Apple May Sell Series 9 and Ultra 2 Watches Without Blood Oxygen App in U.S. Amid Patent Dispute

[jz0309]

I smell class action against Apple by customers (for removing purchase functionality). Apple is in no-win situation. Thankfully they only have to remove the functionality in the US (which we all know “only affects small number of users™”).

Apple will not remove blood oxygen functionality for already purchased watches, only for purchases going forward and they will not advertise the functionality anymore

 

[iGeneo]

Skirting the patent rather than doing what's right and paying Masimo for their infringment. Typical Apple. Steal other's tech, claim victim & cry foul, litigate the infringed company & then settle for far less than they should be.

Such a scuzzy company

Are you a patent attorney that knows the details of this case in depth?

 

[Timo_Existencia]

You can buy a $12 device that does this; the one that is used by the medical clinic I use costs $12 on Amazon. It's a professional use device. The rumor is that Masimo is trying to extort $100/device from Apple. All of you saying "just pay up" are outside of the specifics of this case.

It's time for Apple to start playing hardball. Not just here, but everywhere.

 

[sleven]

As a physician I am happy they are turning it off, since it basically is a mysterious number to non-physicians, Understanding what that number means and what to do about it except in VERY SPECIFIC situations (like you are in an airplane that depressurizes like the AL flight that popped the door plug) is meaningless to most patients. There are also a couple of life threatening situations where it fools you that all is fine when your life is in imminent danger, the most classical one you learn in medical school is CO poisoning since CO shows as "oxygen" to the sensor and patients will read 100% when in fact they need oxygen to try and force the CO off the hemoglobin (we measure CO2/CO via a arterial blood gas). Additionally the other day my staff told me an asthmatic was hypoxemic with a low oxygen saturation but was now showing 97% after they'd given him a nebulizer before i could get into the room (but they didn't understand an asthmatic absolutely should not be hypoxemic, their problem is exhaling not inhaling and nothing should interfere with absorbing oxygen in asthma, and that represented a huge emergency and that the fact that they magically made the number better meant nothing). I get that from nursing all the time (patient is is respiratory distress but their sats are "ok," so it's not that serious, where that's rarely the issue, you don't breathe from low oxygen but from high CO2 (makes your blood acidic which drives the sensor in your brain) so not helpful in any situations (there are of course many situations where it matters such as heart failure, pulmonary embolism, etc but there is a reason we train for a long time to understand those numbers properly)

To help me better understand - are all asthmatic cases the same? I also saw the word “should,” does that suggest that the opposite is possible?

 

[delsoul]

Seems like apple’s betting that it’s cheaper to have a lawsuit from customers by cutting off their watch feature even though they paid for it than it is to face the lawsuit of stealing someone else’s patent!

 

[mebehere]

A "fix" implies the original feature in question is maintained. Masimo agrees a device with the blood oxygen feature must have the software installed. They're fine if Apple wants to delete the software, which kills the entire feature.

This is definitely not a fix. Not unless you're a used car salesman.

Semantics 🙄

 

[XXPP]

Hundreds of companies from China produce watches with the exact same technology and sell them in the US.
Is there a more stupid country that destroys its own best companies?
Does the patent troll know that he won't get anything anyway?

 

[theorist9]

If Apple resolves this by changing the algorithm, it will be interesting to compare the results with the old algorithm to that with the new one.

 

[dblackwood72]

How long before Apple makes a bid for Masimo?

 

[canyonblue737]

Seems like apple’s betting that it’s cheaper to have a lawsuit from customers by cutting off their watch feature even though they paid for it than it is to face the lawsuit of stealing someone else’s patent!

NOTHING about this refers to turning off watch features on watches already sold. The ban was for NEW SALES. It's likely a court will impose damages on Apple (if they find cause, they haven't yet) for existing watches but it is very unlikely to punish existing owners by forcing Apple to apply a firmware updates. Summary: new watches won't have it, old watches get to keep it (but Apple may have to pay a fortune.)

 

[latweek]

Are you a patent attorney that knows the details of this case in depth?

Lower the drama, its a fair conclusion, based on public knowledge, educate yourself at the link provided by Macrumors and come back when you have a better informed retort.

We have shared the ITC's full response as a PDF.

 

[Fat_Guy]

This is so funny. Now my AW 5 SS is still relevant! For those that want the O2 monitor you can just buy the watch in Canada.

 

[Fat_Guy]

I see some (joking?) comments that European Apple Watch 9s will be sold at a premium since they’d be unaffected.

I’m American with a U.S. Apple ID account, but my wife bought me an Apple Watch 9 from a Canadian Apple Store. Can anyone help me interpret what this means for me? Or is it too early to tell?

It means you have a fully functioning watch. Don’t upgrade the OS for a while - but it may not matter.

 

[Radeon85]

Don't you dare touch the watches outside of the US, and we better not get nerfed hardware functionality on devices we already paid for especially outside of the US!

 

[svish]

Good temporary solution. Wonder what will happen when Series X launches.

 

[FlyingDutch]

As I predicted. Next step will be software modification to avoid patent issues but then less accurate pulse oximeter.

Less accurate than an already inaccurate reading ?

 

[Dominican]

Can Apple update the Watch with update to disable this?

 

[5232152]

Can Apple update the Watch with update to disable this?

Probably. I don't think they can be forced to use these tools in cases like this, but the potential risk of loosing out of security updates might not make it worth it IMO.

 

[ItsASpider]

Instead of, you know, just paying the patent royalties assuming Masimo is willing to license them and have this all just go away by actually playing fair...

 

[arkitect]

I guess i am turning automatic update OFF. Since software update will make it none usable of completly remove it. So 10.2 will be last working for now.

All my automatic updates are off for Watch, Mac, iPad and iPhone.

Nothing to do with this particular debacle though, I just prefer to wait a bit and see if the latest update is safe(ish) and bug free(ish) enough to install.

🙂

 

[hans1972]

Nobody sensible is calling this a fix. If anybody went to Tim Cook and told him it's a fix, they'd be fired on the spot. Without SpO2, it puts the Watch S9 and SE at near feature parity.

Ultimately, I think Apple will relent. The Masimo patent is broad. Other watch makers sued by Masimo relented. Apple has had three years to design something different. If it were easy, they'd have done it by now.

Of course it's a fix. Apple's problem, which they communicated, was not being able to sell the Apple Watch in the US.
This is appears to be a software fix for that problem.

 

[Abazigal]

Ultimately, I think Apple will relent. The Masimo patent is broad. Other watch makers sued by Masimo relented. Apple has had three years to design something different. If it were easy, they'd have done it by now.

Personally, I would rather Apple not. In for a penny, in for a pound.

 

[Glideslope]

Probably. I don't think they can be forced to use these tools in cases like this, but the potential risk of loosing out of security updates might not make it worth it IMO.

Sure makes one curious back on 10.1 when many (that had it on the watch face) lost the O2 complication on our watches. Then had it restored in 10.1.1. 😉

 

[dandy1117]

The Series 9 is already an 8.2, wasn’t even worth considering over my Series 4.

I just bought a condo. And across the street, the same development firm built new condos with just slightly faster elevators. That’s so stupid! I’m not selling my unit just to move across the street for faster elevators and a slightly nicer lobby! 😉 /sarc

 

[FriendlyMackle]

Does this take effect immediately?

I was thinking of upgrading my Apple Watch to the 9 but hadnt gotten around to it yet.

If I buy it soon will the blood O2 monitor still work?

That was one of the key features for me

I bought my Ultra 2 two weeks ago as I thought this would be the outcome, and I wanted to have the working blood O2 sensor. They won’t be disabling it on watches already in consumers’ hands. Just new sales. I’d say upgrade ASAP.