Apple Maps to Be Rebuilt 'From the Ground Up' With First-Party Data Over the Next Year

[dilbert99]

I’d have to disagree with you here

Oh please...almost every response on here to your ridiculous posts were trying to either get info on how you are using or offering up solutions which the rest of us have used successfully.

Your only response is that the phone HAS to be used on your dash in direct sunlight in an environment that is typically 35-degrees.

Don’t be surprised then when folks respond in kind about you being screwed.

And honestly, mounting a phone on the dash is not the most common area because of the reasons you state. If the Uber rides I take while traveling every single week are any indication, vent mount is number one. Windshield mount is a distant second.

Why? Because the phone mounts are more stable in those locations. AND...both of those locations allow the phone to be visible while keeping them out of the sunlight.

everyone’s use case is different for me I put my satnav in one of three places, windscreen mount, dash mount or vent mount.

I don’t like the vent mount because it restricts airflow.

The other two locations put the phone in view.

Mounting the phone at the visor height is not usable and I don’t know why you thing it is but each to their one needs.

I don’t have an issue with my sat mac on my dash and I don’t see why I should have an issue with my phone being there either.

It’s not as if the car gets that hot. The climate is set to 24c

Anywhere I put the phone in usable safe view means on the dash/screen which means it is going to get sun.

Putting it down on how center console is not an option and is unsafe.

Just because Apple designs a phone that has satnav that cannot be used in the most common location doesn’t mean I am going to be happy.

You might be fine compromising and putting your sat mac on center console, but done expect everyone to be fine with it (a couple of Apple fans on here is not a good sample size) nor is a few users from a cooler climate like the uk.

Anyway, I use my in dash mac in one of our cars and that doesn’t have a problem. You see it can be designed to work, just don’t blindly stick up for Apple.
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What’s your solution? If you know it gets hot in the one spot you want to put it, you can’t use it. That’s not rocket science. That’s simple logic. Either get a Sat Nav or find somewhere else to put it. Those are, literally, the only solutions.

My current solution is to use the inbuilt navigation which happens to be mounted exactly where I would normally mount my phone and that is fine in the sun.

I would personally rather use Waze on my phone but because the phone can’t be used where I want it, I have to use this compromise.

I did have it mounted on the vent for a while but didn’t like it blocking my air. So went back to the inbuilt nav.

I’m thinking of designing something with my 3D printer to cool the phone.

 

[campyguy]

Were people complaining about GPS accuracy??

I missed that.

I’ve never had an issue with Maps GPS.

And btw...I love your detailed posts about mapping. Thanks for commenting on this stuff. I’m just a fan of mapping because I use them so much with travel. But getting the detailed background around how it happens (more than I’ve learned on my own) is really interesting.

Complaining, to me, yes - to be fair. Persons like me generate the raw data that ends up in maps apps. 15 odd years ago I worked for a consultant that hired my firm to lay down the dirt work for a 50+ acre site that a high school would be constructed on, that consultant had hired a surveyor that used this newfangled GPS technology to lay out the site. The principal in my firm succumbed to the hype of GPS layouts not knowing what I knew about the accuracy of GPS - my firm took a bath with the cost of the earthwork quantity differentials to the tune of mid-six figures, but my firm started paying attention to me and my directions... GPS tech has really evolved in the past several years.

My point is that GPS accuracy now will be like throwing a beach ball in an ocean compared to what's coming next. I already have access to the next-gen hardware that will be in our next smartphones. GPS accuracy now is around 15-30 feet, this time next year it'll be 15-30 inches or less. That chipset that Broadcom created will change how we use our smartphones, drive hands-free cars, and deal with emergencies when it's connected to the newest GPSS network flying overhead. The L5/E5 GPSS frequencies are already available to certain industries that pay for equipment that can access it, and it's pretty sweet - I've busted hump through blackberry brambles and muck for 30 years and wish this tech was available then as I could have spent time watching soccer, drinking Scotch, or blasting my Benz on twisties instead of cleaning my survey chain or copying survey data........

No offense, you're seeing a bit of what's coming next. I'm seeing a paradigm shift in how we use maps because I've had a bit of an opportunity to use the tech that's going to be in our next iPhone or Nexus. I learned how to program a computer using punch cards, I'm that "old" but I've adapted. IMHO Apple has bided its time until a product like Broadcom's BCM47755 came out - my next smartphone will have that chipset in it, regardless of OS platform. I remember when Google Maps was available on S60, you'll remember how primitive maps and navigation and access to POI features are today in a year or two. I really hope that Apple's next iPhone has a Broadcom BCM47755 chipset in it.

And, carrier aggregation and a decent parsing engine would be nice too....

 

[Sciomar]

Complaining, to me, yes - to be fair. Persons like me generate the raw data that ends up in maps apps. 15 odd years ago I worked for a consultant that hired my firm to lay down the dirt work for a 50+ acre site that a high school would be constructed on, that consultant had hired a surveyor that used this newfangled GPS technology to lay out the site. The principal in my firm succumbed to the hype of GPS layouts not knowing what I knew about the accuracy of GPS - my firm took a bath with the cost of the earthwork quantity differentials to the tune of mid-six figures, but my firm started paying attention to me and my directions... GPS tech has really evolved in the past several years.

My point is that GPS accuracy now will be like throwing a beach ball in an ocean compared to what's coming next. I already have access to the next-gen hardware that will be in our next smartphones. GPS accuracy now is around 15-30 feet, this time next year it'll be 15-30 inches or less. That chipset that Broadcom created will change how we use our smartphones, drive hands-free cars, and deal with emergencies when it's connected to the newest GPSS network flying overhead. The L5/E5 GPSS frequencies are already available to certain industries that pay for equipment that can access it, and it's pretty sweet - I've busted hump through blackberry brambles and muck for 30 years and wish this tech was available then as I could have spent time watching soccer, drinking Scotch, or blasting my Benz on twisties instead of cleaning my survey chain or copying survey data........

No offense, you're seeing a bit of what's coming next. I'm seeing a paradigm shift in how we use maps because I've had a bit of an opportunity to use the tech that's going to be in our next iPhone or Nexus. I learned how to program a computer using punch cards, I'm that "old" but I've adapted. IMHO Apple has bided its time until a product like Broadcom's BCM47755 came out - my next smartphone will have that chipset in it, regardless of OS platform. I remember when Google Maps was available on S60, you'll remember how primitive maps and navigation and access to POI features are today in a year or two. I really hope that Apple's next iPhone has a Broadcom BCM47755 chipset in it.

And, carrier aggregation and a decent parsing engine would be nice too....

Are you saying it’s going to be utilizing the L5 band (aeronautical) along with L1 for triangulation?

 

[campyguy]

Are you saying it’s going to be utilizing the L5 band (aeronautical) along with L1 for triangulation?

Both E5 and L5, yes. Demo black boxes have been in testing for several months now. I've seen them in testing but haven't been able to get my hands on one. The first exposure was at a conference here in Portland, September I think. I hadn't seen geeks that buzzed (the one in my mirror, too) since the first iPhone was revealed. And, the satellites are up...

 

[truthertech]

I don't really need to research this topic because I do analytics from an implementation level. It's amusing you're trying to lecture about how criminal Google is, when you have absolutely no idea how susceptible you are.

The level of effort is fairly simple. It's easy to bypass people such as yourself who try and block GA via proxy requests. If Macrumors wanted to, they can track you here via their own analytics endpoint even though you disabled ads, and they can still give your information to GA. Along with this information, they can still record your IP address and pass along any cookies you might have in your browser for this domain. You might not see ads if you disable various ad servers, but Google already your information.

There's nothing you can do to prevent this other than disable javascript and disable cookies.

Regarding the actual Google mining, you're completely delusional if you don't think Microsoft, Apple, or <insert tech company> doesn't do the same behind the scenes.

Again, the best practice is to exercise caution when posting content and custom tagging things. You use a public service you can get tracked.

Yes, it is so difficult to disable javascript (done by default with Apple OS's), or cookies, or use VPN, etc. And why aren't you discussing the use of Google services when that is the bulk of their data mining. Again, very easy to deny Google most of this data, e.g., if you don't use Google photos, they won't have every photo you take/receive; if you don't use Google maps or location services, they won't have everywhere you walk, drive, bike, transit, etc.; if you don't use gmail (or send to it) they won't have every email you've ever written or received, etc., etc. It doesn't mean there's zero data being collected on you; it means you are denying Google that particular private data from their digital dossiers.

So, don't give up--Google is counting on you having that attitude of "there's nothing I can do."

 

[Sciomar]

Both E5 and L5, yes. Demo black boxes have been in testing for several months now. I've seen them in testing but haven't been able to get my hands on one. The first exposure was at a conference here in Portland, September I think. I hadn't seen geeks that buzzed (the one in my mirror, too) since the first iPhone was revealed. And, the satellites are up...

I was racking my brain trying to figure out the E5 signal and the current constellation lol, now I see, GNSS from the Galileo will be used to cross cue with our own GPS constellation for millimeter precision. That's pretty cool, hope they have the new receivers dialed in to properly demodulate those freqs from the GNSS constellations. Guess we'll see soon since they're finishing the constellation up on July 25th.

 

[ipponrg]

Yes, it is so difficult to disable javascript (done by default with Apple OS's), or cookies, or use VPN, etc. And why aren't you discussing the use of Google services when that is the bulk of their data mining. Again, very easy to deny Google most of this data, e.g., if you don't use Google photos, they won't have every photo you take/receive; if you don't use Google maps or location services, they won't have everywhere you walk, drive, bike, transit, etc.; if you don't use gmail (or send to it) they won't have every email you've ever written or received, etc., etc. It doesn't mean there's zero data being collected on you; it means you are denying Google that particular private data from their digital dossiers.

So, don't give up--Google is counting on you having that attitude of "there's nothing I can do."

Apple OS does not by default disable Javascript. When has this ever happened?

What is there to discuss about Google services when I disallow them from knowing my location as well as other points? I only use their their email and docs. I don't use their Photos. I turned off any location tracking. It's why my Google data dump is so small compared to Apple. Ironically, Apple knows more than Google about me.

Your problem is you think Google is the only problem. The same results could be said if you used any online commodity whether it be from Microsoft, Yahoo/AOL, Apple, etc.

Why don't you exert the same effort for all your other online services? Don't use them so you don't give them the option of tracking you.

You're delusional.

 

[Tronam]

You're not understanding how data mining by Google works. To begin with, Google is amassing data on you that never appears in "your dump," e.g.,. if you aren't blocking their trackers on Macrumors site as you read this, they are tracking and collecting everything you do on this website and then using that to follow you across the web, and assigning it to your universal identifier numbers based on your IP address, etc. , but Google doesn't consider that part of your "Google account." If you sent an email to someone who has a gmail address that information has been scanned, but again, doesn't show up in your Google data dump. If you are using Google photos, they don't remind you that they retain a world wide perpetual license to use those photos and have that information linked to you, and your family, forever, but that doesn't show up in your Google account. The contacts that they vacuumed up don't show up in your Google account. Ditto, your docs uploaded to Google docs. See how this is really working?

Case in point, out of the blue this large ad has been glued to the top of my YouTube feed for several days now and no matter how often I close it, keeps returning.

This is the first time I can recall them targeting an ad like this at me: a pasty pacific northwest caucasian atheist computer nerd who doesn't visit Islamic websites or even search for information on the subject. I also exclusively use iCloud for all of my personal e-mail. Then it occurred to me that I had recently exchanged e-mails with an old friend of mine who uses Gmail. Although she was born in America and is caucasian in appearance, she has family in Syria and mentioned doing some research on the cultural traditions of wearing headscarves. It’s the only possible explanation and helps illustrate the extent to which Google is collecting and building profile data on people who aren’t even directly using their services. It's annoying and since ads are difficult to completely avoid on the modern web I would much rather they target them at me based exclusively on the types of videos I ‘Like’ and channels I subscribe to instead of shadow tracking me across countless other websites and services. Thankfully Google gives you some control over this.

 

[- rob -]

This is untrue, and continuing to repeat it invalidates just about anything you say.

it's not bad to be questioning about how companies use your data. But to repeat this FUD shows you have absolutely no clue what you're talking about.

Google has never sold your data. They use your data to compile aggregrate information in order to sell advertising space to you. But their business model is so dependant on this, that selling your personal data would essentially give away their business.

Nevermind the fact that in virtually the entire world now, except the US, selling of personal data is illegal.

if you want anyone to take you seriously. Don't say stuff like this.

Well let me revise my statement: Google sells your behavior and they use your personal data to make money. To your average person, there is not a big difference between this and equifax when compared with Apple's business model.

Google will sell to an advertiser that there is a person who is going to this place at this time and probably for this reason and offer an opportunity to be reached for a price.

It might not have a person's or group of people's names attached to it but it doesn't need to.

While they may not directly sell that a particular person uses a particular coin-op laundry, they will sell that the person may be in the market for a washing machine. Or something much more personal than that. Which is why it is so important to avoid using Google's products, this includes Google Analytics on websites you create. It is giving a ton of behavior data to Google.

Which is the point of not using Google Maps. You are contributing your personal data to a pool which is indirectly sold for ad placement.