When was the last time customers raised a concern about a hardware defect in an Apple product that ended up not actually being an issue?
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Apple May Have Quietly Addressed 'Flexgate' in 2018 MacBook Pros
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Even when Jobs was flashing his arogant nature, you felt he was passionate about Apple products.
There is no passion in saving 20 cents by using a shorter cable.
There is no passion in saving 20 cents by using a shorter cable.
We kind of do because huge issues cannot be buried.
For example, if the iPhone XS actually had a design flaw with the antenna, it would be on the front page of the NY Times every day until fixed.
Widespread issues/design flaws are too obvious to ignore.
Isolated issues will come up when you sell 300M devices annually. Even 1% with some issue is 3M devices.
I've only used Apple products for a few years and what I have will likely last at least a few more.
Besides what you've written, Apple's reaction over the next few months to those fundamentally flawed management decisions will help determine my future expenditures. As it stands, it's not likely that they'll be to Apple and related third-party businesses in a significant way; possibly none at all. I doubt they'll do the big reaction I'm looking for. Attitudinal stasis and finger pointing is the norm for entities, especially large ones. It's a shame. Talented, good people work there, and the same can be said for the development and other third-party communities.
Thanks for reminding me about Librem.
Most recently? iPhone XS reception issues. Not saying a few (normal when you ship tens of millions) didn't have problems, but people immediately were calling design flaw. Wrong. Wrong. Wrong.
MacBook Pro throttling issue. People here said hardware issue, no question. Was fixed in a week with a software update. Wrong. Wrong. Wrong.
Point is, people raise issues all the time. Sometimes, there are isolated problems. I don't think the MacBook keyboard is an issue. Ask about it here? It's a design flaw that people can't get over. Mine is flawless, but I don't eat chips and tacos over my keyboard.
It is not the number of issues which are important, but the probability of each issue happening to a particular machine.
Let's say it is 100 problems that can happen to any MacBook Pro. The probability of each issue is independent of each other and the probability is p=0.0001.
Then the probability for having at least one problem would be p=0.01=1% which is good.
I've had my 2016 15" Pro for nearly two years and while it's a very nice laptop it's had some pretty obvious quality defects from the get-go and quite frankly shouldn't exist on a $2k+ machine. Used to when I paid extra for Apple I was paying for the software/hardware integration and the quality of the product. Well here I am 15 years later and software/hardware integration has become less stable and ever more bloated and quality has taken a nosedive (though I do remember the many issues with iBook G3 logic boards and PowerBook G4 RAM slot failures, etc.)
Overall I'm very on the fence about buying another Apple laptop. I've seen the sales Best Buy has had recently on the 2018 15" and while it's tempting I still think with $300 off they are too expensive. I also HATE my iPhone XS and it's easily the worst iPhone I've ever had so there's that too.
Overall I'm very on the fence about buying another Apple laptop. I've seen the sales Best Buy has had recently on the 2018 15" and while it's tempting I still think with $300 off they are too expensive. I also HATE my iPhone XS and it's easily the worst iPhone I've ever had so there's that too.
Fair point, but not what I was referring to.
There are a lot of people who dismiss reports of hardware defects, like the stagelighting effect as a one-off and not an actual hardware defect. When people complained about the Macbook butterfly keyboard problem, it was dismissed as a non-issue... only to get to the point where Apple made a change to address this so-called non-issue.
When reports of a hardware issue are widespread, it turns out to be a legitimate design/hardware defect. Yet when the next wave of reports on an issue get publicized, people again dismiss those reports out of hand.
Do you have an example of where a widely reported issue turns out NOT to be a legitimate issue?
I'll probably be holding onto my 2015 MacBook Pro for years. The 2018 model seems to solve the defects with the 2016/2017 models, but there's still no replaceable NVMe SSD. In a year or two I can upgrade to a 2TB NVMe SSD when they're down to like $150.
Point - keyboard reliability should not be a concern on buying a high priced laptop. Not in 2016, 2017, and 2018. Apple used to make a reliable keyboard, and instead decided to make one that was less reliable.
>I don't think the MacBook keyboard is an issue.
It does. I have personally experienced problems with mine. Apple has a warranty extended to cover the problem. There is a problem with the keyboard. Beyond that its loud and clicky - and distracting in a quiet environment.
Know what else shouldnt be a reliability concern on a modern laptop? Screen backlight failure due to how/how often the laptop is opened.
On a premium laptop, which these are, because spec wise we pay the most for an Apple product, having common failures of keyboard and now failures of weak, short, poorly designed ribbon cables that arent serviceable do not say "premium" - in fact it says the exact opposite.
How is my post Anti American ?
Care to explain ?
I mean if you really want an asbestos computer.
In my part of the world , we have banned asbestos due to scientific proof of its affect to human health.
And if an American designed, American made , American invented asbestos computer , you are welcome to be patriotic and buy it to spite other and show your American “freedom”?
Is there a thread that discusses PC alternatives to the Macbook/Macbook Pro line, is there even a chance you could find a 14/15" screen that is somewhat close to the Retina screen and would not be a significant drop in quality, something under 1k, possibly matte screen as well.
That would have been my philosophy until I no longer had the experience you describe. Over the past several years I have been on the receiving end of Apple design decisions and price points which led me to "courageously move forward" with other laptops and phones. I actually find Linux to be kind of fun to tinker with these days, and on PC laptops of increasingly exceptional quality. After my personal disappointments, I have come to take experiences of others with Apple product problems a lot more seriously. I will not risk paying thousands of dollars on a laptop with unreliable keyboards and displays, cooling/throttling issues with high performance cpu's, and expensive repairs dictated by poor repairability designs. I don't want to pay $700 to fix a $6 cable, or $400 to replace a butterfly keyboard. Sure, not all of the macbooks have these issues, but the failure rate is significant enough to make me wary of purchase. I continue to follow this forum in hopes of finding positive changes by Apple to address the issues of the last several years, and I still have an iPhone 6s+, a 2017 iPad Pro 12, and a 2017 iMac. Apple design issues have pushed me away from the phones and the iPads currently produced, and QC problems and lack of ports have done the same with the Macbook Pro line. Hopefully, you will continue to be pleased with Apple design decisions and QC issues as they pertain to you. Good luck, and yes, Godspeed with your continued Apple bliss.
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That is often the case with CEO's who were also founders of their companies. Microsoft didn't really begin to lose direction and ground until Bill Gates retired. Apple nearly lost it when they pushed out Jobs. His experiences with developing the NEXT line, based upon BSD Unix, was aptly applied to the Mac design when he returned to Apple, creating an OS based upon BSD. Jobs always had an eye for a balance between form and function in his products - the form was appealingly elegant, and the function was efficient and top notch (it just worked). That balance has been lost in much of Apple products - form has become ascendant, and function has started to take a back seat. I never really thought Jobs was arrogant - he was just focused and passionate about the Apple company, his co-creation.
I have no idea.
I still have my old MBP and for the money I was going to put toward updating it I decided to go full desktop PC instead. I'm done with all Macs for now, for myself. The family computer will likely continue to be a Mac, though.
And yet you still don't have any data to support large failure rates or that the issue is widespread.
My proof is that we don't see a mountain of evidence to the contrary. If it were an issue, it couldn't be stopped. Apple doesn't sell that matter different products, so millions buy the products they do offer.
Remember Antennagate? It couldn't be stopped and Apple sold a lot fewer units then. Oh, and your hero was leading the company at the time and told you you're holding it wrong.
I think you meant to say when was the last time customers raised an issue that was as widespread as they claimed?
It's pretty clear that you are mocking the USA. Just wondering where you sense of superiority comes from. Have a good day.
I feel the same way and I was in the process of buying the new Mac Mini but then decided against it. The base model @$799 is crippled with a 128GB SSD drive. I can jump to the i5 with a 6 core CPU and 256GB SSD for $1,100. The worse part is that the SSD is soldered to the motherboard so if either the T2 Controller Chip or the soldered SSD fails (finite amount of writes) that's an expensive motherboard replacement. I have no worries regarding any of that with my 2012 Mac Mini because I can easily upgrade the RAM or replace the SSD.
Some say well all you have to do is add an external SSD to the 2018 Mini and my answer is why? Why do I have to spend even more money to because Apple decided to cripple the Mac Mini on purpose for financial reasons? There are tons of micro PC's out now that are just as small or smaller as the Mac Mini that allow you to easily upgrade the RAM or swap out the blade SSD stick if it fails at a much cheaper costs.
Thankfully for me when my 2012 Mini is no longer supported it will be converted to a Linux box. There's so much similarities between macOS and Linux it's not funny and Linux as an open source OS is even more secure than macOS.
I SO hear you. I've become a Linux mainline user
Way empathize with your place. I gave up on Apple laptops, now have a System76 Oryx Pro, a Dell XPS13, and an HP "gaming" laptop, all running Linux. The Linux OS has so improved the last 10 years for the desktop as to be a huge competitor for both Apple and Windows for the laptop/desktop market. PC's have very much come to the fore in hardware offerings. And as you mention, Apple hardware design, with soldered SSDs and memory boards, et al, is not amenable to repair or upgrade. And no really usable ports. Onward - I miss the old Apple, but don't care for the new one.
[doublepost=1551837645][/doublepost]Well, of course, Louis Rossmann sort of has his views about this flexgate thing. The video is out of sync video vs sound, but just listen to what he says.
My favorite thing is to see how an apple white knight will always rise in defense of poor and defenseless Apple....
