull the move with a mouse.
 
Of course it has a filesystem, what - I guess - you're looking for is something like a Finder app to browse the contents of it, right? Apple has long gone out of its way to try to simplify file usage, and that's never going to change in iOS.

OK, but that's not how "professionals" use their computers. So no, the iPad Pro does not have a file system that the users can explore.
It runs the PHONE version of Windows 10?
 
Did you not get enough attention as a child? Seriously, what is it with people needing to inject and self-deflect with ``Say what you want,...'' comments that add nothing to the conversation of the new iPad Pro, or any product?

Hey did you see the new Porsche Cayene?

Say what you want I'm happy with my Tourag. I really wish Cayene was $30,000 less expensive.

Yeah I can't believe that jerk wants something! HOW DARE HE! He should just take what is offered and be happy and never want it to be better.
 
See, some of us aren't convinced it is. The Surface Pro 3 is "OK" as a laptop, and "OK" as a tablet, but it masters neither. I'd rather just have a laptop OR a tablet. Until someone "gets" the tablet/laptop combo, I'll take a tablet or a laptop. Not both. The iPad Pro is still unmistakably a tablet (even with adding a keyboard), and I'm glad for it. Because it will be a darn good one.

I;ve asked this of others before, but what makes the iPad pro a good tablet versus the surface pro an OK tablet? I could never understand this, I think the surface is an awesome tablet, excelling over the iPad any day of the week.

I can understand if folks have no issues carrying around a laptop AND a tablet, but meh not for me. Mobility always has a price, but it's weird to see the complaints around it. My desktop setup completely trumps my laptop, but I don't complain about that, I understand the mobility of the laptop is an advantage. I agree that the surface isn't as good as a laptop, but that's mainly because it is much more mobile and versatile, of course not everyone needs that. But as a tablet it's the best out there.
 
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I;ve asked this of others before, but what makes the iPad pro a good tablet versus the surface pro an OK tablet? I could never understand this, I think the surface is an awesome tablet, excelling over the iPad any day of the week.

Because the iPad (any of them!) is running an OS 100% designed for touch. Windows isn't designed for 100% touch.
 
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I;ve asked this of others before, but what makes the iPad pro a good tablet versus the surface pro an OK tablet? I could never understand this, I think the surface is an awesome tablet, excelling over the iPad any day of the week.
Again, it comes down to the software. The iPad Pro is a good tablet simply because of the quantity of quality touch-optimized apps. Even Microsoft knows that the Surface isn't so good as a tablet as evidenced by NEVER advertising the Surface without the TypeCover. Of course you knew that'd be my answer. :D

The problem is, the iPad Pro is simply that, a good tablet. It doesn't make any advances beyond tablet. For those of us who were expecting Apple to move the iPad closer to that line of convergence (between tablet and ultrabook) it is a pretty big let-down. No support for mice/trackpads, USB peripherals are two areas where the iPad Pro falls short.

Microsoft is moving the Surface from the ultrabook side of things closer to that point of convergence.


I can understand if folks have no issues carrying around a laptop AND a tablet, but meh not for me. Mobility always has a price, but it's weird to see the complaints around it. My desktop setup completely trumps my laptop, but I don't complain about that, I understand the mobility of the laptop is an advantage. I agree that the surface isn't as good as a laptop, but that's mainly because it is much more mobile and versatile, of course not everyone needs that. But as a tablet it's the best out there.
Again, I am of the opposite opinion. I think that the Surface is a terrific ultrabook. :D
 
Because the iPad (any of them!) is running an OS 100% designed for touch. Windows isn't designed for 100% touch.

That's a pretty weak reason IMO. Windows 10 has narrowed the gap for touch only significantly. Yes if you dig deep enough you will get to areas where old windows comes through, but we are talking about depths the iPad could never imagine. Even file explorer is quite nice with touch only on windows now, where with an iPad you don't even have the option at all for a file system. The average user will get no where near those deep settings in windows. Although I'm not saying you are incorrect, it just doesn't seem like a big deal anymore. Now once you slap on the keyboard and prop it up that touch only interface suddenly becomes a massive weakness, where with windows it makes it shine even brighter.
 
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