Apple Launching A9X-Based 12.9" iPad Pro in November for $799+

[spinedoc77]

you could be a deviant like me and use both at the same time

Being a lefty and having a Surface pro, i often use the touchpad with my right hand (or a mouse) and the stylus in my left.

I even have installed a IR based screen on my desktop (dell's 22" IPS based screen) so that I can use the surface pen then (albeit it without pressure sensitivity)

Oh I do sometimes, hehe. Well touchscreen and mouse I mean, I can't see any

you could be a deviant like me and use both at the same time

Being a lefty and having a Surface pro, i often use the touchpad with my right hand (or a mouse) and the stylus in my left.

I even have installed a IR based screen on my desktop (dell's 22" IPS based screen) so that I can use the surface pen then (albeit it without pressure sensitivity)

Not to change topics, but do you have a link to those screens? I'd be very curious. My main monitor is on a monitor arm that lets me twist and turn it anywhere, I use it to show patients studies where I can flip the monitor around and show them. Using a stylus like that might be awesome. But I don't want to subvert this thread too much.

 

[Robstevo]

Forgive me if I can't stand Windows. As for developers not taking advantage of the power, that's somewhat true and false. There are plenty of apps out there that allow for lots of powerful productivity on an iPad. It will continue to evolve - adding additional hardware like the iPad Pro only helps that.

At the end of the day, I can't handle anything that runs windows. The OS isn't intuitive, it's taken some cues from OS X, but ultimately doesn't do anything for me. Call it preference.

The Surface is a clunky tablet - as a laptop (actually on your lap), it's uncomfortable with the kickstand and keyboard case. The iPad Pro is a tablet with some additional accessories. It's not a laptop, it's not a desktop. Apple doesn't make hybrid devices - that's why features such as continuity and handoff exist. The idea is to be able to use the device that works best for the time and task and smoothly/efficiently move between devices as you move through your day.

Expecting anything else isn't Apple's problem. It's pretty clear what they are trying to do. If a Surface fits your work flow, go for it. Personally I'm a desktop/iPad guy. For 95% of what I do, an iPad works great. But I have an iMac at home for those times I game or need extra desktop oomph. For me, the iPad Pro seemed like it would be unnecessarily large, but I like the Pencil for sketching and keyboard for the occasional time I need to type out something long (like this post).

Still very much a tablet - because a tablet gets the job done as easily and efficiently as possible for my work flow. I'm gonna try the iPad Pro (I have extra devices to sell) - will still hold on to my trusty Air 2 that I love (my most used device). But the iPad Pro looks pretty great IMO.

I didn't have any problems using the Pro on my lap, Especially the pro 3 because the kick stand could adjust itself.

I to don't really like windows 7 ( And 8 was a bit confusing with the mix of old and new).

Windows 10 however has been the best experience I have had on any desktop OS, even better than OSX when i had a macbook air. It runs even smoother and faster than my old macbook air and the design language is now far more consistent.

In terms of the ipad, Handling it will be even harder than the pro 3. At least with the pro 3 you have the kick stand to rely on. On the ipad your either having to handle a huge ipad for a long period of time. or rely on there keyboard that I see being really clumsy. And can you adjust the angle of the new keyboard? Is it as sturdy as the pro 3's?

 

[jrswizzle]

But don't forget the SP3 also handles different paradigms smoothly. I have the surface dock and simply plop it in and instantly it turns into a desktop with multiple external monitors, mouse, full sized keyboard, external storage, etc.

I also never understood why the SP3 is "clunky" as a tablet, I'm curious about that. At the end of the day it's still ONE device and I'd rather carry it than a laptop and a tablet, what a waste IMO. Apple doesn't make hybrid devices because it would affect their bottom line. An OSx tablet would eat into their laptop sales, and Apple banks on convincing the consumer they need multiple devices.

Perhaps - though so far I'm not convinced combining tablet and desktop OSes into a single OS has been all that successful causing me to question its utility.....I mean, Windows 8 was an abject failure. I'm not convinced having a touch screen optimized version of OS X would really offer all that much more than I can get on an iPad.

 

[jrswizzle]

I didn't have any problems using the Pro on my lap, Especially the pro 3 because the kick stand could adjust itself.

I to don't really like windows 7 ( And 8 was a bit confusing with the mix of old and new).

Windows 10 however has been the best experience I have had on any desktop OS, even better than OSX when i had a macbook air. It runs even smoother and faster than my old macbook air and the design language is now far more consistent.

In terms of the ipad, Handling it will be even harder than the pro 3. At least with the pro 3 you have the kick stand to rely on. On the ipad your either having to handle a huge ipad for a long period of time. or rely on there keyboard that I see being really clumsy. And can you adjust the angle of the new keyboard? Is it as sturdy as the pro 3's?

My work puts me in front of a variety of customers. I've heard the complaint I raised from multiple users. Seems like the kickstand would be somewhat sharp in your legs but maybe not.

I wouldn't use the keyboard for the iPad Pro on my lap.....it's not a laptop. I'd only use the keyboard in certain instances. I'd likely continue using an iPad Pro as I do my current iPad. I'd just trust an Apple made stylus and keyboard more than 3rd party.

 

[OneMike]

Funny how some say that iPad pro is a big iPad. I remember when they said the iPad was a big iPhone. Look beyond the surface.

 

[spinedoc77]

Perhaps - though so far I'm not convinced combining tablet and desktop OSes into a single OS has been all that successful causing me to question its utility.....I mean, Windows 8 was an abject failure. I'm not convinced having a touch screen optimized version of OS X would really offer all that much more than I can get on an iPad.

Windows 8 wasn't a failure at all, and the bad press it got was mostly because it lost desktop function, in particular the start button/menu. Windows 8 is FAR superior to windows 10 when it comes to tablet use, but then again win10 was released unfinished and hopefully will be improved.

Touch OSx, who knows. It seemed that for a while Apple was headed in that direction, but I haven't used OSx in a while. I'd certainly be curious what Apple could do with OSx and touch, I'll bet they would do a great job. It's a shame that most don't realize why there is no OSx tablet isn't functionality, it's loss of income. I would bet anything that if Apple released an OSx tablet tomorrow it would completely blow away sales of the iPad and the MacBook air combined.

 

[spinedoc77]

Funny how some say that iPad pro is a big iPad. I remember when they said the iPad was a big iPhone. Look beyond the surface.

What changed? The iPad is a big iPhone. The iPad pro is just a bigger iPhone. Nothing wrong with that, but don't fool yourself.

 

[jrswizzle]

Windows 8 wasn't a failure at all, and the bad press it got was mostly because it lost desktop function, in particular the start button/menu. Windows 8 is FAR superior to windows 10 when it comes to tablet use, but then again win10 was released unfinished and hopefully will be improved.

Touch OSx, who knows. It seemed that for a while Apple was headed in that direction, but I haven't used OSx in a while. I'd certainly be curious what Apple could do with OSx and touch, I'll bet they would do a great job. It's a shame that most don't realize why there is no OSx tablet isn't functionality, it's loss of income. I would bet anything that if Apple released an OSx tablet tomorrow it would completely blow away sales of the iPad and the MacBook air combined.

I can tell you from experience, if sales of Windows machines are any indication, Windows 8 was a massive failure. I can't tell you how many folks I've talked to who told me how much they hated Windows 8 and that it made them look to OS X and Macs for the first time.

If you haven't looked into OS X in a while, look no further than Windows 10. A bunch of it's new features came from OS X.

 

[jrswizzle]

What changed? The iPad is a big iPhone. The iPad pro is just a bigger iPhone. Nothing wrong with that, but don't fool yourself.

Wrong - apps look and act completely differently on iPads versus iPhones. Again, developers are the key. But those that take advantage of the added screen real estate and power can make huge experience changes based on devices that run on the same OS.

This is a fundamental philosophy that people seem to ignore or not understand. The OS doesn't determine the utility of an Apple product. Apple's focus is apps and developers.

Although, iOS 9 introduced split view and slide over for the iPad. It won't be coming to the iPhone.

 

[Renzatic]

What changed? The iPad is a big iPhone. The iPad pro is just a bigger iPhone. Nothing wrong with that, but don't fool yourself.

I can't complain too much about it. It has a stylus, which was the one single thing I wanted to see the most on an iPad.

Though the SP3 has put a dent in some of my enthusiasm over it. Now, I guess it all comes down to apps and functionality, which, for now, is a battle the Surface is winning by default.

 

[rowspaxe]

At least with the pro 3 you have the kick stand to rely on. On the ipad your either having to handle a huge ipad for a long period of time. or rely on there keyboard that I see being really clumsy. And can you adjust the angle of the new keyboard? Is it as sturdy as the pro 3's?

I can see this cover feeling very floppy at 12.9"--the smart cover for the ipad air feels that way to me
already. MS really did a great job of implementing the "kickstand"--it gives good functionality with
no fabric swim.

My two surprises about this device are 1) does apple pencil have palm rejection or is this issue being
implemented per app and 2) how could they not have a mouse?

I hear the anti ios chorus--but the ipad--by virtue of ios--is a much tighter media and app device than
the surface. And I own and really like the surface. So "pro" aside--this is apples bid as an enhanced
media tool. I think they could have done alot more

 

[rowspaxe]

I call maximum BS on this, my surface pro 3 in NO way lags.

When it comes to Surface comments--misinformation here is stunning

 

[spinedoc77]

Wrong - apps look and act completely differently on iPads versus iPhones. Again, developers are the key. But those that take advantage of the added screen real estate and power can make huge experience changes based on devices that run on the same OS.

This is a fundamental philosophy that people seem to ignore or not understand. The OS doesn't determine the utility of an Apple product. Apple's focus is apps and developers.

Actually... correct! Meh, the difference isn't staggering. It's still a big iPhone IMO. It's not the sort of difference you would get with say windows continuum where a tablet or phone app would truly turn into a fully fledged desktop program. You aren't talking about small differences that mainly take advantage of a larger screen, but truly functional changes that take advantages of touch based mobile paradigms versus seated, workhorse, mouse, etc paradigms.

I've been hearing that developer's make the difference crap for years now, but still don't see much differentiation between the iPad and the iPhone except maybe developers making better use of the iPad larger screen.

 

[Renzatic]

My two surprises about this device are 1) does apple pencil have palm rejection or is this issue being
implemented per app and 2) how could they not have a mouse?

1. It does, and it's implemented across the OS. If an app uses the stylus, it has palm rejection already implemented.

2. Well, with the stylus and OSX shortcuts, it isn't quite so necessary. Though if you're typing, having to use the stylus to highlight things or jump the cursor around would get kind of tiring if you do it quite a bit.

 

[rowspaxe]

I'm tired of Wacom's overpriced (and underwhelming) hardware! This is a huge step in the right direction! Wacom was just put on notice today.

What in this presentation gives you any confidence apple pencil will be nearly as good as wacom, wacom
es, or ntrig. Apple is making no claims about palm rejection or levels of pressure.

 

[LordVic]

I can see this cover feeling very floppy at 12.9"--the smart cover for the ipad air feels that way to me
already. MS really did a great job of implementing the "kickstand"--it gives good functionality with
no fabric swim.

My two surprises about this device are 1) does apple pencil have palm rejection or is this issue being
implemented per app and 2) how could they not have a mouse?

I hear the anti ios chorus--but the ipad--by virtue of ios--is a much tighter media and app device than
the surface. And I own and really like the surface. So "pro" aside--this is apples bid as an enhanced
media tool. I think they could have done alot more

This will be an excellent 12.9" iPad. I don't think there is any doubt about the quality of the product. The same good experience you have with a current iPad will still be had here.

Its just the "pro"name, and that Apple wanted to show this thing off as a real productivity tool that is getting the concerned talk. This is not a pro device, just because it's larger. which feels like what Apple is trying to tell everyone.

Its not the stylus that makes it pro. That helps.
it's not the keyboard that makes it pro, that too helps

it's what you can run on it. what platform it is running. what tools that platform has available to you.

the comparison everyone uses is to the Surface (Pro) lineup. with the surface lineup, those things I mentioned above, are good. they're helpfull, but thats not what is the true definition. It's the Operating system and system architecture that is able to run, and is compatible with an extremely large, wide dearth of software platforms. 20+ years of software that ranges from fun and games to full blown productivity suits. If windows desktop can run it, a surface can run it.

that what a lot of people want from something calling itself a "pro" device. Apple did not deliver that. They've given the same limiting CPU architecture and same limitting OS that is running on their iphone and ipads. its a good OS for that uses, but does nothing to bridge the gap between OSx productivity and a touch based powerful handheld (or docked) device.

So my preliminary verdict? If you like iOS and ipads, and want a bigger device that will run basically the same stuff you're currently on with your iPad, this will be a great larger tablet.

But ti will not provide a professional grade experience to bridge that gap between desktop caliber programs and mobile.

 

[Ploki]

I suppose it depends on how you work. If you want to hunt and peck with a stylus all day long I suppose you are entitled to it. For me HELL no, I need my mouse. I couldn't see working with menus, file systems, etc with a stylus.

Your quad OSx setup barely runs full office? That's nuts, have you sent it in for warranty yet? Office in no way slows down any of my PC's, not even the literally 10 year old laptop I have in one of my back offices.

I need my mouse too. Just thought I'd throw that in though. But, mouse is probably as skill you learned, just like pencil skills

as far as office goes, I didn't mean it runs slow... I mean its not really reliable. Word isn't super stable on OS X

I don't know what you're doing... My '06 OG MacBook1,1 used to run Office fine. I eventually switched to iWork for everything except spreadsheets (since Numbers sucks), and it was more resource-efficient, but c'mon, Office works too.

Yeah, I miss Excels power functions too. But I switched to other programs for that.

Didn't say it doesn't work, its just not stable at all... ugh. and bloated...

 

[macguy360]

Apple have been saying for the last few years the Ipad has a desktop level graphics and Cpu, Yet developers are not even close to making anything that takes the amount of performance it has.

Most games still look crap, Most software is dumbed down etc

Oh and with the surface running windows 10, Very clearly it does decide what it wants to be, Infact all it takes is a click of a button and you can switch from a desktop mode, to a complete tablet mode.

It craps all over the Ipad pro if we are honest, and you mention apps. It runs bloody full windows! pretty much any major application you get **** done, it has.

I completely agree. There is something about picking up and using a Surface 3 or Surface pro 3 that you can just tell that it is capable of so much more than the walled garden of IOS.

With the Surface 3 $499 tablet I can...
1) develop college level research papers AND use citation software such as Zotero or Refworks (neither of which work on iPad).
2) I can also play graphically intensive games using either Steam Stream from my desktop computer or Windows 10 Xbox One streaming in the event that I want to play a game and the TV is being used or Im not wanting to Hobbit upstairs at a desk.
3) I can present powerpoints at school or at a business meeting using a tiny hdmi wireless maracast adapter and hold my Surface 3 tablet as a remote/note reader.
4) I can write notes that convert to text with a very precise pen and palm rejection tech.
5) Have complete file management control and the ability to easily incorporate google docs and other software.
6) Add additional storage with micro sd card slot on the back of the device.
7) Fully edit photographs and video with full OS functionality AND use a keyboard and mouse.
8) Run multiple external monitors with multiple windows open.

I could probably come up with a couple other things, but I feel like 8 is enough.

Or I could spend $799 for a tablet that has a walled garden, with top grossing games that are psychologically designed like casino games to be addicting yet "free" initially. Hmm, I wonder which tablet is really "Pro"

 

[OneMike]

What changed? The iPad is a big iPhone. The iPad pro is just a bigger iPhone. Nothing wrong with that, but don't fool yourself.

Would you build a website on an iPhone?

For me bigger device = more possibilities and productivity.

Overall the limiting factor is the OS. that said I'd probably still go for a surface rather than an iPad pro if in the market. I do think the pro has a place though.

 

[spinedoc77]

Would you build a website on an iPhone?

For me bigger device = more possibilities and productivity.

Overall the limiting factor is the OS. that said I'd probably still go for a surface rather than an iPad pro if in the market. I do think the pro has a place though.

Hell no, but then I wouldn't dream of building a website on an iPad, even an iPad pro. But I would definitely not hesitate to build a website on a surface pro 3. How you would survive building a website with no mouse support, file system, access to desktop programs, graphics, etc I have no idea.

 

[LordVic]

Hell no, but then I wouldn't dream of building a website on an iPad, even an iPad pro. But I would definitely not hesitate to build a website on a surface pro 3. How you would survive building a website with no mouse support, file system, access to desktop programs, graphics, etc I have no idea.

or install my own webserver and SQL engine for offline testing , or run full VM's for test environments before deploying things to clients sites.

I'm a deployment analyst for enterprise financial institution software back ends.

I can 100% do my work powered by a surface Pro 2.

(though, don't get me wrong, having a nice big beefy server to run a few more VM's at the same time doesn't hurt)

this is the type of stuff that pops into peoples minds when you call something "professional".

not just drawing sketches and writing word docs

 

[teslo]

You don't snip your fingers and have a touch-based UI for your desktop OS. ...You'd see an evolving of the OS X UI towards touch-friendlyness years in advance before a tablet with a version of OS X would ship.

what's 'unfriendly' about OS X? seriously?

 

[caipirina08]

How dare they call watching a movie on a 4:3 screen a 'cinematic' experience? I keep waiting for a 16:9 iPad ...

 

[Xiroteus]

On the right track yet they are doing the same things with storage space. Should make 64GB 799 and go from there. At least they made a pencil (pen) for art with pressure. I already find the iPads pricing too high so this just knocks it too far into crazy. After you buy everything and tax it will end up being $1200 or more.

 

[sudo1996]

So, a touch screen belongs on the MacBook where it will be hardly used and not on an iPad where it will be almost exclusively used? If I had to give out general advice on this, I would say a touch screen doesn't really belong on devices that cannot be positioned such that the screen is where your hands naturally would rest (eg, not on a device which had a fixed keyboard attached to the screen).

A touch screen does belong on an iPad. It's just that an iPad shouldn't have a MacBook-sized screen. You can't even hold it with one hand at that point. Your hands don't really rest on an iPad anyway except when you're typing. I don't see what's wrong in terms of ergonomics with having a laptop screen support touch.