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Apple Music Classical Now Available for Pre-Order on the App Store, Launches Later This Month

Seriously, this is pompous arseholery… there are genres of jazz that some could justify as requiring a separate app (as they also become standards and are played by many) but they’re just chucked in with the lumpen proletariat and happy to be there, to be available. Classical music is just a collection of complex notes, patronised by the rich and maybe some pieces are certainly longer than 3.5 minutes of current pop songs, but it’s all just music. How this ended up happening must have been some severe pressure at the top of Apple from « cultured » friends.
 
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johnmacward said:
Seriously, this is pompous arseholery… there are genres of jazz that some could justify as requiring a separate app (as they also become standards and are played by many) but they’re just chucked in with the lumpen proletariat and happy to be there, to be available. Classical music is just a collection of complex notes, patronised by the rich and maybe some pieces are certainly longer than 3.5 minutes of current pop songs, but it’s all just music. How this ended up happening must have been some severe pressure at the top of Apple from « cultured » friends.
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I just got off the phone with Ron Carter and he's not very happy about being chucked in with the lumpen proletariat. In fact, he's pretty pissed.

He thinks Miles would be apoplectic, and he should know. :cool:

Seriously, the classical app seems like a good idea to me, and I'd love to see one for jazz.

Using technology to drill down deeper into any musical genre (classical, jazz, country, R&B, Hip Hop, Rock ...) seems like a great opportunity for people who love music to learn, grow and enjoy their music to the fullest.

Let's have more of it!
 
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olavsu1 said:
Whatever, but they don't care about their users at all. If they cared, they wouldn't make something as limited in every way as iOS. I had to install VLC on the iphone, otherwise it was not possible to load the contacts archive to the phone in a normal way.
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The limitness of iOS is BECAUSE they care about the average user, and not about edge cases by nerds. Android is designed by and for the 1% who are interested in how tech works, and then try to persuade everyone else that their lives would be better if they cared too.

If iOS being designed for non-nerds is s problem for you, just go buy a nerd-phone and leave the rest of us alone.
 
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johnmacward said:
Seriously, this is pompous arseholery… there are genres of jazz that some could justify as requiring a separate app (as they also become standards and are played by many) but they’re just chucked in with the lumpen proletariat and happy to be there, to be available. Classical music is just a collection of complex notes, patronised by the rich and maybe some pieces are certainly longer than 3.5 minutes of current pop songs, but it’s all just music. How this ended up happening must have been some severe pressure at the top of Apple from « cultured » friends.
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You obviously don’t listen to neither classical nor jazz, so your input is irrelevant, and like many others here you totally missed the point of the app.

Yes there are standards in jazz. But noone searches for Paul Desmond to find Take Five covers, and noone searches for a conductor in jazz music. Finding jazz music is generally done in 100% the same way as finding Lady Gaga.
 
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Velli said:
The limitness of iOS is BECAUSE they care about the average user, and not about edge cases by nerds. Android is designed by and for the 1% who are interested in how tech works, and then try to persuade everyone else that their lives would be better if they cared too.
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considering how the vast majority of Android users don’t care one bit about tech either, and the Android os has the majority of smartphone shares due to much lower prices, i would say the typical Android user doesn’t care about tech and just wants a cheap smartphone that does the job.
Android tech nerds are the minority of users, just like Apple tech nerds.
 
In the West, I am considered a very highly educated professional, a tech nerd in your languages. But I'm not.
If I were, I'd write normal operating systems for these things myself.
 
The number of posts about “why it’s a separated app” is so damn high…
 
czaffa said:
Can someone explain why this is being called a pre-order when the app is free?
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'pre-' because it isn't available for download. 'order' so that it downloads when it is ready. What's not clear is which devices it will download to.

Also noting there are no iPad or macOS or AppleTV or Watch apps as yet.
 
ginkobiloba said:
considering how the vast majority of Android users don’t care one bit about tech either, and the Android os has the majority of smartphone shares due to much lower prices, i would say the typical Android user doesn’t care about tech and just wants a cheap smartphone that does the job.
Android tech nerds are the minority of users, just like Apple tech nerds.
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Oh, I agree completely! My point is, at least to my eyes, Android is designed for the minority that is tech nerds. It is not designed for people who don't care. It's just that because it is available for less money, it tends to get used by the people who don't care. That's not the same as being optimal.

And yes, there are plenty of products in any product category that are specifically designed for people who don't care. Designing for those people (who are generally the majority*) is an art.

*I'm not saying a majority of people don't care about anything. It's just that people care about different things, so people that care about any individual product type, is almost always in a minority. You may not care about phone user interfaces, but be really fanatic about dog leashes.
 
agoodpub said:
An order? If it was a pre-order then you would need to do something more to actually get it. That’s not the case here.
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Dictionaries disagree, and I will actually argue the opposite. You place an order on an item that is available. You place a pre-order on an item that is not yet available. There is no requirement for you to do something more. If you purchase a book from Amazon before the release date, you are pre-ordering the book, so that they send it to you when it is released. You are not required to do anything at the day of release.

If you are reserving it rather than pre-ordering it, then you need to do an action to actually purchase it once it is released. When you pre-order this app, it is automatically installed on your device on the day of release, with no action required.
 
martens said:
'pre-' because it isn't available for download. 'order' so that it downloads when it is ready. What's not clear is which devices it will download to.

Also noting there are no iPad or macOS or AppleTV or Watch apps as yet.
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IIRC, it would download to other devices automatically if you have that setting enabled (not sure off the top of my head what the phrasing is in English, but under Settings>App Store there is a setting for automatic download of apps purchased on other devices).
 
johnmacward said:
Seriously, this is pompous arseholery
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Thank you for your deeply informed and heartfelt commentary. I will almost certainly file it under "indispensable and sage."

Velli said:
Yes there are standards in jazz. But noone searches for Paul Desmond to find Take Five covers, and noone searches for a conductor in jazz music. Finding jazz music is generally done in 100% the same way as finding Lady Gaga.
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I think there's room for better metadata search in jazz -- ways to distinguish different recordings by the same artist of the same work with the same ensemble but at a different gig, for example.

But the kicker is that there has to be good, consistent, curated metadata to search, and I don't know if there's a jazz counterpart to the big stack of metadata Apple acquired when they bought Primephonic. A great search app fed crummy data does crummy search.
 
johnmacward said:
Seriously, this is pompous arseholery… there are genres of jazz that some could justify as requiring a separate app (as they also become standards and are played by many) but they’re just chucked in with the lumpen proletariat and happy to be there, to be available. Classical music is just a collection of complex notes, patronised by the rich and maybe some pieces are certainly longer than 3.5 minutes of current pop songs, but it’s all just music. How this ended up happening must have been some severe pressure at the top of Apple from « cultured » friends.
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you have some great points here.

what is the diffence between Mozart's "eine kleine nachtmusik"
and Guns and Rioses guitar intro to "sweet child?
the notes structure and patterns are quite similar and catchy
while everyone probably knows both pieces.

therefore music is a strong art in our society no matter the venue or classification. HL-158893First_BIG.pngset_watermark.png
 
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tubular said:
Thank you for your deeply informed and heartfelt commentary. I will almost certainly file it under "indispensable and sage."


I think there's room for better metadata search in jazz -- ways to distinguish different recordings by the same artist of the same work with the same ensemble but at a different gig, for example.

But the kicker is that there has to be good, consistent, curated metadata to search, and I don't know if there's a jazz counterpart to the big stack of metadata Apple acquired when they bought Primephonic. A great search app fed crummy data does crummy search.
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The thing is, that metadata for jazz is still arguably much more similar in structure to say, rock music than it is to classical. Rock/Pop etc could do with much better metadata as well, as mentioned earlier Tidal does this much better than Apple Music, for any genre. Tidal is getting that from somewhere, I don't believe Apple don't have similar or even better data. My mention of Nigel Godrich earlier was not random - Apple Music has a curated playlist of tracks produced by him, but you cannot find these tracks individually by searching his name.
 
MBAir2010 said:
what is the diffence between Mozart's "eine kleine nachtmusik"
and Guns and Rioses guitar intro to "sweet child?
the notes structure and patterns are quite similar and catchy
while everyone probably knows both pieces.

therefore music is a strong art in our society no matter the venue or classification.
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That has nothing to do with it. Try searching for "Sweet child of mine by guns n roses". You'll find three versions of the song. Now try searching for "eine kleine nachtmusik by mozart". You'll find literally hundreds of versions. Even if you include Berliner Philharmoniker and Karajan in your search, it's still a mess if you're trying to find a specific version.

And this is just the specific use case of finding a given track. The whole approach to music discovery is completely different with classical music. But if you never listen to classical music, you will probably never understand.

I don't listen much to classical either, but enough to understand the frustration. What I don't understand is the constant "this is not for me ergo it should not exist" bickering by people who aren't in the target group.
 
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Velli said:
That has nothing to do with it. Try searching for "Sweet
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I try not to search for info online, and use my brain and thoughts to reply
(which I did in this case.)
or else we would be more robotic than we have become.


sorry to upset you, I will play "Adagio for strings" by...... does it matter?
 
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Spaceboi Scaphandre said:
I have to ask: Why do you need an Apple Music sub for this? This is just classical music, music that is free since classical music is public domain. So why should you need a subscription just to listen to public domain music you can get for free from archive.org?
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Free from composer's rights. Agree. But are you a musician? Do you perform with your instrument? Do you expect to have a professional job without being paid? Are you paid where you work or do they expect you to provide your efforts for free?
 
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