Apple Makes $29 Battery Replacements Available Immediately for iPhone 6 and Newer

[cmaier]

Crash https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crash_(computing)

Hardware fault

Wrong again, it's the way I work based on experience and research.
PS what you said in your first post, isn't that EXACTLY what is happening to the iPhone, IE the equipment ceases to function?
And how do you explain that even "nowadays", sometimes the OS DOES cease to function.

If the os does cease to function it’s still a crash, just like when the app ceases to function but the os doesn’t. The only difference is that in one case the app crashes and in the Other case both the app and the os crash. But that’s irrelevant to my point. You claim that based on your experience and research, a crash means that the device ceases to function. I point out that your definition is provably wrong - if I’m using Microsoft word and it suddenly exits for no apparent reason it has crashed, but the device still functions. You ignored the point and tripled down.

I never claimed that your definition wouldn’t cover hardware failures. I am claiming your definition is WRONG, for TWO reasons.

1) your definition excludes actual crashes when those crashes do not prevent continued functioning of the device
2) your definition includes hardware faults, and hardware faults are not crashes.

Your definition, in fact, would include power outages and smashing the computer with a hammer. It’s just plain wrong.

 

[mi7chy]

A shutdown needs time as it waits for all the applications to close. A shutdown is when you power off your iPhone and you see the spinning wheel for a few seconds. That does not happen in the critical situation of a power failure. Of course, this can be easliy proven with logs.

Spot on. Regardless of software or hardware it should be a graceful shutdown to prevent file corruption and data loss.

The fact that it just cuts out points to an amperage issue with the battery. If it was a voltage issue the symptom will more likely be a software crash due to logic level, undervolting SoC, etc.

 

[FormerFanboy]

The real questions still needs to be investigated; what other devices has Apple purposely throttled and not disclosed? MacBooks, Airbooks, iPad, etc. This needs to be investigated by the Apple Consumer Community!

Also how are iPhone users going to be compensated for the resell value lost because of this? Resell of iPhones has been a good market for users to sell their phones. This will certainly impact resell value...

My friend with an iPhone 6 went to the Dallas Apple Store to get his battery replaced. They ran some tests with the Apple diagnostics and told him that the battery "was at 95%" and that his older processor wasn't coping with the demands of the latest software. He called me and I called BS, had him install a couple of battery apps on his phone - 65% capacity on both apps. He went back and they told him that they were out of batteries (probably true) and that he needed to wait until next week, then convinced him to buy an iPhone 8. He is taking it back, and getting his iPhone 6 battery replaced after I explained to him that he was rewarding fraudulent behavior by giving them even more money.

Bait and switch time at Apple, they get caught out in using software to degrade the performance of perfectly good hardware and then play good guy by offering "cheap" battery replacements, except they do everything they can to keep people from actually getting them replaced and use the fact that they have them in the store to try to upsell them to new handsets. The non-replaceable battery has always been a factor in the upgrade cycle of Apple products, they have extended that to laptops now too.

I used to evangelize for Apple and over the years have probably been directly responsible for over 200 Macs being sold, and God knows how many iPhones. Never again - my next phone is a Pixel when my 5S dies, and my last "new" computer purchase was a 2009 Mac Pro flashed to a 5,1 firmware and upgraded with Westmere 6-core processors as the current crop of "Pro" machines don't allow for the variety of upgrades that the earlier ones did. If it weren't for the thousands of dollars I have invested in CAD and Adobe software I would ditch the OS completely and switch to Linux.

Apple is now a company focused on only one thing, and that is creating expensive toys for the gullible. I used to push the products because I felt that the approach they had to interface design and supporting the creative pro users was better than anything else out there, but after years of horrible software updates that break features that people built workflows around and the focus on building products that focus on passive consumption of media I have stopped giving my money to Apple and steer anyone that asks to some other options.

 

[JForestZ34]

I agree, no one should have to pay for those new batteries and it shouldn't be a restricted to a year-long program. I hope the battery heath test they have gets updated, so that customers are not turned away due to the results of that test (which someone here posted some information about dealing with 10.2.1 and 10.3)

Honesty and transparency was all that was needed.

The one thing that still baffles me is no matter what my battery health is, if I'm paying full price or whatever the price is apple SHOULD replace it for me. They shouldn't be saying NO... Same thing if you want you lawnmover worked on.. Bring it to the shop tell them what you want, they will likely respond " you don't need that. " but if your willing to give your money they are gonna take it. I just don't understand why apple won't replace a battery that your willing to pay for to get replaced..

with the new year starting this week, and things back to normal business after the holidays, it'll be interesting. I would not be surprised if some folks at apple are terminated or resign over this.

Have to wonder if the CEO knew what was going on with the throttling before it came to light.

For something this big I'm sure old Timmy boy was made aware but it was off the record so he can officially say he had no knowledge..

It's New Years. Everyone forgot about throttling already. So, what do you want to see from Apple this year?!

HONESTY


James

 

[2IS]

"iPhone 6 or later". Does "Later" = "Older", or does that mean 6 series through X? Originally read that it was 6 and 'older', but the language here isn't as clear. Battery life on my 7 was worse than my 2 year old 6, even on day 1. For $29, I'll replace it without thinking twice.

Well if you tell someone you’ll show Up at 6 or later, does that mean 6 or earlier in any way shape or form?

 

[MH01]

And...still using rhetorical devices...because you don't have any facts...and your goal is to muddy the waters, not learn anything about the issue.

I already answered your question in detail. iOS uses throttling in situations that would otherwise result in an auto shutdown. It's unlikely a standard application would require throttling unless the device was below nominal voltage (i.e., below 20% charge in a non-EOL battery). That's when the voltage available to the CPU begins a steep drop below nominal levels due to the limitations of lithium ion battery design.

If you were sincere in your approach to the issue, you would have already acknowledge that many of the things you've posted about aren't accurate.

The irony . Every accusation you posted right there, find a mirror please.

You are just spamming the same thing over and over. Does not make it right, I hope a mod pulls you up on this spam
[doublepost=1514827761][/doublepost]

I agree. But still, behind the hardware shutdown due to power failure you have a crashed OS .

This is correct, the user sees a crashed Os.

 

[charlituna]

Is there a list somewhere that states which iPhones are eligible for the discount battery replacement program?
I have a slow 6 Plus. Is that on the list?

6/6 plus or any phone released after that. however if your battery isn't actually failing you'll be wasting your money and time. and it is possible that your phone is slow for reasons other than the battery. I'd do a chat or call with support and have them run the battery test. if your batter fails, cool go get it replaced. if it doesn't then you probably have **** software or such going on. they can help you backup, restore etc.

 

[opfreak]

Logical fallacy. Neither Apple or the developer who posted that quote are saying that auto shutdowns could only occur when running a benchmark. iOS is looking for big peaks/valleys in power draw relative to available voltage. Benchmarking triggers this at nominal voltage levels specifically because it's not designed to operate like a normal app and doesn't allow standard idle time, but standard apps could potentially trigger it if the voltage was below nominal levels...which typically is around 20% charge for lithium ion batteries that aren't EOL yet. Voltage available starts to drop very steeply around 20% or lower charge in a healthy non-EOL battery.

posters here are making the claim that it only throttles during geekbench. That is what I was referring. No fallacy involved.

 

[macsforever]

Do you get a new phone every year, by any chance?

NO! I update when I need new features and an iPhone 5S can run the newest software and has 2 radios so I can surf on a phone call... something the iPhone 6S can’t do unless on WIFI!!! So NO...
I don’t update every year just to brag that I have the “new” iPhone he he. Once the network speeds increase where you can actually see the difference in hardware speed, you’re still dealing with a bottleneck!!!

 

[deferredAnon]

posters here are making the claim that it only throttles during geekbench. That is what I was referring. No fallacy involved.

That silly iDefence is still going?

Here is Geekbench results on iPhone 7 over various iOS releases. iOS 11.2 is when Apple started throttling iPhone 7, which Apple admitted to after Geekbench results!

 

[gijoeinla]

My friend with an iPhone 6 went to the Dallas Apple Store to get his battery replaced. They ran some tests with the Apple diagnostics and told him that the battery "was at 95%" and that his older processor wasn't coping with the demands of the latest software. He called me and I called BS, had him install a couple of battery apps on his phone - 65% capacity on both apps. He went back and they told him that they were out of batteries (probably true) and that he needed to wait until next week, then convinced him to buy an iPhone 8. He is taking it back, and getting his iPhone 6 battery replaced after I explained to him that he was rewarding fraudulent behavior by giving them even more money.

Bait and switch time at Apple, they get caught out in using software to degrade the performance of perfectly good hardware and then play good guy by offering "cheap" battery replacements, except they do everything they can to keep people from actually getting them replaced and use the fact that they have them in the store to try to upsell them to new handsets. The non-replaceable battery has always been a factor in the upgrade cycle of Apple products, they have extended that to laptops now too.

I used to evangelize for Apple and over the years have probably been directly responsible for over 200 Macs being sold, and God knows how many iPhones. Never again - my next phone is a Pixel when my 5S dies, and my last "new" computer purchase was a 2009 Mac Pro flashed to a 5,1 firmware and upgraded with Westmere 6-core processors as the current crop of "Pro" machines don't allow for the variety of upgrades that the earlier ones did. If it weren't for the thousands of dollars I have invested in CAD and Adobe software I would ditch the OS completely and switch to Linux.

Apple is now a company focused on only one thing, and that is creating expensive toys for the gullible. I used to push the products because I felt that the approach they had to interface design and supporting the creative pro users was better than anything else out there, but after years of horrible software updates that break features that people built workflows around and the focus on building products that focus on passive consumption of media I have stopped giving my money to Apple and steer anyone that asks to some other options.

Dude realistically speaking you realize that these types of decisions are arbitrary at the store at that time.. meaning it’s happened to me several times over a span of 25+ years. Sometimes I’m fuming at the time, I follow up with phone support, I speak to senior techs and 99% I’ve been taken care of.

I’m sorry to see you feel a “This is it” moment but I’d remind you that Apple at this point is facing its “everyone and their mother” moment descending on them to just give out free or replacement batteries. Yes it’s true because the type of customer they service has drastically changed. From? From professional core customers to mass market “I’m entitled” just because I heard it on the news types.

So just because the experiences of more knows is happening I certainly do not feel the company turned against me. In this case you can be talking about potentially claims being counted in the 10’s to hundreds of millions.

What should they do? Not have a system of discretion at all? I mean c’mon. I’m confident your friend will get his battery even after some angst.

Name a manufacturer that just hands out replacements just because an app and not their own test say so. Maybe just maybe his hardware is damaged and in fact it’s not the battery itself. ?

My gut is he’ll be made whole again.

Oh and about the “path of least resistance” suggesting he get a new phone - hello - I’m obviously from a different generation — the employees in ALL retail environments operate in general from a mindset like that. That’s not always Apples corporate culture but the mind of the individuals. Kick this case upstairs on the phone and give it another try. I’m betting he gets what he wants.

 

[Tor Eckman]

I already answered your question in detail.

You are just making stuff up, and your star expert witness so far is another poster in this thread who is an "app developer."


From apple:

"About a year ago in iOS 10.2.1, we delivered a software update that improves power management during peak workloads to avoid unexpected shutdowns on iPhone 6, iPhone 6 Plus, iPhone 6s, iPhone 6s Plus, and iPhone SE. With the update, iOS dynamically manages the maximum performance of some system components when needed to prevent a shutdown. While these changes may go unnoticed, in some cases users may experience longer launch times for apps and other reductions in performance."
https://www.apple.com/iphone-battery-and-performance/



The text in bold could have certainly caused many users to buy a new phone, thinking their current (last year) model could no longer effectively run the latest os.


Again, and the issue you have avoided over and over, is the fact that Apple didn't properly disclose this in a way an average consumer could understand. What about a pop up when 10.2.1 installed alerting users that under certain conditions their phone performance would decrease due to a worn battery, but a simple battery replacement would restore performance? The issue is the lack of transparency, not the software throttling per se.


To your argument about the throttling "updates" per se, however, the timing of the "updates" that caused the throttling is interesting too, both coming in point releases just after a new model is released. The 6/6s "update" in 10.2.1 coming just after the 7 was released, and the the 7 throttling update 11.2 coming just after the 8 was released. Pretty convenient if you are trying to subtly encourage people to upgrade to your latest and greatest. Also, why is this power management "improvement" not implemented across the board including the latest model phones? If the throttling only occurs when a battery is catastrophically aged as apple is now claiming, then it wouldn't occur on the newest device until that device's battery had aged sufficiently anyway. Without reviewing the source code for iOS we are not going to really know what is going on.

 

[macsforever]

Yes they are. There are people on here in denial that a user would be impacted .

Forget about geekbench , it's not really Relevant , and a silly tangent that is defecting from the real issue......

Did Apple introduce throttling , Yes, done.

I like it!

 

[Baymowe335]

The fact that you are doing that says something about your judgment...
[doublepost=1514790464][/doublepost]

Her phone slowed down, she perhaps thought the hardware was too old to run the latest OS, and therefore she upgraded to the newest phone. That sounds like a solution many reasonable people might and have made. Throttling iPhones is the cheapest solution apple could have done and not telling consumers that a new battery would restore performance is negligent at best and willful and malicious at worst.

I hope that after this apple will at least stop being self righteous asshol$% I don't think they would have any problem at all causing people to have to upgrade all of their apple devices once a year and and dumping last years models in landfills. Apple is no different than Wal Mart or Exon Mobil, so they should stop pretending they are.

Guess you’ve n ver on d a car with a recall? Not a lot of options and millions are affected. I could sell the car?

The risk is low, but it’s there and BMW chooses to handle it poorly.

 

[GizmoDVD]

So, Apple, you frack up my phone and I'm suppose to smile and say "Thank you" for charging me "just" 29 bucks to fix what you broke?

You have an old phone. Get over it. You don’t even deserve a $29 battery replacement.

 

[firewood]

Benchmarking tools are not designed to measure normal app performance.....
.

Properly designed benchmarks are of little value unless they measure normal performance, typical of apps that the customers actually use. Otherwise, improperly used, they can mislead customers into buying computers that are unsuitable for the software that the customer primarily runs. Which is seldom using their computer as a building heater or hand warmer.

 

[Tor Eckman]

Guess you’ve n ver on d a car with a recall? Not a lot of options and millions are affected. I could sell the car?

The risk is low, but it’s there and BMW chooses to handle it poorly.

You have played up your BMW airbag issue is several threads, making it sound like you are driving around in a death trap, this is the first post (i've seen) where you have tempered your point and allowed that the risk is low. I haven't done any independent research on the matter, so I'll take your word for all of it. At any rate, the BMW issue, as you've described it, is not analogous to the apple issue everyone is discussing in this thread. The fact that BMW disclosed the issue to you and others makes it much different.

 

[gnipgnop]

What about a pop up when 10.2.1 installed alerting users that under certain conditions their phone performance would decrease due to a worn battery, but a simple battery replacement would restore performance? The issue is the lack of transparency, not the software throttling per se.

The problem with that idea is that performance issues are not always related to the battery. Apple does have a low power warning pop-up at 20% charge though, and it's not a coincidence that is in line with the charge level that a lithium ion battery will begin to drop below nominal voltage very rapidly. They also have information available to customers about 80% capacity or lower being the time to replace a non-defective battery.

And here's the reality: unless your battery is EOL or defective, replacing it prior to it being EOL is only going to achieve higher capacity, not higher performance. You can expect a non-EOL battery to supply nominal voltage or higher for around 80% of the charge cycle every time you charge it to 100%. The voltage drop-off below nominal is always going to happen around 20% or lower...that's just the way lithium ion technology currently works. That's when you could potentially run into the CPU needing more voltage than the battery can supply and get a slowdown that is specific to Apple's 10.2.1 fix.

 

[rusty2192]

I just got back from the Genius Bar. My 6s is from launch and is included in the free battery replacement program. Coconut Battery put my battery at 76%. Apple today said it was 84%. After a little BS they are going to replace my battery for free under the program, but they don’t have any batteries in stock so I’ll have to go back once they get one in. I’ve been putting off getting my free battery to get as much life as possible out of the phone, but it’s lately gotten so bad lately and the throttling was the last straw. I guess waiting bit me in the butt a little since so many people are trying to get batteries now.

 

[firewood]

Also, why is this power management "improvement" not implemented across the board including the latest model phones?

What makes you think this improved power management isn’t implemented in the latest devices? They have similar processor cores and batteries, so power management should be optimized in the same way, and maybe improved more after Apple has a year or two worth of statistics and field data about battery aging behavior during the customers typical usage patterns.

 

[Tor Eckman]

What makes you think this improved power management isn’t implemented in the latest devices?

This message from apple:


"About a year ago in iOS 10.2.1, we delivered a software update that improves power management during peak workloads to avoid unexpected shutdowns on iPhone 6, iPhone 6 Plus, iPhone 6s, iPhone 6s Plus, and iPhone SE. With the update, iOS dynamically manages the maximum performance of some system components when needed to prevent a shutdown. While these changes may go unnoticed, in some cases users may experience longer launch times for apps and other reductions in performance.

Customer response to iOS 10.2.1 was positive, as it successfully reduced the occurrence of unexpected shutdowns. We recently extended the same support for iPhone 7 and iPhone 7 Plus in iOS 11.2.

Of course, when a chemically aged battery is replaced with a new one, iPhone performance returns to normal when operated in standard conditions."
https://www.apple.com/iphone-battery-and-performance/ December 28, 2017
[doublepost=1514832097][/doublepost]

The problem with that idea is that performance issues are not always related to the battery. Apple does have a low power warning pop-up at 20% charge though, and it's not a coincidence that is in line with the charge level that a lithium ion battery will begin to drop below nominal voltage very rapidly. They also have information available to customers about 80% capacity or lower being the time to replace a non-defective battery.

And here's the reality: unless your battery is EOL or defective, replacing it prior to it being EOL is only going to achieve higher capacity, not higher performance. You can expect a non-EOL battery to supply nominal voltage or higher for around 80% of the charge cycle every time you charge it to 100%. The voltage drop-off below nominal is always going to happen around 20% or lower...that's just the way lithium ion technology currently works. That's when you could potentially run into the CPU needing more voltage than the battery can supply and get a slowdown that is specific to Apple's 10.2.1 fix.

You are making most of that up. Cite your sources to support each point please. And none of that has anything to do with apple's lack of disclosure/transparency, or the suspicious timing of the updates. To your second point, however, if the software is sophisticated enough to know when to throttle based on battery health, then it is sophisticated enough to let consumers know that the battery health is poor enough to affect performance and that a new battery would remedy the issue.

 

[gnipgnop]

I just got back from the Genius Bar. My 6s is from launch and is included in the free battery replacement program.

If it's in the free replacement program, then you had a defective battery. You could have had it replaced in 2016.

 

[MrX8503]

It's arguable that Samsung's situation was an actual scandal in that it was not deliberate... I know there was some discussion that potentially laboratory battery testing reports were altered internally at Samsung , but nothing ever came of those allegations. Apple deliberately and specifically followed the course of action they took, intentionally misleading their customers. Samsung's issue had the potential to be more dangerous, but all available evidence says it wasn't done deliberately and the company sincerely apologized and drastically improved things as a result. Apple deliberately followed an insidious course of action, ignored the pleas of customers for years, and then when finally forced by evidence to admit it was indeed slowing devices, told its customers they were morons or at least "misunderstanding" for thinking Apple secretly degrading their devices' performance was a bad thing. What a nice company.

Samsung deliberately didn't carry out an official recall when the issue was first known.

 

[firewood]

This message from apple: ...

You may be reading far too much into a simplified message written by the marketing department. What’s actually in the power management code might be partially revealed in a later more technical document, or is part of a very complex engineering trade-secret on how Apple manages dark silicon.

 

[Tor Eckman]

You may be reading far too much into a simplified message written by the marketing department. What’s actually in the power management code might be partially revealed in a later more technical document, or is part of a very complex engineering trade-secret on how Apple manages dark silicon.

Apple plainly stated that the update was not extended to the 7 until 11.2 update, so we know it was not included in 10.2.1 which affected the 6 and 6s, just after the release of the 7. You are the one who is reading too much into this.

Btw, that message was not written by a marketing department, it was written by apples attorneys.